Has anyone seen this EXTREMELY DANGEROUS decoy ?

[FireFly908]

Trevan

I appreciate your attempt to explain "fanning" birds and how well it works BUT you obviously don't understand the dangers of it.  Just using a Gobbler call is considered dangerous, especially on public ground, and is used only sparingly by safe, experienced hunters after observing and considering the situation.  They don't put the killing of a turkey above their safety.  Turkey hunters that need a guide that uses "fanning" are most likely beginners that don't understand the dangers of this practice and these are the same individuals that your product is appealing to. 

Yes, "fanning" works and nobody doubts that, but it's just downright dangerous.  Since all the people on this site are serious turkey hunters that enjoy turkey hunting, there is no way they want to do something dangerous to get that gobbler as soon as possible.  They enjoy being out in the field and enjoying the wildlife and coming home at the end of the day in one piece so they can go back the next day.  You Must Understand How Dangerous The Practice Of "FANNING" Is!

It sounds like what you are saying is that turkey hunting can be an inherently dangerous sport...I agree 100%.

-Trevan
trevan@wallhangeroutdoorproducts.com

Trevan, you are wrong!  Hunting is not an inherently dangerous sport!  But some people tend to make it that way and then products like yours makes it a whole lot easier to change it into an inherently dangerous sport.  And you also convinced me that you will never understand the danger of your product.  You have my prayers and forgiveness!

[shootumindaface]

It sounds like what you are saying is that turkey hunting can be an inherently dangerous sport...I agree 100%.

-Trevan
trevan@wallhangeroutdoorproducts.com

Actually No, via the NWTF website "2.95 per 100,000 incidents last spring. Statistically, turkey hunting is four times safer than ping-pong, and you are 50 times more likely to take a trip to the emergency room if you play golf."

So No it is not dangerous but products and the practices suggested by your product are what will lead to a rise in incidents..

[HoleInTheWall Longbeard]

Trevan ~
Your twisted logic is absolutely astonishing !

[navert]

I understand your concerns with our decoy and I thank you for your input.  I don't have time to sit on a messageboard and argue with all the keyboard kings out there but I would like to answer a few comments and I will try to let you guys continue to discuss without my input.

Trevan

I appreciate your attempt to explain "fanning" birds and how well it works BUT you obviously don't understand the dangers of it.  Just using a Gobbler call is considered dangerous, especially on public ground, and is used only sparingly by safe, experienced hunters after observing and considering the situation.  They don't put the killing of a turkey above their safety.  Turkey hunters that need a guide that uses "fanning" are most likely beginners that don't understand the dangers of this practice and these are the same individuals that your product is appealing to. 

Yes, "fanning" works and nobody doubts that, but it's just downright dangerous.  Since all the people on this site are serious turkey hunters that enjoy turkey hunting, there is no way they want to do something dangerous to get that gobbler as soon as possible.  They enjoy being out in the field and enjoying the wildlife and coming home at the end of the day in one piece so they can go back the next day.  You Must Understand How Dangerous The Practice Of "FANNING" Is!

It sounds like what you are saying is that turkey hunting can be an inherently dangerous sport...I agree 100%.

-Trevan
trevan@wallhangeroutdoorproducts.com

Trevan, you are wrong!  Hunting is not an inherently dangerous sport!  But some people tend to make it that way and then products like yours makes it a whole lot easier to change it into an inherently dangerous sport.  And you also convinced me that you will never understand the danger of your product.  You have my prayers and forgiveness!

I did not say it *is* inherently dangerous, I said it *can be* inherently dangerous.  I only meant that when people are handling firearms or bows the possibility exists that someone could get hurt, therefore it *can* be dangerous.  I do understand that this product can be dangerous if the proper care isn't taken...just think about it like this- Firearms can be super-dangerous if they aren't handled properly and the utmost care isn't taken to make sure they are pointed in the right direction, unloaded when they are supposed to be, etc.  Diaphragm calls can be a serious choking hazard if not used properly.  Do you hammer turkey call companies that manufacture diaphragm calls simply because someone could choke on it if they aren't careful?  Maybe you would but I wouldn't.

I have a serious question.. How are you going to be able to sleep at night when somebody is shot using your product?

Let's say that the absolute worst thing happens and a trespasser thinks that a person with a decoy mounted on their gun barrel is a real turkey and shoots them...why would someone skip the irresponsible hunter and go straight to blaming our decoy?  With that logic, why not blame the company that manufactured the ammunition or blame the maker of the firearm...do you sue the maker of the "good" hunter's firearm or do you sue the maker of the trespasser's?  Or better yet, you could actually blame the landowner for not posting enough "no hunting" signs to keep the trespassers out.  If the landowner did put up signs, you could blame the manufacturer of the signs because the ink wasn't bright enough for the trespasser to notice as he crossed the fence.  Ah, don't forget about that fence...whatever company designed that fence needs to pay for not designing a more deterring fence.  Or, the logical person might blame the TRESPASSER WHO CLEARLY DID NOT PROPERLY IDENTIFY HIS TARGET AND WAS BREAKING THE LAW BY TRESPASSING!

It sounds like what you are saying is that turkey hunting can be an inherently dangerous sport...I agree 100%.

-Trevan
trevan@wallhangeroutdoorproducts.com

Actually No, via the NWTF website "2.95 per 100,000 incidents last spring. Statistically, turkey hunting is four times safer than ping-pong, and you are 50 times more likely to take a trip to the emergency room if you play golf."

So No it is not dangerous but products and the practices suggested by your product are what will lead to a rise in incidents..

Are you saying that even if my product causes 4 times more turkey hunting "incidents," then Turkey Hunting will still be at least as safe as playing ping pong?  If golfing is 50 times more likely to send you to the emergency room, we ought to be beating up on golf ball manufacturers because if they would make their balls fly farther then the poor golfers wouldn't have to swing so hard and maybe they wouldn't throw their backs out...Or maybe when someone slices a golf ball and nails the guy trying to tee off 2 holes down, we should sue the golf club maker for making a golf club that slices when you don't swing it right...it might just be me, but I would blame the person who made a bad hit on the ball, not the club maker.


Again thanks for your input.

-Trevan
trevan@wallhangeroutdoorproducts.com

[Gobble!]

there are warnings all over there site. people know what they are signing up for.
Its called natural selection

[3.5inchpainfulldeath]

this topic is like .  On a positive note I just recieved my deer skin coat complete with custom made antler hat...  i can't wait to try that out this fall.

[3.5inchpainfulldeath]

 

You forgot to glue the big red target to your forehead...

[shootumindaface]

Sad thing is, Ronnie is joking.. This guy is looking make a fast buck

[wareagle99]

I really only think it's dangerous if someone else is being stupid....stupid happens, but lets cut this guy a break.  If you dont like the product dont buy it!!!!!  I'm kinda tierd of seeing this site being used to bash others....Will sold his company, Eddie put out the squeelin hen, Waddell had an affair....Whaaaa, Whaaaa, Whaaaaaa.....

I'm gonna try fanning.  I'm not gonna buy this guys decoy, but I ain't gonna rag him either....ease up fellas!!!!!  DANG

Navert,  dont think you going to make much progress defending your product here, but welcome to the site anyway....hope to see you on some other posts

[FireFly908]

I really only think it's dangerous if someone else is being stupid....stupid happens, but lets cut this guy a break.  If you dont like the product dont buy it!!!!!  I'm kinda tierd of seeing this site being used to bash others....Will sold his company, Eddie put out the squeelin hen, Waddell had an affair....Whaaaa, Whaaaa, Whaaaaaa.....

I'm gonna try fanning.  I'm not gonna buy this guys decoy, but I ain't gonna rag him either....ease up fellas!!!!!  DANG

Navert,  dont think you going to make much progress defending your product here, but welcome to the site anyway....hope to see you on some other posts

wareagle99, this is a turkey hunting site and as a result it has the right to critique products.  Not all critiques are negative (or "bashing" in the bashing manner you put it).  Other things such as "Will sold his company" or "Waddell had an affair" I have never heard of or even participated in since these are rumors and are totally different than critiques and I just don't care about them.  But, the bottom line is why shouldn't this site have the right to critique a product and if somebody wants to differ with our critique, why shouldn't we beg to differ with them or them with us?

This thread has already stated my feelings on fanning but I'm not going to criticize you for doing it because you are not telling me that I should try fanning.  If you do, then we can discuss it.

Also, I have nothing personal against Navert.  If he posts something other than telling me the virtues of his product, then there are no discussions like what has been going on.  I would be more than glad to hear from him.

I don't know if you realize it or not, but I'm not a big poster.  But this subject is something that I feel would be wrong to be silent about.  So let's take it for what it is and not get upset about what has been said.  We're not going to change most people's minds anyway.  We're just discussing the issue and possibly some noobe's are sorting the issue out while lurking.

[Woodsman4God]

What did Forrest say, Stupid is that decoy??

[HoleInTheWall Longbeard]

FireFly ~


                

[lightsoutcalls]

As for the use of decoys, I will just stick with my DSDs, thanks.

As for the issue of liability, Navert, take a long, hard, honest look at the argument you are trying to make about golf balls and trucks, etc.  The manufacturers of golf balls and trucks do not specifically build a product and instruct you to place the product 2 feet in front of your face.  A golf ball and a truck do not mimic objects that are expressly the focus of being shot at.  Think about it... The primary focus of turkey hunting is shooting a turkey, right?  You are making a product whose primary purpose is to increase the odds of successfully shooting a turkey, right?  Your product does its very best to mimic a live turkey, right?  Even though you put out your disclaimer, you are instructing people that your product was created with a clamp for the express purpose of clamping it onto their gun, right?  By the very nature and design of a gun, with that product clamped on your gun, it will be only about 2 feet in front of your face, right?   That said, how can you not understand that by producing this product and giving such instructions for its use that you will not be held liable if someone is injured or dies while using it? 

I'm not trying to degrade you as a person or your company, only to try to help you understand that no amount of money gained from the sale of a product is worth the risk you are placing yourself in regarding liability.  I did some work several years ago for an attorney in the town where I live.  This attorney was an avid pheasant hunter and big game hunter (hads several moose mounts in his workshop out back and a huge trophy room of African game in his office).  At the time I was doing some contract work for him, he was working on a lawsuit against Thompson Center.  His client lived in a state where deer could be hunted with a pistol, but not a rifle.  The plantiff he was working for had mounted a 7mm mag barrel on the pistol frame for the encore.  Even though the parts allowed this to physically fit, somehow the action did not hold up to the pressure of the round.  The hunter was horribly disfigured, but lived after the gun exploded.  I know that your decoy will likely not explode on its own, even out of misuse.  The moral of this story is this... There are irresponsible people out there.  There are people out there that just don't have the sense of your average box of rocks.  If even one of those people buy your product and get hurt or killed as a result, there are attorneys, even ones that are avid sportsmen, who will jump at the chance to own everything that you currently think is yours.  I hope it never happens, but don't say that you haven't been cautioned.   

[shootumindaface]

I have a serious question.. How are you going to be able to sleep at night when somebody is shot using your product?

Let's say that the absolute worst thing happens and a trespasser thinks that a person with a decoy mounted on their gun barrel is a real turkey and shoots them...why would someone skip the irresponsible hunter and go straight to blaming our decoy?  With that logic, why not blame the company that manufactured the ammunition or blame the maker of the firearm...do you sue the maker of the "good" hunter's firearm or do you sue the maker of the trespasser's?  Or better yet, you could actually blame the landowner for not posting enough "no hunting" signs to keep the trespassers out.  If the landowner did put up signs, you could blame the manufacturer of the signs because the ink wasn't bright enough for the trespasser to notice as he crossed the fence.  Ah, don't forget about that fence...whatever company designed that fence needs to pay for not designing a more deterring fence.  Or, the logical person might blame the TRESPASSER WHO CLEARLY DID NOT PROPERLY IDENTIFY HIS TARGET AND WAS BREAKING THE LAW BY TRESPASSING!

Trevan you still haven't answered the question but instead have decided to pass the blame.. I never said anything about trespassing, many members here and folks across the country hunt properties whether in a lease, club or on public property..

I hope that any experienced hunter would think better about using your product.. But what you are doing is feeding on the new in experienced hunters.. So I will re write the question..

How are you going to feel if someone is using your product in the manner that it is intended to be used, is shot on a piece of property in which they and the shooter have permission to hunt said property.. I agree the shooter is partially to blame, but the incident is fully in a result of your decoy and its intentions.

[trkehunr93]

            This has to be about the stupidest, most dangerous thing I have ever seen!  I do not see this product cornering any market except maybe an increase in funeral home business.  Might want to go back to the drawing board with this one!!!!