Well, this mornin was strike three for the hevi 7's this year for me. I shoot an 835 with a stardot choke. The 7's patterned great at 40 yards and even farther. The first two misses were both within 40 yards ranged with open sights. Neither were clean misses. Both birds stumbled but either ran or flew off. I decided maybe I was raisin my head right before the shot. Bought a mueller red dot to solve that problem. Patterned it at 40 yesterday, got the poa right with the poi, I mean almost perfect. Felt like maybe I had regained my confidence. Put the gun back in the case and didn't get it back out till this mornin. They were tight lipped till about 6:30 then they let loose. Time was limited cause of a good storm that was comin in fast. I got within a hundred yards of a group of toms that were across a creek. Got set up on the fence line, had the gun rested on the barbed wire, ranged the trees across the creek at 37 yards and let out a soft purr or two. It immediately got their attention and they came running. I patiently waited for one to come within the tree line for fear of missing again. The first one within the tree line stopped right in the clearing for the shot. I put the red circle right around his head and slowly pulled the trigger. He stumbled a step or two and took flight. Good thing that was my last 3.5 inch 2 1/4 oz hevi 7 cause I'm done with em. I know alot of folks on here shoot em and love em and drop birds at well over 40 and 50 yards. The patterns are awesome but they just haven't proven themselves out of my gun in the field. I wish I could but its just not workin out for me so goodbye hevi 7's. . . .
On another note I have dropped three birds this year. One at 35 yards and two at over 45 yards. All three with the same gun and choke combination but with the hevi 6's. So no worrys hevi-13, you still have my business, just not with the 7's.
Any thoughts? Bad round of 7's maybe?
It's not the plane - it's the pilot.
I concur. H-13 #7's will lay a turkey on it's back, everytime at 37 yards..Everytime. Mike
Quote from: spaightlabs on May 01, 2011, 05:34:51 PM
It's not the plane - it's the pilot.
I have taken 5 longbeards this spring with the 3" #7 hevi.
If you hit one from 0-60 you got turkey, if you pull off you get to see Mr.Turkey fly or run away. I shot a gobbler at 53 a couple days ago and he wouldn't been no deader had you dropped a house on him, a brick house. :z-guntootsmiley: :newmascot:
Don't jerk don't yank, squeeze! :fud:
Quote from: Hognutz on May 01, 2011, 05:46:54 PM
I concur. H-13 #7's will lay a turkey on it's back, everytime at 37 yards..Everytime. Mike
:you_rock:
Somethings up and it aint the ammo..I killed a bird with the bad lot of hevi shot 7s this year, he was right at 40, and it killed him fine. good luck with the 6s though
I've killed a few birds with the 6's and this year (yesterday) my first with the 7's. He was at 33 yards, and I can honestly say that i've never seen a bird flop less after the hit. I skinned out his neck just to satisfy my curiosity of the killing power of the 7's. His neck was an unbelievable mess, from his skull to his breast. I mean just wrecked! I've gotta think if the good part of the pattern hit the bird, he'd be layin' beak down in the dirt!
Its a tuff pill to swallow when you miss turkeys like that but its not Hevi 13 7's. Limited out on turkeys this year and that is the most devastating shell i have ever shot at a turkey. Sounds like you are getting too excited and now you have lost your confidence. Spend some time at the range and you will believe in your gun/shells again..take your time and squeeze the trigger like a rifle..if you snatch on the trigger you are going to miss and wound birds...
I have killed three birds this year with my 835, .670 Pure Gold choke and Hevi #7's and all of them hardly flopped. I will make one observation that I picked up on when I read the original post though and you stated, "YOU PUT THE RED CIRCLE RIGHT AROUND THE HEAD!" My question is why are you shooting at the head? By shooting at the head, about 2/3 to 3/4's of your pattern is useless. By aiming a little lower, at where the feathers meet the caruncles (wattles), you optimize the pattern. I've said this before, with today's guns and chokes, it is imperative that we shoot our shotguns like rifles because the patterns are so tight at ranges to 40 yards. If we think we are shooting a shotgun and we point and shoot, "AROUND THE HEAD", we aren't optimizing our guns, chokes or shells.
I have FAITH in the Hevi #7's and they have proven to me that if I do MY Job, They will do Their Job. When we are shooting an animal of any kind, it is imperative that we have 100% CONFIDENCE in all our gear. As for me, I will continue to BUST SOME BEAKS with the HEVI 7's!!!!!
I think that they will kill. I like to see you put the line at 50 yards. Now that said I have saw them kill past that but hate to see shots taken past 50. Now one thing is that with some of the chokes that yall have now. If you move any at all you will miss.
Well this is my first year shooting hevi 7s and both of the turkeys I shoot with them I had to ring their necks. Granted they were both 60 yard shoots but the second bird I shoot again at 20 yards and still had to ring their necks. If it sounds too good to be true it probally is and the hevi 7s is no exception. I too am going back to the 6s.
Shooting turkeys at 60yds with anything you are gonna run into problems..you were lucky to get those turkeys..
If you shot at 20 yards and had to wring his neck its cause you missed him with a majority of your pattern.. at 20 yards with my combo the bird is headless. Yall got to hit the patterning board and range more often
This year was my first attempt with 7s. I loved the patterns but was still a bit concerned. Anyway I killed two birds last week one @ 39 and the second I misjudged and shot at 52. Neither bird even flopped! I've never seen birds killed more humanely! I'm a believer!
This is my first year with the h13 and tight chokes. clear missed at 20 yds. I know what I did, i have a clear mental image of it. front sight was not down in the rear sight. Just to make sure I didn't do it agan I put a scope on, and zeroed it in. One morning I was picking up my stuff off the ground and let my gun slide off my sholder. fell about 2 feet and landed on a log square on the end of the scope. I wanted to shoot it to be sure it was still on but I only had 3 shells left. Been waiting on a turkey, several people been trying to kill two years, to be without hens. It finally happened and I scratched leaves and listened to him gobble for two hours. When he stepped out in the small clearing to circle around me in the thicket I was ready. crosshairs on waddle BOOM, all I got was feathers. neck feathers. I stepped it off several times with normal steps. 56-57 walking down hill 54-55 walking uphill. Had to be the scope. must have knocked it off, should have shot it to see. stupid stupid stupid. Well maybe not, I stepped it off today and it measures 57 yds with a tape. Pull the trigger bullseye. 159 in 10" circle and 201 more in the 20". I don't know what happened. Maybe pulled a little. I think he's a lucky SOB, if he's still alive. I'll still shoot the 7s. If I have to I'll shoot that far,only be more carefull.
Quote from: Longshanks on May 01, 2011, 10:00:13 PM
Shooting turkeys at 60yds with anything you are gonna run into problems..you were lucky to get those turkeys..
:agreed:
I killed two long beards in Kentucky this year with this years Hevishot 3.5\2.25\#7s it puts 218 in 10 at 40yds. The first bird was at 30 yds and the second was at 40yds. All I can say is STONE dead!! You gotta pattern and know your limits!! Headed to Kansas in a few days :you_rock:
I shoot that exact same set-up with the 835/StarDot/and the 7's.
I cannot attest as to what may have happened on your birds, but at the ranges you speak of my gun just shreds an ol turkeys head and neck violently.
But if you have lost faith in the 7's, you won't get an argument from me if you go to the 6's. Confidence is a big part of killing turkeys, and if you ain't got it, you ain't got it.
Get that gun patterned up well with the 6's, go kill some more birds and don't look back. It's what you are confident in that matters most to you, nobody else.
:icon_thumright: :icon_thumright: :icon_thumright:
You must've got your hands on a box of NEXT year's batch. :TooFunny:
No problems here. Shot three birds this year with the 2.25 oz 7's at 12, 47, and 52 steps.
This could be one of the things I was talking about in the past. Some of you are shooting diffrent chokes and this is the deal with a long shot column or a ball of shot. I cant prove it but with the choke he has will give a long shot column I think do to the parallel. Also the bore is some guns will make a choke work diffrent then in others so this could be the deal in this case.
Now I do not want to start a war about this. With the speed the 7's have and if you get a long shot column you may not be putting all the shot on the bird that the paper will say you are. Now the yards get more I think the shot column will come into play more. Then the big bore in the 835 may play into it more. I know that the local hunters do not like the 835 to shoot buck shot out of. They say they will not hit as hard as the smaller bore guns.
This thread is reflective of the fact that shooting turkeys at 50+ yards results in a allot of birds lost....let the turkeys come into a "for sure" kill distance and this wont happen nearly as much. In one of these threads the gentleman says he shot at 57 yards and lost the turkey but he "doesnt know what happened". This is the response i hear quite often from folks who are taking long shots and losing turkeys. Shooting paper at 50+ yards is much different than shooting at a wild turkey in hunting conditions. Im sure that i am getting ready to see a bunch of posts of turkeys killed at 50+ yards. For every turkey that is killed at 50+ it would be disturbing to know how many are lost so i am not impressed by turkeys killed at long distances. Let em come closer guys..its much better to let one walk away than to wound one... :boon:
Quote from: stinkpickle on May 02, 2011, 07:00:26 AM
You must've got your hands on a box of NEXT year's batch. :TooFunny:
I love ya, man.. Now that is stinkin' funny, right there..Mike :TooFunny: :TooFunny:
I go back to my previous post, We need to get in our heads that we need to Shoot Today's Turkey Guns Like a RIFLE! We can't think, this thing in my hands is a shotgun and if I'm in the general area of a Turkeys head and neck I'll kill him. If you have patterned your gun at 10, 20, 30 and 40 yards, you understand (very small room for ERROR). I don't care if you have a long shot column or a ball of shot or use open sights or scope, if your gun shoots POA = POI and you hold on a specific spot and not in the general area, you will Drop birds in their TRACKS.
We all get TURKEY FEVER when we have our EARDRUMS blown out, when OLE Three Toes GOBBLES at twenty yards, but Take Time and Settle the Bead on a SPECIFIC SPOT and SQUEEZE the Trigger.
Or we need to quit trying to make a rifle out of a shotgun. 350 pellets in a 10' circle at 40 yards is great at the range, not so good when hunting. Get a good combo of shell and choke that gives you near 200 at 40, and a solid 20" pattern to boot. Spend some time learning to actually hunt, and get the bird inside 40 yards like so many good hunters have been doing for years. If you have trouble shooting with just beads, get a good scope. Have a little respect for the animal you hunt by making only ethical shots. If you misjudge yardage as bad as some here claim they do, spend some time working on that. When you can't tell the difference between 40 and 60 yards, you better spend more time in the woods with a range finder and practice estimating yardage.
Longshanks, you are exactly right. For every post here claiming a dead bird at 60 yards, I am sure there are many more wounded birds that won't be talked about.
Thanks for all the replies. Thats why i love this site, there is so much to be learned from everyone's combined experience. I have missed a few turkeys in my time and have no problem admitting it lol. Even though at times they are hard to swallow.
As for "its the pilot, not the plane." I agree and take the blame for the first two losses. But after installing the mueller, the head raising shouldn't be an issue, right? I had all the confidence in the world in 7's after that trip to the range. Honestly I cannot figure out the third loss though having shot the gun with the 7's and the red dot the day before at the same yardage that the turkey was and getting such a great pattern. Obviously something didn't go right, no flop. Of course I don't blame the 7's as so many of you are droppin em left and right at distances past what I have tried the 7's. But I couldn't help but lose my confidence in the 7's out of my gun.
I am an avid shooter and do everything I can to keep from developing bad habits such as jerking the trigger in the off season. I have shot the gun enough to know it kicks somethin terrible but I'm not recoil sensitive to it, so I can't see myself flinching before the shot. I actually laugh when I have to take an off balanced shot and the gun knocks me off my feet. lol
I did say in the original post that "I put the circle around the head". Thats how I patterned the gun with the red dot though. The pellets were all below the top circle with the majority being toward the lower half. Seemed like a killer pattern to me utilizing the majority of the shot to the head and neck region.
I swapped to the 6's for this morning and dropped one in his tracks at right under 50 yards around 6:20, barely even flopped. I like the pellet count of the 7's but just couldn't seem to make things work in the field. The 6's did the job and then some. I don't know that I did anything differently this morning than I did yesterday other than changing the shell. The shot was a few yards further and this bird had a clue I was there so I didn't even have the element of surprise. So for me and my gun, the 6's are it. Plenty of confidence in my setup, no hesitation to pull the trigger.
I think we can all agree that its our duty as hunters to make sure that our equipment can perform as ethically and humanely as possible, as well as being to perform ourselves. No one wants to lose birds or have to chase em or ring necks after the shot. That being said, I just couldn't justify wounding or losing any more birds with the 7's. Just doesn't seem fair to the animal. In no way am I bashing the 7's or trying to get others to question em, just thought I would share my experience with em this year. I love em, I really do, but it just isn't gonna work lol. I agree that you have to be confident in your equipment and if the 7's have proven themselves for you, then I'm jealous. lol If it ain't broke, don't fix it.
Thanks again for all the replies and advice.
i've always been taught to aim at the waddles.. if you're aiming at the head, perhaps that's why?
Quote from: roostershooter on May 02, 2011, 12:01:14 PM
Thanks for all the replies. Thats why i love this site, there is so much to be learned from everyone's combined experience. I have missed a few turkeys in my time and have no problem admitting it lol. Even though at times they are hard to swallow.
As for "its the pilot, not the plane." I agree and take the blame for the first two losses. But after installing the mueller, the head raising shouldn't be an issue, right? I had all the confidence in the world in 7's after that trip to the range. Honestly I cannot figure out the third loss though having shot the gun with the 7's and the red dot the day before at the same yardage that the turkey was and getting such a great pattern. Obviously something didn't go right, no flop. Of course I don't blame the 7's as so many of you are droppin em left and right at distances past what I have tried the 7's. But I couldn't help but lose my confidence in the 7's out of my gun.
I am an avid shooter and do everything I can to keep from developing bad habits such as jerking the trigger in the off season. I have shot the gun enough to know it kicks somethin terrible but I'm not recoil sensitive to it, so I can't see myself flinching before the shot. I actually laugh when I have to take an off balanced shot and the gun knocks me off my feet. lol
I did say in the original post that "I put the circle around the head". Thats how I patterned the gun with the red dot though. The pellets were all below the top circle with the majority being toward the lower half. Seemed like a killer pattern to me utilizing the majority of the shot to the head and neck region.
I swapped to the 6's for this morning and dropped one in his tracks at right under 50 yards around 6:20, barely even flopped. I like the pellet count of the 7's but just couldn't seem to make things work in the field. The 6's did the job and then some. I don't know that I did anything differently this morning than I did yesterday other than changing the shell. The shot was a few yards further and this bird had a clue I was there so I didn't even have the element of surprise. So for me and my gun, the 6's are it. Plenty of confidence in my setup, no hesitation to pull the trigger.
I think we can all agree that its our duty as hunters to make sure that our equipment can perform as ethically and humanely as possible, as well as being to perform ourselves. No one wants to lose birds or have to chase em or ring necks after the shot. That being said, I just couldn't justify wounding or losing any more birds with the 7's. Just doesn't seem fair to the animal. In no way am I bashing the 7's or trying to get others to question em, just thought I would share my experience with em this year. I love em, I really do, but it just isn't gonna work lol. I agree that you have to be confident in your equipment and if the 7's have proven themselves for you, then I'm jealous. lol If it ain't broke, don't fix it.
Thanks again for all the replies and advice.
I respect you rationale about this topic. You used the #7 after patterning and even went to a scope to try to fix an apparent problem. You were not above the possibility that you could have been the problem (Pilot vs Plane). You gave them a chance and they did not carry your confidence. You went to the #6 and got back your confidence. That is all anyone can ask for in a review. I saw no where that you were bashing the product. I say keep using the #6's if that works for you.
Thank you for the honest review.
Lab
a bad shot is a bad shot. I pulled a shot on a bird at ten steps shooting ER 5's 3.5 out of an 835. The turkey was walking from my right to left and it looked like I hit him center mass. I lost that bird. A bad shot is a bad shot.
Some just don't get it..! if your having a problem with 7's go back and do your homework something wrong somewhere and goin to a larger shot size isnt going to fix it.Hevi 7's are just to deadly.
Once you have done your homework on paper..then you have to learn your lessons in the woods..experience will teach you more than anything that shooting turkeys at 60yds is just asking to wound and miss turkeys...
Quote from: Longshanks on May 02, 2011, 06:50:54 PM
Once you have done your homework on paper..then you have to learn your lessons in the woods..experience will teach you more than anything that shooting turkeys at 60yds is just asking to wound and miss turkeys...
+100 AMEN
a shotgun isn't a rifle although some people seem to think they are
You gotta shoot what makes you feel the most confident. Congrats on the bird. :wav:
First off.............Your gonna have to learn where and when to pick a fight. Showing up to OG and even hinting that you've had issues with Hevi 13 #7's and you might as well walk into a biker bar and yell "HD Sucks". On the other hand, mention you had issues with Hevi 13 #7's at the patterning board and throw out a few lot #'s and all is well..............go figure.
However........I can and will stomp birds all day long with copper plated lead #6's at 37 yards (I can miss them too).........I've not even shot H13 #7's and enjoy making fun of the H 13 groupies around here because they are very semilar to high school girls and call each other often to see what the other is wearing ;D, but have no doubt that Hevi #7's will do the same.............I hate to say it becuase I've denied it myself, but you missed the bird.
I'm inclined to believe I missed mine too. I just don't think he could run away from 159 pellets in a 10" circle around his head. I knew I would have to be pretty quick as he crossed the trail and back into the thicket. First year I've really had to aim. Always pointed it at his head, pulled the trigger and watched him flop.
Quote from: Longshanks on May 02, 2011, 06:50:54 PM
Once you have done your homework on paper..then you have to learn your lessons in the woods..experience will teach you more than anything that shooting turkeys at 60yds is just asking to wound and miss turkeys...
That's flat out the truth..don't ask what happened when one flops away from a 57 yard miss. I don't know what's up with folks takin long range shots because they believe there is a super shell in their gun. These shells are designed to give better coverage not twice the range. Even when I carry my 10 ga I pass up 60+ yard shots. It's no different than shooting with lead too far..you may have killed a couple with a lucky pellet but its gonna burn you one day and you'll have to blame every ounce of your equipment but yourself.
I've found that Star Dot chokes throw really tight patterns with Hevi13.
Maybe a little bigger, more open pattern would help most of us?
I don't like to comment on controversial issues but this one time will add make a opinionated statement based on experience , not pointed at the original poster but rather a commentary at some of the other opinions added afterwards
40 yards in my mind will always be a long shot to me.
Like mentioned a shotgun is exactly that a shotgun not a rifle , nor will it ever be . People will and should try to improve the performance to enhance clean kills , the side product is that the range is increased - If one chooses to shoot beyond what the equipment is capable of doing then the inevitable result will the direct opposite , the diminishing of clean kills. Everyone knows that is not good for the sport of turkey hunting .
you have guys shootin at extremely long ranges 50 and over because they think that hevi shot or tss is super the sport is to get them close some mite try farther with 10 gauge or 3and a half but not with a3 inch gun have some ethics gobblers deserve it :turkey2:
killed one Saturday at 33 steps with h-13, 3.5, 2 1/4oz of # 7s he honestly wiggled a wing a few times and that was it. Ive turkey hunted for over 10 years and these are by far the best patterns Ive ever seen. I shoot a nwtf browning silver
and a .670 jellyhead choke. 133 pellets in a 4 inch circle at 40 steps. the bird i killled Saturday was dropping off a hill and i shot right before he disappeared. the main pattern hit him in the noggin the pellets actually exited his head truly a jellied head. i have 0 complaints about the #7s other than the price. 11 1/4 beard 3/4 spurs and 21#.
I want to clarify a couple of things about my statement of, We need to Shoot our Shotguns Like Rifles. What I am trying to say is CONCENTRATE on a SMALL Spot on the neck of that Bird, Keep your Head Down and Squeeze the Trigger, like you would your Favorite Deer Rifle. Be a Marksman!!!! Aim SMALL, Miss SMALL!!!! If we have done our Homework prior to the season, we will know where that Gun is shooting, POA=POI??? It is imperative with the tight patterns we have with todays guns and chokes, that we put those tight patterns on target.
The next thing I want to clarify is, I DO NOT ADVOCATE taking LONG Shots at Turkeys with a SHOTGUN!!!! Each of us need to know what our guns are doing at all ranges (just like your Favorite Deer Rifle). There is a Maximum Range, that each of us need to establish, that we know we can harvest an animal 100% of the time and we need to stay within that range.
I want to express my apologizes to many of you that thought I was advocating long shots. As a True Sportsman, I believe we should do everything Humanly possible to harvest every animal HUMANELY!!! If you have ANY doubt, that you can't harvest a particular animal then let it walk. KNOW YOUR EQUIPMENT. AIM SMALL, MISS SMALL!!!!
I don't know what it is about #7 Hevi shot, but it must cause catastrophic heart attacks in turkeys since it's not great at killing them in statistical means...
Massive heart attack
(http://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f121/Muscadine36269/0410110730_0001.jpg)
Massive heart attack
(http://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f121/Muscadine36269/Georgia2011_1.jpg)
Massive heart attack
(http://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f121/Muscadine36269/Georgia2011_2.jpg)
Quote from: Dawn2Dusk on May 03, 2011, 10:40:34 AM
I don't know what it is about #7 Hevi shot, but it must cause catastrophic heart attacks in turkeys since it's not great at killing them in statistical means...
:TooFunny:
Sorry bbcoach.
I went back to what I posted and it may have come off wrong. It by no means was a shot at you. You are right about the tightness of some patterns, they are not what a shotgun pattern traditionally is thought of as being. It seems as though so many are trying to get their patterns so tight, thinking this is going to extend the range of the gun. Maybe. A little. What you then end up with is an inferior pattern at closer distances. We will all never agree on this. When the season is over, I want to look back on it and have those experiences of a strutting gobbler inside of 40 yards. When they gobble, the hair on the back of your neck stands up! That kind of hunt. Hiding in a blind at the edge of a field and shooting a bird at 50, 60, 70 yards. Ehhhh. Like was said before, doesn't impress me. Just the opposite. A compensation for shortcomings.
Quote from: bbcoach on May 03, 2011, 10:25:33 AM
The next thing I want to clarify is, I DO NOT ADVOCATE taking LONG Shots at Turkeys with a SHOTGUN!!!! Each of us need to know what our guns are doing at all ranges (just like your Favorite Deer Rifle). There is a Maximum Range, that each of us need to establish, that we know we can harvest an animal 100% of the time and we need to stay within that range.
How do you establish a maximum range? Mine has always been 40yds. Never had any problem with lead. Now I spend money on another choke and several boxes of high dollar HS. All the HS 7s shooters tell me as far as you have the pattern you can kill him, and that pattern is 100 in a 10" circle. I have 159 but its too far. Spending that money for a more dense pattern at 40yds is ludicrus. 12 pellets through the brain won't kill him any deader than 4 pellets through the brain
Quote from: jfair on May 03, 2011, 10:58:35 AM
Sorry bbcoach.
I went back to what I posted and it may have come off wrong. It by no means was a shot at you. You are right about the tightness of some patterns, they are not what a shotgun pattern traditionally is thought of as being. It seems as though so many are trying to get their patterns so tight, thinking this is going to extend the range of the gun. Maybe. A little. What you then end up with is an inferior pattern at closer distances. We will all never agree on this. When the season is over, I want to look back on it and have those experiences of a strutting gobbler inside of 40 yards. When they gobble, the hair on the back of your neck stands up! That kind of hunt. Hiding in a blind at the edge of a field and shooting a bird at 50, 60, 70 yards. Ehhhh. Like was said before, doesn't impress me. Just the opposite. A compensation for shortcomings.
:agreed: next year I'm opening mine back up a little so I don't have to worry about those 20 and under shots. I've shot way more of those than past 30 anyway
[/quote]
:agreed: next year I'm opening mine back up a little so I don't have to worry about those 20 and under shots. I've shot way more of those than past 30 anyway
[/quote]
Just don't give up on the hevi's. They throw a heck of a good 40 yard pattern. I got mine pretty open. 200+ in 10" another 200+ in 20". Much better than my lead shot. 20 and under are real fun hunts ;D
first time shooting Hevi this year.. shot one yesterday at 33yds and he didnt flop, didnt move, didnt twitch.. head was crushed with red dots
Hevi-13 #6's may pack more punch, but the problem I see with them is finding the right combination that will shoot them to the density that most are wanting or looking for. Why settle for maybe 200 hits when you can have 300 or maybe more? I'm with reloader that pattern density with multiple hits in the small vital skull and vertebrae neck area of a turkey with a face full of Hevi-13 #7's that still have the penetration power to penetrate this small delicate area on a turkey is way to go even if you have to shoot one past 50yds. That's if the pattern density is there to do the job.
Here's why I shoot Hevi-13 #7's. How would a turkey unless I missed of course even think about living even if I shot him at 50yds? Don't even tell me that load won't still kill one very easily.
(http://www.hunt101.com/data/526/DSCF00593.jpg)
I love these long posts. So far off the original topic. I am all for a whole bunch of pellets hitting the turkey. 200 - 250 in 10" is plenty enough to ensure a clean kill. I am not going to argue about how much energy you need to kill a bird. I don't really know. This thing about TSS being far superior I'm not too sure about. If you are comparing 6 shot to 6 shot, then yes it is better. When you start talking 8's and 9's, that is a different story. I'm sure the paper is going to look fantastic as that is a pile of pellets. Why not keep pushing the limits and shoot 18g/cc shot that is the size of a grain of sand. Numbers will be fantastic, right?
Hal those same Hevi-13 7's can blow clean through the body of a turkey at 45yds on some shots. Now that was only a few. I really don't care if they didn't myself. Several 7's will penetrate half way through the body. And I do mean several. Again that don't really matter to me much. The shot that hits the head and neck are what counts. The 7's have the punch to completely penetrate and pass through the other side on most of all the shots that hit the head and neck area at 45yds. That is all I care about. It wouldn't matter to me if they only penetrated half way through the head and neck at that range. If one can do that with these loads, then what more could you want without shooting TSS which I know you are sold on and you sell it. The 7's will smoke a turkey and still kill him at a measly 50yds. And if you can't center your pattern over the head and neck region of a turkey you really have no business shooting at a turkey. Aim small miss small. But we all do make mistakes including me. But we can't blame the Hevi-13 #7's 99% of the time.
I'll add that the Hevi-13 7's will eventually become the best selling load that they make. More and more people are finding out just how bad this little shot is. :z-winnersmiley:
i dont shoot hevi 7s but i do shoot nitros loaded with straight 7s and i know for a fact that 5 birds have died this year with them and not a twitch out of a turkey yet :z-guntootsmiley:.so i think shoot what makes you happy and go kill some more.
I know a few guys have put the time in with all the HTL offerings and have become very knowledgable but the diameter to weight ratio works with the #7. The Bird i killed last year at 52yds was hammered pretty good with excellent penetration that was proof enough for me that 7's will do the job.In 27 yrs of turkey huntin anytime i've failed to kill a bird it was always pilot error..!
Wow this thing sure got alot of attention. Let me restate that I in no way am blaming the 7's. They patterned better than anything I have ever shot out of my 835. I did my paper work at the range and got fantastic numbers at 40 yards. But it seemed like everytime I made a shot on a bird within the 40 yards with the 7's something went wrong. I'm not above pilot error as I'm sure thats probably the blame. It just seemed odd to me that I could drop one right under 50 yards with the 6's and lose 3 all under 40 yards with the 7's. In all I dropped 4 birds with the 6's this season. I guess I was looking for some reassurance that the 7's should drop birds stone cold at atleast 40 yards. Yall gave plenty of reassurance on that one. I know they are insanely popular on this site, this is in fact where I first learned about the hevi 7's among several other things.
I've had lots of folks say that 7's just aren't big enough for turkeys and most of them after hearing that i had lost three with them said, "well no wonder you lost em, you are shootin em with dove shot." Now granted that these people are no where near as hardcore about turkeys than the people on this site. But I guess its kind of like the power of suggestion. You hear it so much that you start to believe it somewhat.
I do appreciate all the replies and all the suggestions. I've come to accept that its just coincidence that the times I lost those three I was shootin 7's. It would have more than likely been the same outcome had I been loaded with 6's those mornings. I, keyword I, just couldn't make it happen with the 7's this year for some reason. But I did cleanly harvest 4 birds with the 6's and thats what it is all about.
Good luck to everyone who still has tags left.
Roostershooter,
Your last post hit it right on!! It was a (3) coincidence that those birds got away. Things do go wrong and sometimes we don't know and can't figure out why. That's the way it is sometimes. know your gun/pattern, know your distance, get a clear shot, try not to flinch and sometimes you still miss. Maybe you flinched, lifted your head, sights were off, shell had a problem, you hit something you didn't see, gun was tilted to the side, bird moved, .... or the bird just got Lucky. If it hasn't happened to you, you haven't turkey hunted long enough.
But like most everyone said those hevi 7's will kill easily to 40yds. I do like mine at 1200fps and they will kill easily to 50yds (and a little more). Trust me most people that are turkey hunters and have been for a long time don't know anything about hevi shot and TSS (though they have an opinion on it). And you don't need to know anything about this shot to kill lots of turkeys at 35yds. If you have used lead for 30yrs you have to reteach yourself about hevi and TSS. Hevi shot has been out for a long time and very few knew the power of the small shot, Untill Now!!!
Steve
Roostershooter. Anything that gets this much attention is a good post. You are one of the few that will question the hevi shot. One of the few that will give an honest, negative opinion. Thank you for that. I have never shot much more than 40 yards. In turn I have never shot at a bird that I did not get. When I made this comment before, the immediate response was to question how many birds I have ever shot. Quite a few. My first purchase of Rem hevi-shot was the 3.5 inch 1300 fps 1.75 oz. 6 shot. Patterned good, in the 130's at 40 yards. I shot a bird in a field at 35 yards that year. I needed all three shots and a head stomp at the end to finish him off. I cursed that shell up and down. Still have five left. Looking back on it, something strange must have happened. A hole in the pattern that somehow found the right spot maybe. Who knows. Went back to lead 6's and continued killing birds. I changed to hevi 7's this year as the pattern is fantastic. Season just started so I will do some in the field checking soon. Thanks for your input as you have me leaning back toward the 6's in hevi now too. They pattern nice also. Shoot what you have confidence in. Don't let anyone tell you different.
Well I just gave a couple of my friends some of my 7's that I have stashed. They have never used the stuff. I told them they will kill a gobbler stone dead even if he flops like a chicken does with his head chopped off. :z-guntootsmiley:
Rooster, Great post!! I am kinda on the fence along with you. I hit a bird last year with the 7`s out of a 20 ga. and I will say they won`t penetrate feathers!!! He was within 25 yds. Your opinion is your opinion; you don`t like em that`s that.
At 25 yards hevi #7 will decapitate a bird. The pattern is the size of a softball. You straight up missed that bird.
The issue here is the shots that people are taking rather than which shell is more productive and efficient for harvesting a turkey. :deadhorse:
Big Hevi 13 fan here. Best load for my Beretta 390 is the 3-inch #6 of 1.75 ounces. We can all kill those 60 yards birds on occasion. The problem is, when we knock one down it encourages us to take a shot of that distance again. But we should be limiting our shots to something less than that. I try for 35 and in, but occasionally I squeeze off further than that.
Quote from: ILIKEHEVI-13 on May 04, 2011, 08:38:13 PM
Well I just gave a couple of my friends some of my 7's that I have stashed. They have never used the stuff. I told them they will kill a gobbler stone dead even if he flops like a chicken does with his head chopped off. :z-guntootsmiley:
Well 2 of those guys went out and killed 2 turkeys with those 7's I gave them. They said they never have hit one any harder. One of them never even flopped. :z-guntootsmiley:
Some of you guys say the funniest stuff I swear. If you aint killing him with 7s, then you need to go to tss 8s or 9s. Claiming to have hit a bird at 25 yards and loseing him is some funny stuff. Hell you could shoot him with a reduced recoil target load at that distance out of my gun and it would still roll him. Moving up to 6s isnt going to help you any, but if thats what helps you sleep at night than go ahead and do it.
Update..
Went out this mornin on coyote control since I am out of tags thanks to the hevi 6's. I spotted somethin odd off to the side of the trail, a dead turkey. But not just any dead turkey, specifically the last turkey I shot with the hevi 7's that was within 40 yards ranged. There he laid close to 80 yards away from where I shot him almost a week ago. Call it a bad shot or maybe I hit some brush that I didn't think was in the line of shot or maybe he moved as soon as I pulled the trigger. Whatever it may have been I will say that the 7's took him down, after an 80 yard flight over a creek and crash landing through the trees. I searched for him best I could that day as I was confident that the shot should have been right on. It is hard to say what exactly happened or went wrong. I know the 6's won't fix any of those problems mentioned but let's face it, sometimes it seems you can do everything right and still get a marginal outcome, no matter what you are shooting. Just too many variables that you can't control. Thats just hunting for ya. I'm glad to say thats one less bird I lost with the 7's this year though. The bugs had worked him over real good so I couldn't see where the shot had hit. Still clueless as to what the problem was exactly but atleast I've got some closure on that one.
Just one more story of how the hevi 7s failed us once again.
Still not blaming the 7's. I blame myself or unforeseen circumstances; either or.. doesn't change the outcome. The shot doesn't always go as planned. I know nothing makes up for a bad shot but maybe the 6's would make the difference when those unforeseen circumstances arise like light brush in the way or the shot being a little more range than originally thought or the shot missing the mark a little. I guess thats all the more reason I'm liking the 6's. Maybe they will take up the slack on those not so perfect shots. Can't be too dead but they sure can be not dead enough. I know the 7's should cleanly kill at 40 yards, that being the case theres no doubt the the 6's will too.. .Speaking of 6's, just had a visit from the fedex truck with 2 more boxes of em. Thank you hevi-shot.
It sounds to me like a poor shot followed by an even poorer tracking effort. Trust me when I say that I'm not casting stones cause I've been guilty of both. Learn from your mistakes and move on. Good luck in the future!
I will say that i would have looked harder had a bad electrical storm not rolled in hard on top of me that morning. It was no easy track by any means though. He crashed in some thick stuff with zero visibility. What led me to him was the smell a week later. I searched all I could the morning I shot. Sometimes it just doesn't go according to plan. I will say that I have dropped birds at well past 40 due to misjudged range this year with not so perfect shots and the 6's. By not so perfect shots I mean the shot dropping a little from poa because of the range. I do carry a range finder but sometimes its just too late to put it to use.
Quote from: roostershooter on May 01, 2011, 05:24:18 PM
On another note I have dropped three birds this year. One at 35 yards and two at over 45 yards. All three with the same gun and choke combination but with the hevi 6's. So no worrys hevi-13, you still have my business, just not with the 7's.
Any thoughts? Bad round of 7's maybe?
Well, now you're at 4, probably at 6 when ya add the other 2 hit and lost...not sayin' ya did anything wrong - it's tough to count a bird as part of your bag when you didn't get a chance to put a tag on it. Been there.
Patterning any gun is a touch and feel proposition. I finally discovered that my Beretta 390 shooting through a Hastings .681 patterns the Hevi 6s best when using the 1.75-ounce shot load instead of the 2 ounce load. Took me a while to figure out the best choke too. It ain't cheap patterning a bunch of Hevis, but once you get to where you need to be you'll be jellynecking them on a regular basis. Still pays to get 'em as close as possible.
I would think that a solid hit with the 7s would flatten them.