50 yard pattern

[Bigeclipse]

All...I wanted to test some longbeard XR number 6s out of my shotgun. I have never really been able to find a great load in this gun so I was contemplating buying a new one. Anyways I think I have found a good load. At 40 yards I got 187 in a 10 inch ring on a clean bore. I averaged 165-175 after that. I have always got more pellets with a clean bore so I'm hoping further testing shows it to be averaging 170s to 180s on clean bore. Anyways, after about 10 shots sighting in my red dot I decided to try 50 for crap and giggles. At 50 I got 108 and then 115 pellets in a 10 inch circle. Now I would never intentionally advocate a 50 yard shot but I must say it is nice knowing if I mess up my calculation on range (yes I own a range finder) and I thought the bird was 40 but was really 50...I would still be making an ethical kill. I wonder if the 50 yard shot would have had more pellets on target if it was a clean bore shot? Anyways seems like a HUGE drop in pellet count from 40 to 50 yards which was quite surprising.

[Rapscallion Vermilion]

No surprise at all.  The drop off is going to go something like the distance squared as the pattern spreads.  In your case, going from 40 to 50, would be a factor of 0.64, or 165 drops to 106.

[Gamblinman]

Don't forget...not only a loss of pattern density, but loss of energy too. After 40 yds, even lead drops off fast in retained energy.

[Bigeclipse]

Don't forget...not only a loss of pattern density, but loss of energy too. After 40 yds, even lead drops off fast in retained energy.

Understood and that's why I'd never intentially shoot at 50. I have searched around and it appears longbeard  #6s retain enough at 50 for  head/neck penetration for an ethical kill.

[lowoctane]

 
Without trying to appear like a snob or know it all, I thought this forum was about 40 yds as the acceptable ethical distance for clean kills...my hunts usually yield a bird within 20-30 yds, and if I'm really talking turkey, quite a bit less yardage than that. Do I like to hot rod my guns? Yes! BUT, I'm about the hunt instead of the shot. Anyone who's hunted this magnificent creature knows how wily and unpredictable they are, which makes the hunt so spectacular, especially when you've done everything correct. I fear that far too often we, as hunters, get so wrapped up in what are guns can do that we forget the actual hunt. It's another reason why I appreciate this site and it's stance on limiting our testing and talk to 40 yds. I personally dislike the idea of long distance hunting and prefer the up close challenge that this type of hunt presents. And, I think we do a disservice to hunters that are growing into this sport by pushing longer shots instead of promoting successful hunting skills. 

[Bigeclipse]

Without trying to appear like a snob or know it all, I thought this forum was about 40 yds as the acceptable ethical distance for clean kills...my hunts usually yield a bird within 20-30 yds, and if I'm really talking turkey, quite a bit less yardage than that. Do I like to hot rod my guns? Yes! BUT, I'm about the hunt instead of the shot. Anyone who's hunted this magnificent creature knows how wily and unpredictable they are, which makes the hunt so spectacular, especially when you've done everything correct. I fear that far too often we, as hunters, get so wrapped up in what are guns can do that we forget the actual hunt. It's another reason why I appreciate this site and it's stance on limiting our testing and talk to 40 yds. I personally dislike the idea of long distance hunting and prefer the up close challenge that this type of hunt presents. And, I think we do a disservice to hunters that are growing into this sport by pushing longer shots instead of promoting successful hunting skills. 

Did you read my posts? I not once said I would intentionally shoot 50 yards. I simply patterned at 50 just to see. I am an avid bow hunter as well. There have been a few times I would have sworn the deer was at 30 yards but it was 40. Or 40 yards and it was 50. All I was saying is it is nice to know should I shoot thinking a bird was 40 and I made a mistake and it was 50 then it is nice to know it would still be a kill and not a wounded bird.

[owlhoot]

Without trying to appear like a snob or know it all, I thought this forum was about 40 yds as the acceptable ethical distance for clean kills...my hunts usually yield a bird within 20-30 yds, and if I'm really talking turkey, quite a bit less yardage than that. Do I like to hot rod my guns? Yes! BUT, I'm about the hunt instead of the shot. Anyone who's hunted this magnificent creature knows how wily and unpredictable they are, which makes the hunt so spectacular, especially when you've done everything correct. I fear that far too often we, as hunters, get so wrapped up in what are guns can do that we forget the actual hunt. It's another reason why I appreciate this site and it's stance on limiting our testing and talk to 40 yds. I personally dislike the idea of long distance hunting and prefer the up close challenge that this type of hunt presents. And, I think we do a disservice to hunters that are growing into this sport by pushing longer shots instead of promoting successful hunting skills. 

Did you read my posts? I not once said I would intentionally shoot 50 yards. I simply patterned at 50 just to see. I am an avid bow hunter as well. There have been a few times I would have sworn the deer was at 30 yards but it was 40. Or 40 yards and it was 50. All I was saying is it is nice to know should I shoot thinking a bird was 40 and I made a mistake and it was 50 then it is nice to know it would still be a kill and not a wounded bird.

No you should not shoot !  If you don't know how far that animal is, turkey or deer ,shotgun or bow you should not shoot. When using a rangefinder , use it before to mark known yardages. Intentional or accidental. No reason for it with rangefinders or at the least pacing it off . Practice pacing at a known distance to become familiar with it. A 30 to 40 yard test comparison would have shown the shot fall-off at 10 more yards. Anyone can read enough on the web to try to make the case that lead shot #6 is effectively a 100 percent killer at 50 yards, even though scientific tests show and recommend it is not.
longbeard lead is lead..There are just too many variables out in the fields and woods.

[Bigeclipse]

You clearly didn't read my posts. I own a rangefinder. And I do exactly what you said but we all know that's not how exactly it always turns out. If you have been hunting long enough then you know I'm right.

[owlhoot]

You clearly didn't read my posts. I own a rangefinder. And I do exactly what you said but we all know that's not how exactly it always turns out. If you have been hunting long enough then you know I'm right.

oh i read them , i know you have a range finder. Which is why are you so worried about the mistakes? i started turkey hunts in 78, bow hunts in 79. Which is long before rangefinders and still never flung arrows at game or took shots at turkeys out of range of my guns.

[Bigeclipse]

Ok I'll give you an example. 2 years ago, I got into a climber tree. I ranged the nearby trees. On my left a deer came. He was near a 35 yard tree I had ranged. He took a couple steps back. About 20 yards to his right was a tree I ranged at 40 yards. He looked like he was right in line with that tree. I slung my arrow. I noticed it hit lower than where I was aiming but still an ethical kill. When out of my stand I found where I had shot at him and realism it was not in line with the 40 yard tree as I had thought. He was right at 47 yards. In the hard woods that I hunt...Sometimes depth perception is a bit scued. I have YET to lose a deer and turkeys. I have only shot one turkey past 40 yards and it was 42 yards. Once again...I would NEVER intentionally shoot one past 40 yards but MISTAKES do happen and WILL happen again. I am sure so why NOT test your equipments capabilities to see your margin of error. I KNOW my margin of error is 50 yards now. If I believe with all my confidence the turkey is very close to 40 yards...I will be shooting. Again no one said 50 yards. You must be the most perfect hunter I know to have never made a mistake.

[lowoctane]

Bigeclipse: obviously I mistook some of your post and do apologize sir. That's what happens when my sleep is interrupted by dogs in the middle of the night!

[Bigeclipse]

Bigeclipse: obviously I mistook some of your post and do apologize sir. That's what happens when my sleep is interrupted by dogs in the middle of the night!

I apologize as well as my last remark was it bit cold about being a perfect hunter. I agree with you. If I do not feel confident the turkey is inside 40...or even 30 yards I do tend to pull back and not let one fly but I am also a realist and know that I might make a mistake...whether it be due to nerves or whatever. I know I will likely never think a turkey is 40 and it is really 50+ plus yards. I am just now more comfortable that should I make a mistake thinking the turkey is 40 but it is really 46 yards...I will have a dead turkey and not wounded.

[owlhoot]

Yep my apologizes too. I have seen a rangefinder do that.  Now I am far from perfect as you say.
Guess i just try to error on the side of caution, shoot less than my max effective range.
Try to learn from my mistakes through many years though.


Have a great season. Good luck to you and your team !

[lowoctane]

No worries, gentlemen! Another reason why I like this site is because of the quality people on it! 

[Bigeclipse]

Yep my apologizes too. I have seen a rangefinder do that.  Now I am far from perfect as you say.
Guess i just try to error on the side of caution, shoot less than my max effective range.
Try to learn from my mistakes through many years though.


Have a great season. Good luck to you and your team !

That's true. Doing a lot of 3d shoots has definitely helped my abilities with mental picture and distances. Goodluck to you as well! I 100 percent agree that it is much more about calling them close than it is about shooting just to get a bird!