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Over the years I've killed a few birds that came to the call without so much as a gobble.  It has been the exception of course. 
I'm curious to know what everyone's thoughts are on what makes a bird silent. I'm thinking there are numerous reasons why a bird won't or prefers not to vocalize. I'd love everyone's input! 


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I think the number one reason is hunting pressure, not just the calling aspect of turkey hunting but the visual. Where the birds see hunters calling and walking.

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Predatory pressure from yotes & bobcats..

Butt whopping(s) from dominant gobblers.

Increased human or predatory activity levels in & around strut zones .

Turkeys being turkeys...

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Was just reading an article on Outdoor Life on this topic. Along with the usual suspects (hunting pressure, henned up, etc.), the one thing that caught my attention is the observation noted at the end of the article that horned owls may be a deterrent to gobbling. Apparently the study (led by the turkey doc Mike Chamberlain) found that owls prey on (and prefer) toms  and will decapitate them off the limb. The study found that the number of tagged toms killed by owls picked up in March when gobbling activity started to increase. Pretty crazy stuff.

"Almost in every research site we have in the Southeast, we've seen predation by great horned owls," Chamberlain says. "I think this is as important as anything outside of human predation."

Here's the link to the article:

https://www.outdoorlife.com/story/hunting/how-to-hunt-turkeys-that-are-silent/?fbclid=IwAR1iCO4LiQ0UoWWI4qk95EZubZCt5baKDcr0GnmATQcn1Ip-hMmUwdoHev4 (https://www.outdoorlife.com/story/hunting/how-to-hunt-turkeys-that-are-silent/?fbclid=IwAR1iCO4LiQ0UoWWI4qk95EZubZCt5baKDcr0GnmATQcn1Ip-hMmUwdoHev4)

Quote from: zombiewoof on May 04, 2022, 02:10:31 PM
Was just reading an article on Outdoor Life on this topic. Along with the usual suspects (hunting pressure, henned up, etc.), the one thing that caught my attention is the observation noted at the end of the article that horned owls may be a deterrent to gobbling. Apparently the study (led by the turkey doc Mike Chamberlain) found that owls prey on (and prefer) toms  and will decapitate them off the limb. The study found that the number of tagged toms killed by owls picked up in March when gobbling activity started to increase. Pretty crazy stuff.

"Almost in every research site we have in the Southeast, we've seen predation by great horned owls," Chamberlain says. "I think this is as important as anything outside of human predation."

Here's the link to the article:

https://www.outdoorlife.com/story/hunting/how-to-hunt-turkeys-that-are-silent/?fbclid=IwAR1iCO4LiQ0UoWWI4qk95EZubZCt5baKDcr0GnmATQcn1Ip-hMmUwdoHev4 (https://www.outdoorlife.com/story/hunting/how-to-hunt-turkeys-that-are-silent/?fbclid=IwAR1iCO4LiQ0UoWWI4qk95EZubZCt5baKDcr0GnmATQcn1Ip-hMmUwdoHev4)

Learn something new every day!  I never would have thought that owls (of any sort) would have been a significant problem for wild turkeys, much less for gobblers.  Interesting. ...With this new information, I am predicting that Great Horned Owl numbers will be going down in the near future.   ;D   :angel9:

Quote from: zombiewoof on May 04, 2022, 02:10:31 PM
Was just reading an article on Outdoor Life on this topic. Along with the usual suspects (hunting pressure, henned up, etc.), the one thing that caught my attention is the observation noted at the end of the article that horned owls may be a deterrent to gobbling. Apparently the study (led by the turkey doc Mike Chamberlain) found that owls prey on (and prefer) toms  and will decapitate them off the limb. The study found that the number of tagged toms killed by owls picked up in March when gobbling activity started to increase. Pretty crazy stuff.

"Almost in every research site we have in the Southeast, we've seen predation by great horned owls," Chamberlain says. "I think this is as important as anything outside of human predation."

Here's the link to the article:

https://www.outdoorlife.com/story/hunting/how-to-hunt-turkeys-that-are-silent/?fbclid=IwAR1iCO4LiQ0UoWWI4qk95EZubZCt5baKDcr0GnmATQcn1Ip-hMmUwdoHev4 (https://www.outdoorlife.com/story/hunting/how-to-hunt-turkeys-that-are-silent/?fbclid=IwAR1iCO4LiQ0UoWWI4qk95EZubZCt5baKDcr0GnmATQcn1Ip-hMmUwdoHev4)

Wow! That's a huge surprise. I wouldn't have thought an owl (even a large one)  would prey on adult turkeys!


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Read the posts from Gobblers Gobbling / Something to think About - Hens
Started by Greg Massey. Food for thought and some very good information from some of the other members.

Quote from: Wisgobbler on May 04, 2022, 02:43:20 PM

Quote from: zombiewoof on May 04, 2022, 02:10:31 PM
Was just reading an article on Outdoor Life on this topic. Along with the usual suspects (hunting pressure, henned up, etc.), the one thing that caught my attention is the observation noted at the end of the article that horned owls may be a deterrent to gobbling. Apparently the study (led by the turkey doc Mike Chamberlain) found that owls prey on (and prefer) toms  and will decapitate them off the limb. The study found that the number of tagged toms killed by owls picked up in March when gobbling activity started to increase. Pretty crazy stuff.

"Almost in every research site we have in the Southeast, we've seen predation by great horned owls," Chamberlain says. "I think this is as important as anything outside of human predation."

Here's the link to the article:

https://www.outdoorlife.com/story/hunting/how-to-hunt-turkeys-that-are-silent/?fbclid=IwAR1iCO4LiQ0UoWWI4qk95EZubZCt5baKDcr0GnmATQcn1Ip-hMmUwdoHev4 (https://www.outdoorlife.com/story/hunting/how-to-hunt-turkeys-that-are-silent/?fbclid=IwAR1iCO4LiQ0UoWWI4qk95EZubZCt5baKDcr0GnmATQcn1Ip-hMmUwdoHev4)

Wow! That's a huge surprise. I wouldn't have thought an owl (even a large one)  would prey on adult turkeys!


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Owls are hell on turkeys and especially poults. They'll kill them off the limb at night.

Quote from: Kylongspur88 on May 04, 2022, 08:53:50 PM

Quote from: Wisgobbler on May 04, 2022, 02:43:20 PM

Quote from: zombiewoof on May 04, 2022, 02:10:31 PM
Was just reading an article on Outdoor Life on this topic. Along with the usual suspects (hunting pressure, henned up, etc.), the one thing that caught my attention is the observation noted at the end of the article that horned owls may be a deterrent to gobbling. Apparently the study (led by the turkey doc Mike Chamberlain) found that owls prey on (and prefer) toms  and will decapitate them off the limb. The study found that the number of tagged toms killed by owls picked up in March when gobbling activity started to increase. Pretty crazy stuff.

"Almost in every research site we have in the Southeast, we've seen predation by great horned owls," Chamberlain says. "I think this is as important as anything outside of human predation."

Here's the link to the article:

https://www.outdoorlife.com/story/hunting/how-to-hunt-turkeys-that-are-silent/?fbclid=IwAR1iCO4LiQ0UoWWI4qk95EZubZCt5baKDcr0GnmATQcn1Ip-hMmUwdoHev4 (https://www.outdoorlife.com/story/hunting/how-to-hunt-turkeys-that-are-silent/?fbclid=IwAR1iCO4LiQ0UoWWI4qk95EZubZCt5baKDcr0GnmATQcn1Ip-hMmUwdoHev4)

Wow! That's a huge surprise. I wouldn't have thought an owl (even a large one)  would prey on adult turkeys!


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Owls are hell on turkeys and especially poults. They'll kill them off the limb at night.

I realize that owls take poults I just never thought an owl could take a full grown 20+ pound Tom. 


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Quote from: Wisgobbler on May 04, 2022, 09:08:21 PM

Quote from: Kylongspur88 on May 04, 2022, 08:53:50 PM

Quote from: Wisgobbler on May 04, 2022, 02:43:20 PM

Quote from: zombiewoof on May 04, 2022, 02:10:31 PM
Was just reading an article on Outdoor Life on this topic. Along with the usual suspects (hunting pressure, henned up, etc.), the one thing that caught my attention is the observation noted at the end of the article that horned owls may be a deterrent to gobbling. Apparently the study (led by the turkey doc Mike Chamberlain) found that owls prey on (and prefer) toms  and will decapitate them off the limb. The study found that the number of tagged toms killed by owls picked up in March when gobbling activity started to increase. Pretty crazy stuff.

"Almost in every research site we have in the Southeast, we've seen predation by great horned owls," Chamberlain says. "I think this is as important as anything outside of human predation."

Here's the link to the article:

https://www.outdoorlife.com/story/hunting/how-to-hunt-turkeys-that-are-silent/?fbclid=IwAR1iCO4LiQ0UoWWI4qk95EZubZCt5baKDcr0GnmATQcn1Ip-hMmUwdoHev4 (https://www.outdoorlife.com/story/hunting/how-to-hunt-turkeys-that-are-silent/?fbclid=IwAR1iCO4LiQ0UoWWI4qk95EZubZCt5baKDcr0GnmATQcn1Ip-hMmUwdoHev4)

Wow! That's a huge surprise. I wouldn't have thought an owl (even a large one)  would prey on adult turkeys!


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Owls are hell on turkeys and especially poults. They'll kill them off the limb at night.

I realize that owls take poults I just never thought an owl could take a full grown 20+ pound Tom. 


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As told by Dr Chamberlain, the owls hit them on the roost, lift them from the limb, and ride them to the ground. At the kill sites he's discovered there's a trail of feathers from the roost tree to the ground about 35 to 40 yds long.

During the season, you will encounter this behavior in every flock. Some people refer to this as a lockdown.
The things that contribute to it are multifaceted, hunting pressure is one for sure but I think predator and peer pressure from domant toms or Jake gangs also should be considered.
Normally they will gobble but later in the day instead of straight off the roost.

Quote from: topnotch on May 05, 2022, 06:41:28 AM
During the season, you will encounter this behavior in every flock. Some people refer to this as a lockdown.
The things that contribute to it are multifaceted, hunting pressure is one for sure but I think predator and peer pressure from domant toms or Jake gangs also should be considered.
Normally they will gobble but later in the day instead of straight off the roost.

I'm not talking about periods of time when turkeys aren't gobbling in answer to general calling or just randomly gobbling. I'm interested in the birds who hear the call and respond by coming to the call silent. Often sneaking in or coming in drumming but not vocalizing.
We all have periods of time when gobbling activity is shut down to some extent. Usually due to weather or because the birds are "henned up" but the birds that fascinate me are the quiet, so called ghost birds who come in silent even when other birds in the same area are vocalizing. 


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I have experienced the "Silent Gobbler" numerous times through the years. Them jokers try and sneak in, if out of curiosity. That's why it is so important to always be alert and on "your game".
Because if you move, or decide to get up to change location, well then that's when you get to hear the awful loud "Putt". Followed by running and wing beats. When you get the hankering to leave try and wait 15-20 more minutes. I often wonder how many come in Silent and see movement, and not make any noise, just slipping out of your life forever!!!! Probably more than we would ever want to know.  One reason why I set up like I do. Usually try and find the thickest place to put my back against.

Have a good one
Bo

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Quote from: Wisgobbler on May 05, 2022, 06:49:34 AM

Quote from: topnotch on May 05, 2022, 06:41:28 AM
During the season, you will encounter this behavior in every flock. Some people refer to this as a lockdown.
The things that contribute to it are multifaceted, hunting pressure is one for sure but I think predator and peer pressure from domant toms or Jake gangs also should be considered.
Normally they will gobble but later in the day instead of straight off the roost.

I'm not talking about periods of time when turkeys aren't gobbling in answer to general calling or just randomly gobbling. I'm interested in the birds who hear the call and respond by coming to the call silent. Often sneaking in or coming in drumming but not vocalizing.
We all have periods of time when gobbling activity is shut down to some extent. Usually due to weather or because the birds are "henned up" but the birds that fascinate me are the quiet, so called ghost birds who come in silent even when other birds in the same area are vocalizing. 


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Subordinates trying not to draw attention to themselves would be my guess.

The one that came in silent on me and a buddy took a truck ride.  We had waited a few more minutes.   Nothing much happening and getting late in the day.  He was a ragged mess of a two year old, tail fan feathers broke off, one good gouge out of feathers on his side.  We figured mature bird whooped him or some critter tried to take a bite.  Either way, he was sneaking in to the hens.

Hard to pin it down on what type of silent bird you speak of. A)The silent bird that doesnt gobble even on the limb? B) The bird that gobbles on the limb but not on the ground? C) The bird that answers on the ground but comes in silent?

A) Hunting pressure, getting flushed before flydown or a lot of hunters walking around in open cover
B) Henned up birds, if he comes hes probably following a hen that isnt aggressive. Your in their strut zone
C) Sees your deke or hes cautious to come to your location. You may be in to thick cover, or just over a ridge

We all live for the gobble. I can say the feel of the back and forth conversation is what I enjoy most about hunting them. But I'm sure whether we know it or not, we've all given up minutes (maybe seconds) too soon and never knew a big silent tom was on his way had we only been a little more patient. Been trying to remind myself this season that just because I don't hear them, doesn't mean they fell off the face of the earth. They're out there and can slip in at any second!

Quote from: bonasa on May 06, 2022, 09:19:26 PM
Hard to pin it down on what type of silent bird you speak of. A)The silent bird that doesnt gobble even on the limb? B) The bird that gobbles on the limb but not on the ground? C) The bird that answers on the ground but comes in silent?

A) Hunting pressure, getting flushed before flydown or a lot of hunters walking around in open cover
B) Henned up birds, if he comes hes probably following a hen that isnt aggressive. Your in their strut zone
C) Sees your deke or hes cautious to come to your location. You may be in to thick cover, or just over a ridge

I'm talking about the bird that comes to the call without gobbling as he comes. I don't use decoys or blinds. I'm not talking about birds that blunder along happenstance  into gun range or are ambushed like whitetail deer. I don't believe there's such a thing as too thick of cover. I've killed birds in cedar stands that came to a call where you couldn't see 30 yards.
So to clarify. Let's say that you're more of a run and gun hunter who hunts public ground Which is how I hunt. Maybe there's not much going on after fly down even though there might be birds gobbling on a neighboring property or maybe not. Doesn't really matter. So you find a nice bench or flat with good to great sign and you sit down and do some blind calling. Maybe you call a bit every 15-20 minutes and then just watch for a while. 
After an hour of this you notice a Tom headed directly to your position. Generally alone. No hen leading. Sometimes he isn't even displaying, sometimes your first indication that there's a turkey anywhere near is the sound of him drumming.  These are the birds I'm talking about. It's happened to many times even on lightly pressured ground for me to not pay attention. In fact I killed a great bird on my brothers private ground in Iowa a few years ago that perfectly matches the scenario I mentioned. Cold calling an oak flat with lots of fresh scratch at 10:00 AM and after about an hour and just thinking maybe I should move on I heard him drum. Never heard anything from him until that moment. I'm wondering if there's something more to it than I'm aware.


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I think it all comes down to everything needs to fall into place to make the birds feel that they are safe and secure in their world. The weather needs to be just right, the temperature and wind also. I had a gobbler gang of younger jakes gobbling their fool heads off on Tuesday, Wednesday it rained and I stayed in. Thursday looked beautiful, everything was in alignment, perfect day on tap, then as I was putting my boots on to go up the mountain, there is a small town about 3-4 miles away that has one of those fire sirens that alert the town about an emergency, that thing went off at 5:30 AM, and it triggered a response from a nearby hunting pack of 15 coyotes at the base of the mountain. they were howling and yipping their fool heads off. I didn't hear jack the rest of the morning. So it can be that sudden! The day wasn't a total loss, I did find a nice patch of morel mushrooms, we had them for supper last night. You never can tell, but that's why we hunt! Good luck out there.

Quote from: Paulmyr on May 05, 2022, 01:25:42 PM

Quote from: Wisgobbler on May 05, 2022, 06:49:34 AM

Quote from: topnotch on May 05, 2022, 06:41:28 AM
During the season, you will encounter this behavior in every flock. Some people refer to this as a lockdown.
The things that contribute to it are multifaceted, hunting pressure is one for sure but I think predator and peer pressure from domant toms or Jake gangs also should be considered.
Normally they will gobble but later in the day instead of straight off the roost.

I'm not talking about periods of time when turkeys aren't gobbling in answer to general calling or just randomly gobbling. I'm interested in the birds who hear the call and respond by coming to the call silent. Often sneaking in or coming in drumming but not vocalizing.
We all have periods of time when gobbling activity is shut down to some extent. Usually due to weather or because the birds are "henned up" but the birds that fascinate me are the quiet, so called ghost birds who come in silent even when other birds in the same area are vocalizing. 


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Subordinates trying not to draw attention to themselves would be my guess.

This seems likely. They're sneaking around to mate uncontested.

Quiet turkeys?

1) Hunting pressure (humans or predators)
2) Henned up toms
3) Dominance (less dominant birds more likely to come in quiet)
4) Weather patterns
5) A bunch of other reasons we have not figured out.

I have noticed that quite often, later in the season, I will get a bird to answer some distance off, and they go quiet.  They often come in quietly from a direction that I would not expect.

I have also seen birds come in completely quiet (to my ears) come in quietly in half-strutt or strutt, never making a sound.

Are they trying to sneak into the hens?  Are they coming in quiet to inspect things and look for that other tom (to avoid a fight)?

When that bird gobbles, keeps gobbling, and comes in on a string, I feel it is probably a dominant or aggressive bird that is hard up (or at least that is my impression).  Or a jake...

I have also noticed that very often those quiet woods, that if you can get one bird going, often others will then start to gobble.  I feel like gobbling is a stimulus for breeding, aggression, and/or gobbling.

Are evil!

I do get a certain satisfaction killing them though! Something about that sneaky joker peaking, neck stretched out at 30yds and you hadn't hear him in an hour!

Quote from: Dtrkyman on May 07, 2022, 04:48:52 PM
Are evil!

I do get a certain satisfaction killing them though! Something about that sneaky joker peaking, neck stretched out at 30yds and you hadn't hear him in an hour!

Lol! Agree 100%. I know this probably seems far fetched but I'm wondering if maybe we aren't helping natural selection a bit by killing birds that are most prone to being highly vocal?
It would make sense to me that we are not the only predators doing so. Just some crazy conspiracy to think over while I sit against a tree.


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Quote from: Wisgobbler on May 06, 2022, 10:40:42 PM
So you find a nice bench or flat with good to great sign and you sit down and do some blind calling. Maybe you call a bit every 15-20 minutes and then just watch for a while. 
After an hour of this you notice a Tom headed directly to your position. Generally alone. No hen leading. Sometimes he isn't even displaying, sometimes your first indication that there's a turkey anywhere near is the sound of him drumming.... Cold calling an oak flat with lots of fresh scratch at 10:00 AM and after about an hour and just thinking maybe I should move on I heard him drum. Never heard anything from him until that moment. I'm wondering if there's something more to it than I'm aware.

Do you have much luck off the roost or just after flydown?

No decoy or blind in this (these) scenarios, got it. I dont know how you hunt or call but sounds like you are a subtle caller when you are on sign, purrs and clucks mostly, maybe some yelps thrown in? But call sparingly, without much fanfare i.e. aggressive yelps and cutts?

Sounds like its later in the morning after flydown. The dominate birds have their harems they are tending to and a satellite , not necessarily a juvenile bird is what you are hunting almost by default. Hunters seem to have a pattern they follow, i'm sure most hunters can relate (if they keep records). Look back and they kill birds around the same time every hunt. Outliers, sure they are always there. I am talking a bell curve effect, if you tally your hours I'm sure its there.

Out of the last 60 birds the average kill time was 2.06 hours with 45 being killed in less than 1 hour, the longest hunt was 6 hours that resulted in a kill and the shortest was .15 hours. I am aggressive in scouting and calling while on the road and local. 

Quote from: g8rvet on May 05, 2022, 01:59:32 PM
The one that came in silent on me and a buddy took a truck ride.  We had waited a few more minutes.   Nothing much happening and getting late in the day.  He was a ragged mess of a two year old, tail fan feathers broke off, one good gouge out of feathers on his side.  We figured mature bird whooped him or some critter tried to take a bite.  Either way, he was sneaking in to the hens.

I think that is a reason for a lot of turkeys sneaking in, overall gobbling slows down as more hens enter the game the more hens the less the boss gobbles . Subordinate Tom's are wanting to breed and sometimes just reluctant because of the pecking order. Sometimes Ithink they going to sneak in and just find them a girlfriend and get away with it