YouTube and public land

[owlhoot]

You cant even mention states? Pretty extreme. I don't have the time and luxury to go out to any out of state hunts. I spend enough on leases so I can go to different places in my home state. Only hunted 2 states and quit that 10 years ago as K got too crazy but was less pressure than here. State land around here is overrun and has been for many years. Many state lands are full of out of staters. We don't drive by people hunting in a spot because we have parking lots.  If they were not for people from out of state we would have some pretty good hunting. Deer hunters who have to travel a few hours can't get a room because of out of staters booking up years in advance.
All this started before you tube .
Anyway agree some on both sides and wouldn't want to have any more hunters now especially with the population of turkey being what they are. 

[GobbleNut]

a while back I posted a thread on how we treat each other and I think we all need to dial back our emotions some and think about all sides. I agree with most the videos create problems for not only the resource, but the user when specifics are shared about location. shane, Catman and Dave have all engaged and defended themselves, I respect their willingness to have a a dialog with us. There is a Bible verse that applies in all situations; do unto others as you'd have them do unto you. when doing something it's good to ask yourself, "how would I feel if I were the other person". The local guys are passionate about preserving their resource and the quality of their hunt and the video producers are committing to providing entertainment and educational resources. Let's stop and find some common ground. One thing is for sure, civil discussion is good. I suspect that as they built on their brand none of these guys thought they were doing anything harmful to anyone. Now at least three of them have heard our concerns, let's give them a chance to address them. Maybe they think we have a valid point maybe they don't. I do think we will see states start to address issues if they become harmful to the resource or their constituents, which are residents first, then everyone else.  Lost in this is there are a lot of hunters who simply don't have other options to travel or hunt elsewhere. A hunter lives and pays taxes and has his home in a community and he has a local WMA or state forest as his only place or best place to turkey hunt. Every year he contends with other people and they all find time and space. Then one year someone from another state rolls in and broadcast this spot to literally the world and the following year he rolls up and finds there is not even a place to park. Of course it's public and everyone has a right, but he has no option in his own back yard. Sure you can say he needs to just deal with it because it's public, but I understand why he's pissed too. The guy who lead them all here is gone after a 2-3 day visit and is off somewhere else doing his thing, but poor ole local is stuck in the carnage. This will probably last a few years or may be ruined for a long time. He used to have private land to hunt, but after all the shows and videos about how great the hunting is in XYZ out of state money bags have leased up all the farm ground. One simple rule would help alleviate all this grief...,don't reveal locations!

Great post eggshell!  Pretty well sums things up. 

[Gobble!]

THPs latest video is a prime example what not to do.

If you've spent any time looking at OnX or satellite/topo maps in general you can figure out where they are in no time. Being from Maryland it took me less than 5 minutes. At no point should they be looking at OnX with a camera over their shoulder, they basically shared a pin. I appreciate their attempt to hide it based on the order they put the video together but I can put a pin within a quarter mile of where they had one.

As it's taking them 7 days to kill a bird, unlike the easy to kill states down south  , I don't expect an explosion in pressure this spring. In the event they were piling up birds in these videos, I'd make note and possibly avoid that area.

Blame is not all on them though. For anyone who wasn't sure after watching the video all they need to do is review the comments and there you will find jackasses making sure everyone knows exactly where they are.

[POk3s]

I commented early on in this thread and after seeing Dave commented I read through his and others and I understand both sides. I love watching the style of hunting these guys bring. It's the "average guy" learning a place and hunting extremely hard. It's what I want to watch on tv. It excites me, it lights a fire, and gets me excited to hit the next state and go on my next hunt. In Wyoming, turkey hunting isn't locally popular. We don't have any very close at all, so it requires traveling and is a different mindset that most don't share. I have a very meager following here in the western states, even smaller on YouTube, and probably even smaller than that that watch any of my turkey hunting videos. With that said, I've went and removed the states from the titles. It might be something I revisit in the future and it will definitely result in fewer "clicks" as people research their state or states they plan on going to and enjoy watching those videos about them but I'm okay with that. I realize you can't make everybody happy, and again my small contribution literally means nothing, but I guess in the end I don't want reason for people to take the wind out of my sails this coming turkey season as I simply try and show a different aspect of what the YouTube giants have already done.

Before I end my pointless ramblings, I would say everybody shares a common courtesy to keep spots safe. If you know where these guys are, don't comment, and maybe even bring awareness to the fact that people are commenting on the spots. I delete a lot of comments, but I get a whole lot less and it's easy for me to keep up on. I imagine it's impossible for those guys.

[deerhunt1988]

I commented early on in this thread and after seeing Dave commented I read through his and others and I understand both sides. I love watching the style of hunting these guys bring. It's the "average guy" learning a place and hunting extremely hard. It's what I want to watch on tv. It excites me, it lights a fire, and gets me excited to hit the next state and go on my next hunt. In Wyoming, turkey hunting isn't locally popular. We don't have any very close at all, so it requires traveling and is a different mindset that most don't share. I have a very meager following here in the western states, even smaller on YouTube, and probably even smaller than that that watch any of my turkey hunting videos. With that said, I've went and removed the states from the titles. It might be something I revisit in the future and it will definitely result in fewer "clicks" as people research their state or states they plan on going to and enjoy watching those videos about them but I'm okay with that. I realize you can't make everybody happy, and again my small contribution literally means nothing, but I guess in the end I don't want reason for people to take the wind out of my sails this coming turkey season as I simply try and show a different aspect of what the YouTube giants have already done.

Before I end my pointless ramblings, I would say everybody shares a common courtesy to keep spots safe. If you know where these guys are, don't comment, and maybe even bring awareness to the fact that people are commenting on the spots. I delete a lot of comments, but I get a whole lot less and it's easy for me to keep up on. I imagine it's impossible for those guys.

Props to you!

And you are right, you will get less views. That is why the big YouTubers will continue to name states. If they all took the same approach as you, they'd still be recruiting plenty of hunters, selling more licenses, but not causing the 'gold rush' syndrome that is ruining the quality of some of our public lands. Once again, I commend you for your actions. It shows you truly care.

[Fdept56]

Like some others have said, I hate to chastise this guys too much for being able to make a living doing what they love, but something has really irked me lately about THP. I noticed on a few of their Instagram posts that they will say "Sponsored by Tennessee DNR" or something to that effect. Are they really taking money from states to hunt their public land? Further, are states really paying people to show off their public lands? I understand that it will cause people to want to travel there but that is doing nothing but hurting these places. Hopefully someone knows a little more about this.

[El Pavo Grande]

One can say what they want about the need for hunter recruitment, but turkey hunting is 3 fold or probably even more than it was 20+ years ago.  I don't believe hunter recruitment was a viable reason for these guys to start YouTube channels.  I would bet that wasn't even on the radar.  They can honestly answer that if they want.  To share what they love to do?  Sure, I understand that.  I don't begrudge them for doing it, but agree with others.... why even name states or show campgrounds, etc.??  It's not necessary.  For sponsors like OnX, it's about $$$, and these guys are the platform.  It's not about hunter recruitment or the betterment of the resource.  It's simply about the bottom line.  Now the animal has been unleashed.  It's amazing how many now have YouTube channels, many of which won't adhere to any parameters.  Most just don't know any better.  Just as many don't know any better than to share specifics or photos at WMA signs on FB or forums.  I'm not naming names, but a YouTube video was brought to attention of guys wearing a strutter decoy on a helmet?  Is that good the sport??  If you argue, "well if it's legal" then we can just agree to disagree.  I would say social media and technology has done more negative for the resource than positives.   

[FL-Boss]

The bottom line is we live in a world of "likes" "shares" and "follows"  The YouTube superstars will only continue to grow every year....that's a fact.  Private land lease prices will continue to go through the roof, and push even more hunters to Public land.  The overall available U.S. land to hunt decreases every year (4,200 acres per day)  as the overall population increases every year.
Do the math, the public land pressure will only get worse every year.  Public land turkey hunting in Florida is already a total $hit show.  This goes for many southern states, the western states will be the same in the not so distant future.

[The Southpaw]

The bottom line is that youtube isn't going away, so hunters are going to have to learn to deal with the added pressure. I think a lot of people have a bad taste in their mouth from all of the extra hunters that were in the woods last season due to Covid. Sure, it might not be hard to tell where these guys are if you have a decent amount of competence with maps, but there will still be turkeys there. There are plenty of places to hunt, so if there is an influx of pressure in a particular spot, why not drive to another? Sure it might take a little extra effort, but there is nothing wrong with that. 

The guys who are willing to put forth a little extra effort will still kill turkeys, the guys that aren't willing to will continue to find something to complain about.

[Hobbes]

Im opposed to any mention of WMA names, trailhead numbers, road names, displaying OnX aerial maps or anything that can pinpoint a location, but I've only seen that a couple of times on the folks that I watch and only one of those was a turkey hunt.  However, I don't go digging to see if I can find where they are hunting.  It looks like a few of the whiners here are doing just that.   

I suppose if you have to blame pressure or your inability to kill a turkey on something, the YouTube guys are an easy target.  It used to be the forums that got blamed and before that it was magazine articles.   

[Kyle_Ott]

I commented early on in this thread and after seeing Dave commented I read through his and others and I understand both sides. I love watching the style of hunting these guys bring. It's the "average guy" learning a place and hunting extremely hard. It's what I want to watch on tv. It excites me, it lights a fire, and gets me excited to hit the next state and go on my next hunt. In Wyoming, turkey hunting isn't locally popular. We don't have any very close at all, so it requires traveling and is a different mindset that most don't share. I have a very meager following here in the western states, even smaller on YouTube, and probably even smaller than that that watch any of my turkey hunting videos. With that said, I've went and removed the states from the titles. It might be something I revisit in the future and it will definitely result in fewer "clicks" as people research their state or states they plan on going to and enjoy watching those videos about them but I'm okay with that. I realize you can't make everybody happy, and again my small contribution literally means nothing, but I guess in the end I don't want reason for people to take the wind out of my sails this coming turkey season as I simply try and show a different aspect of what the YouTube giants have already done.

Before I end my pointless ramblings, I would say everybody shares a common courtesy to keep spots safe. If you know where these guys are, don't comment, and maybe even bring awareness to the fact that people are commenting on the spots. I delete a lot of comments, but I get a whole lot less and it's easy for me to keep up on. I imagine it's impossible for those guys.

Kudos to you for this.  Wish there were more adapting this approach.   

[Dtrkyman]

I hunted public in three states last year, ran into 2 guys in the woods and one was at a parking spot. You can still avoid folks!   Fortunately I am able to hunt during the week mostly though.

I am sure the activity has increased but I started hunting these birds in the early 90s and public land had the same stigma.

The first few times I hunted Missouri on public was in the mid 90s, and the pressure was crazy, however the locals seemed to just ride the gravel listening for gobbles, my cousin killed his first bird there while a guy was hooting at them from the road!

We are a major minority in this country and with the current clown show in Government we need em all!!!

[GobbleNut]

I'm opposed to any mention of WMA names, trailhead numbers, road names, displaying OnX aerial maps or anything that can pinpoint a location, but I've only seen that a couple of times on the folks that I watch and only one of those was a turkey hunt.  However, I don't go digging to see if I can find where they are hunting. 

Agreed.  I personally find it surprising that turkey hunters seem to want to seek out places to go hunt based on figuring out where someone else hunts.  As far as I can tell, there are hundreds of millions of acres of public land in this country open for hunting, much of which has turkeys on it.  Don't want to hunt turkeys in the crowds?  Stop looking for the places where the crowds will be and go find the places where they aren't.  I guarantee you there are still plenty of those places left in this country.

If someone's dedication as a turkey hunter extends only to the point of wanting to drive five, ten, or fifteen minutes from his house and have a public hunting spot all to himself on a Saturday morning, then my first thought is that maybe that individual is not dedicated enough,...as well as not being realistic.

One recent video by one of the YouTuber's in question shows him driving all night long from his home to hunt another state for a couple of days at the end of the season.  That's dedication, gentlemen and ladies!  If you want to get away from the crowds to turkey hunt, then try that on for size!



 

[eggshell]

I only have one philosophy when it comes to killing turkeys....I kill em where I find them. I have killed them 75 yards from the truck and 5 miles from the truck. You'd be surprised how many birds are walked and driven past.

[Hobbes]

I'm on board with what you are saying Gobblenut.  I'll add this though, I don't drive hours to find unpressured gobblers, I drive hours so that I have more tags to fill.  I think that's what you'll find with most folks, they are driving to extend their season and more opportunities.  I kill my one local bird with the masses then move on to other regions, some with less pressure and some with more.  (I'll admit that "masses" is a relative term and spring turkey hunter numbers in MT are a small fraction of what most of you find back East.)
 
I walk miles to find birds if necessary but I'll gladly call one in within spitting distance of the road if I find him there.  I've not noticed any difference with the folks mentioned on YouTube. 

To use a term that one of my teenagers used to use.......Some of you guys need to spend more time hunting and planning your own hunts instead of walking around "butt hurt" over a few YouTube channels. 

Heck.....plan a trip to kill a Merriam's in someone else's backyard.