NWTF Convention disappointment

[Goodtimekiller]

For a comprehensive evaluation

https://www.charitynavigator.org/index.cfm?bay=search.summary&orgid=4201

They do get a high score as charities go, but accounting can be pretty creative. The most glaring thing I see in the graph goodtimekiller posted is only 22%+ went to conservation and 52%+ to program and fund raising, program means any expense not attributed to direct mission. That may include salaries. Overall aprox. 77% went to things other than direct Turkey conservation. I concede thay have done a lot of good in the past. They helped fund land and research, but they have also evolved into a corporate beast. The link I gave shows >40 million in revenue and ~39 M in expenses. Divide that by 49 states with turkeys = ~795,000 dollars per state meant to help turkeys. In my home state of Ohio 1.7 M +/- hunting license were sold. That equals 45 cents per license holder spent by the NWTF on turkeys. If we each donated $1.00 extra on our license purchase we'd bury their contributions. Ohio allow you to do that and I have. I'll spnd my money at home thank you.

Their goals have changed and this is one reason why the programs % is higher, spreading turkeys is now not a major concern as recruiting and keeping hunters, obtaining land we can all use, lobbying for gun rights, etc etc etc.

Conservation is not the huge issue for turkeys today as it was, but if you recruit and keep hunters in a conservation minded organization, then conservation by default grows.


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[Goodtimekiller]

I was part of an NWTF chapter for a while and finally realized that I really didn't agree with what was happening. I think the organization was beneficial to the wild turkey at one time, but I have never seen their presence or evidence of their presence anywhere that I personally hunt or have hunted, and populations seem to be falling everywhere. Where are they doing anything to help a single turkey?

I will go as far as to say that the NWTF's promotion of the sport for monetary gain is doing our precious turkeys more harm than good.


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If you have hunted turkeys, are able to have guns, seen more abundant wildlife, you have definitely seen the presence of the nwtf, whether you knew it or not.

And, the nwtf id helping fund and provide personnel to several states to study the decline in turkeys.

If you think that anyone promoting hunting is hurting the sport, when hunter numbers are falling drastically on a national level, you are selfish or ignorant.



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[Gentry]

I was part of an NWTF chapter for a while and finally realized that I really didn't agree with what was happening. I think the organization was beneficial to the wild turkey at one time, but I have never seen their presence or evidence of their presence anywhere that I personally hunt or have hunted, and populations seem to be falling everywhere. Where are they doing anything to help a single turkey?

I will go as far as to say that the NWTF's promotion of the sport for monetary gain is doing our precious turkeys more harm than good.


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If you have hunted turkeys, are able to have guns, seen more abundant wildlife, you have definitely seen the presence of the nwtf, whether you knew it or not.

And, the nwtf id helping fund and provide personnel to several states to study the decline in turkeys.

If you think that anyone promoting hunting is hurting the sport, when hunter numbers are falling drastically on a national level, you are selfish or ignorant.



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Well I guess I struck a nerve. They must sign your check.
I can agree with your first paragraph. Although I was not aware they have helped us maintain our 2nd amendment in anyway.

Where are the hunter numbers dramatically falling? I've heard this before but have never seen proof, but I have not looked for it. I don't think they falling one bit. Definitely not in the SE. I believe they are more turkey hunters in the woods now than ever before. I would like to see the numbers. We are all selfish to some existent when it comes to turkey hunting. Ignorant nah I don't believe so. That's all I have to say about this topic.


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[Roost 1]

Number of people hunting squirrels, doves, rabbits, raccoons, etc may be dripping but I firmly believe their are more turkey hunters today than ever before....

[guesswho]

I'm one of the ignorant ones I guess.   The best turkey hunting I ever experienced was pre N"WTF".   I also remember the FG&FWFC trapping and trading turkeys for deer way before the N"WTF" was even a thought.   

And I wish someone would send me a map of all this property they purchased that we can hunt I'd appreciate it.   I called them a few years ago and they couldn't point me toward any property they acquired for us hunters to enjoy.   If someone wants to support them, more power to you, but They got my last dollar years ago.  I'll give them credit, they are great at taking advantage of photo opportunities. 

[Goodtimekiller]

I was part of an NWTF chapter for a while and finally realized that I really didn't agree with what was happening. I think the organization was beneficial to the wild turkey at one time, but I have never seen their presence or evidence of their presence anywhere that I personally hunt or have hunted, and populations seem to be falling everywhere. Where are they doing anything to help a single turkey?

I will go as far as to say that the NWTF's promotion of the sport for monetary gain is doing our precious turkeys more harm than good.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

If you have hunted turkeys, are able to have guns, seen more abundant wildlife, you have definitely seen the presence of the nwtf, whether you knew it or not.

And, the nwtf id helping fund and provide personnel to several states to study the decline in turkeys.

If you think that anyone promoting hunting is hurting the sport, when hunter numbers are falling drastically on a national level, you are selfish or ignorant.



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Well I guess I struck a nerve. They must sign your check.
I can agree with your first paragraph. Although I was not aware they have helped us maintain our 2nd amendment in anyway.

Where are the hunter numbers dramatically falling? I've heard this before but have never seen proof, but I have not looked for it. I don't think they falling one bit. Definitely not in the SE. I believe they are more turkey hunters in the woods now than ever before. I would like to see the numbers. We are all selfish to some existent when it comes to turkey hunting. Ignorant nah I don't believe so. That's all I have to say about this topic.


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The fact that you say you had no idea that the nwtf helped maintain our 2nd amendment right is proof of ignorance by definition.

I have never received a penny from the nwtf but i have been given much more than that because I can remember hunting when it was rare to hear or see a turkey, much less have a limit of 4/season.


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[GobbleNut]

Their goals have changed and this is one reason why the programs % is higher, spreading turkeys is now not a major concern as recruiting and keeping hunters, obtaining land we can all use, lobbying for gun rights, etc etc etc.
Conservation is not the huge issue for turkeys today as it was, but if you recruit and keep hunters in a conservation minded organization, then conservation by default grows.

Conservation of wild turkeys, their habitats, and the myriad issues that affect them is just as big an issue, if not more-so, than it has ever been.  There are plenty of places where the money that is being spent on these other programs could be put to much better use (in a lot of folks opinion) by spending it on trying to resolve current turkey population problems. 

Simply put, the reason that it is not is because turkeys don't give dollars to pay for salaries and infrastructure.  Granted, there is a balance between helping turkeys and finding the financial resources needed to accomplish that.  Unfortunately, it appears to many of us long-time supporters that the balance has tipped too far to the side of raising dollars at the expense of helping turkeys.

....Just the view from a long-time NWTF volunteer/leader that witnessed the changes take place over several decades.  If others are happy with the current status quo of the organization, that is their prerogative.  Again, I just think it is unfortunate that helping wild turkeys has become secondary to putting dollars in the NWTF coffers. 

[trkehunr93]

My comment was from experience at the local level seeing first hand how the hard work you put into organizing and getting people to attend a banquet and then seeing finances divided up and a tiny check cut for a local chapter compared to what went to the national organization was mind boggling.  You can access the "Super Fund" but you have to ask for the money if you have a project you want to work on.  If that's the case just start your own rod and gun club and make an impact locally where it matters.  If you want to enact change then bend your representatives ear and let them know how you feel about a conservation/access issue, enough people bending the same ear gets results.  We need to fight our own fights, not depend on others to do it for us. 


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[Kystrut]

LOL...I swear...some of you guys are DRINKING the koolaid... you are also the same guys working your tails off at your local chapter to send NWTF a fat check...?
It's ok though..call it charity. I mean when Mr Keck resigned in 2008 he was only pulling down $360,000 a year...
Keep your money in your pocket boys. The real turkey men are at unicoi. I could care less about seeing Michael Waddell and his roadies...
I mean come on.. take a blue collar man that has 3 boys and works for a living. It cost him $80 bucks to take his boys last year. That same show this year cost him $140...
I'm a call maker..I have been right there on the front row. Most of you have probably walked past my booth. I know how it works as an attendee and a vendor.
I can tell you one thing for sure... I never even had one of those fat cats with the $400,000 salaries stop by my booth and thank me for being there....
Boys if you want someone to fight for your guns join the NRA.

[GobbleNut]

I mean when Mr Keck resigned in 2008 he was only pulling down $360,000 a year...

Actually, I think that was just his base salary.  With "perks" I believe it was pushing half-a-mil. ....Anyhow, way too much for a non-profit that was primarily being supported by a bunch of folks making 10% of that or less a year.  Some folks just don't get the concept of working for the resource because you love the resource,...money be damned.

[Goodtimekiller]

https://www.charitynavigator.org/index.cfm?bay=search.summary&orgid=4201

One of the highest rated conservation nonprofits.

Funny, if i had walked by your booth and tried your calls and didnt like them, i would not post on tndeer about how bad they are. I guess some people just like to gripe and complain while the rest of us keep working hard to keep hunting and conservation going.


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[HookedonHooks]

It cost him $80 bucks to take his boys last year. That same show this year cost him $140...

That same man now has $100 in Bass Pro gift cards that he wouldn't have had last year paying $80. Not sure if you're against Bass Pro, and their higher than most price point, but surely $100 back to spend there could get something useful for you and your boys. A couple boxes of shotgun shells at least, they're only a couple dollars higher than Wally World.

I don't see the big gripe many are having, seems like it was really put together this year. Sure it's not the same show it used to be, but as times change, businesses and orginazations have to adapt and revolve around those changes or they won't survive.

[dzsmith]

I have expressed my displeasure with the NWTF here before and got hit pretty hard with criticism, but I see that others are feeling like me now. I was on board at the inception and actually met or knew many of the "old guard" officers. I remember when Rob Keck was just some young upstart guy. I actually called in an a amateur competition with him once, where he mentored the contestants with tips. He was a very personable guy. A friend of mine became a regional director and he often called me to take people they wanted to impress on hunts. Mostly these were pheasant hunts and he always joked he didn't want me he just wanted my dog. Anyway, I met a lot of the top people and they were great. As time went on, I saw less and less of these guys as "money men" took over. My friend told me once, "I can't get these new guys to come hunt with us we're not important enough". Since I also worked for DNR I saw how money was spent and that soured me too. All I will say is it wasn't spent wisely on the local chapters. I also contend that the states done most of the hard work and would have done it without the NWTF. What NWTF done best was put more idiots in the woods. OK, I'm starting to rant so I'll quit.

AMEN!.... not to say the convention isn't cool, I went a couple years ago and had a decent time , but I agree with the last part of your statement . Everybody is a turkey hunter now days.

[eggshell]

The best turkey hunting I ever experienced was pre N"WTF".   I also remember the FG&FWFC trapping and trading turkeys for deer way before the N"WTF" was even a thought.   .

Actually that is a good point. Here in Ohio our first modern day season was late 60s, I believe maybe 1967. I do know that reintroduction started in the late 1950s and I actually knew the people who done it. The NWTF didn't start until 1971 or 72 (maybe someone remembers which year). They were pretty small until the 80s. So most of the turkey populations were well on their way before the NWTF was a significant organization....this is why I have stated several times, "the states done the work" at least for the most part. Now I will concede the NWTF in it's most effective time brought a lot of light to turkey huunting and yes they actually did provide a lot of money for land and thousands of boxes. Yet just as a train was built to haul freight and is valuable when it's doing that, it's no good when it runs down tracks to the wrong destination. I once was all in on NWTF, but I am convinced they are on the wrong track. I will say if you enjoy the show and all the trappings then support what you believe in. When I worked for Wildlife I had many organizations approach me wanting to know what they could do. The ones who done the most for me were the local or state groups, the big national Organizations done very little. I always made time and created the avenues for these groups. They were salt of the earth and sportsmen and women are some of the most dedicated and generous in the world, corporations are not. The NWTF now works more like a corporation. What I'm sayiing is I think they have lost some of their humanity.

One point I hope we can all agree on by reading through this thread.....The NWTF has an image problem

[Roost 1]

GTK,
   Please tell me what your local chapter is doing to help the turkeys in the Clarksville/Montgomery Co area? With all the money that is raised by that chapter, along with the way you are defending the NWTF, it must be something good going on over there. I'd like to come see the local dollars at work.