Future of hunting

[dirtnap]

I live in southwest Georgia and we are the land of the lease. It's almost impossible to get a place to hunt on private land with out paying. Due to some of the reasons posted earlier, we have a huge influx of Florida hunters that are willing to pay to hunt, so unless you are a local willing to pay, you are out. I really can't blame a landowner for taking in more income, if for no other reason than to help with property taxes. I saw this trend coming several years ago and decided I would buy my own small place to hunt. Instead of buying fancy new trucks, big boats, paying expensive outfitters or leases fees, I decided to put this money toward land of my own. I have worked a part time second job for the last 20 years to make my land payment. My place is small, 155 acres.
It is in no way the greatest place to hunt in our area, but it's mine. ( I say mine, but it's really just a blessing I pay to enjoy.) I have really enjoyed making the habitat better and seeing the wildlife populations increase. We also live on the property so it is super convenient to maintain and enjoy. I don't own any stocks or bonds. Land has been my major investment. We live here, hunt on it, ride the golf cart on it, shoot skeet, camp, trap, fish and just overall enjoy the place. It's been a great place to raise my kids. It's been hard at times to pay for, but I have always managed to get by some how. ( There again the blessing.) Do we kill a bunch of huge deer and a lot of turkeys? No, but it's much better than having no where to enjoy. My advice to  people that enjoy the outdoors that are able to make it work, is buy land. I started off with 15 acres, then bought 42, then 78, then 20. I did it a little at a time over 20 years. I started with zero acres. I know everyone is not able or willing to do this, but some may be. Hopefully this may inspire someone to do the same if they possibly can. I at least have a place to hunt until I die, as long as health and interest is there, or until  hunting is a thing of the past. I know this is not the solution for every one that has posted on this subject but it might be something to think about. It worked here in Georgia where land prices are not as high as they are in other states. That also is a very big factor, land prices and availability. Hope this helps somebody. Larry

Good post.  I'm in the same boat in SC.

[Southerngobbler]

I live in a neighborhood that has a large public hunting area right behind it, its actually right behind my house-it hasn't gotten any smaller or harder to access it's still right there. I have at least 15 tree stands back there and pretty much have the place to myself. Iv'e always worried as new kids moved into the neighborhood that they would take an interest in the woods and maybe interfere with my hunting but in 15 years it hasn't happened yet. Plenty of kids in the area they just don't play in the woods anymore. I also build houses for a living and used to have to worry about forming up a foundation and leaving it set for awhile  b4 I poured concrete, in the old days kids would play in the footers and unfortunately mess them up. These days its not a problem, I can form them up and let them sit over the weekend. it's not that kids are better behaved -their not-it's just that they don't play out side anymore. They're indoors playing video games or whatever there doing in there. Folk that cant find a place to hunt or fish usually aren't looking very hard.

[eggshell]

Your right dirtnap, buy whatever you can make work. On an economic bases it is the best investment and it is the best way to have a place to hunt. I bought our small farm almost 30 years ago and live on it too. I have managed it and with planned select timber cuts I payed for more than half the farm and there is still the same value left in timber. I run a maple syrup operation off it too for a little income. I used to do hay but not any more.

[GobbleNut]

Tired of losing places to hunt?  Are you aware of the Republican Party stance on transferring federally owned lands (national forests, BLM) to the states?  Are you aware of your state's Republican Party stance on selling state owned land?  I don't like posting anything about politics and maybe it's not even allowed here, but you should be aware of the biggest threat to the public lands you can hunt on.  Where are you going to hunt if federal land is transferred to the states and the states sell that land to private owners? My state has sold over half the land it owns in the last 100 years. If you like access to public lands you might be voting for your worst enemy. Try reading this: https://www.outsideonline.com/2100586/fact-checking-gops-plan-steal-your-public-land

Right on the money idgobble.  I can tell you are a fellow westerner that has been dealing with this issue.  Fortunately, it seems to have settled down a bit for now.  The important point to be made is not so much one of party affiliation (although it has been one-sided, for sure) but that the entire concept of liquidating federally-owned lands is bad for not only hunters, but for all recreational users. 

Too much BS is being spread by the folks that want to get rid of our federal lands.  The drum-beat they use that the feds want to "lock us out" is total hogwash.  Yet, those that don't know any better are buying it just because there is an "R" behind the name. 

We had a congressman here that was one of the main proponents of giving away our public lands.  The operative word there is "had".  We, the voters, told him just how we felt about his support for that plan!

Folks, you do not want to support the give-away of your federally-owned public lands, period.  If that issue raises its ugly head again, make sure you tell the appropriate people that loud and clear. 

[NCL]

Access to land for hunting is probably the biggest impediment to future hunting along with the other points that have been made in previous posts. The issue of transfer of land from Federal owned to state owned or sell off to private ownership is certainly an issue here is the west. It started  the Sagebrush rebellion and has continued on and off to the present. The states do not have good track records dealing with public land, about ten years ago the state parks were temporary closed due to lack of funding, they have reopened,but it certainly makes you wonder what the politician would have done if they had Federal Land at their disposal.

[eggshell]

It only takes one jerk politician and they can do a lot of damage before you can vote them out. we just went through that with Kasich in Ohio, he made a train wreck out of our wildlife fund and DNR. During his tenure many of the state forest were timbered very hard and our wildlife fund was depleted for pet projects. Those were forest that had only been select cut very carefully. Many were huge big open timber stands and are now brush. Up until the last few years our forest were run great, but one administration took care of that.

[idgobble]

Access to land for hunting is probably the biggest impediment to future hunting along with the other points that have been made in previous posts. The issue of transfer of land from Federal owned to state owned or sell off to private ownership is certainly an issue here is the west. It started  the Sagebrush rebellion and has continued on and off to the present. The states do not have good track records dealing with public land, about ten years ago the state parks were temporary closed due to lack of funding, they have reopened,but it certainly makes you wonder what the politician would have done if they had Federal Land at their disposal.

Many of the legislators in my state are proud to be members of movements similar to the Sagebrush Rebellion crowd. They use different names now but a few still call themselves Sagebrush Rebellion. They are very open about their plans to sell any public lands they can get their hands on and want the Federal lands turned over to the states.  The most alarming part of all this, to me, is that outdoor recreationists vote for these crackpots.

[NCL]

James Watt was the big proponent of all Federal holdings being sold off to ranching and timber interests. Last year one of the large state held lands in Oregon was sold to a timber company. What I read, want to be clear I do not have first hand knowledge, was the first thing the timber company was gate the holdings which had been utilized by elk hunters.  The number one reason I hear when I ask permission on private ground is I am afraid of being sued if something happens. A new one I heard this Spring is that insurance companies are starting to abandon the area and thus are canceling policies for any reason including hunting. The person that told me about this wanted to allow me to hunt on his property but was afraid if his insurance company found out he would be canceled and then not be able to find a policy. To put this in context there were two very large and devastating fires in this area last Summer which is why they do not want to write policies for the area.

[snoodcrusher]

So the Republicans want to sell off your hunting land and the Democrats want to take your guns.  Looks like you're screwed.  Save the last bullet for yourself.


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[GobbleNut]

The number one reason I hear when I ask permission on private ground is I am afraid of being sued if something happens. A new one I heard this Spring is that insurance companies are starting to abandon the area and thus are canceling policies for any reason including hunting. The person that told me about this wanted to allow me to hunt on his property but was afraid if his insurance company found out he would be canceled and then not be able to find a policy. To put this in context there were two very large and devastating fires in this area last Summer which is why they do not want to write policies for the area.

Quite honestly, someone telling you that they can't allow you to hunt because of liability issues related to their insurance is either 1) just blowing smoke up your a$$, or 2) needs to be told to find a better insurance company.  We own property on which we host hunters every year.  I specifically discussed the liability concerns with our insurance carrier and was assured that allowing hunting (which is statistically one of the safest recreational pastimes there is) was not a concern.

Now, we do require a release of liability document to be signed, but that is just an additional peace-of-mind thing we do so that our guests understand that we are not liable if something were to happen.  Perhaps we hunters should carry one of those whenever we are seeking permission to hunt someone's property and just whip it out when they start talking liability issues just so we can see what their next excuse is going to be.   

[GobbleNut]

So the Republicans want to sell off your hunting land and the Democrats want to take your guns.  Looks like you're screwed.  Save the last bullet for yourself.

I am still somewhat concerned about the first (although less so right now than I was last year at this time), and I am not at all concerned about the second.  However, if either one becomes a reality, I can assure you there will be a lot more than one bullet expended!   

[eggshell]

In Ohio there is a law that you can not be sued by someone as a result of giving permission for hunting activities. The liability is a non issue. Now if you lease or charge then it's a business and you are subject to liability claims. Of course gross negligence over rules everything. If you run over a hunter with your tractor, your getting sued

[Greg Massey]

I think the main concern with most land owner's not giving you permission, they feel you will not respect the  property. I don't think it's so much thinking you will sue them.  But i think it's a good point to have a liability forum, relieving the owner of any liabilities ... let the land owner know you will help him around the farm or property and also with predator problems.

[NCL]

The number one reason I hear when I ask permission on private ground is I am afraid of being sued if something happens. A new one I heard this Spring is that insurance companies are starting to abandon the area and thus are canceling policies for any reason including hunting. The person that told me about this wanted to allow me to hunt on his property but was afraid if his insurance company found out he would be canceled and then not be able to find a policy. To put this in context there were two very large and devastating fires in this area last Summer which is why they do not want to write policies for the area.

Quite honestly, someone telling you that they can't allow you to hunt because of liability issues related to their insurance is either 1) just blowing smoke up your a$$, or 2) needs to be told to find a better insurance company.  We own property on which we host hunters every year.  I specifically discussed the liability concerns with our insurance carrier and was assured that allowing hunting (which is statistically one of the safest recreational pastimes there is) was not a concern.

Now, we do require a release of liability document to be signed, but that is just an additional peace-of-mind thing we do so that our guests understand that we are not liable if something were to happen.  Perhaps we hunters should carry one of those whenever we are seeking permission to hunt someone's property and just whip it out when they start talking liability issues just so we can see what their next excuse is going to be.   

Actually when I was talking with him the search for a new carrier is what brought up the liability issue. He said his insurance broker told him that carriers were not offering coverage in the area due to the large losses they took on the two huge wild fires here last year. He said any activity including hunting could cause cancellation of his policy and he would have a very difficult time finding a new one. I know the guy from my fly fishing club so I do not believe he was blowing smoke it was a genuine concern. As to waiver of liability forms. I have talked with an attorney about waiver of liability forms and was advised they are basically not valid as you can not waive liability.

[GobbleNut]

As to waiver of liability forms. I have talked with an attorney about waiver of liability forms and was advised they are basically not valid as you can not waive liability.

Of course, you are correct about this,...in the "official" legal sense.  My agreements are of more of a "personal nature" between me and whoever I am allowing to hunt.  When I look someone in the eye and tell them if I allow them to hunt they are making a contract with me personally, they get the picture.  A breech of our agreement will not be settled in a court of law! 

I am one of those types that if you and I agree to something, I will hold up my end of the bargain,....and you best hold up yours,...insurance companies and lawyers be damned.  Making that clear up front seems to lessen the possibility of misunderstandings considerably.  ...Then again, it also makes those folks that might have "nefarious intentions" think twice about wanting to screw with me. 

Perhaps you have seen the T-shirt with the slogan: "Don't mess with me.  I have reached the age where life in prison isn't all that much of a deterrent".  I really don't have that attitude (yet),...but I can sure bluff my way through it!