Clear vs rasp on trumpets?

[bwhana]

After a sight in / calling session with friends yesterday, it became obvious that my calling is more clear than my friends on the same calls. Stowe, Permar, wing-bone, cane yelpers...consistently clear for me, so I assume it is the way I draw air, and not the calls.

I have had success with mine, so the birds don't mind, but any suggestions or input on getting more rasp is welcome!  I'm sure others would like to know too.

[Zobo]

For me, generally, if I loosen my lips I can usually get more rasp (saliva doesn't hurt either) , but I'm sure it's different for others and there are more factors at play.

[MossyOak92]

I can get a little more rasp by drawing air but not dropping my jaw to do it. And just a little saliva pushed up to my lips.

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[Greg Massey]

I agree with lip pressure and i also think it depends on how your lips, like that style of lip stop... I hope this makes sense..  I see some of the lip stop design that in a way pushes your lips back and some of your lips go into the lip stop, for me this affects play for each individual depending on the build of the lip stop design and who's trumpet your playing.. Now a season trumpet play , may say this doesn't matter ... this is just what i have observed in trying to learn to play... BY no means am i any kind of expert with these trumpets.. This is all just my opinion... with dealing with lip seals on different style lip stops ...

[bwhana]

Great suggestions so far.  I saw the Farmer front porch video where he mentioned keeping a piece of hard candy in while calling, but have not tried that yet.

[EZ]

I think that any way you can learn to call benefits you as the caller. Anything you can do to learn air control is important. AIR CONTROL is EVERYTHING. Try paying the "Star Spangled Banner"....seriously.
It makes you control the air in many different ways.

I really wouldn't worry about rasp until you are very proficient with all your calls. I actually prefer a soft, fairly clear sound. That's the call for me that leads to turkey dinners, but, nothing wrong with throwing some rasp at them. My point is that I'd rather see you calling clear with great control, than raspy and mushy.

I call exactly the same way whether clear or raspy. I call with my tongue and throat. When calling clear, I draw air straight down the call and right down my throat. When calling raspy, I only move my lips back a slight bit so the air hits and vibrates my lower lip, and it does help to have in a chew or candy for a little saliva.

I just realized that this is very hard to descrbe, lol.

[RLAG]

Ez, looks like I got you thinking about exactly how you move your mouth after talking about it at unicoi

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[chefrific]

For what it's worth, I've called and killed turkeys with a trumpet with using no "rasp" far more than with it.  Come to think of it, I've killed more with just clucking and whining on one then yelping.  The yelp and rasp is overrated.  Cluck a few times on one and he'll let you know if you need to sit, move, or go to waffle house. 

[outdoorguy3]

I think that any way you can learn to call benefits you as the caller. Anything you can do to learn air control is important. AIR CONTROL is EVERYTHING. Try paying the "Star Spangled Banner"....seriously.
It makes you control the air in many different ways.

I really wouldn't worry about rasp until you are very proficient with all your calls. I actually prefer a soft, fairly clear sound. That's the call for me that leads to turkey dinners, but, nothing wrong with throwing some rasp at them. My point is that I'd rather see you calling clear with great control, than raspy and mushy.

I call exactly the same way whether clear or raspy. I call with my tongue and throat. When calling clear, I draw air straight down the call and right down my throat. When calling raspy, I only move my lips back a slight bit so the air hits and vibrates my lower lip, and it does help to have in a chew or candy for a little saliva.

I just realized that this is very hard to descrbe, lol.

Great help Mr. EZ  Thanks

[GregGwaltney]

For what it's worth, I've called and killed turkeys with a trumpet with using no "rasp" far more than with it.  Come to think of it, I've killed more with just clucking and whining on one then yelping.  The yelp and rasp is overrated.  Cluck a few times on one and he'll let you know if you need to sit, move, or go to waffle house.

I agree......the trumpet can make sweet soft talk.

[hpo]

For what it's worth, I've called and killed turkeys with a trumpet with using no "rasp" far more than with it.  Come to think of it, I've killed more with just clucking and whining on one then yelping.  The yelp and rasp is overrated.  Cluck a few times on one and he'll let you know if you need to sit, move, or go to waffle house.

All three are solid choices

[Spitten and drummen]

My Copenhagen keeps saliva flowing and is extremely helpful for rasp. Draw air through throat and don't to the jaw dropping or kissing method.

[DFelico]

I agree still a novice and was shown the kiss method first. Personally feel like I get more control and rasp just drawing air and not pulling too hard.

[Poconodoghunter]

It's all in the lips, they say a minting your mouth but I just add some saliva

[Delmar ODonnell]

I think that any way you can learn to call benefits you as the caller. Anything you can do to learn air control is important. AIR CONTROL is EVERYTHING. Try paying the "Star Spangled Banner"....seriously.
It makes you control the air in many different ways.

I really wouldn't worry about rasp until you are very proficient with all your calls. I actually prefer a soft, fairly clear sound. That's the call for me that leads to turkey dinners, but, nothing wrong with throwing some rasp at them. My point is that I'd rather see you calling clear with great control, than raspy and mushy.

I call exactly the same way whether clear or raspy. I call with my tongue and throat. When calling clear, I draw air straight down the call and right down my throat. When calling raspy, I only move my lips back a slight bit so the air hits and vibrates my lower lip, and it does help to have in a chew or candy for a little saliva.

I just realized that this is very hard to descrbe, lol.

This is so well put. It is frustrating how difficult it is for me to articulate how I'm making the sounds I'm making, even to myself as I'm making them. Here are my thoughts, but I by no means have the experience of EZ and other people, so I'd love any thoughts/feedback/counterpoints.

To me, it helps to think of rasp on a trumpet the same as rasp on a mouth call, in that the higher front end is caused by air moving over the tight reeds pressed against the roof of your mouth, and the back end rasp is caused by air vibrating over the top reed loosened by the dropping of your tongue. Applying that to trumpets, your lips, specifically on the back portion between the end of mouthpiece and mouth cavity are the reeds. So the front end is caused from the sudden burst of air coming across that portion of your bottom lip, and the back end caused by the stabilized and waning air you drew vibrating across your bottom lip.

Also, keeping in line with your lips as the reeds, I always think of lip pressure in the terms of tightening and loosening the reeds by pulling the edges of my mouth out in a smile, or vice versa, rather than ever putting pressure in the form of "biting down" with your lips. My non-scientific and unsupported thought is that by "biting down" or putting vertical pressure, you eliminate the chance of the back of lip being able to vibrate, whereas by widening my mouth, the front of your lips are tight, but the back is allowed to vibrate, creating a higher pitched but still somewhat raspy sound. Back pressure/hand chamber also makes a difference, in that a closed hand chamber will muffle a lot of rasp and vice versa.

I'd also echo EZ's thoughts on air control. With all calls, but especially trumpets, I think its easy for me to get in a habit of practicing repeated cadences rather than playing notes that form the sound I want for the situation I'm trying to mimmick. To combat that, I'll practice giving a specific number of clucks, yelps, and kees, and I've got go to songs I try now. Hint: for cutting and clucks, "Staying Alives" by the BeeGees is my go to

Again, I'm no expert nor do I have any musical ability or experience in acoustics whatsoever (tho I do think I could be a good backup for the Oom Papa MowMow guy in the Oak Ridge Boys). That's what has helped me, but I'd love to hear any feedback/thoughts.