New developments in shotshells

[mtns2hunt]

I have been reading old posts and found the following statement from a forum member "allaboutshooting" from back in 2015?

"The new generation of shells with different sizes of shot like the 3rd Degree shells from Federal, containing both lead and tungsten-based shot and the "New" Magnum Blend shells with #4, #5, #7 shot, from Hevi-Shot, are very interesting. I expect that we'll see some specialized chokes for those shells, just as we have for the WLB shells."

Now I have been having some success with LB #4 and #6 shells with a simple Kicks choke. However, I have always been interested in "Blended loads." I have seen very little written/spoken on these blended loads so my question is: do these loads work well from 15 to 40 yards or more? Do they come in lead and hevi shot? Seems like I shot some Remington blended loads some time back that performed well but used copper plated shot. I have not kept up with many of the new choke designs so what chokes have been developed for blended loads in particular Or have the blended loads fallen out of favor? Seems to me that most of what is written is about WLB or Hevi shot these days.

Finally, I have never heard of 3rd degree blended shells from Federal nor seen them on the shelves of any local store. I also frequently peruse online stores and have not run into them. I did find an interesting article from Outdoor life comparing 3rd degree, WLB and Winchester double X. According to the authors the differences were fairly minor. Although I would be inclined to stick with LB after reading the article. It would be nice if Winchester could develop a blended LB load in my opinion.

The site for Outdoor life's article:http://www.outdoorlife.com/articles/hunting/2015/03/field-test-federals-3rd-degree-shotshells-near-and-far-ranges

A different article from The American Rifleman is much more favorable and provides more information on the 3rd degree. I think if I could find this shell I would like to try it. https://www.americanrifleman.org/articles/2016/4/8/tested-federal-premium-3rd-degree-turkey-loads/

[Uncle Nicky]

I had a fella named Rob Roberts work on my turkey gun, he tried every choke/shot combo imaginable, and finally settled on one of his custom chokes along with Winchester high density loads, #6. Once Winchester discontinued these, I called Rob back and asked for his suggestion, and he said Hevi-Shot blended (5,6, & 7). I've been using them for about 4 years, no complaints, and I know with complete confidence I have the ability to kill a turkey at 50 yards if I choose to do so.

[Tom Foolery]

After using straight 7's I see little need in a blended shot.  1/4oz of 4's and a 1/4oz of 5's does nothing but take up space for more 7's.  The Hevi7's out pattern everything I've tried hands down.   

[Marc]

 I have never been a fan of "blended "shells,  especially when considering using different materials with different densities.

I would certainly at the least think you would get some shots stringing issues, and I have had very little luck getting "duplex loads" quote to pattern well.

I would think or hope that most of us are shooting a Turkey at somewhere between 20 and 30 yards. It seems to me that we as turkey hunters have come to really overthink the situation. A full choke with Hevi-shot #6's will kill a turkey out to 40 yards all day long.

Tighter Turkey chokes, especially with higher density shot allows us to reach out a bit further, but I would hope that would be the exception not the rule. Personally I like  especially with higher density shot allows us to reach out a bit further, but I would hope that would be the exception not the rule. Personally I like Hevi-shot  because it gives me a bit more margin for error if I do not judge the range correctly.

But just about any load with any choke will kill a bird out to 30 yards.

[BABS9]

I use Hevi Shot magnum blends 5,6,7 and love them. One of the things I like best is they perform great at all distances. The 7 shot opens up a bit more at close ranges so your pattern isn't to tight and gives you a margin of error. And all the way out to 40 yds and even further the patterns are great. I shoot a Remington 11-87 with a hevi shot choke.

[snapper1982]

I have never been a fan of "blended "shells,  especially when considering using different materials with different densities.

I would certainly at the least think you would get some shots stringing issues, and I have had very little luck getting "duplex loads" quote to pattern well.

I would think or hope that most of us are shooting a Turkey at somewhere between 20 and 30 yards. It seems to me that we as turkey hunters have come to really overthink the situation. A full choke with Hevi-shot #6's will kill a turkey out to 40 yards all day long.

Tighter Turkey chokes, especially with higher density shot allows us to reach out a bit further, but I would hope that would be the exception not the rule. Personally I like  especially with higher density shot allows us to reach out a bit further, but I would hope that would be the exception not the rule. Personally I like Hevi-shot  because it gives me a bit more margin for error if I do not judge the range correctly.

But just about any load with any choke will kill a bird out to 30 yards.

That last line is not correct and should not even be said.

[Cut N Run]

I never got the blended ammo to perform as well as straight Hevi 7s or 6s in any of my gun\choke combinations.  I ended up giving the Magnum Blends to a buddy who liked them.  Why change to an inferior product and mess with what works great?

Jim

[Marc]

But just about any load with any choke will kill a bird out to 30 yards.

That last line is not correct and should not even be said.

You are correct, as I mis-spoke. Steel BB's in a skeet choke would be a poor choice, as would #9 lead shot...

I meant to say any reasonable load of  #4-#7 shot (with lead or denser materials) will work of of a Modified or tighter choke (probably even an I.C.) out to 30 yards quite effectively and consistently.  A modified choke with #6 shot (lead or denser) out of a 20 ga. or 12 ga. will consistently roll birds if you put the pattern on them, but I will not argue that a full choke or tighter is probably a better option.

I have killed a couple of birds while quail hunting...  One with #7.5's in an I.C. out of 12 gauge at about 35 yards, and one with #7.5's out of a 20 ga. with I.C.  Both birds were dead with one shot (both also presented good targets with the head and neck fully exposed).  No doubt this is not an optimal situation, but at the ranges I have killed most of my birds, any "reasonable" load and choke combination will work.

When it is done the way most of us do it, we are shooting a bird at close range on the ground, with a relatively stationary target (at least compared to wing-shooting).  The denser shot materials, and tight constrictions allow us to reach out a bit further as long as we can make the shot.  Admittedly, I have mis-judged birds once or twice, and was glad to have a good load/choke combination that still allowed me to come home with the bird...

But, the vast majority of my shots have been within 30 yards or less...  And at those ranges (especially for beginning shooters), I am not certain that these ultra-tight chokes are such an advantage...  The denser pellets are a benefit over lead (both for holding a tighter pattern and getting better penetration), but once again, at the ranges that I would guess most of us are shooting birds, these loads are probably "over-kill."  However, I would rather have "over-kill" rather than "under-kill."

These specialty loads were created more to market to the turkey hunters appeal, rather than something that turkey hunters need to kill birds better.  To me, gettin' em in range is the difficult part, and for the most part killin' em' once they are there is not all that complicated.

[snapper1982]

I have personally tested many guns that would not put up acceptable patterns at 30 yards with 4,5 and 6 shot. Both modified and full choked guns. I used such guns my first 2 years turkey hunting because I was under the impression that a few shot in the head was all that was needed. Took 3 shots on my first bird and 2 shots for my second. Both birds were 30 or closer on the first shot. Just dont want newbies to read that any gun with a shell of those shot sizes will kill at 30 yards.

[mtns2hunt]

Well, interesting discussion and I appreciate the feedback. I agree to a certain extent that any choke or load will kill a Turkey if he is close enough. However, I am interested in finding an optimum Turkey load that will hopefully provide a good pattern at 20 yards as well as 40 or even 50. Not all of us are experts and many are beginners that have a difficult time harnessing the excitement and adrenaline rush when after many attempts we finally get that Turkey into shotgun range either 20 yards or less or even 50 yards.

Last year I almost missed a bird very close in with the LB. so I am researching for a shell that is better at closer ranges as well as farther out. Normally I use LB 6 for woods hunting an LB #4 for field shooting. My results have been very good. However, I want to tweak my loads.

Federal 3rd degree has some very good reviews. I have also been hearing a lot about Hevi Shot #7's however, hevi shot has never shot well in my current Turkey shotgun. I have also read that Federal 3rd degree does not work well in ported chokes. I like the concept of blended shot with different densities and uneven shapes that impact flight and patterns. So in trying to save time I am very interested in hearing about first hand experiences from our online community. I respect all opinions.

[Happy]

Personally I like hevi shot straight #6's. I have a little wiggle room up close and personal and it is a sure thing at 40. It isn't gonna drop any jaws on this forum but it is darned effective for me. I just let em flop anymore and then walk out and get em.

Sent from my SM-G800R4 using Tapatalk

[Kylongspur88]

Personally I like hevi shot straight #6's. I have a little wiggle room up close and personal and it is a sure thing at 40. It isn't gonna drop any jaws on this forum but it is darned effective for me. I just let em flop anymore and then walk out and get em.

Sent from my SM-G800R4 using Tapatalk

This is what I shoot in more open areas. Plenty of energy at and past 40 yards and good killing patterns. If I'm in the woods and my shots are more up close and personal I'll still use lead 4's.

[paboxcall]

Personally I like hevi shot straight #6's. I have a little wiggle room up close and personal and it is a sure thing at 40. It isn't gonna drop any jaws on this forum but it is darned effective for me. I just let em flop anymore and then walk out and get em.

Sent from my SM-G800R4 using Tapatalk

This is what I shoot in more open areas. Plenty of energy at and past 40 yards and good killing patterns. If I'm in the woods and my shots are more up close and personal I'll still use lead 4's.

Where I landed.  I shoot straight 7s in Hevi, never saw the benefit of a mixed load either.

After using straight 7's I see little need in a blended shot.  1/4oz of 4's and a 1/4oz of 5's does nothing but take up space for more 7's.  The Hevi7's out pattern everything I've tried hands down.   

But I will also carry the old Winchester Supreme red hull #5 lead late in the season after the full green up, when things get close and personal.

[Gobble!]

I'm a firm believer in smaller shot. Larger shot only takes up space and hurts your down range pattern IMO. I went from lead 6s to Hevi 7s to tss 9s.

[Marc]

However, I am interested in finding an optimum Turkey load that will hopefully provide a good pattern at 20 yards as well as 40 or even 50.

Last year I almost missed a bird very close in with the LB. so I am researching for a shell that is better at closer ranges as well as farther out. Normally I use LB 6 for woods hunting an LB #4 for field shooting. My results have been very good.

Anything that puts a reasonable pattern out to 50 yards will be awful tight at 20 yards...  Laws of physics.

Denser pellets tend to have patterns that open a bit more slowly though, thus you can start off with a tad more open choke, and it will hold patterns out a bit further (i.e. TSS).  I have been impressed by some of the patterns put up by shooters on other sites (for wing-shooting) with some of the TSS loads, and how well those patterns hold together.  (Admittedly, I have zero personal experience with such loads).

It is my understanding with blended loads (especially those of different materials) that you will have more pellet collisions with pellets flying at different speeds (or at least decelerating at different speeds), and thus have longer shot strings...  Although for a relatively stationary target, shot stringing is not an issue cause the target is not moving.

I have fallen victim to the marketing of a couple different duplex loads, and have been horribly disappointed and frustrated at the patterning board with such loads.

Thus far I have been very happy with Hevi-Shot #6's, and with the right choke, it could probably kill birds further than I could consistently kill them (using the bead of my shotgun for sights).

Currently I am hunting in tighter areas, and have gone to a standard full choke (I feel has a sufficient pattern out to 40 yards)...  If I hunted more open areas, I would likely put in a tighter choke (knowing that I will have to be more careful with shot placement on close shots).