At what point is an Eastern considered an Osceola?

[JMalin]

Chime in Florida natives.

[SD_smith]

Being from LaBelle I personally think it's the HWY 70 line. We've killed many birds around the Kissimmee River that had lots of white bars on the wings. I just think that's the southern end of the two populations breeding together. A true Osceola should have hardly any white bars.

[Turkeytider]

Being from LaBelle I personally think it's the HWY 70 line. We've killed many birds around the Kissimmee River that had lots of white bars on the wings. I just think that's the southern end of the two populations breeding together. A true Osceola should have hardly any white bars.

Ohhh...! And after all this time I thought it was just when an Eastern crossed the Florida state line! 

[Turkeyman]

Seems to me that, several years ago, I read whereas Ocala was the "borderline" between Eastern/Osceola hybrids and "true Osceolas". I imagine that line will continue southward until the entire state is hybrids. Does it really matter? If it weren't for the NWTF establishing these boundaries would anybody really care? Just turkey hunt and enjoy it. If you're hung up on it have your bird DNA'd...for a fee I imagine it could be done.

[Rapscallion Vermilion]

If you're hung up on it have your bird DNA'd...for a fee I imagine it could be done.

I doubt that would help.  The studies I've seen were not able to distinguish Easterns and Osceolas on the basis of DNA.  However those two, as a group, and the other subspecies are distinguishable through DNA.

[bbcoach]

I've heard the dividing line was Interstate 4.  North was recognized as Easterns and south was recognized as Osceolas.

[Bucktale]

I live and hunt in NE Florida near St Augustine. My son took photos of wings of 4 different gobblers we shot a few years ago on our lease and the appearance varied from Osceola to Eastern and inbetween. I had one mounted from here a couple years ago by a guy who does lots of Florida birds and he said Osceola, no question. I believe the state of Florida considers any below I-10 to be Osceola for what that's worth. I believe they're all mixed up around here, myself. Doesn't matter to me, I've shot plenty of Osceola south of here and Easterns north. Just fun to hunt.

[joeturkey]

This is the official FWC position for the Osceola and eastern turkey in florida.

[Old Gobbler]

Orlando area and south for the real thing .....backed up by Dr.Williams  none the less

[cracker4112]

I believe that the traits of Osceolas can be found throughout Florida, but true Osceolas are swamp birds.  The birds in the Green Swamp, are north of I4 and SR 70 and exhibit all of the true Osceola characteristics: light gobbling, long legs, black wings.  Likewise, I have killed several birds from the coastal swamps all the way up near St. Marks that look every bit Osceola. A couple weeks ago, we had an incredible hunt in which 4 of us each killed a longbeard.  One of the 4 had longer legs and black wings, north of Ocala near the Orange Creek swamp.  I have a piece of land I have hunted for a decade now which is south of the "line" and those birds seem very much eastern. Once you get north of the Green Swamp, its a crapshoot, and I'd say that most all of the birds are some degree of hybrid.

IMO if you feel the need to kill a "true" Osceola, stay south of the Green Swamp and if south of 70 it will definitely have the black wings and long legs.

My 2 cents and they're free lol.

[GobbleNut]

To kill a true Osceola, you first gotta look for the line on the ground where you are hunting that the NWTF put there.  Once you find that line, just stay on the south side of it and don't shoot any gobbler that is on the north side of it.  If a gobbler is on the north side of the line, do not shoot him on that side of the line because he is a full-blooded Eastern.  If he is headed south, just wait till he crosses the line and then you got yourself a full-blooded Osceola.

Now, if you have two tags and there are two gobblers together, wait 'til one of them is on the north side of the line and the other on the south side and shoot them both.  Then you got yourself two of the four subspecies of the Grand Slam.  You gotta make sure that the second one does not get back across that line before you shoot him, though, because if he does, then you only got yourself one subspecies. 

Now, if you're not sure you can kill one on each side of the line, try to wait 'til both of them are on the south side so that you will have two Osceola's instead of two Eastern's.  Osceola's are harder to get and cost more, so shoot'em on the right side of the line. 

[SCGobbler]

When he says y'all and not you guys.

[derek]

I don't hesitate calling either an osceola but found this was really cool.. side by side top bird from south Florida vs Orlando area bird bottom.

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[Bucktale]

Where exactly is that line, Gobblenut? Maybe we could get a crew together and draw a chalk line down it so there are no mistakes...?

[bbcoach]

The debate can be taken up as well for merriams.  A true merriam has white tip tail feathers.  Many hunt Nebraska and kill the buff colored merriam hybrid.  Many outfitters will tell you I have Osceolas or Merriams for the money but they don't.  A line drawn on a map is just a guide.