20 GA Pattern Advice

[Tommy Strutsalot]

Thank you all for your input.    For now, I'm going to put some adjustable sights on it and go from there, as well as introduce one or two more TSS loads.  I actually spoke with a gentleman from Indian Creek yesterday on the phone and he indicated, to support what Chester Copperpot and Ranman have said, is that it's more likely than not to have POI issues with high performance choke/load combos.

Another question for you guys if you're willing...  for those that have installed adjustable sights.. do you leave the existing bead and just mount the new front sight behind it, or do you remove the factory bead? If you think I should remove the factory bead, has anyone removed one from a Weatherby Element that could give me any tips? 

Thanks again.

[Hook hanger]

Just mount behind bead. I've had a couple guns shoot like yours. I wouldn't even mess with trying different loads. Get the adjustable sights and sight in and start killing with it.

[ChesterCopperpot]

Another question for you guys if you're willing...  for those that have installed adjustable sights.. do you leave the existing bead and just mount the new front sight behind it, or do you remove the factory bead? If you think I should remove the factory bead, has anyone removed one from a Weatherby Element that could give me any tips? 

Some of the available options (maybe most) come as sets so you'd have a new front sight to match the rear. In some instances that's necessary as the height of the rear sight may necessitate a higher front. Not always. But often. Tru Glo makes a lot of options. As mentioned, I tend to prefer Williams.

POA vs POI is the big reason turkey guns need rear sights. But the other reason I think rear sights (or red dot or scope) are necessary is that lots of times you wind up being off balanced or even shooting weak side. Those situations are almost impossible with a bead. With a rear sight I could lay flat on my back and shoot back behind me left handed if I had to. What I'm getting at is that with a rear sight or scope or red dot, the gun doesn't have to be mounted perfect or level or anything else for you you to line things up and hammer one home.

I think you'll be happy adding a good sight set up.

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[sasquatch1]

Shims don't change impact if you are shooting using the same barrel/rib/bead sight plane.

X1000, there's soo many people that believe shims change POI is crazy

Shims are for quick aging shooting alignment

Sights are for POA/POI.

Get you some adjustable sights, even better is a red dot


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[Tommy Strutsalot]

Shims don't change impact if you are shooting using the same barrel/rib/bead sight plane.

X1000, there's soo many people that believe shims change POI is crazy

Shims are for quick aging shooting alignment

Sights are for POA/POI.

Get you some adjustable sights, even better is a red dot


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

Gotcha.  I read a lot on forums that raising the comb will raise POI.  I guess the nuance is, encompassed in Trkmaster's quote, that raising the comb WILL raise POI if you are prepared to see more rib?   Either way, I did order some sights.  As for the red dot, I have a Burris Fast Fire II that I removed from another turkey gun and will not be putting on this one.  Nothing against the sight - great sight and I killed a good handful of turkeys with it - but they are pieces of technology and will fail if conditions allow (me, I'm the condition).   

The last time I used a red dot for turkey hunting was a few years back.  The week prior I had shot a bird out of state and when I went to pick him up, the gun swung off of my shoulder (action open) and slammed onto the ground.  I didn't think much of it at the time and about 10 days later I was hunting North Central PA and had a longbeard come storming in out of nowhere right off the roost, knocked my jake decoy like 3 yards off the stake, and stood on top of it about 13-15 yards from me.  I reflexively raised my gun and put the dot right at the base of his waddles and pulled the trigger.   He raced out of there so athletically that I knew immediately that I had missed him clean.   Low and behold the zero had been bumped in the prior incident and was shooting 12 inches to the left at 20 yds.  While I cost myself that bird at the end of the day, it was the last time I shot at a turkey with anything but a good old bead.   It's the last time I used a decoy too and not for a totally unrelated reason.   That incident had me all rattled and I just needed to reset my framing of turkey hunting -just relax, have fun and ditch all the fancy equipment. 

[mountainhunter1]

POA vs POI is the big reason turkey guns need rear sights. But the other reason I think rear sights (or red dot or scope) are necessary is that lots of times you wind up being off balanced or even shooting weak side. Those situations are almost impossible with a bead. With a rear sight I could lay flat on my back and shoot back behind me left handed if I had to. What I'm getting at is that with a rear sight or scope or red dot, the gun doesn't have to be mounted perfect or level or anything else for you you to line things up and hammer one home.

Good advice - this is spot on from my experience.

[Tommy Strutsalot]

All, thank you for the suggestions. I've been able to improve my POI at 30 and 40 yards with use of the Tru Glo Gobble Dot sight.  What do you guys think about how far I needed to move the sight forward on the base to raise POI? Is that ok you think? Also updated patterns below.

[paboxcall]

It'll be fine. Here is the rear sight I had drilled/tapped to the barrel of my H&R 12 to correct the low POI.

[Tommy Strutsalot]

Perfect!  Thanks man. 

[yelpy]

I have the same gun. No poi trouble with the one I have. I do know elevation problems have a lot to do with how you mount the gun. It doesnt take much of a difference in cheek weld to raise or lower your poi. Not saying this is the problem for sure but its possible. Try pulling the butt tight against your cheek and take a shot than try a shot lifting your head a bit. You will see a difference in poi.

If its shooting that far off it might be a good idea to call Weatherby.

[Tommy Strutsalot]

Appreciate that! I'm pretty proficient with a shotgun and this is a POI issue that occurs with my choke and load combination (Apex TSS #9 and an IC .570).  Appreciate the feedback but I am confident the issue is not related to my mount.  I've been through 3 boxes of this now and the issue was extremely consistent.  I put front and rear sights to adjust POI and had to make some pretty significant adjustments.  With a target load it was shooting dead center with factory bead and with rear sight added.