State season alignment opinions

[dzsmith]

If you really want to take pressure off of birds then make south states a 14 day season and north states 14 days also with a 7 day overlap. One bird per week.

I tend to somewhat agree . I think bama is doing it right. Public opens later for non res.... No and 1 bird in first 10 days on public . It doesn't eliminate all pressure but it gives the residents a jump in time without the ability to slaughter out right off the bat, also forces the non res to kill and keep moving verses squat for 1/2 the season .

[WV Flopper]

 State agencies should control the season dates and take through sound data and studies. Not by an armchair biologist!

We have way to much public input now in WV, don't need more public input from out of state.

No, I do not like the idea of a US start date, or a regional start date either. Way more factors than just making people happy to consider.

[GobbleNut]

State agencies should control the season dates and take through sound data and studies. Not by an armchair biologist!

Unfortunately, many, if not most, wildlife agencies are governed by Game Commissions (or the equivalent) which are very often made up of folks who fit squarely into that "armchair biologist" category.  And just as unfortunately, often the "armchair" decisions they make are based on something other than sound science. 

In addition, the directors of wildlife agencies serve at the whims of those Game Commissions.  Going against decisions made based on politics and/or money, regardless of how bad those decisions might be biologically, generally only results in those directors/leaders of wildlife agencies being relegated to seek new employment. 

[sasquatch1]

State agencies should control the season dates and take through sound data and studies. Not by an armchair biologist!

We have way to much public input now in WV, don't need more public input from out of state.

No, I do not like the idea of a US start date, or a regional start date either. Way more factors than just making people happy to consider.

Regional start date idea isn't about making people happy

It's about helping the resource without being pounded all at once. Think South Florida

Tell me how that could be BAD for the resource?


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[Old Gobbler]

We have several Titanic issues facing Florida
1) is that the FWC is clueless ...did you know they only harvest about 500 turkeys in the entire state wma's !!!!And that half are really hybrids or eastern ..the rest of the private land is being developed at a alarming rate ..we got 21 million people in the state and they project a 45 million population by 2050 ...if you haven't turkey hunted in Florida...hope you plan on doing it soon !!

Central Florida Guides are getting $3000 per gobbler , I was informed there is a guide service that gets that in groups of 4-6 ...all 6 weekends of the season and averages %40 success! And gets 3 grand ..I told people 10 years ago this would happen ..and I'll tell you guides get $2800 in Florida for fulvous tree ducks ...in 5 years time it will be 5-7 thousand dollars for a real Osceola..and it will keep going up



Some of the better leases south of Orlando get $10,000 per year per member and you have to share that with other lease holders and that's for 2 birds

About the only thing they have done right is move the "line" of demarcation for Osceolas to near Jacksonville..a move yet again based on zero scientific data ..the foremost expert (Dr. Lovett Williams) and every real turkey hunter in the state will tell you Orlando and south for the real deal ! Anyways this simple act of buffoonery , may have saved Osceolas from over hunting as every cracker with a airboat is guiding out of staters to "get thier slam" all over north Florida ..and trust me the guide$ will tell you different! But those birds north of Orlando are hybrids, some a tiny bit , some a way bit

2) here is the hard facts ... with in 15 to 20 years all of the suitable land that is coded or will be coded for residential development will slowly checkerboard the horizon..urban sprawl will creep ever so quickly ...those WMA's that butt up to private land and pull birds in off those leases ..well the WMA's will be the only place with habitat..cause those leases will be shopping malls , apartment buildings , warehouses freeways and the like ...

20- 30 years from now Florida will issue tags like they do for Dall Ram and Elk in other states ..the preference points will go through the roof ..look for the FWC to start doing some crazy stuff once they figure out how bad the situation really is with the new online harvest check-in that is mandatory

BTW Alaska kills more Dall Ram than Florida kills turkeys on WMA's enjoy turkey hunting while you can ...

Hear me now .. believe me later

[Yoder409]

We have several Titanic issues facing Florida
1) is that the FWC is clueless ...did you know they only harvest about 500 turkeys in the entire state wma's !!!!And that half are really hybrids or eastern ..the rest of the private land is being developed at a alarming rate ..we got 21 million people in the state and they project a 45 million population by 2050 ...if you haven't turkey hunted in Florida...hope you plan on doing it soon !!

Central Florida Guides are getting $3000 per gobbler , I was informed there is a guide service that gets that in groups of 4-6 ...all 6 weekends of the season and averages %40 success! And gets 3 grand ..I told people 10 years ago this would happen ..and I'll tell you guides get $2800 in Florida for fulvous tree ducks ...in 5 years time it will be 5-7 thousand dollars for a real Osceola..and it will keep going up



Some of the better leases south of Orlando get $10,000 per year per member and you have to share that with other lease holders and that's for 2 birds

About the only thing they have done right is move the "line" of demarcation for Osceolas to near Jacksonville..a move yet again based on zero scientific data ..the foremost expert (Dr. Lovett Williams) and every real turkey hunter in the state will tell you Orlando and south for the real deal ! Anyways this simple act of buffoonery , may have saved Osceolas from over hunting as every cracker with a airboat is guiding out of staters to "get thier slam" all over north Florida ..and trust me the guide$ will tell you different! But those birds north of Orlando are hybrids, some a tiny bit , some a way bit

2) here is the hard facts ... with in 15 to 20 years all of the suitable land that is coded or will be coded for residential development will slowly checkerboard the horizon..urban sprawl will creep ever so quickly ...those WMA's that butt up to private land and pull birds in off those leases ..well the WMA's will be the only place with habitat..cause those leases will be shopping malls , apartment buildings , warehouses freeways and the like ...

20- 30 years from now Florida will issue tags like they do for Dall Ram and Elk in other states ..the preference points will go through the roof ..look for the FWC to start doing some crazy stuff once they figure out how bad the situation really is with the new online harvest check-in that is mandatory

BTW Alaska kills more Dall Ram than Florida kills turkeys on WMA's enjoy turkey hunting while you can ...

Hear me now .. believe me later

Eye opening post.

But from what I can observe from 1000 miles away........and having only hunted Osceolas one year.......... I don't think you're wrong.   Sad.  But true.

[WV Flopper]

 Florida is the elephant in the room. It is not the same for the rest of the country.

As some may not understand, they have one of the four turkeys recognized for the grand slam. You could lobby to push back the start of the south Florida season to align with Alabama, Miss, and Georgia.

I am doubtful that anyone will kill their Osceola in Alabama so in mind mind....nothing was gained. People are going to come.

[sasquatch1]

We have several Titanic issues facing Florida
1) is that the FWC is clueless ...did you know they only harvest about 500 turkeys in the entire state wma's !!!!And that half are really hybrids or eastern ..the rest of the private land is being developed at a alarming rate ..we got 21 million people in the state and they project a 45 million population by 2050 ...if you haven't turkey hunted in Florida...hope you plan on doing it soon !!

Central Florida Guides are getting $3000 per gobbler , I was informed there is a guide service that gets that in groups of 4-6 ...all 6 weekends of the season and averages %40 success! And gets 3 grand ..I told people 10 years ago this would happen ..and I'll tell you guides get $2800 in Florida for fulvous tree ducks ...in 5 years time it will be 5-7 thousand dollars for a real Osceola..and it will keep going up



Some of the better leases south of Orlando get $10,000 per year per member and you have to share that with other lease holders and that's for 2 birds

About the only thing they have done right is move the "line" of demarcation for Osceolas to near Jacksonville..a move yet again based on zero scientific data ..the foremost expert (Dr. Lovett Williams) and every real turkey hunter in the state will tell you Orlando and south for the real deal ! Anyways this simple act of buffoonery , may have saved Osceolas from over hunting as every cracker with a airboat is guiding out of staters to "get thier slam" all over north Florida ..and trust me the guide$ will tell you different! But those birds north of Orlando are hybrids, some a tiny bit , some a way bit

2) here is the hard facts ... with in 15 to 20 years all of the suitable land that is coded or will be coded for residential development will slowly checkerboard the horizon..urban sprawl will creep ever so quickly ...those WMA's that butt up to private land and pull birds in off those leases ..well the WMA's will be the only place with habitat..cause those leases will be shopping malls , apartment buildings , warehouses freeways and the like ...

20- 30 years from now Florida will issue tags like they do for Dall Ram and Elk in other states ..the preference points will go through the roof ..look for the FWC to start doing some crazy stuff once they figure out how bad the situation really is with the new online harvest check-in that is mandatory

BTW Alaska kills more Dall Ram than Florida kills turkeys on WMA's enjoy turkey hunting while you can ...

Hear me now .. believe me later

It's very believable. You can not have an ever increasing population anywhere, without simultaneously having a decrease in habitat.

It's just a slow death by 1000 cuts that people don't see or notice until too late.

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[Yoder409]

How would y'all feel if states worked together and started their seasons at the same time?

Such as break the country up into 4 sections. Or maybe even two.

NW, NE, SE, SW and each quadrant opened on same day.

Or the same if split in two. Just the north and south.

#1.  Never work.

There is "south".  Then there is 'deep south"  There is "north".  Then there is "great white north"  There's too big of a climatic difference to do things other than by individual state.  Some states like Florida even have different openers within the state for that reason.

#2.  You have state agencies that are bent on doing things that make NO SENSE.

Now............. I'm not a biologist.  So I won't say WHO is making no sense in setting season dates.  But in the north (and look at a map if you're not a geography buff) the following places have openers BEFORE Pennsylvania:

Michigan
Wisconsin
Minnesota
Manitoba
Ontario
Quebec
Maine

What the CHUCK, Farley   So, no matter HOW much sense a concept of merging opening dates might make..........some states are gonna do it THEIR way no matter what.

[WV Flopper]

 It is sad that Florida does not have turkey biologist in place, or , if they do, the commission allowing them to do their job which they were hired for.

Upon the lucky day I killed the first Florida turkey of my career I was amazed I did not have to check the animal in??? This, in its self, says a lot about the UNsound turkey biology in Florida.

Agreed Yoder. Even in WV we could argue different start dates for different regions within the state. But, there is not a sound way to accomplish that. You would just have a Florida issue in WV.

[sasquatch1]

Openers

S FL-3/4
MS-3/15
N FL-3/18
AL-3/20
LA-4/1
GA-4/1

From one extreme to the other in these states, your talking 4 weeks span. Do you all think the breeding between these states is that much diff? Or either way they'll breed when they ready.

However, 3/18 like N florida is right in the middle of the earliest and latest opener

If all those states opened then, there's no way the resource don't get some breathing room in my eyes as all the opener travelers can't hone into isolated spots.

Would opening 14 days late hurt the Osceola? In some way? Or hurt any of those states?

To get away from losing opportunities the states that got pushed back a few days could run a little longer (same totals days of season)

This is all just for nothing but closed season boredom discussion also. So no need to get all hot and bothered


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[Sixes]

I'd rather see all states go to their own quota system for non residents.

I know that won't be a popular opinion, but make the states a hard quota draw.

[sasquatch1]

I'd rather see all states go to their own quota system for non residents.

I know that won't be a popular opinion, but make the states a hard quota draw.

That would affect ALL Turkey hunters that move around, which is many. So that'd be very unpopular I would think.

Would help local residents though.

Any Non resident restrictions would probably always be public land driven only. Which also could have negative affects with even more private leases being taken from residents etc etc


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[WV Flopper]

 I am ignorant to South Florida! How productive would it be to lengthen the season by 14 days?

Meaning, if you pushed the season opener back by two weeks are those Toms workable end of April? Or did you just screw hunters out of two weeks of hunting. Sorry, I meant limit opportunity by two weeks.

[sasquatch1]

I am ignorant to South Florida! How productive would it be to lengthen the season by 14 days?

Meaning, if you pushed the season opener back by two weeks are those Toms workable end of April? Or did you just screw hunters out of two weeks of hunting. Sorry, I meant limit opportunity by two weeks.

Screw them out of hunting? With the same amount of season days?

Or do you mean, screw them out of good or better hunting?

And to that I am not sure, maybe someone down that way could elaborate on their gobbling or activity. It would have to be based off a place that didn't lose a lot of gobblers though.

Can't say they not gobbling late due to most being dead already


And to all those people I apparently screwed over already. I apologize

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