I just got back from an Osceola turkey hunt with a known outfitter. I arrived Thursday afternoon and got ready for an early morning.
Friday morning, we went to a 10 acre property that the guide owned (we'll get to why this in important later). He parked the truck and we walked a hundred yards or so to a palmetto blind. We did not hear any gobbles at daybreak. Once it was light enough to see well, I noticed a fence that was 42 yards out front and another one 25 yards to our left (I used rangefinder). The fence straight out was simple 4 strand barb wire which a bird could walk under while the fence to the left was hog wire and not bird would be walking under that. I asked about the fence because I know how stubborn birds can be with a fence. I was told it "wouldn't be a problem." We sat there all day and saw nothing. After a few hours sitting there I got curious and asked who owned the property on the other side of the fence. He told me it was XYZ State Park (no hunting allowed). I said to myself, great.
That evening I asked about going somewhere different as we did not see or hearing anything there the previous day. I was told the "birds are there, we need to be patient", I said ok. The Saturday morning, we headed to the same spot. As daybreak approached, we heard a few birds sound off but nothing close. We sat there till about 530pm before anything happened. After sitting there and calling off an on, a couple of toms appeared. I worked them for 30mins trying to get them across the dang fence. First they worked down the fence to our left (hog wire) I went silent for a bit and they began to work back up where they came also closer to the 4-strand wire fence. They got in front of us close to the fence when they guide began pressing me to shoot. I did not feel comfortable shooting across the fence line. He continued to pressure me to shoot, "shoot now, hurry up, shoot now." So I gave into the pressure and shot. I intentionally shot over the bird as I was comfortable with this situation.
After the shot the guide said "there goes $350." I asked him what that meant and he told me the owner gives him $350 per bird that's harvested there since its his property.
We got back to camp at sunset and I saw the owner was there so I thought I would have a chat with him about what happened. Well, I quickly realized he was already intoxicated and was fraternizing with another hunter so I did not approach him about this.
Sunday morning, I asked to go to another spot. The guide told me he had roosted 3 birds near the spot we'd been hunting and we should be able to get one. At daybreak we again heard a few birds gobbling, none of them were very close. After a few hours, I managed to yelp up a gobbler with a hen. The tom stayed about 80 yards out strutting for his hen and never paid us much interest besides the courtesy gobble. That was the extent of my hunt.
I returned to camp and packed up my gear. The owner was not there so I was left to deal with his business associate. He told me my remaining balance was $1400. I told him I shouldn't have to pay the remaining balance as I did not have an opportunity to cleanly harvest a gobbler. He disagreed and said "you shot at a bird yesterday didn't you?" I explained that I shot over a bird on purpose because the guide wanted me to make an illegal shot. I went on to explain that the location we were at puts a hunter in a difficult predicament. He said that someone shot a bird there last weekend just fine. I informed him that the guide had told me that hunter shot the bird across the fence and they both lied about it. He then called me a liar. I realized there was no talking to this guy so I got in my truck and began the 17 hour drive home.
I understand that nothing is guaranteed with an outfitter but one would think they would have their together and could at least put you on property that has birds on it. I believe the guide kept taking me to that spot even after I asked to be taken to a different spot because he would collect additional money if I shot the bird from his property. I am beyond furious about the whole thing. What does the forum say?
Sounds like an awful hunt! I would have pulled the plug early and cut my losses. I did exactly that several years ago when a buddy and I paid an outfitter in NM to put us up in a bunk house, feed us and give us some prehunt scouting information, but otherwise turn us loose on the Gila. What a joke! The only info he had was from his wife who had seen a gobbler beside the black top a week earlier.
We got onto some birds on our own on the third morning, but pulled the plug, left and both scored on another public land area we had hunted in the past.The lodging was clean and the food was decent, but what we paid the guy for--narrowing our focus in the Gila was a total joke.
Stinks to travel that far and pay that much for a poor experience. If the entire hunt was going to consist of sitting in the same blind, on the same 10 acres, the outfitter should have told you that prior to the hunt, IMO.
That's rough, I would have been upset the moment the plan included a blind on 10acres. The urging to shoot over a line would have been a conversation right then and there
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Hearing your story, and what you went through, you should somehow let others know who this guy is in your own way, so no one else gets stuck. I get it if you rather not say. Be safe my friend, best of luck ..
I'm not sure I have room to type all the shady stuff that goes on but it happens because the birds have value and hunters are willing to chance it for the slam. I know a guy who's "meals" consisted of grilled hot dogs and pb & jelly sandwiches, no bird. Next "outfitter" sat him on lawn chairs in a friend's backyard of a subdivision, no bird. I could go on and on. However, I will be the first to say that only 10 acres is plenty to get it done there in the right place. One place my buddy has borders over a thousand acres w no trees. The birds head to the pasture all day but come to the half acre patch of trees on his place every evening. BUT, you screwed up when you took that shot, intentions aside. That told him he done his part and you couldn't seal the deal.
I've never paid for a guided hunt before but I have paid for a place to stay that had access to a pretty large amount of private land I could chase merriams on. I didn't pay near $1,400.00 and had I have paid even what I paid ($700 for 3 nights stay and 4 days to hunt) and arrived to find out I would only have access to 10 acres to hunt, I would of been pissed! That's absurd if you ask me and is NOT the kind of turkey hunting I would enjoy or feel satisfied with if I shot my last bird for my slam, some kind of a world record 2.5inch spurred, 15 bearded 35 pound behemoth gobbler or beautiful smoke phase or albino. That's just not for me!
I would bet a lot of people get caught up in the excitement and make the mistake often of not thoroughly checking out the outfitters they book with and aren't asking the right questions. Sorry about you lousy experience, but I'm guessing next time you'll probably have a lot more questions to ask before you book to make sure the outfitter you choose lines up with the experience you're hoping to take home with you regardless if you go home empty handed or not.
Dang man that sucks! Yea maybe there's a way you can mention the outfitter so others can avoid them. I plan on doing an Osceola hunt in 2022 and I would hate to pick this place.
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Sounds like a terrible experience!!
But I think you may have fowled up your chances of getting some of your money back by taking that shot .
In hind sight, you probably should have just stuck to your gut and told him NO ! I don't feel comfortable.
Quote from: TauntoHawk on April 07, 2021, 06:53:23 PM
That's rough, I would have been upset the moment the plan included a blind on 10acres. The urging to shoot over a line would have been a conversation right then and there
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X 2.
I don't mind saying if it helps someone out. This was at S&N Outfitters. I do agree that I'm on the hook for the money since I took a shot technically. I'm not too mad about the money as I make a good living but someone with not as much spending cash would be in a different boat. I had a good time other than the bad stuff that went down.
For the area, yes there were a lot of birds on the park across the fence.
I'm mostly upset as this would have been my first Osceola, completed my first slam, and would have been bird #100.
I will not be back with them that's for sure.
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To play devils advocate, should you not have paid the remaining balance because you didn't have a chance to cleanly harvest a bird or because you sat in the same blind for 3 days? I see what you're saying but that almost makes it sound like if you did have a chance to shoot a gobbler fairly, you wouldn't have had an issue paying even if all of the poor aspects of this hunt (the blind, the property, etc) were still the same. In fairness, even if this outfitter busted their the right way, it still shouldn't even remotely be a guarantee that you have a clean shot at a gobbler. I guess I'm just not a fan of outfitted hunts, especially when you can hit public land or knock on doors
All things considered, the thread could just as equally be titled "unethical hunter" considering you knowing pulled the trigger when you shouldn't have. Like they say, you can never take a shot back. Learn from it and move on.
We need to know who it is. Total B.S. pressuring you to shoot, if you would not have fired the "warning shot" you would have more ground to stand on. I know hind sight.
I have been guiding for years and actually had clients not shoot across lines, I try to avoid hunting close but at some point you always wind up on a line.
Quote from: Wvdanimal on April 07, 2021, 10:27:38 PM
All things considered, the thread could just as equally be titled "unethical hunter" considering you knowing pulled the trigger when you shouldn't have. Like they say, you can never take a shot back. Learn from it and move on.
Sure, I could agree to that. I gave in to the pressure and shot way over the bird or purpose just to shut up the guide. I admit I didn't handle that situation very well in the heat of the moment.
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Quote from: turkeyfool on April 07, 2021, 10:27:27 PM
To play devils advocate, should you not have paid the remaining balance because you didn't have a chance to cleanly harvest a bird or because you sat in the same blind for 3 days? I see what you're saying but that almost makes it sound like if you did have a chance to shoot a gobbler fairly, you wouldn't have had an issue paying even if all of the poor aspects of this hunt (the blind, the property, etc) were still the same. In fairness, even if this outfitter busted their the right way, it still shouldn't even remotely be a guarantee that you have a clean shot at a gobbler. I guess I'm just not a fan of outfitted hunts, especially when you can hit public land or knock on doors
I know there's no guarantee in a hunt. I don't mind hunting the same spot or area if that's where the action is. It felt a lot more.like deer hunting over a feeder than a turkey hunt.
I don't like the fact of paying the remaining balance because of the opportunity to cleanly harvest a bird. Didn't expect to be pressured into shooting at birds across the fence line.
I'd be ok to paying a pro-rated amount for not getting a bird would be better. I know they still have costs to cover their overheads, insurance, etc.
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The part that hits home for me is the outfitters name. That's really all I need to know.
Quote from: turkeygod4 on April 07, 2021, 10:26:26 PM
I don't mind saying if it helps someone out. This was at S&N Outfitters. I do agree that I'm on the hook for the money since I took a shot technically. I'm not too mad about the money as I make a good living but someone with not as much spending cash would be in a different boat. I had a good time other than the bad stuff that went down.
For the area, yes there were a lot of birds on the park across the fence.
I'm mostly upset as this would have been my first Osceola, completed my first slam, and would have been bird #100.
I will not be back with them that's for sure.
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Dang that's a bummer... I thought they were supposed to be a good place. I know Scott Ellis is guiding for them at the moment.
Bummer because that's some real shady crap to pull for what seems to be a top notch place.
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That sucks!! It's not the first time I've heard about unethical guides. Shoot me a PM if you want the contact info on a legit Osceola guide I've known for almost 30 years, and has an EXCELLENT success record.
Sent from deep in the woods where the critters roam.
Quote from: turkeyfool on April 07, 2021, 10:27:27 PM
or knock on doors
Apparently you haven't tried knocking on doors in Osceola country in the last 30 years. They'll laugh in your face.
Sent from deep in the woods where the critters roam.
Quote from: turkeygod4 on April 07, 2021, 10:26:26 PM
I don't mind saying if it helps someone out. This was at S&N Outfitters. I do agree that I'm on the hook for the money since I took a shot technically. I'm not too mad about the money as I make a good living but someone with not as much spending cash would be in a different boat. I had a good time other than the bad stuff that went down.
For the area, yes there were a lot of birds on the park across the fence.
I'm mostly upset as this would have been my first Osceola, completed my first slam, and would have been bird #100.
I will not be back with them that's for sure.
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Hard to beleive S&N would treat someone like this. I have always heard good things about them and was considering a hunt.
Quote from: mtns2hunt on April 08, 2021, 01:21:43 PM
Quote from: turkeygod4 on April 07, 2021, 10:26:26 PM
I don't mind saying if it helps someone out. This was at S&N Outfitters. I do agree that I'm on the hook for the money since I took a shot technically. I'm not too mad about the money as I make a good living but someone with not as much spending cash would be in a different boat. I had a good time other than the bad stuff that went down.
For the area, yes there were a lot of birds on the park across the fence.
I'm mostly upset as this would have been my first Osceola, completed my first slam, and would have been bird #100.
I will not be back with them that's for sure.
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Hard to beleive S&N would treat someone like this. I have always heard good things about them and was considering a hunt.
I heard great things about them which is why I booked a hunt with them. I've always hunted public land or got permission to hunt private. As this was my attempt at an Osceola I decided I would pay the money and hunt with an outfitter vs trying to get one on some very tough public ground.
I'm not trying to bad mouth them or ruin their reputation. I'm just sharing my experience with them. I'm hoping this in only a one off. The other hunters in camp harvested their birds and appeared to have a great time. They also hunted on larger parcels of property than I.
Quote from: Mossberg90MN on April 07, 2021, 11:17:50 PM
Quote from: turkeygod4 on April 07, 2021, 10:26:26 PM
I don't mind saying if it helps someone out. This was at S&N Outfitters. I do agree that I'm on the hook for the money since I took a shot technically. I'm not too mad about the money as I make a good living but someone with not as much spending cash would be in a different boat. I had a good time other than the bad stuff that went down.
For the area, yes there were a lot of birds on the park across the fence.
I'm mostly upset as this would have been my first Osceola, completed my first slam, and would have been bird #100.
I will not be back with them that's for sure.
Sent from my SM-G986U using Tapatalk
Dang that's a bummer... I thought they were supposed to be a good place. I know Scott Ellis is guiding for them at the moment.
Bummer because that's some real shady crap to pull for what seems to be a top notch place.
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Scott was actually in camp. He rolled into in a couple hours after I did. He and I spent the evening scouting/roosting birds for his hunter for the next morning. He was a great guy. Never thought in my life I would be roosting birds and drinking some brews with Scott. Unfortunately that was really the only highlight of the trip.
Quote from: turkeygod4 on April 08, 2021, 02:02:44 PM
Quote from: Mossberg90MN on April 07, 2021, 11:17:50 PM
Quote from: turkeygod4 on April 07, 2021, 10:26:26 PM
I don't mind saying if it helps someone out. This was at S&N Outfitters. I do agree that I'm on the hook for the money since I took a shot technically. I'm not too mad about the money as I make a good living but someone with not as much spending cash would be in a different boat. I had a good time other than the bad stuff that went down.
For the area, yes there were a lot of birds on the park across the fence.
I'm mostly upset as this would have been my first Osceola, completed my first slam, and would have been bird #100.
I will not be back with them that's for sure.
Sent from my SM-G986U using Tapatalk
Dang that's a bummer... I thought they were supposed to be a good place. I know Scott Ellis is guiding for them at the moment.
Bummer because that's some real shady crap to pull for what seems to be a top notch place.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Scott was actually in camp. He rolled into in a couple hours after I did. He and I spent the evening scouting/roosting birds for his hunter for the next morning. He was a great guy. Never thought in my life I would be roosting birds and drinking some brews with Scott. Unfortunately that was really the only highlight of the trip.
I would have liked to meet Scott. Been using his videos for some time. Great stuff.
One thing about this post is that it is rather onesided. There are always two sides to a story and a lot of variables. I certainly would not make a judgement call on this outfitter without hearing his side. To many friends have spoken highly of S&N. Just like Google reviews I am always skeptical.
Quote from: mtns2hunt on April 08, 2021, 02:23:46 PM
Quote from: turkeygod4 on April 08, 2021, 02:02:44 PM
Quote from: Mossberg90MN on April 07, 2021, 11:17:50 PM
Quote from: turkeygod4 on April 07, 2021, 10:26:26 PM
I don't mind saying if it helps someone out. This was at S&N Outfitters. I do agree that I'm on the hook for the money since I took a shot technically. I'm not too mad about the money as I make a good living but someone with not as much spending cash would be in a different boat. I had a good time other than the bad stuff that went down.
For the area, yes there were a lot of birds on the park across the fence.
I'm mostly upset as this would have been my first Osceola, completed my first slam, and would have been bird #100.
I will not be back with them that's for sure.
Sent from my SM-G986U using Tapatalk
Dang that's a bummer... I thought they were supposed to be a good place. I know Scott Ellis is guiding for them at the moment.
Bummer because that's some real shady crap to pull for what seems to be a top notch place.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Scott was actually in camp. He rolled into in a couple hours after I did. He and I spent the evening scouting/roosting birds for his hunter for the next morning. He was a great guy. Never thought in my life I would be roosting birds and drinking some brews with Scott. Unfortunately that was really the only highlight of the trip.
I would have liked to meet Scott. Been using his videos for some time. Great stuff.
One thing about this post is that it is rather onesided. There are always two sides to a story and a lot of variables. I certainly would not make a judgement call on this outfitter without hearing his side. To many friends have spoken highly of S&N. Just like Google reviews I am always skeptical.
I agree, there are, but I have no reason and gain nothing by lying. I regret not doing enough to speak up about going to a different location. I grew up mainly hunting Rio's on large acreage so I did not question the tactics used to hunt Osceola's. I believe they best know how to get on birds. I've hunted turkeys over 20 years and this was my first time hunting with an outfitter. So yea some blame can be put on me for not doing something about it and I should have listened to my gut when I was not comfortable.
I'm sure the local game warden would love to hear that they are regularly encouraging people to shoot across property lines. Good guides are hard to come by. Most that I run into are in it for a quick buck and don't mind bending the rules or screwing people over to achieve success. I'd like to do an Osceola trip sometime but it will likely be when I can take 10+ days off to do it on public vs paying 2-3k for a bird. The idea of hunting birds that are only there due to the bait pile that is 100yds away isn't appealing to me.
Quote from: turkeygod4 on April 08, 2021, 02:02:44 PM
Quote from: Mossberg90MN on April 07, 2021, 11:17:50 PM
Quote from: turkeygod4 on April 07, 2021, 10:26:26 PM
I don't mind saying if it helps someone out. This was at S&N Outfitters. I do agree that I'm on the hook for the money since I took a shot technically. I'm not too mad about the money as I make a good living but someone with not as much spending cash would be in a different boat. I had a good time other than the bad stuff that went down.
For the area, yes there were a lot of birds on the park across the fence.
I'm mostly upset as this would have been my first Osceola, completed my first slam, and would have been bird #100.
I will not be back with them that's for sure.
Sent from my SM-G986U using Tapatalk
Dang that's a bummer... I thought they were supposed to be a good place. I know Scott Ellis is guiding for them at the moment.
Bummer because that's some real shady crap to pull for what seems to be a top notch place.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Scott was actually in camp. He rolled into in a couple hours after I did. He and I spent the evening scouting/roosting birds for his hunter for the next morning. He was a great guy. Never thought in my life I would be roosting birds and drinking some brews with Scott. Unfortunately that was really the only highlight of the trip.
That's cool you got to hang out with Scott. He seems like a real solid guy.
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I wonder if that hunt Scott filmed with them not too long ago was in that exact same blind?
Lots of questions to be answered there.
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This is the first thread I have read on here where I just want to say "stop". I don't really want to hear about it. There is an old saying that always rings true. "Two wrongs don't make a right". Please don't say you gave in to the pressure. What pressure? According to your story, you were hunting with a piece of _____ outfitter and a no good guide. What kind of pressure could two people like that apply to an ethical turkey hunter? None. That is the answer. If you had not shot and complained or not shot and simply left, I would support you 100 percent. However, I am no more sympathetic to your situation than I am your outfitter. You each got what you deserved.
I am a little more sympathetic to your problem, I would not have shot. Nobody calls my shots. I did however have a bad experience with an outfitter(only time I ever used one) and see that some are very shady. I booked a hunt in Mo/Ks/and SD with an outfitter. When I showed up to his"camp in Mo, he was not to be found and never returned my calls. I got my license and slept in my rental that night in his yard. I hunted a WMA I scouted and made it into a great trip. I also had a chance to shoot a huge double bearded tom, across the property line of the WMA, and passed on an 18 yard shot at the biggest turkey I will probably ever see. Nobody around except me and my conscience. I did my homework and got hosed, I feel for you on that. But never give in to that BS. I did report him to local F&G and he was caught. I got my money back and he was fined. I still had a great trip and will try that area in the future. With my wife or kids this time. Al Baker
You may as well be knocking on doors in New York City and asking to hunt their apartment balcony as getting cold permission in South Florida. Ain't happening any more down there. When I was a young 'un 40 years ago, sure. Now? not a chance.
Quote from: g8rvet on April 09, 2021, 05:35:15 PM
You may as well be knocking on doors in New York City and asking to hunt their apartment balcony as getting cold permission in South Florida. Ain't happening any more down there. When I was a young 'un 40 years ago, sure. Now? not a chance.
How about knocking on doors with a big wad of greenbacks in hand?
Quote from: WTNUT on April 09, 2021, 03:28:01 PM
This is the first thread I have read on here where I just want to say "stop". I don't really want to hear about it. There is an old saying that always rings true. "Two wrongs don't make a right". Please don't say you gave in to the pressure. What pressure? According to your story, you were hunting with a piece of _____ outfitter and a no good guide. What kind of pressure could two people like that apply to an ethical turkey hunter? None. That is the answer. If you had not shot and complained or not shot and simply left, I would support you 100 percent. However, I am no more sympathetic to your situation than I am your outfitter. You each got what you deserved.
Good thing I'm not looking for sympathy. Thanks for your opinion.
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Quote from: zelmo1 on April 09, 2021, 04:04:38 PM
I am a little more sympathetic to your problem, I would not have shot. Nobody calls my shots. I did however have a bad experience with an outfitter(only time I ever used one) and see that some are very shady. I booked a hunt in Mo/Ks/and SD with an outfitter. When I showed up to his"camp in Mo, he was not to be found and never returned my calls. I got my license and slept in my rental that night in his yard. I hunted a WMA I scouted and made it into a great trip. I also had a chance to shoot a huge double bearded tom, across the property line of the WMA, and passed on an 18 yard shot at the biggest turkey I will probably ever see. Nobody around except me and my conscience. I did my homework and got hosed, I feel for you on that. But never give in to that BS. I did report him to local F&G and he was caught. I got my money back and he was fined. I still had a great trip and will try that area in the future. With my wife or kids this time. Al Baker
I know exactly who this one has the potential to be. He's everything you think of him and more. A liar and a scam artist.
Quote from: mtns2hunt on April 09, 2021, 10:30:31 PM
Quote from: g8rvet on April 09, 2021, 05:35:15 PM
You may as well be knocking on doors in New York City and asking to hunt their apartment balcony as getting cold permission in South Florida. Ain't happening any more down there. When I was a young 'un 40 years ago, sure. Now? not a chance.
How about knocking on doors with a big wad of greenbacks in hand?
The money isn't the issue. More than enough guys are willing to pay big money. Liability is the issue.
Quote from: Dukhuntr1991 on April 12, 2021, 06:04:46 AM
Quote from: mtns2hunt on April 09, 2021, 10:30:31 PM
Quote from: g8rvet on April 09, 2021, 05:35:15 PM
You may as well be knocking on doors in New York City and asking to hunt their apartment balcony as getting cold permission in South Florida. Ain't happening any more down there. When I was a young 'un 40 years ago, sure. Now? not a chance.
How about knocking on doors with a big wad of greenbacks in hand?
The money isn't the issue. More than enough guys are willing to pay big money. Liability is the issue.
I agree that liability is an issue but I think a wavier will overcome that.
10 acres/ Id be bored in 2 hrs. Any good outfitter should have room to move around.
Sorry for your bad experience, post the outfitters name and get on with turkey hunting!! Of all the places I have turkey hunted in the last 40 years, Fla goes down as the craziest,,,,packed public land with people lining up 3 hrs before daylight,,,,to get on!! Everything stings or bites,,,, Only hunted it once but that was enough.....never will kill a Osc,,,,but choose to hunt states much more enjoyable!!
Plenty of shady outfitters out there. You have to do your research, and preferably have a buddy who had a positive prior experience with the guy.
Sent from deep in the woods where the critters roam.
When I hunted Florida I was extremely fortunate. At that time...back in 1988...my BIL had a repair garage in Sarasota...I'm up here in NY. I asked him if he knew anybody that would let me turkey hunt. He got back to me that a cattle rancher inland from him was a customer...and would let me hunt. Well...I jumped on that. On his unpressured, unhunted ranch it took me all of two days to bag a couple Osceolas. The first was a dandy with a triple beard and 1 1/8" spurs.
Regarding hunting with a guide, do what you will. But I will never do so. The only time I have ever had a paid guide was to get my bow moose in NF...only because you have to in Canada.
Quote from: Turkeyman on April 13, 2021, 05:16:05 PM
When I hunted Florida I was extremely fortunate. At that time...back in 1988...my BIL had a repair garage in Sarasota...I'm up here in NY. I asked him if he knew anybody that would let me turkey hunt. He got back to me that a cattle rancher inland from him was a customer...and would let me hunt. Well...I jumped on that. On his unpressured, unhunted ranch it took me all of two days to bag a couple Osceolas. The first was a dandy with a triple beard and 1 1/8" spurs.
Regarding hunting with a guide, do what you will. But I will never do so. The only time I have ever had a paid guide was to get my bow moose in NF...only because you have to in Canada.
"At that time...back in 1988" I am not sure how a hunt back in 1988 is even relavent to todays Florida hunting. Florida has probably not seen many generous cattle ranchers in decades. Weather you hunt with or without a guide is an entirely personal decision and often depends on many different variables when hunting far from home. As stated many different variables exist such as the requirement to have a guide in Canada Geez :TooFunny:
I have to say, I think you're WAY more generous than I would have been.
I had a similar experience with a guy in Tx. who actually had an outdoor show called Tex Mex Outdoors.
I was bowhunting exotics and he told me there was a species of sheep on this one ranch. They weren't there...
I payed him for everything else that I hunted but not that species. Had they been there and I couldn't get them, I wouldn't have had the slightest issue paying. His excuse was, they were here three weeks ago according to someone he knew. Of course other people had hunted there since, and, to be honest, the guy had a little trouble with the truth.
Regarding "the shot", you gave in to the pressure. New guy in camp. They kind of have you in a spot. You trust that they'll do what's right...I understand how that could cloud your judgement. At least you purposely missed. I know a LOT of guys who would have caved and buried it. I give you credit there.
Had you not shot, and I'm sure you're painfully aware of this, you'd have had leverage to withhold payment, legitimately.
Appreciate you naming them for everyone else. I don't care their reputation, if they did it, they need to own it and change it.
I've had some really good experiences with outfitters and really bad ones. You wonder how the bad ones look in the mirror...
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I would not pay more than ten dollars to sit in a blind on the same 10 acres for 3 days. That is where you have a legitimate claim that you should get your money back. I think I would rather slum around public land and not see or hear anything than spend all the money and do that, at least I'd get some exercise. At least I'd have a chance at finding a shed antler or some mushrooms, or identify a new (to me) species of tree or anything.
I don't like outfitters, and I would never pay one a dime.