Ohio proposing new bag limit

[the Ward]

I'm on board with the one bird season, and closed fall season, at least for a couple years anyways. But it needs to work in tandem with some predator control/trapping. Way too many nest robbers and predators taking poults.

[eggshell]

I agree Ward,  My personal opinion is reduced nest success is the primary cause. They even hint at this in the proposal announcement when they say due to reduced brood success in recent years. In my opinion two things are paramount; Habitat destruction and nest depredation. One other factor that is uncontrollable is weather.

I don't think that in the big picture harvest is impacting the flock in any significant form.

I don't know a fix for the nest predators on a large scale. The destruction of the fur market really destroyed our predator control. Raccoon hunting used to be huge around here and now I know of 1-2 active coon hunters. Add in all the other nest predators and it's a tough go for hens. I don't think any single predator is more destructive than raccoons. I used to trap and I would catch anywhere from 25-30 raccoons on my trap lines . I can catch that many now by simply trapping around my  barns and garden.

[perrytrails]

I agree bigslam. One bird per person. No hens. Those that feel the need for 2 tags, take a kid or a friend hunting. I promise you'll get more satisfaction seeing and helping someone get their first bird. And they will never forget it.

4-5 years down the road the state would realize they made the right decision.

[the Ward]

I agree Ward,  My personal opinion is reduced nest success is the primary cause. They even hint at this in the proposal announcement when they say due to reduced brood success in recent years. In my opinion two things are paramount; Habitat destruction and nest depredation. One other factor that is uncontrollable is weather.

I don't think that in the big picture harvest is impacting the flock in any significant form.

I don't know a fix for the nest predators on a large scale. The destruction of the fur market really destroyed our predator control. Raccoon hunting used to be huge around here and now I know of 1-2 active coon hunters. Add in all the other nest predators and it's a tough go for hens. I don't think any single predator is more destructive than raccoons. I used to trap and I would catch anywhere from 25-30 raccoons on my trap lines . I can catch that many now by simply trapping around my  barns and garden.

Same situation where i live too. Raccoon population is out of control. And we also have a rising population of coyotes. Don't see hardly anyone running coonhounds around here any more.Like you said, fur prices bottomed out and people just quit trapping and hunting them.

[bigriverbum]

I agree Ward,  My personal opinion is reduced nest success is the primary cause. They even hint at this in the proposal announcement when they say due to reduced brood success in recent years. In my opinion two things are paramount; Habitat destruction and nest depredation. One other factor that is uncontrollable is weather.

I don't think that in the big picture harvest is impacting the flock in any significant form.

I don't know a fix for the nest predators on a large scale. The destruction of the fur market really destroyed our predator control. Raccoon hunting used to be huge around here and now I know of 1-2 active coon hunters. Add in all the other nest predators and it's a tough go for hens. I don't think any single predator is more destructive than raccoons. I used to trap and I would catch anywhere from 25-30 raccoons on my trap lines . I can catch that many now by simply trapping around my  barns and garden.

Same situation where i live too. Raccoon population is out of control. And we also have a rising population of coyotes. Don't see hardly anyone running coonhounds around here any more.Like you said, fur prices bottomed out and people just quit trapping and hunting them.

is there any way to change this? or was it just too big of a cultural shift?

nwtf or turkeys for the future could have contests where each pelt brought in gives you a chance to win things like special trips or prizes. though game regulations would have to change for that to be legal

[Sasha and Abby]

   Just REFRAIN FROM SHOOTING HENS...

[owlhoot]

I agree Ward,  My personal opinion is reduced nest success is the primary cause. They even hint at this in the proposal announcement when they say due to reduced brood success in recent years. In my opinion two things are paramount; Habitat destruction and nest depredation. One other factor that is uncontrollable is weather.

I don't think that in the big picture harvest is impacting the flock in any significant form.

I don't know a fix for the nest predators on a large scale. The destruction of the fur market really destroyed our predator control. Raccoon hunting used to be huge around here and now I know of 1-2 active coon hunters. Add in all the other nest predators and it's a tough go for hens. I don't think any single predator is more destructive than raccoons. I used to trap and I would catch anywhere from 25-30 raccoons on my trap lines . I can catch that many now by simply trapping around my  barns and garden.

Same around here. Last year 46 coons , one trap one season. Live trap by the shed. Dang things should be considered rats. Open season. Would bet there are 10 coon or more for every hen turkey in Missouri, maybe more.
And strange this year only 4 caught. They didn't come running back in to take over apparently.

[deerhunt1988]

I'd love to know what % of hunters actually kill both of their birds on public. Thinking this will make a difference is laughable. Time in the woods kills turkeys. The more opportunity, the more killing. If they were genuinely concerned, they wouldn't be adding 2 days to the season!

[BigSlam51]

I'd love to know what % of hunters actually kill both of their birds on public. Thinking this will make a difference is laughable. Time in the woods kills turkeys. The more opportunity, the more killing. If they were genuinely concerned, they wouldn't be adding 2 days to the season!

Good point

Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk

[tracker vi]

IMO  deer feeders = more coon

[Kylongspur88]

IMO  deer feeders = more coon

Totally agree! I would love to see a study on whether there is a correlation between when baiting becomes legal and declines in turkey numbers. I also don't think using only harvest results is the best measure.

[deerhunt1988]

IMO  deer feeders = more coon

Totally agree! I would love to see a study on whether there is a correlation between when baiting becomes legal and declines in turkey numbers. I also don't think using only harvest results is the best measure.

Not quite what you are asking before, but Mississippi State will be releasing a study soon showing how quickly corn reach dangerous levels of aflatoxins for poults during the summer months. It can happen as quickly as 5 days!!!

[WTNUT]

There is a lot of good comments here.   I live in a state other than Ohio,  but have about 1,200 acres of prime turkey habitat.   It has been managed for a variety of wildlife for over 20 years.   I purchased land in Ohio 20 plus years ago because my home state had become far too political within its department of natural resources to manage wildlife for the people that purchase licenses,  abide by the laws,  and introduce persons young and old to the sport of hunting.  It got really bad especially with the Sunday hunting fiasco just to name one of many fiascos there.   

Over the last 20 years the Ohio DNR has become more of a political animal operated out of Columbus than in years past - which is not good for hunters or wildlife.   I do not work for that agency and am not a state employee,  but I do spend a lot of time each year attempting to assist persons within the agency. 

It has become all about revenue generation to be used for other aspects state government and not wildlife.  For example,  game checking stations with metal tags are gone as an attempt to save money.  While I agree some are going to poach regardless,  there is little doubt that far moe people get their bird or game home and don't call or get on line to check it in then in the past.   Therefore,  more birds are bing killed and not tagged then in the past.   Next,  a larger percentage of your license fee goes to agencies other than OHDNR than in the past.   Wildlife officers are cut back in terms of the number of hours they can work and without spilling the beans the single most productive manner in which they catch turkey poachers has been completely removed from their tool bag so to speak to save money.   Without it the number of people baiting illegally increases yearly.   I detest any person who shoots a turkey over bait,  and unfortunately many do and I have helped catch and prosecute a _hit ton of them so I know what I am talking about. 

Moving on,  Ohio promotes baiting for deer in the fall because it sells corn!   A lot of corn.   I would love to make it illegal to bait,  but they are not going to bait.   As someone stated above,  far more turkeys are being killed over bait in the fall by a bored hunter who sees one wonder in to the bait pile than we know.   

Moving on again,  fewer and fewer people hired by the OHDNR these days hunt.  Yes,  you read that correctly.  This includes officers.   They truly don't appreciate the natural resource as we do.  It is just a job to them.   And,  while many many many in that division of state government are truly vested in doing a great job,  more and more each year simply view it as a 9-5 job that has little impact on them personally. 

Throw in a bad spring or two,  and you have a significant impact on the population.   I am blessed because there is truly very little hunting on my farm so our population is strong,  but it is not what it once was.   Maybe we don't need as many as we had in the past and I would accept that from most biologist looking at my property.   But,  lets not allow a political bull crap continue to impact our outdoors.   

Make some phone calls,  educate yourself and make a difference.   Don't just assume they are trying to do something for the hunter.    The extra two days this year is there for one reason and one reason only.  They are trying to sell more out of state licenses to make up for lost revenue last year when the State was closed to out of state hunters a few weeks before season opened.   

[eggshell]

This has been a great thread and a lot of really good points. I may just send a link to the chief of ODW. They need to hear us.

I never really though of the baiting issue. I do get upset that so many farms have deer bait that I am afraid to turkey hunt on them. Officially, if there are active feeders it's baited and you can't hunt within a certain distance of bait, for turkeys. Sometimes you don't even know it's there. ON one farm I hunt they keep feeders going year round and the birds roost on the property I hunt and soon as they come off the roost they head to the feeders across the valley and stay there most of the day....I hate it. I just hunt it in the evenings mostly. I asked a wildlife officer once and he said it's a huge problem, trying to determine if someone is hunting bait anymore. Unless they are parked right in the feeder area he said he let's them go. He said he understands most turkey hunters aren't hunting the bait, but if you are close and repeatedly set up close to a feeder your getting a ticket. You may not even know it. 

WTNUT, I am a retired employee of Ohio Division of Wildlife and I can tell you you are right on  how the employee profiles have changed. They have cut hours too. The new license increase will help. License money is still by law dedicated to Wildlife, but many have tried to get at it. Our past Governor Kasich was a horrible fund raider and he done everything he could to politicize and take Wildlife's money, but the fact it's law has mostly protected the funds. He did fire some dedicated people and put a lot of people in place that were political gifts. I agree that the division is not what it once was on a professional level, but it's still good. Back in the early 2000s they lost a lot of the really experienced "movers and shakers" as they offered retirement incentives to get the higher salaried people off the books. I understand that management philosophy from a pure money point, but a lot of high level knowledge went with those people. I was among those who left and two of my counter parts left as well. Between us we had changed the entire face of our unit. I am not trying to brag, but stating something I have awards for and is well documented. The people who replaced us where good people, but had very little real experience managing a resource. I also agree a lot is driven by money now. I see some of the things they come up with and just say to myself, "Oh my God, what are they thinking".   

[the Ward]

Some great thoughtful posts in this thread. We, as turkey hunters, need to go to the regional Odnr public meetings and have our voices heard. Squeaky wheel and grease. I think it is going to take a multi-pronged approach of small, incremental changes. There are a lot of other states with declining populations also, so what are the common denominators causing it? If we can pinpoint these, we can start moving forward with solutions.Every state will have it's own regional issues, i.e. weather, but there should be some things causing it since the decline is widespread.