What’s happening to our precious Turkey’s

[lunghit]

Strange thing is here on Long Island we have an exploding population. They are proposing the first ever spring season next May. I see turkeys all over the place now, they even roosted on my shed roof a few weeks ago. The one thing we don't have is coyotes, fishers, bear and other predators. The only predators we have are fox, hawks and cars lol. So maybe an over abundance of predators is the reason.

My parents bought a house in Montauk in the 1960, I grew up hunting duck in the salt marshes and and pass shooting divers and sea ducks on the beach sandspits and bars. NEVER saw any turkeys anywhere in that region for decades. Think they released some out there in the early 90s and they took well. I see turkeys in Suffolk County now when I go out there, which is infrequently. I really can't imagine hunting out there now, it's gotten so bought out and built up in a bad way if you ask me. But other parts of Suffolk might be ok for a well managed spring hunt.

I started seeing turkeys in the late 90's and since then they have boomed. I live on the east end of the island and we have great deer hunting and hopefully turkey hunting soon. But yea it's getting harder and harder by the season. I have 7 years left here and I am out.

[Tom007]

Great info, thought it was just my areas.....hopefully it will turn for us....

[ChesterCopperpot]

The lack of gobbles that so many have described is something I can't really wrap my head around. I think some folks hear that and think, "Yeah, you just weren't on birds," or, "Yeah, I hear that every year from folks when they get henned up; 'gobbled on the roost, quiet on the ground.'" Every year there's those folks who don't half hunt who say they think all the breeding got done early and nothing's talking. Every year there's those people who don't understand the stages the birds go through. We all know those people, the back to Hardees for a biscuit before nine crowd. But those aren't the people I'm talking about. I'm talking about people I know who are genuine killers who I know were on birds who said they just weren't gobbling much the entire season. I know for me I was all over birds but they weren't talking. Still killed them, but they weren't talking. Even at my house, I've got a pile of birds on my property. Had hens roosted on me every day and a couple good gobblers. Every spring I start climbing onto the ridge above my house to listen on March 1st. Usually by about the 20th they're hammering every morning. I go every morning that I don't hunt and listen till mid May. I'll usually hear five or six birds in different directions. This year I heard one gobble from up there. And the birds were there. I know the birds are there. I see them. I get them on camera. They just weren't gobbling. I've heard that from a lot of folks this year that I know are woodsmen and hunters, who I know were on birds, so I don't think it's coincidental. Now how in the world that happens or what causes a zip lipped season, I don't have the foggiest. Like I said earlier, the first two weeks were all low pressure, heavily overcast days when birds tend not to gobble great anyways, but even on those perfect bluebird, still, high pressure mornings it was radio silence on the limb and if and when they did get fired up it was late. For reference, I'm in the North Carolina mountains. But I heard it from folks in Georgia, South Carolina, Tennessee, Virginia, West Virginia, Maryland, New York, Pennsylvania, etc.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[mikejd]

I believe 90% of our problem is the anti fur atmosphere.
Very few guys trapping like just a few years ago.
Every valley where I hunt is now flooded and taken over by beaver. That never was the case. There's more raccoons flattened on the roads then ever before.

[Howie g]

 

The lack of gobbles that so many have described is something I can't really wrap my head around. I think some folks hear that and think, "Yeah, you just weren't on birds," or, "Yeah, I hear that every year from folks when they get henned up; 'gobbled on the roost, quiet on the ground.'" Every year there's those folks who don't half hunt who say they think all the breeding got done early and nothing's talking. Every year there's those people who don't understand the stages the birds go through. We all know those people, the back to Hardees for a biscuit before nine crowd. But those aren't the people I'm talking about. I'm talking about people I know who are genuine killers who I know were on birds who said they just weren't gobbling much the entire season. I know for me I was all over birds but they weren't talking. Still killed them, but they weren't talking. Even at my house, I've got a pile of birds on my property. Had hens roosted on me every day and a couple good gobblers. Every spring I start climbing onto the ridge above my house to listen on March 1st. Usually by about the 20th they're hammering every morning. I go every morning that I don't hunt and listen till mid May. I'll usually hear five or six birds in different directions. This year I heard one gobble from up there. And the birds were there. I know the birds are there. I see them. I get them on camera. They just weren't gobbling. I've heard that from a lot of folks this year that I know are woodsmen and hunters, who I know were on birds, so I don't think it's coincidental. Now how in the world that happens or what causes a zip lipped season, I don't have the foggiest. Like I said earlier, the first two weeks were all low pressure, heavily overcast days when birds tend not to gobble great anyways, but even on those perfect bluebird, still, high pressure mornings it was radio silence on the limb and if and when they did get fired up it was late. For reference, I'm in the North Carolina mountains. But I heard it from folks in Georgia, South Carolina, Tennessee, Virginia, West Virginia, Maryland, New York, Pennsylvania, etc.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I've found what my grandad always said to be true .
If you have a good strong acorn crop that year they gobble better .
Poor crop ? They don't gobble as much it seems .   What kind of acorn crop did you have this past year ?

[WAGinVA]

I hunt in central VA, about 2/3 private and 1/3 public.  I had a pretty tough season but managed to tag out, I did end up hunting every day but three (not counting Sundays) until 5/12.  I heard a significant amount of gobbling but very little mid morning activity.  All gobbling was on the roost or very late morning.  One morning i was hunting private along a major creek and I could hear for a good 3/4 of a mile.  I heard at least 7 different gobblers.  They started gobbling at 6:05 and gobbled continuously until 6:35.  I counted gobbles from 6:15 until 6:20 and counted 99 different gobbles, i could not tell any difference in the frequency of gobbling during the entire 30 minute period.  When the turkeys flew down I never heard another peep, could not tell if they quit or if I just could not hear then after they hit the ground.  It was the most awesome display of gobbling I have heard in my 44 springs of hunting.  I was in a good place for turkeys to come to so I sat until 11:30 and did not hear or see anything else.

[mikejd]

The lack of gobbles that so many have described is something I can't really wrap my head around. I think some folks hear that and think, "Yeah, you just weren't on birds," or, "Yeah, I hear that every year from folks when they get henned up; 'gobbled on the roost, quiet on the ground.'" Every year there's those folks who don't half hunt who say they think all the breeding got done early and nothing's talking. Every year there's those people who don't understand the stages the birds go through. We all know those people, the back to Hardees for a biscuit before nine crowd. But those aren't the people I'm talking about. I'm talking about people I know who are genuine killers who I know were on birds who said they just weren't gobbling much the entire season. I know for me I was all over birds but they weren't talking. Still killed them, but they weren't talking. Even at my house, I've got a pile of birds on my property. Had hens roosted on me every day and a couple good gobblers. Every spring I start climbing onto the ridge above my house to listen on March 1st. Usually by about the 20th they're hammering every morning. I go every morning that I don't hunt and listen till mid May. I'll usually hear five or six birds in different directions. This year I heard one gobble from up there. And the birds were there. I know the birds are there. I see them. I get them on camera. They just weren't gobbling. I've heard that from a lot of folks this year that I know are woodsmen and hunters, who I know were on birds, so I don't think it's coincidental. Now how in the world that happens or what causes a zip lipped season, I don't have the foggiest. Like I said earlier, the first two weeks were all low pressure, heavily overcast days when birds tend not to gobble great anyways, but even on those perfect bluebird, still, high pressure mornings it was radio silence on the limb and if and when they did get fired up it was late. For reference, I'm in the North Carolina mountains. But I heard it from folks in Georgia, South Carolina, Tennessee, Virginia, West Virginia, Maryland, New York, Pennsylvania, etc.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

There are definitely seasons that are quiet but you k ow the birds are around just from sign sightings while driving etc. Problem in my area is where I have seen and killed birds for the past 25 years I am not even seeing sign of any birds. Woods look as if birds have not been there in 1000 years. Thats the scary part. When you walk a field that has been turned over a week ago and there is not a single turkey track in it when there has been since I started hunting you start to worry.

[ferocious calls]

Turkey hunters will spend lots of time and money to pursue turkeys, but very few will put the time and effort into predator control. How can we change this? I will give free instruction to anyone wanting to help reduce turkey predation in areas they hunt.

[Turkeybutt]

We can sit and speculate as to why turkey populations are down across the country.
Reading the various posts some have mentioned.
    A.   Habitat:
        Urban Growth/Development 
    B.   Predators:
        Fox, Racoon, Opossum, Coyote, Skunk 
       Anti trapping community putting pressure on certain states, to pass   ridiculous laws against trapping adds to the problem.
   C.    Over harvest of adult gobblers.
   D. State agencies more interested in money management over wildlife    management.
   E.   Disease
   F.   Farming methods and the overuse of insecticides.
         I mention this because in Penna. Lancaster County was once the place to go to hunt pheasants. Due to cutting the crops to the earth, removing hedge rows and other habitat, and the overuse of insecticides it has been years since I last seen a ringneck.
The common denominator is man!  We have a responsibility to be stewards for the use and protection of our environment but somehow, someway everything we touch seems to go awry!

[mikejd]

We can sit and speculate as to why turkey populations are down across the country.
Reading the various posts some have mentioned.
    A.   Habitat:
        Urban Growth/Development 
    B.   Predators:
        Fox, Racoon, Opossum, Coyote, Skunk 
       Anti trapping community putting pressure on certain states, to pass   ridiculous laws against trapping adds to the problem.
   C.    Over harvest of adult gobblers.
   D. State agencies more interested in money management over wildlife    management.
   E.   Disease
   F.   Farming methods and the overuse of insecticides.
         I mention this because in Penna. Lancaster County was once the place to go to hunt pheasants. Due to cutting the crops to the earth, removing hedge rows and other habitat, and the overuse of insecticides it has been years since I last seen a ringneck.
The common denominator is man!  We have a responsibility to be stewards for the use and protection of our environment but somehow, someway everything we touch seems to go awry!

Excellent post and you could not be more correct.

[sswv]

very interesting reading here. I'll agree with the opinions and I'll even add one. where I hunt there use to be an amazing amount of turkey then BAM, they're gone. I was complaining about this to a good friend that grew up on a farm in that area. he looked at me and said "daddy said the DNR took'em". I said what the heck are you talking about. he said the DNR ask his dad if they could trap some turkey in his back field where he fed the cattle in the winter and he gave then permission. between my hunting buddy and myself we knew by counting the flocks the previous fall there were just over 120 turkey in that area. the next spring you'd be overwhelmed to see any fresh turkey sign. his dad told him they come in about mid January and started feeding/baiting them and one evening late they come and stretched out nets. the next morning well before daylight they were back and when the turkey gathered the launched the nets, loaded them up and off they went. we're assuming they were trade stock for who knows what? I guess it's sorta like robbing Peter to pay Paul.

[Gooserbat]

Predators, Habitat, weather trends, changing agriculture practices,

[GobbleNut]

Predators, Habitat, weather trends, changing agriculture practices,

This,...(and add avian diseases, parasites, and probably other "unknowns").  All of it resulting in the fact that we are killing off more gobblers each spring than are being replaced through reproductive success,...or more precisely, reproductive failure.  In addition, human turkey hunters have become much more numerous,...and we have become much more effective at killing turkeys due to the "manner and methods" that we now use to kill them. 

[Rapscallion Vermilion]

In addition, human turkey hunters have become much more numerous,...and we have become much more effective at killing turkeys due to the "manner and methods" that we now use to kill them.

This is certainly a factor, and it is also much easier to accelerate though the learning curve on turkey hunting methods and skills with all the internet resources, youtube videos, and forum info.  Another thing that has stuck in my mind was an email exchange I had with a former member of this forum a few years back.  He sent me picture after picture of gobblers he had called up for other "hunters" after he had filled his own tags. There must have been a dozen or so.  I don't know how widespread this sort of thing is, but it is certainly a multiplier on the number of gobblers killed.

[nyhunter]

I hunt NY Steuben and Allegany counties and I can tell you the numbers have been declining steadily for 8-10 years. It's sad the dec doesn't care about it. There even trying to open season for all day hunting. Bottom line in the decs eyes it's all about license sales making more money. I wonder how license sales will be when there isn't any turkeys to hunt. 2022 was by far the worst season ever since I started turkey hunting in 1986.  What exactly is the NWTF's goal? Do they really care about the decline in turkey population?