Merriams!!!

[mdb]

Hey there folks it's been a long while since I been on this site, I do believe I joined at Old Gobbler inception when it first came on line but life took over thereafter and here i am whatever years and 5 kids later and I'm back to thinking the grand slam.  Never killed a Merriams.  From what I read to get a pure strain white tipped merriam you gotta go to Montana or Wyoming    I am so very up for a wilderness hunt in either state or anywhere that the white tipped thunderbirds hang.  Any and all tips and advice welcome (i'm in New England, not a hunting or fishing mecca but we have some strengths and I am happy to help with whatever anyone wants in trade --I have a camp in VT if that helps)  I might be able to take my oldest son on this hunt, which would be incredibly special. Thanks and God Bless

[Gooserbat]

If you want white and native range northern New Mexico or southern Colorado

[GobbleNut]

For Merriam's, the terms "pure strain" and "white tips" are not necessarily synonymous.  The fact is that pure Merriam's strains vary a lot in terms of the white coloration found in them.  The white tips found in some places is strictly a function of specific genetic traits within those localized populations of birds.   

Now, if you are just using "the whiter the better" as your qualifier, then perhaps Montana or Wyoming may be your preferred hunting location.  There are perfectly pure Merriam's turkeys in other places that do not exhibit those pure white characteristics, however.  One thing to remember when hunting Merriam's is that they almost all look a lot whiter "on the hoof" than they do once they are up close on the ground. ...Not always, but often. 

[Sir-diealot]

For Merriam's, the terms "pure strain" and "white tips" are not necessarily synonymous.  The fact is that pure Merriam's strains vary a lot in terms of the white coloration found in them.  The white tips found in some places is strictly a function of specific genetic traits within those localized populations of birds.   

Now, if you are just using "the whiter the better" as your qualifier, then perhaps Montana or Wyoming may be your preferred hunting location.  There are perfectly pure Merriam's turkeys in other places that do not exhibit those pure white characteristics, however.  One thing to remember when hunting Merriam's is that they almost all look a lot whiter "on the hoof" than they do once they are up close on the ground. ...Not always, but often.

Never knew that, thanks for the education. OK shows some Merriam's near the end of the Panhandle and I was thinking about maybe going up that way if I got my Rio Next year early enough.

[GobbleNut]

For Merriam's, the terms "pure strain" and "white tips" are not necessarily synonymous.  The fact is that pure Merriam's strains vary a lot in terms of the white coloration found in them.  The white tips found in some places is strictly a function of specific genetic traits within those localized populations of birds.   

Now, if you are just using "the whiter the better" as your qualifier, then perhaps Montana or Wyoming may be your preferred hunting location.  There are perfectly pure Merriam's turkeys in other places that do not exhibit those pure white characteristics, however.  One thing to remember when hunting Merriam's is that they almost all look a lot whiter "on the hoof" than they do once they are up close on the ground. ...Not always, but often.

Never knew that, thanks for the education. OK shows some Merriam's near the end of the Panhandle and I was thinking about maybe going up that way if I got my Rio Next year early enough.

Couldn't say for sure, but I would be very surprised that those turkeys in the western panhandle of Oklahoma are "pure" Merriam's due to their long-term proximity to Rio's.  I would be even more surprised if you can find a place to hunt for them in that location. 

[FL-Boss]

+1 ...

If you want white and native range northern New Mexico or southern Colorado

[Hobbes]

I really should write this out somewhere because I harp on it too often.  It would be simpler as a cut and paste. 

I understand the desire for the white tips, but Merriam's range from a buff color to snow white wherever you find them.  More often than not you'll find sort of a blonde color.  Photos taken in the right light will appear more white than they are.  There is however those birds on the white end of the spectrum.  To confuse it more, states like Nebraska and SD have transplanted both resulting in a cross.   However, the Pine Ridge and Blackhills are Merriam's.  Some of NMs birds that are native Merriam's are more buff than white.  Consider the range of colors in Eastern birds.  If you've not seen it you're not paying attention.

As far as native range, as stated, southern CO, New Mexico, and Arizona are the native range states.  Wyoming and Montana birds were transplanted originally from Colorado.  Turkeys are not native to MT, but they are Merriam's. Same goes for Wyoming.

[Yoder409]

I really should write this out somewhere because I harp on it too often.  It would be simpler as a cut and paste. 

I understand the desire for the white tips, but Merriam's range from a buff color to snow white wherever you find them.  More often than not you'll find sort of a blonde color.  Photos taken in the right light will appear more white than they are.  There is however those birds on the white end of the spectrum.  To confuse it more, states like Nebraska and SD have transplanted both resulting in a cross.   However, the Pine Ridge and Blackhills are Merriam's.  Some of NMs birds that are native Merriam's are more buff than white.  Consider the range of colors in Eastern birds.  If you've not seen it you're not paying attention.

As far as native range, as stated, southern CO, New Mexico, and Arizona are the native range states.  Wyoming and Montana birds were transplanted originally from Colorado.  Turkeys are not native to MT, but they are Merriam's. Same goes for Wyoming.

Good post !!!

Couple years ago my bro and I did a NE and WY hunt.  We came home with 6 Merriam's that should have been pure, considering the locations.  Our WY birds were whiter-tipped.  But the 4 NE birds came from the same, small area and they ranged from white to a more buff color.

[Sir-diealot]

If ever I can save to take a trip for them I would definitely try to find an area with more white tipped birds in them, to me that is what I find attractive in them and in Gould's.

[bbcoach]

Not trying to ruffle any feathers LOL, Here's what the NWTF has to say about the subspecies https://www.nwtf.org/hunt/article/wild-turkey-subspecies.  I've always been told, white tip is a Pure merriam.  Buff is a Rio.  Plenty of HYBRIDS in the Midwest.  Also in order to kill a true Osceola you have to get south of I4.  The further south you go the better.  Some outfitters in Florida will sell you on they have Osceolas because their property is in Florida. 

[GobbleNut]

Not trying to ruffle any feathers LOL, Here's what the NWTF has to say about the subspecies https://www.nwtf.org/hunt/article/wild-turkey-subspecies.  I've always been told, white tip is a Pure merriam.  Buff is a Rio.  Plenty of HYBRIDS in the Midwest.  Also in order to kill a true Osceola you have to get south of I4.  The further south you go the better.  Some outfitters in Florida will sell you on they have Osceolas because their property is in Florida.

As for the Merriam's description of "snow white tips on tail feathers", quite honestly, the NWTF biologists (or whoever wrote that) should know better.  That description is no more accurate than their line across Florida that declares anything north to be Eastern's and anything south to be Osceola's.  I will give them the benefit of the doubt, however, and assume they are just trying to simplify identification of the subspecies and distribution as best they can.  With the mixing of the subspecies that has taken place in the last fifty years, I suppose that is the best we can expect to do.

[Hobbes]

NWTF can say "snow white tips", but I've killed birds in native Merriam's country that did not have them. In addition I've killed birds in areas that have been solely stocked from CO and NM birds that have buff to cream colored tips.  They say "chestnut brown" for easterns, but I've killed them from buff to dark brown far enough into eastern country that there are no hybrids.

If I had to guess, I'd say that the biologist (if that's even the case) that wrote that is from Eastern country.  Its a fair bet because you won't find many biologists in the West that have much interest in turkeys.  I've had folks on the forums comment about white tips on birds that I've killed and they were not white.  Maybe creamy with just a hint of buff, but not white.  However, relative to an eastern.....I guess some folks would say snow white.  In addition, sit behind a bird while wearing dark camo and add a little sunlight.......a buff colored bird will look a lot closer to white than he really is.

[fallhnt]

True Merriam have short legs,thus short beards. If white tips are desired, go to Mexico and hunt Goulds.

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[Hobbes]

You may be right, but I've not noticed it.

While they may be shorter than an Osceola or Eastern (I've never measured) it's not by much.  They are significantly taller than tame birds.  For the most part, their beards are a sparse broken up mess.  They'll have a stub of a beard hiding in there that could produce a good beard, but I've rarely seen a stub that could produce some of those really thick paintbrush eastern beards.  I think their beards are a result of genetics, nutrition, and weather.  The best Merriam's beards I've seen have been riverbottoms birds.

[chow hound]

I live in MT and the weather is extremely unpredictable that time of the year.  It can blast back to winter and stay there for a week or so.  I would definitely hunt the last week of the season.

Birds will be at low elevations in the spring, which means private land in a lot of areas.  SE part of the state is your best bet for good access to birds.  Cover a lot of ground to find birds.  Roads will be impassible with moisture.