20 gauge single-shot project gun

[gobblergls]

If I go with the Savage, it has to be Tru-Choke; not sure about the Baikal, to be determined.

[gobblergls]

Vital statistics on Baikal MP18 26" bbl vs. Savage 220A  28" bbl
wgt: Baikal 5 lbs., 5.7 oz.
       Savage 5 lbs. .7 oz.

Barrel thickness at muzzle:  Savage:  .078"
                                            Baikal:  .110"

Choke:  Savage: .590
            Baikal: .600

Barrel OD at 26":  Savage: .747"
                            Baikal: .820"

Despite a 5 oz. heavier wgt., the Baikal makes a better platform for modification for me.  YMMV.  Thicker steel in the barrel, modern steel; 3" chamber, synthetic stock and I don't feel bad about painting and cutting up the Baikal compared with a gun that might be older than I am.  The Savage has a very nice trigger; the Baikal okay, but with a little creep.  That can be remedied.  At $91, it's a very good deal.  The barrel is overbuilt.  I've seen a London proof house report where a Baikal 12 gauge was test fired with a 20 gauge shell in front of the 12 gauge.  Slow motion photography showed slight expansion at muzzle with no damage and a return to shape as the loads passed through.   I hope to get the gun to Sumtoy in a couple of weeks for barrel and choke work.  Here's the photos.  Most impressive is muzzle to muzzle.  That's some serious steel in the Baikal.

[Hayudog]

Wow' Great thread.  Just bought a Savage 220A 20 gauge and a Remington SPR 100, 20 gauge by Baikal .  Had taken a few youngsters out this year and 2 of them wiffed  at less than 20 yards.  Thought to build up a single hammerless gun for them.  After watching all the 20 gauge pattern posts decided to really build it for my self and let them use it when I take kids.  Any way, kinda having the same feelings of remorse about altering the Savage.  I'll keep a close eye on this thread as it progresses.  May also have to pick up one of those Baikal MP18's from Cheaper than dirt just for fun!  Doug

[gobblergls]

Doug, I'd recommend the Youth Model Baikal MP18 for 20 gauge.  It has a 24" barrel with plenty of thickness for threading a choke at that length.  It has a 13" LOP which I wish I had so that I could add a slip on pad for increased padding.  The pad on the gun, if it comes with a synthetic stock, sits on a curved buttplate.  I would be difficult adding a better pad unless it is a slip on pad.  The pad isn't that great, but it'll have to do.  Take off the slip on pad when kids use it.  Cheaper than dirt has it for about $100.

[killdee]

Yall are convincing me that I need 1 of these, thats really a good looking shotgun for that price. What are the Savages going for now, I mentioned wanting 1 last year and got a pm from a guy on another forum wanting 600$. If you wanted an adult only model would yall still go with the youth and add the extra pad. All the kids I have taken in the past are full size now and can take me instead!!!!

[gobblergls]

Prices for the Savage 220A are all over the park.  All it takes is two people wanting the same one at Gunbroker to drive a price up.  I got very lucky on what I paid.  If I were to do it over again with the Baikal, I might buy the Youth model as the platform and add a slip on pad to increase LOP and give better recoil absorbtion than what comes with the gun.   Changing out pads on the synthetic stocked gun appears to be problematical.

[Hayudog]

Looks like the youth model comes in both synthetic and a wood stock.  I've never added a slip on pad that had a good fit, but just had a cheapo one for my son's first gun.  Any add on pads that secure well?  Since the gun will get painted or dipped is the wood stock easier to work with adding a regular Limb Saver pad to?  The synthetic stock does look thinner at the front and may be more comfortable.  The barrel will have to be threaded, so cutting an adult barrel to say 24" or 25" shouldn't present an issue.  I'm not sure if shorting the barrel gives a gunsmith more or less to work with for threading for chokes.   At least this was my plan when I picked up the Remington SPR100 made by Baikal in 20 gauge.  It has a 28" barrel.

[gobblergls]

Hayoudog,
According to William at Sumtoy, the Baikal I have has more than enough steel at the muzzle to thread.  I may leave as is at 26" or cut off an inch.  Uncle Mike's and Limbsaver both make slip-on pads of various sizes.  I have an Uncle Mikes on my Mossy Super Bantam and it has no issues of movement.  The synthetic stocked Baikal would be difficult to fit a limbsaver or any aftermarket pad other than a slip on because the factory pad is intregal with the buttplate and the buttplate is curved.  See photos and discussion above. 

[n2deer]

Very interesting, I like your approach very much.

Sounds like that will make a amazing light weight killer.

[gobblergls]

Very interesting, I like your approach very much.

Sounds like that will make a amazing light weight killer.

Thanks.  I sure hope so.  I dropped it off at Sumtoy yesterday.  I'll leave it at 26" barrel length with a threaded choke and lengthen forcing cones.  I'm setting it up for TSS9s.  William will work on the trigger and mount a base for the FFIII.  Looking forward to see how it shoots.  Gil

[n2deer]

Very interesting, I like your approach very much.

Sounds like that will make a amazing light weight killer.

Thanks.  I sure hope so.  I dropped it off at Sumtoy yesterday.  I'll leave it at 26" barrel length with a threaded choke and lengthen forcing cones.  I'm setting it up for TSS9s.  William will work on the trigger and mount a base for the FFIII.  Looking forward to see how it shoots.  Gil

Me too, What load do you plan to run?

[gobblergls]

If I get decent numbers with the old 1 oz.  TSS load, the one that has the 28 gauge wad inside the 20 gauge wad, that load would be the most practical.  I see no reason the 1 oz. won't considering its excellent performance in my 20 gauge Super Bantam which has a 22" barrel. 

[gatrkyhntr70]

Nice looking gun; what choke system is it being threaded for??

[gobblergls]

Tru-choke threads.  Trying out two variations of Sumtoy .5625.  Hope to shoot it tomorrow early before temps soar.  Yesterday temps were 106 in the shade in Glennville.

[gobblergls]

Since this is a thread about a project gun, I'll post the pattern photos here to keep the thread intact.  I shot this morning with temps at 78 degrees, heavy humidity and no wind.  I shot the 1 5/8 oz TSS9 load both buffered and unbuffered.  The unbuffered placed 188 inisde the 10"ring, and 231 between 10 and 20 rings.  The buffered, 250 inside 10" and 248 between 10 and 20".  I'm pleased with the performance so far and especially the work that William of Sumtoy did in this project.  The trigger is crisp and light.  The barrel with choke is 27.75" long, but considering it doesn't have the action of a pump or auto, the overall length is equivalent to a 25" barreled auto or pump.  I don't think the gun would lose much if the barrel was 2" shorter.  The 1 5/8 oz. load I wouldn't want to shoot on a dove field, but is tolerable in the gun.  If I had to do it over again, I'd go with the Youth model so that I could double up on the recoil pad with a slip on pad.  The gun as shot today weighed 5.25+ lbs without sling or FFIII.  I'll start the painting this week.