Pellets in head/neck in a pattern?

[Uncle Tom]

I know this has been discussed many times, but if a pattern has say 3 hits or more in the head and neck it will kill a turkey from 40 yards and more....I have shot one few years ago and only had 1 pellet that I could find and that was #6 Hevi shot from a 12 gauge BPS....if your pattern is even spaced thru out the 10-20 ring how many you getting in the head/neck that is acceptable? I have seen some patterns on here that has very few and easy to count and some that was too many to count....I have some like that in my 20 gauge set ups in 2 different guns with TSS and Longbeards....pattern will kill him but some patterns are few in head/neck and some are way up there....where is the cut off line you looking for in your patterns in the kill zone? I will even say that I want a pattern to be high so as not to destroy his breast if a facing shot at say 40 yards....I know this is risky to do but that is the way I set mine up....what you guys say?

[Yoder409]

I also set my P.O.I. up to be from the wattles up.  My pattern is dense enough that (ESPECIALLY with HTL shot) I'd rather have the extra flying over his head than into the top of the breast.  I bit into a Hevi-7 pellet a few years back and I now have a dental implant ($$).

If I were to look at my pattern on a turkey head/neck target, I'd think I'd want to see a minimum of 50 or so pellets within the "outline".  Just a guess.  There's a lot of places WITHIN that outline that are just skin and meat.  Skull and vertebrae are really all that count for a quick, humane, DRT kill.

[Tom007]

From one Tom to another, I am by no means an expert on patterning, but I can offer this to you. I recently patterned my 870 with TSS 9's. I pattern all my guns in at 35 yards, this is my max "comfortable" distance. I aim right at the waddle, (the blue sticker) on every bird. I shot this with no Turkey outline on it, I usually only draw a 10 inch circle on plain paper. To help you see the hits in head and neck, I took a Winchester Patterning Target, overlayed it over my target and traced the turkeys head and neck on it. As you can see from the photos, there is a pretty good chance this Turkey will drop. There are significant pellets in vital areas, head, neck, windpipe and brain. I took a photo of the back side of the target so you get a better picture of the hits. You can count them, but I think this is a pretty good example of what your looking for. This load  is 3 inch number 9 Apex 2 1/4 oz from an Indian Creek .665. Hope this helps...be safe

[Yoder409]

I pattern all my guns in at 35 yards, this is my max "comfortable" distance.

Looking at you pattern................ 2 1/4 ounces of TSS 9's......... I'm thinking you could be comfortable to, at least, 40.............   

[Tom007]

I pattern all my guns in at 35 yards, this is my max "comfortable" distance.

Looking at you pattern................ 2 1/4 ounces of TSS 9's......... I'm thinking you could be comfortable to, at least, 40.............   

Thanks my friend, I like to have that margin of error. I do range trees when I set up, but he always seems to walk by the trees I didn't range, figures.....lol

[GobbleNut]

It takes a minimal amount of pellets that penetrate the spinal cord and/or the brain to kill a turkey.  A pattern does not need to be dense so much as it needs to be even and with enough pellets in the target area to ensure that at least a few pellets will hit those kill areas.  A pattern that puts fifty pellets in that brain/spinal cord is not going to kill a turkey any deader than one that puts a half dozen.

Having stated that, the less dense a pattern is AT ANY RANGE the more likely a pattern is to hit the turkey without putting a killing pellet or two in that vital kill zone.  That problem is compounded by the fact that, with that same pattern, some pellets that don't hit that vital area are likely to hit something that won't immediately kill that gobbler, but will likely kill him over time somewhere out there in the turkey woods. 

The bottom line, for me at least, is that I don't care if I get fifty or a hundred pellets in that vital area, but I do absolutely care that I have an even pattern that will put "several" pellets in that brain/spinal cord every time I pull the trigger on a bird (assuming my aim is true,...which is another matter altogether and further complicates this entire discussion about pattern density and pattern size at any range). 

[Gooserbat]

There are certain thresholds that ensure a killing pattern.  I really don't care about the head and neck as much as I do the 10" circle because I feel it a more accurate representation of what I can expect my gun to do.  However from my experience a 100/10" paternity translates into around a 40 in the silhouette on average.     With my current setup I'm getting around 320/10" and that's death.

[Greg Massey]

I agree, i don't look for density as much as i want a good overall pattern with no holes in that pattern from where I'm aiming.

[Ihuntoldschool]

It takes exactly 1 in the brain or neck vertebrae.

Put a half dozen in the head and upper neck and he's dead  whether you hit brain/ vertebrae won't matter.
The bird can absorb body hits well but he can't take half a dozen in head/ upper neck.

If you somehow miss the head/ neck or don't land enough pellets to anchor him you'll still recover him IF you break a wing AND a leg.  Their bone structure is not tough and it's pretty easy to break bones with common shot sizes at reasonable distance.

Turkeys aren't tough or particularly hard to anchor when shot right , takes few pellets. 

[Tail Feathers]

The old rule of thumb I recall was if you could reliably and repeatedly put 10 in the spine or brain on those old targets you were good to go.  Yes, one will probably do it, but want to regularly and reliably put several in those vitals to make sure it happens on a kill shot.

[tha bugman]

My mentor once told me "Son, dont scimp on the ammo."  I'm sure if he was still alive he would have used the shell that put as many pellets on target that he could. 

[Dtrkyman]

I have never counted a TSS pattern, have not counted a pattern since the original Remington Hevi shot came out probably.

With TSS I just said holy Chit! and went hunting!  Just made sure it went where I pointed it!

[jhoward11]

Good pattern at 40yrd with-in a 10"circle.with very few open areas. Find combos that do this and the rest is history.

[mountainhunter1]

To help you see the hits in head and neck, I took a Winchester Patterning Target, overlayed it over my target and traced the turkeys head and neck on it. As you can see from the photos, there is a pretty good chance this Turkey will drop. There are significant pellets in vital areas, head, neck, windpipe and brain.


"There is a pretty good chance..." - Tom, there is a 105% chance that pattern is dropping a Tom all the way to fifty yards plus. While I do not advocate shooting birds beyond forty (have only shot one beyond 40 yards in 33 years), your pattern is instant death even at fifty yards plus.

Two things, that is a great pattern you are getting, and I commend you for wanting to get the bird close before shooting him even though you probably know your gun is good to longer ranges. I appreciate guys who still try to get the bird to 25-35 yards before pulling the trigger. At that range, you know you have beaten that turkey. Thanks for sharing your patterns.

[mountainhunter1]

I enjoy patterning turkey guns as much as I do killing turkeys. I am not an expert on many things, but will promise you this: Any range that your gun can CONSISTENTLY SHOT AFTER SHOT put 125 pellets into a ten inch circle, you can kill a turkey every single shot at that range without fail. Some would argue that a 100 pellets is the magic threshold, but I tend to keep in mind that there are twigs, vines and such in the way often times in the woods that you can't even see from 35 yards and such that will eat a few pellets up, so 125 is my number where I know if I am on him and do my part - the turkey is dead every single time.

The reality is, there are very few guns out there that won't put 125 PLUS (emphasis on the word PLUS)  into the ten with TSS with 9's out to 40 yards if they have been patterned correctly. Most are going to be like Gooserbat and be running closer to 300 (likely 250 at the worst) in the ten at forty yards.

That said, I want to shoot the bird inside 40 yards every time, but with a good patterning gun that is putting way beyond 125 pellets into the ten at forty yards, if I misjudge a distance by 5-10 yards at some point the bird is still going to drop.