Call Consistency

[GobbleNut]

I am curious if you guys that make calls with a press or jig that stretch with a meter find that you can make calls that sound consistently the same?  When I used to buy calls from any of the call makers, there was rarely any consistency in the sound of any given call type.  I am wondering if that has changed in recent years?

I am pretty picky about the sound of the mouth calls I use, so I am talking about getting pretty much the exact same sound out of a call.  Making my own calls now,...and stretching "by hand" without any meters,...I get the sound I want out of a call by adjusting the cuts more than anything. 

So, again, my question to all of you mouth call makers,...can you get the exact same sound out of any call you make of the same design type?  I know that was not possible ten years ago because I bought way too many calls that were inconsistent. Has the process changed to a degree with the use of meters and such to achieve precise consistency of sound?

[gergg]

Before I bought a press I thought the same thing....geez these calls are never the same, seemed like I needed to buy 10 to get 1-2 "good" ones. With the press they are very consistent, almost every call is a good one, they might vary slightly, but they are all dang good. so yeah, it is surprising how bad store bought calls are, at least the ones I was buying 5 years ago.

[Lonehowl]

I would say very consistent. About as consistent as you can get I guess with a material like latex rubber coupled with human hands. I really think that is the true variable....the material... and the  shape that it is in (flat, wrinkles, etc). Im not sure Id want it perfect really, there should always be a bit of skill and experience involved in building anything imo.
Mark

[GobbleNut]

Okay,...good to know.  Taking this a bit further, do you have a precise way of measuring reed setback, backstretch, and cuts in your calls?  How to you insure those elements are consistent in each call you make?

From my experience, small variations in setback, backstretch, and cuts can make a significant difference in sound quality.  What methods do you use to get precision in those elements?

I would say very consistent. About as consistent as you can get I guess with a material like latex rubber coupled with human hands. I really think that is the true variable....the material... and the  shape that it is in (flat, wrinkles, etc). Im not sure Id want it perfect really, there should always be a bit of skill and experience involved in building anything imo.
Mark

I agree, Mark...
Jim

[compton30]

Okay,...good to know.  Taking this a bit further, do you have a precise way of measuring reed setback, backstretch, and cuts in your calls?  How to you insure those elements are consistent in each call you make?

From my experience, small variations in setback, backstretch, and cuts can make a significant difference in sound quality.  What methods do you use to get precision in those elements?

I would say very consistent. About as consistent as you can get I guess with a material like latex rubber coupled with human hands. I really think that is the true variable....the material... and the  shape that it is in (flat, wrinkles, etc). Im not sure Id want it perfect really, there should always be a bit of skill and experience involved in building anything imo.
Mark

I agree, Mark...
Jim

If there's a precise way of measuring reed setback, back tension, and getting your cut depth and angle so that they're the exact same every time, I'm not aware of it. I just figure once you "know what it looks like" then you can attempt to replicate it over and over again. Is it exact every time? More than likely not. I'm not sure if there is a good way that's also a good use of time. 

And as for the consistency of using some sort of gauge to measure side tension, whether it be a dial or even a set of calipers on a hand jig, I've found that you can really make a consistent product. I've found that once I've found a call that will run after making a few, when I attempt to make a new one, if that call is going to be crap, it's because I screwed up the initial cut(s) and it needs fiddled with to bring it to life. Usually I can find the turkey in it, but sometimes I've just screwed it up and it goes to the trash.

[GobbleNut]

Again, good information to know, Ben and Mark.  I don't use any kind of tension measuring devices,...just stretch my calls by "feel".  There are both advantages and disadvantages to that, I believe.  Since I stretch the reeds individually, that allows me to vary the tension in each reed.  I think that is good in some regards, but it also adds another variable to call making that is difficult to control.

I have found that I can get pretty good consistency in call sound stretching the way I do, but there is no question I can't control that variable like you guys do.  Most of my fine-tuning is done by adjusting the cuts.  Knowing how the cutting affects the sound and how to modify the reeds to get to where I am I satisfied with the end product has really made the difference for me.

For sure, there are times when I just can't find that sound and just give up on a call,...but those instances seem to be fewer and fewer nowadays.
Jim

[Bwk]

I have my pliers marked so I can crimp the frame the same every time and my scissors marked for depth of cut so its the same every time. Helps me get pretty good consistency. Too many variables in the latex to get it perfect every time..

[GobbleNut]

I have my pliers marked so I can crimp the frame the same every time and my scissors marked for depth of cut so its the same every time. Helps me get pretty good consistency. Too many variables in the latex to get it perfect every time..

Does anybody have some method of assuring the same angle on a cut every time?  That is another variable that impacts the sound,...and is another factor that I just guess at based on "feel". 

[Bwk]

Angle is just by eyeball and feel for me I guess. Never thought about that aspect too much I have too admit.

[Ihuntoldschool]

Good question.  The biggest variable here is the caller, alot of it just depends on whose mouth the call is in.  If the caller is able to have consistency in his/her mouth calling mechanics and get the right amount of pressure, correct call placement every single time then yes many of them are very consistent. Obviously fit is very important and you want a call that fits your mouth.

[GobbleNut]

Good question.  The biggest variable here is the caller, alot of it just depends on whose mouth the call is in.  If the caller is able to have consistency in his/her mouth calling mechanics and get the right amount of pressure, correct call placement every single time then yes many of them are very consistent. Obviously fit is very important and you want a call that fits your mouth.

I agree totally that there is a pretty steep learning curve in mouth call use.  I personally think most folks never reach the point with mouth calls where they can stick just about any call in their mouths and somehow manipulate their mechanics to achieve the precise sound they are looking for.  I have been using mouth calls since the late '70's and I know I can't get the exact soundsI want out of any old call.

Yes, I can sound enough like a turkey to call them in,...but that is a far cry from getting precision out of a call.  For me, that precision is obtained strictly by the call construction,...and in turn, eliminating as many the variables in that construction as I can.  Admittedly, that is difficult because of the way I construct calls,...but, in my past experience, I very rarely bought a call from someone that sounded exactly like another of the supposed same construction,...even from the guys that I assumed had some sort of method of call-construction quality control.

From what I have experienced, obtaining the exact same tonal qualities, pitch, rasp, etc.,....as well as the ability to run through the various turkey calls without having some variation in quality of each individual sound,...is pretty difficult to do.  In fact, I am not sure it is even possible based on all the variables that affect sound. 

Hence, the point of my original question above.  I just wonder if anyone has found a way to control all those variable in such a precise manner to get the exact sound they want out of every call (of the same design) that they construct? I am not talking about "close" to the same sound,...I am talking about exactly the same sound.  For me, the only way I have found to achieve anything close to that is through manipulation of the cut design on each call.

[savduck]

Yep