How Much Numbers Is Too Much Numbers?

[Gobble!]

Shooting 2.5oz of TSS #9s I think a even pattern with 500 in the 10 and 300 in the 20.

[owlhoot]

WOW!!!  130ish!!! 

I shoot 2 1/4 oz 7's through a .670 Pure Gold out of my 835 and she puts up over 300 devastating results on birds.  With that being said, I have many boxes of the early 7's that shot so well before Hevi changed some of their components.

To answer your question and as you stated, it depends on the ammo, lot numbers of that ammo, choke and gun.  Many on this site have done their Due Diligence, experimented with many loads and chokes and have shared those results, which gives the rest of us a GREAT starting point.  Each of us have to decide how much we want to spend to obtain OUR desired results.  Dead is Dead but the Ol Standard is 100 pellets in 10 at 40.

My Standard is 300 plus of Hevi #7's because I've seen what they will do at various ranges.

Yeah, those HEVI numbers were low enough that I found myself counting and bothered for the first time. I've always patterned my guns but like I said have always been more concerned with overall shape and continuity. I wondered if the load wasn't over-choked. If I broke 250 I'd never bat an eye. Here's a thread of those patterns: CZ 1012 with Rob Roberts .660 Invector Plus
https://r.tapatalk.com/shareLink/topic?share_fid=17578&share_tid=101167&url=http%3A%2F%2Foldgobbler%2Ecom%2FForum%2Findex%2Ephp%3Ftopic%3D101167&share_type=t&link_source=app


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What you have with hevi7's will do the job. Yes its 130 is low for that load. Change chokes if you want better.
That .660 rob roberts I have for the Remington guns is the lowest performing choke I have ever seen. Not a cheap one either . And I have shot lots of chokes and loads in Remington guns.

[owlhoot]

Shooting 2.5oz of TSS #9s I think a even pattern with 500 in the 10 and 300 in the 20.

Was just thinking when is Gobble! going to show up?

[RiverRoost]

The post about the percentage of shot concept was pretty good way of looking at a pattern. I'm the one who started the other thread with 255 pellets in a 10 and wanting to tighten it up. So off of the percentage theory I talked to Nitro and got the total pellet count for my 4/5/7 blend and it's 597. Doing the math I have 43% of my pellet load in the 10 @ 40 yards so I'd like to get that up based off of the 50% pattern which id be PERFECTLY happy with

[ChesterCopperpot]

The post about the percentage of shot concept was pretty good way of looking at a pattern. I'm the one who started the other thread with 255 pellets in a 10 and wanting to tighten it up. So off of the percentage theory I talked to Nitro and got the total pellet count for my 4/5/7 blend and it's 597. Doing the math I have 43% of my pellet load in the 10 @ 40 yards so I'd like to get that up based off of the 50% pattern which id be PERFECTLY happy with

I love the tinkering and trying to get everything as close to perfect as we can. What else are we supposed to do in the off season?!? If I had your numbers I'd probably be all right, but I completely understand the desire. And the truth is you might throw in another choke and get something perfect or throw in another choke and blow the pattern all to hell. That's the fun of it. Here's hoping your next choke gets you to the former rather than the latter.


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[Dtrkyman]

I remember the utter disappointment the first time i touched off a 2 1/4 oz double x mag back in the day, after clearing the cob webs out and walking up to the target I was like really, that is it?

Did not count numbers then but I remember it was less than 20 in the head and neck!  Pathetic, when heavy shot first came out, the Remington version that started looking pretty good!

Now my 1 5/8 tss 20ga handloads are crazy good!  Man we have come a long way.

That being said I have never crippled a turkey in 29 seasons hunting these amazing birds, crappy old loads included!  Know your limitations!

[3bailey3]

I didn't count it but like it!

[Gooserbat]

I've been loading tss for seval years now.  I'm past tinkering.  I know what works in my guns and I stick to it.  I will say the most hunter friendly tss load I've ever seen was 2 oz of 9s out of my remington with a turkey extra full (.687)  it shot 280/10 and was so even. 

[Gentry]

Been thinking about what we "require" or expect now out of turkey guns at 40yds, and I was wondering what's the magic number you're looking for in a 10" circle? Obviously this is load dependent so just mention the load and what you're happy with or hoping to get out of it in the 10" at 40yds.

I've always been more into pattern shape and uniformity than numbers but shot some HEVI 13 #7s for the first time recently and found myself very disappointed in the 10" numbers at 40. Pattern was good and even with nothing much getting outside 20" but the 10" numbers were only ~130ish (2oz of HEVI so roughly a quarter of the load). Saw someone mention this morning on a different post that they were getting 250s but were disappointed the choke wasn't getting 280s as advertised and that got me wondering how much numbers is too much numbers? Most of us here seem to be tinkerers by nature so maybe we're all just bound to be dissatisfied


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Are you sure that's the center part of the pattern? When I first shot my 935 it was terrible, but it was shooting a foot high!


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[ChesterCopperpot]

Been thinking about what we "require" or expect now out of turkey guns at 40yds, and I was wondering what's the magic number you're looking for in a 10" circle? Obviously this is load dependent so just mention the load and what you're happy with or hoping to get out of it in the 10" at 40yds.

I've always been more into pattern shape and uniformity than numbers but shot some HEVI 13 #7s for the first time recently and found myself very disappointed in the 10" numbers at 40. Pattern was good and even with nothing much getting outside 20" but the 10" numbers were only ~130ish (2oz of HEVI so roughly a quarter of the load). Saw someone mention this morning on a different post that they were getting 250s but were disappointed the choke wasn't getting 280s as advertised and that got me wondering how much numbers is too much numbers? Most of us here seem to be tinkerers by nature so maybe we're all just bound to be dissatisfied


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Are you sure that's the center part of the pattern? When I first shot my 935 it was terrible, but it was shooting a foot high!


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Yes, I was shooting roughly a 40x40" piece of paper with a reactive turkey target taped to it so that I could flip it over and look at overall shape. Very even pattern but lacked any sort of of core. Spread evenly over about 25". Some folks even say it's a good pattern (and it is even and forgiving), but as far as pellet count about 25% of the load is all that was within the 10".




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[Gentry]

Ok good. Maybe try a new tube, but I can assure you he's dead!


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[ChesterCopperpot]

Ok good. Maybe try a new tube, but I can assure you he's dead!


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Absolutely, he's dead.


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[GobbleNut]

Looking at this subject from a little different perspective...

I'm not a pellet counter.  What I am is a turkey hunter that wants to feel absolutely certain that what I shoot will kill a gobbler cleanly every time at forty yards,...or a little farther if I happen to misjudge the distance.  If I do my part, the gun and load will do its part. 

The thought that always goes through my mind with pellet counting and what seems to be an obsession with "numbers" is what is the reasoning behind the obsession?  If it is because a guy is a "still target shoot" competitor,...or maybe just a target-shooting enthusiast,...then I get that. 

However, in my mind, I suspect there might be a mindset in some folks of,..."hmmm, my gun puts 300 pellets in a 10-inch circle at 40 yards, so that means that it will put enough pellets in that gobbler that is standing out there at 70 yards to kill him,...so here goes!"  (lest anybody think this is not a reality, please refer to certain YouTube videos)

Call me an alarmist with limited faith in turkey-hunter self-discipline, but unfortunately I think there are far too many pellet counters out there whose motives are to be able to go ahead and shoot at those 70 yard gobblers. 

Now, don't nobody here be goin' and gettin' their snood in a knot. I'm not accusing anybody here on OG of having that mindset.  Just pointing out what I consider to be a valid concern about all the hype over numbers-counting.  I am sure it does not apply to anybody around here.   

[ChesterCopperpot]

Looking at this subject from a little different perspective...

I'm not a pellet counter.  What I am is a turkey hunter that wants to feel absolutely certain that what I shoot will kill a gobbler cleanly every time at forty yards,...or a little farther if I happen to misjudge the distance.  If I do my part, the gun and load will do its part. 

The thought that always goes through my mind with pellet counting and what seems to be an obsession with "numbers" is what is the reasoning behind the obsession?  If it is because a guy is a "still target shoot" competitor,...or maybe just a target-shooting enthusiast,...then I get that. 

However, in my mind, I suspect there might be a mindset in some folks of,..."hmmm, my gun puts 300 pellets in a 10-inch circle at 40 yards, so that means that it will put enough pellets in that gobbler that is standing out there at 70 yards to kill him,...so here goes!"  (lest anybody think this is not a reality, please refer to certain YouTube videos)

Call me an alarmist with limited faith in turkey-hunter self-discipline, but unfortunately I think there are far too many pellet counters out there whose motives are to be able to go ahead and shoot at those 70 yard gobblers. 

Now, don't nobody here be goin' and gettin' their snood in a knot. I'm not accusing anybody here on OG of having that mindset.  Just pointing out what I consider to be a valid concern about all the hype over numbers-counting.  I am sure it does not apply to anybody around here.   

You may be right in some instances. Personally I ain't got a place I hunt where I could shoot 50, much less 70. They're usually too stinking close when they get to me. I just like shooting and I like seeing what equipment is capable of. Same reason I'll run 10 or 15 different types of ammo through a new rifle to see what patterns best. I can think of two birds I've killed through the years that I likely couldn't have killed with the original fixed modified Pardner SBI 20ga and #5 lead loads I started out with.


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[davisd9]

Been thinking about what we "require" or expect now out of turkey guns at 40yds, and I was wondering what's the magic number you're looking for in a 10" circle? Obviously this is load dependent so just mention the load and what you're happy with or hoping to get out of it in the 10" at 40yds.

I've always been more into pattern shape and uniformity than numbers but shot some HEVI 13 #7s for the first time recently and found myself very disappointed in the 10" numbers at 40. Pattern was good and even with nothing much getting outside 20" but the 10" numbers were only ~130ish (2oz of HEVI so roughly a quarter of the load). Saw someone mention this morning on a different post that they were getting 250s but were disappointed the choke wasn't getting 280s as advertised and that got me wondering how much numbers is too much numbers? Most of us here seem to be tinkerers by nature so maybe we're all just bound to be dissatisfied


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Are you sure that's the center part of the pattern? When I first shot my 935 it was terrible, but it was shooting a foot high!


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Yes, I was shooting roughly a 40x40" piece of paper with a reactive turkey target taped to it so that I could flip it over and look at overall shape. Very even pattern but lacked any sort of of core. Spread evenly over about 25". Some folks even say it's a good pattern (and it is even and forgiving), but as far as pellet count about 25% of the load is all that was within the 10".




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Nothing wrong with that pattern.