35 yard gun max?

[peashooter]

Hello guys, this is my first post here after doing a lot of reading. Incredible site!

I have a Remington 870 Express (3 inch) 26" barrel. I've shot a few different 3" #5 lead shells through it with the two best being Winchester XX and Turkey Thugs. Surprisingly Winchester grey box 1.5 ounce patterns about as well (making me wonder if I could be over choked and blowing the higher payloads out more). I shot a 40 yard 10" with the thugs that scored 92 hits, but the average at 40 yards is closer to 75 hits, and down to 55 or so if the barrel is too clean or too dirty. The lower the hit number, the more spread out and patchy the pattern gets, with some holes bigger than I like.

At 35 yards I get a little over 100 hits, with a fairly even pattern. At 30 I'm around 150 hits and no turkey would stand a chance. I'm using a Jelly Head .665 choke.

I polished the barrel some using gun oil on 0000 steel wool chucked in a drill, and afterwards deep cleaned the barrel following the instructions found on here. I have not yet found or ordered the cleaners needed to do the bore polish that's popular on here, but when I look down the barrel, I can see pretty obvious rings every few inches. I think it would take some metal removal beyond just polishing to get rid of those tool mark rings.

I'm not new to guns in general, but new to turkey hunting and counting holes in a 10" circle. I'm not sure what to think with this gun and have some questions.

1.) How attainable is 100 evenly spaced hits at 40 yards with lead #5 (other than Long Beard)? Am I expecting too much for #5 lead?
2.) Is it likely that the rings in the barrel could be hurting the pattern this gun throws?
3.) Is it more likely that I need a tighter, or more open choke, or is it impossible to know without trying one or the other? The Jelly head/870 combo was highly rated on here and I was hoping for more, but I can understand that not all barrels are created equal.

I may be sending this gun back to Remington after turkey season ends. It does not eject shells very well. I have polished the chamber and removed a burr that the cases were hanging on as well as remove and clean the extractor, spring, plunger, etc. but it's still very weak and does not eject 100%. Rather than do more myself and void the warranty I might just send it back to have them go over it. Would you advise I also try to get the barrel replaced, or is what I'm describing common for 870's (my Lanber O/U is smooth as could be but has chrome lined barrels))?

As a side note: I am tempted to try #6's as I'm sure they'll put more shot in the pattern, but I'm on the fence of how I feel about taking shots over 35 yards with #6 lead anyway. #5's will already get me to 35 yards with sufficienty pattern density and I'd rather have the greater energy. I'm also against buying the spendy heavier than lead stuff, at least for now. The Long Beard is a possibility, but I'll probably wait till next year to try that if all else fails.

So, long story short: I'm not trying to build a lead-shooting gun that I expect to shoot an unreasonable distance with, but if 100 hits in a 10" circle at 40 yards is attainable without going to extremes I'd like my equipment to perform to the best of it's ability.

If anybody has advice for a turkey gun newbie I would appreciate it!

Thank you,

Tucker

[COssman14]

I have a 870 3" 26" Barrel with a Redhead Blackout .665 and Longbeard XR 3" #6 that puts 150 in a 10" circle at 40 yards.

[Longshanks]

I have a 870 3" 26" Barrel with a Redhead Blackout .665 and Longbeard XR 3" #6 that puts 150 in a 10" circle at 40 yards.

If you want to see an instant tight pattern out of that gun buy some Winchester LB's in 5's or 6's.  I have a new rem 870sm that had a barrel like you described with allot of tool markings. Sent it to my gunsmith and after extensive polishing it will turn 160's with XX 3/2/6's. Ventilator .655 is a killer choke in that gun if you want to give 6's a try. Honestly I have tried every gun choke combo with 5's and finally broke 100 for the first time with HV 3" 5's. Too much time and trouble for me to get the 5's over 100.  Winchester LB's will instantly give good numbers at 40 but the patterns from 0-30yds are super tight and you might want a red dot or scope. Best way for me to determine what I need out of any particular gun is the terrain I am hunting. The lease I hunted this year a factory full choke would have been fine with XX 5's or 6's.  Shots were inside 30yds due to the lay of the land. Hunting in the midwest I hunt with my tighter shooting guns at 40.

[lowoctane]

 
My experience with sending a gun to Rem wasn't a timely one. What yer experiencing isnt a great big deal to a gun repairman.  Personally, I would contact William @ Sumtoy as he's a guru and machinist, plus a great guy to deal with. He can make that gun do what you want it to!

[howl]

If I wanted 5s I'd go factory choke and FliteControl. Lead 6s will kill a turkey well past 40 yards. With the existence of the BPS and 835, there is no need to have to work on a pump shotgun to get it to work.

[mikejd]

Sounds to me like you just havn't hit your right choke shell combo yet.
I dont think you need to have any work done yet.

[the Ward]

Sounds to me like you just havn't hit your right choke shell combo yet.
I dont think you need to have any work done yet.

x2. The quickest and most cost effective route would be to try the win. longbeard in 5 shot with your existing choke. That should have no problems doing well over 100 in the 10" at 40 yrds. If you want to stick to conventional lead shells, you may need to go tighter on your choke. I have gotten over 100 with the Winchester "grey box" 3-1 7/8-5s and fed turkey thug 3-1 7/8-5s with a .650 Sumtoy in a Benelli. For comparison, this same gun has done 108 (low) to 129 (hi) with Winchester long beard 3-1 3/4-4s thru a kicks .665.Give Sumtoy a call and he will hook you up. On the functioning issue, I would contact Remington if your gun is still  under warranty. You paid good money for a gun and it should at least function correctly.

[peashooter]

Thanks for everyone's input. I think before next spring I'll talk to Sumtoy. For those that have done it, do you recommend sending the gun to him to let Sumtoy work up a choke for it, or just try one of his recommended chokes?

There's some extra money for shipping and services to let him work up a choke/load, but I'd imagine the result would be great.

Tucker

[lowoctane]

Thanks for everyone's input. I think before next spring I'll talk to Sumtoy. For those that have done it, do you recommend sending the gun to him to let Sumtoy work up a choke for it, or just try one of his recommended chokes?

There's some extra money for shipping and services to let him work up a choke/load, but I'd imagine the result would be great.

Tucker

What I'm gonna do...

[Swampchickin234]

The first 2 birds that I ever saw shot were with win 6s.  I killed one and my brother killed one with em.  Lead sixes will definitely hammer birds to 35-40......why even worry of shootin farther than that.      Also, though they are pretty expensive, hevi 13 sixes are hardto beat.  No experience with sevens, but there are very good things on here about them also.  ^^^and like the above posts, those long beards might help ya.  Before ya spend a lot of cash on chokes etc..simply switching loads may help. I would try long beards and hevi 13   Good luck brother


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[d.winsor]

My 870 SM had a barrel like that, no matter what I did or tried it would not shoot a 40 yard turkey pattern, had the rings you described in the barrel, I tried polishing it also didn't do any good.  I think it was a duck gun.  Any way believe it or not I took a chance and ordered a short, ported, turkey barrel off ebay,  There is no name on the barrel only the size shells it shoots.  It made the 870 SM shoot like a turkey gun, I don't count 10 inch circles but at 40 yards if I do my job a turkey will not walk out of the pattern.  I shot 3.5 inch winchester supreme HV #5's. 

[Gooserbat]

First, I would try longbeards, Second I would Try #6 shot (trust me after 60 birds with #6 I know it will kill at 40 plus a little wiggle room) Third, if you've polished it and still can see machine marks, (the machine marks are a dead ringer it's an Express apposed to a SP barrel as the final honing is skipped on express barrels as a cost saving measure)  you didn't polish it enough and you might try having it professionally done.  It's cheaper than you might think.

Lastly I have two 870 and neither of them will shoot #4 at all and #5 is marginal at best, but you load them with #6 and it's death and destruction all day long.

[Longshanks]

First, I would try longbeards, Second I would Try #6 shot (trust me after 60 birds with #6 I know it will kill at 40 plus a little wiggle room) Third, if you've polished it and still can see machine marks, (the machine marks are a dead ringer it's an Express apposed to a SP barrel as the final honing is skipped on express barrels as a cost saving measure)  you didn't polish it enough and you might try having it professionally done.  It's cheaper than you might think.

Lastly I have two 870 and neither of them will shoot #4 at all and #5 is marginal at best, but you load them with #6 and it's death and destruction all day long.

That's been the story with my 870's, they are all business with Win 6's but the 5 patterns are mediocre. Kicks .655 and Ventilator .655 best results.  Win LB XR's are guaranteed patterns to 40yds but may have to look into some optics. I have loaded up on XX, HV, and Super X 3" 6's. Should have enough for a lifetime.

[Spurcollecta]

1. Try Win Longbeards
2. Try a tighter choke

Doing 1 and 2 will likely yield the best results

[d.winsor]

Is there any reason you have not tried Winchester Longbeard XR #5's yet?