Way to go Alabama!

[owlhoot]

I don't have a stake in the southeast's current situation but I know there's a portion of turkey hunters who seem to be the only fools on earth who don't believe that bag limit reductions and shortened seasons would help more turkeys survive each year.

When goose or duck numbers go down, USFWS reduce the limits and shorten the seasons.  When whitetail deer numbers go down, state agencies decrease the bag limits.  Wild turkey numbers were highest when we had considerably fewer hunters killing them.

There are too many examples of well managed private lands where harvest management is implemented with public land pieces immediately adjacent to them to dispute the efficacy of harvest reduction.  The better hunting is simply across the line on private.  It's not this great mystery as to why the higher quality hunting is on the private.  It's because they don't have every Tom, Dick and Harry filling their limits over there.  Clearly, part of the solution to the wild turkey's decline, particularly on public ground, is to simply reduce the number of turkeys Tom, Dick and Harry can kill on public lands

I have listened to multiple podcasts with popular turkey hunting figures who want to fight bag limit reductions/shortened seasons and I've read hundreds of comments on Facebook boards fighting against these ideas.  Meanwhile, these guys are all running around public lands filling their limits promoting public land as it continues to become depleted.....

The status quo is simply not working in most parts of the country and I'm glad to see AL taking steps in the right direction.  I have some friends who are stakeholders down there who lobbied hard for a 3 bird bag limit and a March 25th start date; they were optimistic that some change was implemented instead of maintaining the status quo but the fight is not over.

While I agree that population decline is a multi-dimensional issue, what's best for the wild turkey certainly isn't good for the turkey hunter right now.  Contrary to popular opinion, these are mutually exclusive things and there are some guys in this community who need to start to realize that.  I'll be in a southern state next week and I'll be happy to kill one turkey(instead of 2) and drive home; I think the turkeys would be a whole lot better off if more people did the same.

I would like to see how many turkey hunters there are down there in Alabama , compared to how many turkeys?

[tazmaniac]

Not trying to sound selfish, but being from MS, I am dreading the influx of OOSers next spring (and every spring...)  earliest season opener in the continental US except for South FL.

I have a hard time just finding a bird in south MS at season opening... by April 1st, they are insanely scarce.

Fewer turkeys almost everywhere, exponentially more turkey hunters almost everywhere.  Not good for either the birds or the hunters.

Sent from my SM-G970U1 using Tapatalk

[old frank]

Georgia will probably be making changes before next season.
Some of the possible changes are:
Later start date for the season

Lower limit to two gobblers

Only one gobbler first 10 days of season

and there are others being discussed!

I have definitely noticed a reduction in turkey encounters the last few years!

[3bailey3]

Yes our season opens two to three weeks before all bordering states open and at lest a mouth before the rest of the country, so yes we do get hammered early! I would like to see my state move it back to when other states open.

[owlhoot]

Yes our season opens two to three weeks before all bordering states open and at lest a mouth before the rest of the country, so yes we do get hammered early! I would like to see my state move it back to when other states open.

I can agree with that. Missouri hunters used to like the early Kansas opener, that's for sure , you could even notice the east side , closer to home had a lot more Missouri tags at the walk ins.

[Sixes]

Georgia is looking to change some things, but I think the one bird during the first 10 days is ridiculous for a working man that has to schedule vacation.

It would really suck to take the first week of turkey season, kill a bird opening day and then twiddle your thumbs for the rest of your time.

In my opinion, it will not matter what rules are changed until they determine what caused the rapid decrease in numbers.

My theory is increased chicken manure, I watched a 10K acre quail plantation that was ate up in birds and was and still is on a heavy predator control become almost extinct of birds over a 2-3 year period immediately after increased use of manure. It's not the gobblers that are missing, it is ALL the turkeys. No hens means no birds.

Also, it is not just that farm, it is the whole area and the common denominator is heavy use of the manure.

Other parts of the state that is not agriculture have lots of birds and they seem to be thriving in those areas. Luckily, I have 3 different private places in these thriving areas.

We need a solution to the problem, not a band aid.

[g8rvet]

I don't have a stake in the southeast's current situation but I know there's a portion of turkey hunters who seem to be the only fools on earth who don't believe that bag limit reductions and shortened seasons would help more turkeys survive each year.

When goose or duck numbers go down, USFWS reduce the limits and shorten the seasons.  When whitetail deer numbers go down, state agencies decrease the bag limits.  Wild turkey numbers were highest when we had considerably fewer hunters killing them.

There are too many examples of well managed private lands where harvest management is implemented with public land pieces immediately adjacent to them to dispute the efficacy of harvest reduction.  The better hunting is simply across the line on private.  It's not this great mystery as to why the higher quality hunting is on the private.  It's because they don't have every Tom, Dick and Harry filling their limits over there.  Clearly, part of the solution to the wild turkey's decline, particularly on public ground, is to simply reduce the number of turkeys Tom, Dick and Harry can kill on public lands

I have listened to multiple podcasts with popular turkey hunting figures who want to fight bag limit reductions/shortened seasons and I've read hundreds of comments on Facebook boards fighting against these ideas.  Meanwhile, these guys are all running around public lands filling their limits promoting public land as it continues to become depleted.....

The status quo is simply not working in most parts of the country and I'm glad to see AL taking steps in the right direction.  I have some friends who are stakeholders down there who lobbied hard for a 3 bird bag limit and a March 25th start date; they were optimistic that some change was implemented instead of maintaining the status quo but the fight is not over.

While I agree that population decline is a multi-dimensional issue, what's best for the wild turkey certainly isn't good for the turkey hunter right now.  Contrary to popular opinion, these are mutually exclusive things and there are some guys in this community who need to start to realize that.  I'll be in a southern state next week and I'll be happy to kill one turkey(instead of 2) and drive home; I think the turkeys would be a whole lot better off if more people did the same.

Nail, meet head.  Good post.  And furthering that point is that hunter induced mortality is a small drop in the bucket on migrating ducks and geese.  The same is not true for turkey at all.  Way higher hunter mortality in the male turkey population.  Way higher.

I practice what I preach on Redfish too-only kept one in the two days most times, sometimes none.  I don't keep ANY spotted seatrout over 20" unless gut hooked (one over 20 is legal). 

[3bailey3]

i agree a lot with the chicken manure theory, a few places i have hunted use it a lot and have way less birds, one guy that had big fields around our club and put out chicken manure to help grow his fields for his  cows and always found dead birds in his fields and he claimed it was not the manure. I have always heard to used feeders not breeders for manure.

[Hook hanger]

Glad to see it! The public land pressure will definitely be better spread out. Folks were jumping around with the staggered opening dates on WMAs and zone differences. Don't know why someone would feel the need to kill 5 birds in a state... Get a few, if you need more, go to the next state.. A lot of the deer hunters recently turned turkey hunters crowd won't be near as successful those first 10 days without decoys. More gobblers on the landscape to help ensure the deed is done.

Sure does suck for Mississippi public land though. Will be record sales of non-resident licenses next year.

I kill 6 in my state and used to kill 6 in another state and kill 7 in another state and kill at least 4 in another and try and kill 5 in Al even. Too bad limits aren't higher

[owlhoot]

Seems to be pretty bad populations in some states.
Some states have reports of around 2.5-3 turkeys per hunter.  They all ain't toms. They don't have one tag and of course many don't get a single bird. That's a ton of hunters per bird.

[Pluffmud]

I don't have a stake in the southeast's current situation but I know there's a portion of turkey hunters who seem to be the only fools on earth who don't believe that bag limit reductions and shortened seasons would help more turkeys survive each year.

When goose or duck numbers go down, USFWS reduce the limits and shorten the seasons.  When whitetail deer numbers go down, state agencies decrease the bag limits.  Wild turkey numbers were highest when we had considerably fewer hunters killing them.

There are too many examples of well managed private lands where harvest management is implemented with public land pieces immediately adjacent to them to dispute the efficacy of harvest reduction.  The better hunting is simply across the line on private.  It's not this great mystery as to why the higher quality hunting is on the private.  It's because they don't have every Tom, Dick and Harry filling their limits over there.  Clearly, part of the solution to the wild turkey's decline, particularly on public ground, is to simply reduce the number of turkeys Tom, Dick and Harry can kill on public lands

I have listened to multiple podcasts with popular turkey hunting figures who want to fight bag limit reductions/shortened seasons and I've read hundreds of comments on Facebook boards fighting against these ideas.  Meanwhile, these guys are all running around public lands filling their limits promoting public land as it continues to become depleted.....

The status quo is simply not working in most parts of the country and I'm glad to see AL taking steps in the right direction.  I have some friends who are stakeholders down there who lobbied hard for a 3 bird bag limit and a March 25th start date; they were optimistic that some change was implemented instead of maintaining the status quo but the fight is not over.

While I agree that population decline is a multi-dimensional issue, what's best for the wild turkey certainly isn't good for the turkey hunter right now.  Contrary to popular opinion, these are mutually exclusive things and there are some guys in this community who need to start to realize that.  I'll be in a southern state next week and I'll be happy to kill one turkey(instead of 2) and drive home; I think the turkeys would be a whole lot better off if more people did the same.

You compared the reduction of bag limits of turkeys to that of waterfowl and whitetail, that they reduce the bag limits to help numbers as well. I cant speak for the whitetail, but I can speak on the waterfowl, as this is a hot topic among the waterfowl community right now. Long story short, we have two decades of reduced harvest limits on certain species, and just waterfowl bag limits in general, and the data shows the hunter harvest has almost zero impact on waterfowl populations. And this is coming from big names, like Delta Watefowl. In fact, reduced harvest numbers are showing to have a negative impact on the pintail, primarily because surplus drakes are harassing hens during nesting season and hatch numbers are suffering as a result. The major things that affect watefowl numbers are, #1: habitat, #2: predation. I think by and large this can be applied to all game, especially the wild turkey.

Again, hunters and wildlife managers are in the business of restricting and taking things away to "help the population numbers." Lower the bag limits. No decoys. One bird per day. One in the first ten days. People, WE ARE SHOOTING OURSELVES IN THE FOOT. Who defends hunting? HUNTERS. Who funds conservation? HUNTERS. You and I may continue to hunt no matter what, but the only thing that will keep our right to hunt, is a future generation that loves it as much as we do, and continuing to chip away at access and opportunities to hunt is also chipping away at the numbers of people who will stand up and defend our right to hunt. These are the next people who would give conservtion dollars to ensure the survival of the species as well... Contrary to popular belief, less hunters is not a good thing!

I think hunters and conservationists as a whole need to restructure the things we do in order to ensure there will even be game to hunt in the next 100 years. I think a lot of that includes donating time and money to create more habitat, and access to quality hunting opportunities. Its going to take effort from everyone. If not we will continue to slide down this slippery slope of regulating people straight out of hunting right to the living room couch, and hunting will be a thing of the past.

[deerhunt1988]

Glad to see it! The public land pressure will definitely be better spread out. Folks were jumping around with the staggered opening dates on WMAs and zone differences. Don't know why someone would feel the need to kill 5 birds in a state... Get a few, if you need more, go to the next state.. A lot of the deer hunters recently turned turkey hunters crowd won't be near as successful those first 10 days without decoys. More gobblers on the landscape to help ensure the deed is done.

Sure does suck for Mississippi public land though. Will be record sales of non-resident licenses next year.

I kill 6 in my state and used to kill 6 in another state and kill 7 in another state and kill at least 4 in another and try and kill 5 in Al even. Too bad limits aren't higher

Cool.

[deerhunt1988]

I have listened to multiple podcasts with popular turkey hunting figures who want to fight bag limit reductions/shortened seasons and I've read hundreds of comments on Facebook boards fighting against these ideas.  Meanwhile, these guys are all running around public lands filling their limits promoting public land as it continues to become depleted.....

If my 'making a living' depended on killing public land turkeys and filming it, I guess I'd have to be against bag limit and opportunity reductions too. But my living involves making more turkeys. Hopefully one of the many current turkey research projects will be able to shed some light on the situation soon. I know some of the studies have been going on for years yet there doesn't seem to be a good job of presenting the data and results to the public.

[Turkeytider]

I don't have a stake in the southeast's current situation but I know there's a portion of turkey hunters who seem to be the only fools on earth who don't believe that bag limit reductions and shortened seasons would help more turkeys survive each year.

When goose or duck numbers go down, USFWS reduce the limits and shorten the seasons.  When whitetail deer numbers go down, state agencies decrease the bag limits.  Wild turkey numbers were highest when we had considerably fewer hunters killing them.

There are too many examples of well managed private lands where harvest management is implemented with public land pieces immediately adjacent to them to dispute the efficacy of harvest reduction.  The better hunting is simply across the line on private.  It's not this great mystery as to why the higher quality hunting is on the private.  It's because they don't have every Tom, Dick and Harry filling their limits over there.  Clearly, part of the solution to the wild turkey's decline, particularly on public ground, is to simply reduce the number of turkeys Tom, Dick and Harry can kill on public lands

I have listened to multiple podcasts with popular turkey hunting figures who want to fight bag limit reductions/shortened seasons and I've read hundreds of comments on Facebook boards fighting against these ideas.  Meanwhile, these guys are all running around public lands filling their limits promoting public land as it continues to become depleted.....

The status quo is simply not working in most parts of the country and I'm glad to see AL taking steps in the right direction.  I have some friends who are stakeholders down there who lobbied hard for a 3 bird bag limit and a March 25th start date; they were optimistic that some change was implemented instead of maintaining the status quo but the fight is not over.

While I agree that population decline is a multi-dimensional issue, what's best for the wild turkey certainly isn't good for the turkey hunter right now.  Contrary to popular opinion, these are mutually exclusive things and there are some guys in this community who need to start to realize that.  I'll be in a southern state next week and I'll be happy to kill one turkey(instead of 2) and drive home; I think the turkeys would be a whole lot better off if more people did the same.

Nail, meet head.  Good post.  And furthering that point is that hunter induced mortality is a small drop in the bucket on migrating ducks and geese.  The same is not true for turkey at all.  Way higher hunter mortality in the male turkey population.  Way higher.

I practice what I preach on Redfish too-only kept one in the two days most times, sometimes none.  I don't keep ANY spotted seatrout over 20" unless gut hooked (one over 20 is legal).

Certainly in the Spring, and perhaps for the entire year if total mortality were examined, the main predator for adult male wild turkeys walks on two legs. I`ve been satisfied with a self imposed limit of one bird/season here in Georgia.

[Turkeytider]

i agree a lot with the chicken manure theory, a few places i have hunted use it a lot and have way less birds, one guy that had big fields around our club and put out chicken manure to help grow his fields for his  cows and always found dead birds in his fields and he claimed it was not the manure. I have always heard to used feeders not breeders for manure.

The issue of chicken litter as fertilizer and its impact on turkey populations seems to me would be relatively easy to study by wildlife biologists. Also, I`m pretty sure it would be relatively easy and quick to determine toxicity . I`m actually a bit surprised that that`s not already studied and published.