Hevi #7 Patterns.....Thanks Environ-Metal

[Gobble!]

 I will clarify..illegally baiting has become a serious problem where I am from..
    I have also guided for allot of years and i have a number of guys that come in and take shots at 45+ believing that their high tech guns will easily shoot that far. It results in allot of missed turkeys.
    I have taught allot of kids how to turkey hunt and i am certainly not promoting or teaching these kids to see," just how far they can shoot at a turkey".  I have taught them how to call, when to call, and where to set up: as to bring the turkey to them. Has resulted in some amazing turkey hunters. The way we hunt is the legacy we leave behind.
    Not sure which part of that upset you guys so much..the baiting issue or taking unethical shots..but the turkeys i see shot at less than 40yds away..regardless of how spectacular your gun is..seem to ride home in the back of the truck the majority of the time.  

I'm with you on this one, I have read a number of times about nimrods that hear about the new super shells and are shooting at birds 50+ yards with out ever patterning there guns, they are doing more to damage our sport than anything, peppering birds and letting them die a slow death because they read that these new shells will kill birds at unheard of ranges is not cool! I worked next to a guy that sat on the phone and blabbed to his friends how he had these new shells "Hevi-13" and he could shoot 60-70+ he was using his factory full choke and could not figure out why the birds he had shot at of the weekend did not die but he told his Friends they all needed to buy the shells so they could shoot long range to! I begged him to buy a good choke and pattern his gun but he looked at me like I was from Mars.
I wanted to bounce his head off the table! I think (just my 2 cents) if a guy spends the time to dial in a rig to 50 he should spend an equal amount of time learning to get the bird inside 40 so he can crush him at 50 if needed and not spray and pray at 60, well that's my rant sorry!

Kurt

I would be willing to guarantee you your friend never patterned that gun at 60-70 yards. People like him are the ones giving people like some of us bad names who actually put the time in to pattern our guns at 50 and 60 yards

[ILIKEHEVI-13]

Read this and tell me that this was an unethical shot.  The only guy I know that wished he wouldn't have shot that shot was the bird.  

http://forum.gon.com/showthread.php?t=614499

[pdaugherty]

 I will clarify..illegally baiting has become a serious problem where I am from..
    I have also guided for allot of years and i have a number of guys that come in and take shots at 45+ believing that their high tech guns will easily shoot that far. It results in allot of missed turkeys.
    I have taught allot of kids how to turkey hunt and i am certainly not promoting or teaching these kids to see," just how far they can shoot at a turkey".  I have taught them how to call, when to call, and where to set up: as to bring the turkey to them. Has resulted in some amazing turkey hunters. The way we hunt is the legacy we leave behind.
    Not sure which part of that upset you guys so much..the baiting issue or taking unethical shots..but the turkeys i see shot at less than 40yds away..regardless of how spectacular your gun is..seem to ride home in the back of the truck the majority of the time.  

I'm with you on this one, I have read a number of times about nimrods that hear about the new super shells and are shooting at birds 50+ yards with out ever patterning there guns, they are doing more to damage our sport than anything, peppering birds and letting them die a slow death because they read that these new shells will kill birds at unheard of ranges is not cool! I worked next to a guy that sat on the phone and blabbed to his friends how he had these new shells "Hevi-13" and he could shoot 60-70+ he was using his factory full choke and could not figure out why the birds he had shot at of the weekend did not die but he told his Friends they all needed to buy the shells so they could shoot long range to! I begged him to buy a good choke and pattern his gun but he looked at me like I was from Mars.
I wanted to bounce his head off the table! I think (just my 2 cents) if a guy spends the time to dial in a rig to 50 he should spend an equal amount of time learning to get the bird inside 40 so he can crush him at 50 if needed and not spray and pray at 60, well that's my rant sorry!

Kurt

These nimrods that you speak of are probably not real turkey hunters if you actually think about it. They are probably some of the same people that are hunting over bait. If you think turkey hunting over a corn pile is hunting then you are badley mistaken. The comment was made that these shells are super shells and that people think that they can kill birds at unheard of distances. I would be willing to bet that the people making these shots have not been turkey hunting long and don't really understand the whole concept of patterning your gun and what different chokes are for. I've never seen any major ammo manufactor promote shooting turkeys at 60, 70, 80 yds. If anyone out there has please let me know.

[Longshanks]

Thank you.

[K-ZONE]

 The spray and pray people are the same ones that did it with lead and will never change..just cause they dont do it right doesn't mean the rest of us cant do it either..!. Guns that produce a killing pattern at 50 or 60yds do just that "KILL" and very effectivly in the right hands.

When Taking a client hunting u set the guidelines if u let him pull the trigger at extended  ranges then the money meant more than the birds and u are just as guilty of spray and pray unless u know that he and his equipment are capable of  making a clean kill at extended ranges under pressure.

[jakesdad]

The spray and pray people are the same ones that did it with lead and will never change..just cause they dont do it right doesn't mean the rest of us cant do it either..!. Guns that produce a killing pattern at 50 or 60yds do just that "KILL" and very effectivly in the right hands.

This pretty much sums it up for me.I shoot lead and hold my shots to 30 or less.I have tried HTL out of my 20 and would shoot a bird at 45 with the utmost confidence,but I only choose to shoot close because I made that decision,not anybody else.i get tired of hearing the "good ole boy" locals talk about killing turkeys with long barrelled full choke 10 gauges at 80 yds.Possible,yes.Lucky,more than likely.The guys that shoot the HTL stuff,especially the TSS loads,have proven their guns are VERY capable of reaching out and putting the smackdown at 50+.I have no problem with this,as these guys made the ethical choice of making sure what they and their guns could do.Make your own choices,but make them under proven results,not what your buddies said or something from the internet.

[Gobble!]

I make them pattern their guns when they get here.. and if they do something stupid like shoot before i say they leave with no refund..cant stop a grown man that acts like a child from pulling the trigger when he has the gun in his hand...if you can figure out how to do that give me a shout smartass..and furthermore just because a man can hit a piece of paper at 40+ yds doesnt mean he can pull it off on a wild turkey..next time you shoot at a turkey at 60yds and he flies off just remember this little discussion.

So say a customer comes in and a bird hangs up at 50 and you don't let him shoot even though he has done the work patterning his gun knowing what it is capable of. You provide him with a full refund and schedule him in again at his earliest convenience correct?

[Gobble!]

The spray and pray people are the same ones that did it with lead and will never change..just cause they dont do it right doesn't mean the rest of us cant do it either..!. Guns that produce a killing pattern at 50 or 60yds do just that "KILL" and very effectivly in the right hands.

This pretty much sums it up for me.I shoot lead and hold my shots to 30 or less.I have tried HTL out of my 20 and would shoot a bird at 45 with the utmost confidence,but I only choose to shoot close because I made that decision,not anybody else.i get tired of hearing the "good ole boy" locals talk about killing turkeys with long barrelled full choke 10 gauges at 80 yds.Possible,yes.Lucky,more than likely.The guys that shoot the HTL stuff,especially the TSS loads,have proven their guns are VERY capable of reaching out and putting the smackdown at 50+.I have no problem with this,as these guys made the ethical choice of making sure what they and their guns could do.Make your own choices,but make them under proven results,not what your buddies said or something from the internet.

well said

[doepee]

In my own opinion and this is just mine , the guys that take the longer shots, 60 plus haven't really hunted all that long. 50 is along ways and I just wish I had a pattern at 50 incase I misjudge one at 40. I prefer 20 to 30 yards

[doepee]

Longshanks--Wrong,mister shoot at 60 yrds.........I don't know if that was directed at me or not.... I would NOT take a shot at 60yrds   40 is my max, I said I just wish I had a gun that would pattern at 50 , just incase I would misjudge my 40 yard shot and still make a ethical kill,, I prefer them close thats half the fun, I said I think the guys that try to shoot 60 plus really haven't hunted that long,, new guys that think all the new stuff makes clean kills at the longer ranges is just wrong.

[Longshanks]

No sir, that was directed at the two gentlemen before you.  I respect what you had to say and can tell you are an experienced turkey hunter.  I cantfigure out how to pull down a window,  sorry for the confusion.

[doepee]

Longshanks--yeah sorry I was confused also   You can click on the quote and make a reply to their topic... For what we have said, It is amazing that you hear of all these long shots but I am positive that people who take these shots DO cripple some birds , but certainly nobody is going to post that they crippled one this weekend you know that happens. You owe it to the animal that you hunt be what ever it is or how ever it is pursued to make a ethical clean kill. 

[Longshanks]

Well said doepee..can tell that you truly appreciate the wild turkey and turkey hunting.  Sometimes i listen to people talk about shooting long range and it seems they have missed the most exciting part of turkey hunting.  Fooling the turkey with calling and making him come look for you and walking right to your position.  Watching him in all of his glory strutting and drumming right in front of you and gobbling so close to you that it gives you chills.    If you dont fool him its "ok" if he walks away.   The fun is over when you shoot... unless you just hunt turkeys to brag about killing them.  Im very thankful that my old dad taught me and showed me how to turkey hunt and to appreciate the wild turkey.   Immaturity and inexperience in turkey hunting is revealed when a man just has to take a long range shot at a turkey that could result in crippling him just because he cant stand the thought of not killing every turkey they come across.

[doepee]

Quite a few years ago before I started huntin turkeys I did nothing but bowhunt for deer{I still do} and I let alot of them pass by. Alot of people don't ... Then when I started huntin turkeys the fun part was callin them in close, when they gobble right in front of ya , Thats excitin, that beat bowhunting... I got so many calls I never know which ones I want to use. That is the fun part to me, choosing the call and workin the bird and watching and listening to him, I have let birds go that I thought were out of range..doesn't bother me , theres always tomorrow...I would rather be sure than loose a wounded one. Don't get me wrong I love blastin one , but like you said then its over..

[doepee]

Sure them guns might pattern well at 60 yrds, and I am sure there are kills at that range, but when you shoot at the range for patterning its always a whole lot different in the hunting situation...Like I said, nobody posts CRIPPLED ONE AT 60 ....  and everyone has their own opinion