Pre-set blind?

[VanHelden Game Calls]

"what have you or the child accomplished by killing a turkey" 

Base lessons taught and learned that will evolve with them as they progress through the different levels of hunting. We lit a fire that they will now carry with them forever.

They have the rest of there lives to "learn" their way. No one can tell a person what is the best way, right way, and what way will mean more.  There is so much more to a hunt then how it was lured in, how you concealed yourself, what you used to kill it.

Tell me this kid doesn't look proud, tell this kid after 15hrs of hunting, 4hrs of classroom and hrs practice shooting that he did not earn it.

[jakesdad]

"what have you or the child accomplished by killing a turkey" 

Base lessons taught and learned that will evolve with them as they progress through the different levels of hunting. We lit a fire that they will now carry with them forever.

They have the rest of there lives to "learn" their way. No one can tell a person what is the best way, right way, and what way will mean more.  There is so much more to a hunt then how it was lured in, how you concealed yourself, what you used to kill it.

Tell me this kid doesn't look proud, tell this kid after 15hrs of hunting, 4hrs of classroom and hrs practice shooting that he did not earn it.

Agree 100%.Ive been able to let my boy witness things from a blind that may take him years or never see by doing it "the right way".Bird reactions to calls,decoys,other birds are all easier to witness from a blind and it enables a kid to be more interactive and productive without trying to do what a kid does least of............sitting still.There will come a day when its no more blind for the boy,but for now we will use it.I respect Mr Cox and his opinion,but for somebody who never uses blinds or decoys he seems to have a pretty expert opinion on how "easy";as he puts it;it is to kill birds by using them.

[L.F. Cox]

"what have you or the child accomplished by killing a turkey" 

Base lessons taught and learned that will evolve with them as they progress through the different levels of hunting. We lit a fire that they will now carry with them forever.

No lesson on turkey hunting can be learned from a blind....you'll never make me believe there's a way to light a hunting fire in a kid by giving them a turkey.

I've took too many kids deer hunting and given them deer to later see them loose interested in hunting because they expected every time to be like the times I took them.

The point is hunting is either in their genes or it's not...you giving a kid an unearned turkey is not going to put it there.

[wibirdhunter]

I shot my first turkey out of a blind, with decoys. It certainly lit a fire in me but it also wasn't to long before I couldn't stand the confinement of a blind and we were out there working birds. Dad and I both started hunting turkeys together and we both decided early on that hunting out of a blind wasn't for us.

So as a guy who loves to hunt and is younger (25) I'd say a blind ain't going to ruin the kid but I think Frank does have a valid point. If the kid isn't interested or looks like he isn't having fun get him out of the blind and walk. He'll eat it up.

[jakesdad]

Telling a kid that shoots a turkey out of a blind that he really didnt earn is a sure fire way to put out the fire in my book.I'm all for letting a kid enjoy a few "gimmes" as you seem to call it and let them enjoy the joys of success then introduce them to the world of hunting outside the blind.Repeated failures with no hint of success is the easiest way to turn a kid off as oppossed to early confidence building with a little success.If they truly want to hunt they'll learn to do it without a blind,but to start them out without as many advantages as you can give them is a quick way to drive them back inside to the video games.I know very few kids that killed birds out a blind for a couple of years then got skunked a few times before killing one without that gave up hunting all together,but can name several who lost interest because of often repeated failures by doing it only by "earning" it as you put it.

[L.F. Cox]

Kids these days don't want to work for anything because they have parents that hand everything to them.

A kid should start out hunting small game....If his interests last then he should be exposed to hunting big game. I honestly think it should be a requirement by Game and Fish Commissions to hunt small game before you can hunt big game animals.

When I have time I'll post the story about the time I took a 14 year old kid turkey hunting and the gobbler he killed without the use of a blind or decoys...to which he exclaimed "this is real turkey hunting".

He had previously killed 3 or 4 nice longbeards out of a blind and killed a jake the day he hunted with me....

Which hunt do you think will be his most memorable ?

His days sitting in the safety of a dark enclosed blind with a da'coy spread never knowing if they actually called the turkeys in or they just came to the da'coys.....or the time in the woods with me hunting in a light drizzle when we moved on a gobbler 3 times before this jake slipped in ?

[VanHelden Game Calls]

And how would he have known the difference without the other experiences? The only person dictating how one should hunt is you, everyone else is giving options.

[/quote]No lesson on turkey hunting can be learned from a blind....you'll never make me believe there's a way to light a hunting fire in a kid by giving them a turkey.

I've took too many kids deer hunting and given them deer to later see them loose interested in hunting because they expected every time to be like the times I took them.

The point is hunting is either in their genes or it's not...you giving a kid an unearned turkey is not going to put it there.
[/quote]

Huh so your saying no matter how I decide to teach it makes no difference because they have it or they don't.  So tell me again why I need to ditch the blind and Da'coys  

You talk about defeating a turkeys defense, well no kidding thats the point of concealment and camouflage, you rip on luring with decoys but you use calls to lure them in.

I say hunt legally and the way that makes the person happy.

[L.F. Cox]

Legal doesn't make it right.

[mwr]

Legal doesn't make it right.

    Can't teach an old dog new tricks!!!

[Old Gobbler]

A blind in Florida is 3 or 4 dead palmetto fronts grabbed up quickly and thrown down by your feet , if you want to go deluxe you can cut down the palmetto bush in from of you and stick those in front of your feet --not total concealment by any stretch of the imagination , but sure helps to hide your outline  a Florida hunter would be a fool not to use natural cover to his benefit

I have absolutely nothing against blinds , ( big expandable ones ) I can't speak for elsewhere in the country . But down here my opinion is that they actually hinder you way more than help - they restrict your hearing , vision ,weigh you down  and most importantly render you immobile --very , very few Florida hunters use them , but I do see they are gaining in popularity --they are very hot inside those things , you roast in a hot sunny day in one -- if your with a fidgeting kid I assume they help - for those disabled , more power to you

I get to talk to hunters all over the country and there are many parts of the country especially out west and many say it's either you hunt out of a blind , or you don't hunt , it was explained to me that the areas they frequent are similar to areas like you see with the layout goose blinds -- places that are impossible to hunt another way

One problem I hear about is where people are taking the blinds and setting them on public and attempting to lay claim to a spot like if they placed a tree stand - if I was to have a altercation with another hunter and they tried to use the blind for this purpose , there would be a situation

I prefer not to use them in Florida because I think they hinder you ( down here) , but with a kid , they do help

[VanHelden Game Calls]

OG agreed.  I have used natural blinds and a few times a year a pop-up when no cover is available or with a hunter that I feel will require more interaction.

I am not a blind fan myself. But in situations I will use them.  Do I dislike the out of touch feel I get using one?  Yes and this goes for natural and pop-ups.

I use what I have available to reach the end goal, an enjoyable hunt.

[jakesdad]

Im like alot of you and do not like being in a blind;harder to see,harder to hear,hotter than an oven,etc.But with a kid (especially a younger one 10 or under)it is definetely a plus.We tried fall hunting for turkeys this year and without the blind Jacob is so fidgety looking at birds,squirrels,and everything else going on in the timber it makes it almost impossible to kill birds.With the blind he is able to enjoy all that plus stay hidden=more success.

Im not gauging success on a dead bird either.We had lots of birds around us this year we just watched do their thing while inside the blind and we never raised a gun.He got to see birds move about naturally and how they called to each other.Doubt he could of witnessed that by not using a blind.

As far as legal dont make it right,what about using dogs in the fall?Not even legal here in MO like other states.So is it a "earned" turkey if I use a dog to bust up a flock?To each their own and stop preaching to others about how they should be hunting just because you dont like it.

[L.F. Cox]

Im like alot of you and do not like being in a blind;harder to see,harder to hear,hotter than an oven,etc.But with a kid (especially a younger one 10 or under)it is definetely a plus.We tried fall hunting for turkeys this year and without the blind Jacob is so fidgety looking at birds,squirrels,and everything else going on in the timber it makes it almost impossible to kill birds.With the blind he is able to enjoy all that plus stay hidden=more success.

Im not gauging success on a dead bird either.We had lots of birds around us this year we just watched do their thing while inside the blind and we never raised a gun.He got to see birds move about naturally and how they called to each other.Doubt he could of witnessed that by not using a blind.

As far as legal dont make it right,what about using dogs in the fall?Not even legal here in MO like other states.So is it a "earned" turkey if I use a dog to bust up a flock?To each their own and stop preaching to others about how they should be hunting just because you dont like it.

My dog doesn't need a blind...

I like the first part where Jacob was enjoying the outdoors....after all that's what it's all about.

Ask Jacob which he prefers a sky over head and watching all Gods creatures doing what they naturally do or sitting in the darkness and safety of a covered blind in ambush ?

if movement is a problem there are other options such as a short stake blind....although they do offer a slight advantage when it's time to shoot they don't unfairly defeat a wild turkeys defense system like an enclosed blind does.

One of my best my buddy's sons just got his first turkey the other day. I think he's in his twenty's now and autistic....killed him on public land without a blind or da'coy. Shot him about 10 or 15 yards my buddy said he didn't think he would ever shoot....he was waiting on his dad to tell him to shoot.

Wish I could have been there.

[jakesdad]

Actually he prefers the blind.I've given him the choice several times and he prefers the blind because he knows he can get away with being a little more fidgety and still watch critters.

I hope we dont have a misunderstanding about this blind thing,i've told him flat out that in a couple years its no blind and we go at it like its supposed to be.We've done it in the fall turkey hunting and deer hunting and to be quite honest the kid doesnt mind it either way...........he just likes to be outside.I'll continue to give him every edge I can for a few years.He's seen me take deer and turkey in the fall without a blind so he knows both ways.I'm not going to pressure him into anything and just let him enjoy the outdoors in his own little way.And if when he gets older and hunts on his own and wants to use the blind i'll let him.................but he's packin it in.Its his experience to live as he sees fit;nobody elses.

[learn2hide]

To start off I have never been a blind fan.  BUT last year I started helping at our local learn to hunt program where we take anyone that has never turkey hunted out hunting.  This involves kids and it is early in the season when there is absolutely no green and many times snow.  So last year I implemented a blind and had success setting it up the morning we hunt, I also used it in an area where I only had a field to hunt, no fence lines so I had open field where I used the blind - again set-up every hunt.

Well it can be a ton of work hauling the gear and this year I will be hunting with a young kid so not much help hauling gear.  I am thinking of pre-setting the blind but I have concerns of busting birds during set-up and changing their routine 2 days before the hunt. I have not noticed and freaking out from the birds when we show up in the mornings, I have had them brushing up against it last year(on video) in the middle of a dirt field.

What has been your experiences? Pre-set the blind or man up and haul like a mule?

And they are talking 30mph winds 2 days before and 20mph the day before the hunt. Its a double bull matrix blind but the ground is frozen except for a softened top couple few inches here in WI

Don't mean to upset you but the scenario you described is not taking a kid hunting it's basically giving the kid a Wild Turkey.

That line of thinking and action is what's wrong with our society today....great things should be hard earned.

The right to kill a Wild Turkey should be earned not given...

I have to disagree here some.Starting out young kids and giving them an edge for success is what keeps them interested in coming back.Repeated failure will turn a kid off quicker than anything.I've started my boy who is 7 hunting in a blind for that reason.Ive also explained to him that once he gets a little older the blind stays home and we hunt backs on bark.You wouldnt have the local high school pitching ace throw to a kid just learning to play baseball would ya?Ease them in slow then show them that it wont always be "easy" as you say.

Agree...no shame in using a blind...now having no other tactics in your arsenal makes you an incomplete turkey hunter...it's not as if the fact you have a blind somehow magically causes turkeys to come into 30 yards waving a white flag, if anything it's more restrictive cause if you need to shift 25-30 yards to get in front of a bird you really can't.