Disease?

[Brantley]

I pulled a breadt out from one of the birds I killed this spring. As I was cleaning it up a bit I noticed several spots that were a little discolored (darker). I found these spots were some weird mass under the surface and embedded in the meat. I cut them out and they were black. Really disgusting. I tossed the breast and started looking up poultry disease. I found something called breast blisters in chicken but no mention of it in wild turkey. Anyone have an idea of what that could be?

[Jroddc]

Could it have taken a body shot from another hunter?

[hunter22]

Lead poisoning.

[Dr Juice]

Lead poisoning.

X2


All The Way!

[Brantley]

Yeah, I guess it could've been peppered at some point, but I never found any pellets in the breast. The bird didn't have any feathers on its shanks, which I attributed to preening for mites. Would lead poisoning make hard masses in the meat?

[g8rvet]

http://www.hobbyfarms.com/breast-blisters-in-turkeys/

By lead poisoning, they mean shot by, not ingested.  Birds get real lead poisoning only by ingestion, not by it being in their muscle. That gets walled off and does not leak into the blood stream.  If it is in their crop or gizzards, digestive enzymes cause the lead to leach into the blood stream.  It does not cause breast lesions. It does cause muscle wasting(think small/atrophied breast tissue), blood abnormalities and neurolgic disease.

Sounds a lot like birds that I have seen that were shot - I see it more in ducks, but have seen it in turkeys.   

[Marc]

Great post g8rvet.

As far as finding pellets in the breast...  Generally scar tissue forms around any pellets, and that scar tissue becomes hard and dark in color.  If you break apart that tissue, you will likely find the pellet.  The area of scar tissue is generally considerably larger than the original pellet.

Interestingly, with steel, I have found that areas around the wound are green in color and have not yet found a bird with scar tissue surrounding a steel pellet in a duck.  According to what I have learned, steel pellets rust preventing the formation of scar tissue, and making it far more likely for infection (and death) to follow. (Although off topic, I would love your input on this G8rvet)

[g8rvet]

Birds have an odd response to bacterial infections. Many bacteria that would kill humans will barely affect them and vice versa. Probably due to higher body temp typical of birds. 

I have seen the green in a turkey shot by an obvious rifle bullet. I always assumed the green was the formation of bacterial endotoxins in the tissue, like necrosis (or dying tissue), but do not know that for certain. 

I have never read that about steel vs lead.  Seems like there would be some oxygen, but the oxygen at that location should be intracellular or bound to red blood cells, so it would seem like the rust process would take a while. Maybe it occurs, but at a slow pace.

Best study I could find said:
We assessed the potential for embedded steel and tungsten-bismuth-tin (TBT) shot to adversely affect health of mallards (Anas platyrhynchos). Ducks were implanted with three number four steel (n = 19) or TBT (n = 20) shot pellets in their pectoral muscles. None of seven hematology parameters measured differed in response to treatment (P > or = 0.17). At necropsy 1, 2, 4, and 8 wk posttreatment, we observed only localized tissue reactions to embedded steel or TBT shot. Reactions differed grossly: after wk 1, embedded steel shot were enveloped in 0.5 to 2 mm grayish capsules, whereas TBT shot were surrounded by thinner (< 0.5 mm), translucent capsules. Corrosion of steel shot was apparent. Microscopic lesions associated with steel shot were characterized by moderate to severe histiocytic and lymphocytic inflammation and considerable particle deposition, whereas histiocytic inflammation was mild and particle deposition minimal in TBT lesions. Overall scores of inflammation at steel shot implant sites were greater (P < or = 0.043) than at TBT sites during wk 1 and 8. Inflammation at steel implant sites was relatively consistent over the 8-wk period, but decreased (P = 0.0017) at TBT sites by wk 8. Weights of steel shot recovered from muscle tissue declined logarithmically (R2 = 0.978, P = 0.0014) over 8 wk, but TBT shot weights remained unchanged (P = 0.255). Embedded TBT shot, as compared to steel, resisted corrosion and induced comparatively mild inflammatory responses in mallard muscle tissue. However, inflammatory reactions to both embedded steel and TBT shot were localized and had no detectable systemic effects on mallard health under experimental conditions. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8627918

[Happy]

Lot of big words in that article but am I correct in saying that the studies show no serious health risk with steel shot imbedded in ducks although there will be localized indications and that bismuth shot is slightly better?

[g8rvet]

Yes.   It also said steel, while it had much worse inflammation, did not cause systemic illness.

[Happy]

Ok. Thank you.

[mtns2hunt]

Interesting study. So since there is no systemic toxicity the bird should be okay to eat. However considering the local infections the bird must be cooked to a high temperature to be safe. Providing one would choose to cook and eat such a bird. The question then begs the answer: have we made the correct diagnosis - post mortem. I think I would follow Brantley's lead and throw it out.

[Cove]

Here is a mass I found in a bird this past season. There were several bruised areas on one breast and a few pellets below the skin. Pellet also inside the mass, may have been more, I quit looking. My guess is you were dealing with a similar issue. And those aren't my pellets, I shoot much smaller TSS.

[g8rvet]

Yuck.  I cut well away from any unhealthy tissue. Had to throw out one whole side one time on a bird. Was all green.  Ate the good side though.

[wvmntnhick]

I'd have a hard time telling myself it's safe to eat at all after looking at that pic and hearing some of these stories. I don't like to take chances with wild game, or any meat for that matter.


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