I posted this as a response to another thread in the turkey gun forum but I want to make this aware to more of you on here so I've made it into a separate thread.
I have to give an update on the boss tom loads. I don't like to report bad news but out of two five round boxes (I originally bought 4 boxes), I had 2 "dud" rounds. The first one made a fizzle sound when I fired, had no recoil, and the wad was actually stuck in the choke tube. After getting the wad out, I took the barrel off and looked down and it was full of unburned powder. I took pic and video and sent it to boss. They did right and sent me another box, saying that it could have been the cold temps and the fact that they use a slow burning powder. I don't think that was the case as it was 40 degrees that day. (The rest of shells in the box shot with no problems as well as 4 shells from the second box). Today (several weeks later) I decided to shoot some more rounds and had 1 shell left from box #2. I fired and it made a good pop as if it fired fine, but there was hardly any recoil and all the shot hit about 2 feet in front of my 3ft x 2ft target. I reported this to Boss, they have read my message but no response yet. I told them that I now have 3 boxes of this ammo that I will not ever trust in the field.
If you owned a company, how would you go about making this right?
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Here's a pic of the wad stuck in the choke tube.
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I would be done with them. Never seen anything like that.
Quote from: Clydetaylor1 on April 07, 2019, 09:17:41 AM
I would be done with them. Never seen anything like that.
Yea I'm definitely not interested in any replacement shells. I've asked for a refund, I'm hoping they will honor that. They were really helpful and great to talk with prior to buying, I'm hoping they continue that service.
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This very thing cost my hunting partner a big gobbler. He had a big old longbeard in that we had hunted for years and finally it was his time to die. I was sitting back watching and at the shot I thought, "what the hell is he shooting, I never heard a turkey load sound like that". Well old long beard was hit ( it was 30 yards) but he got to wing and sailed off the hill. when I used to shoot competitive trap and reloaded I would hear shells like that. My friend was beside himself. As I walked out I found his wad about 20 feet in front of him and as I walked the soybean stubble i could see where his shot scattered on the ground, but some of it made it to the gobbler and wounded him. We tore the hillside up looking for that bird with no luck. The next day we went back and found his carcass where the coyotes had caught him. My buddy was incensed with anger and literally fired off all the shells he had to destroy them. I'm not sure the brand, but they were something new he had bought. He went back to the extended range Winchesters he had shot for years.
Quote from: eggshell on April 07, 2019, 10:24:37 AM
This very thing cost my hunting partner a big gobbler. He had a big old longbeard in that we had hunted for years and finally it was his time to die. I was sitting back watching and at the shot I thought, "what the hell is he shooting, I never heard a turkey load sound like that". Well old long beard was hit ( it was 30 yards) but he got to wing and sailed off the hill. when I used to shoot competitive trap and reloaded I would hear shells like that. My friend was beside himself. As I walked out I found his wad about 20 feet in front of him and as I walked the soybean stubble i could see where his shot scattered on the ground, but some of it made it to the gobbler and wounded him. We tore the hillside up looking for that bird with no luck. The next day we went back and found his carcass where the coyotes had caught him. My buddy was incensed with anger and literally fired off all the shells he had to destroy them. I'm not sure the brand, but they were something new he had bought. He went back to the extended range Winchesters he had shot for years.
That's exactly the scenario I was thinking could have happened had I not tested these thoroughly.
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I need you guys opinion. I've reached out to boss several times since Friday. I originally had been corresponding through Instagram as they had told me they check social media frequently and that's the easiest way. So I've sent a couple messages, the latest asking for a refund. I can see where they all have been read but no response. I'm thinking of calling Monday, I'm kinda pissed. Or should I cut my losses and forget about it?
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I'd call them
I've decided I'm not going to call them. I've already emailed them and sent a couple messages that I can see they have read. They should be getting a hold of me if anything. Disappointed
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Quick update, and let me know what you all think of this.
Got a call from Brandon, the owner, and talked to him for 10 minutes. He suggests checking firing pin and giving it a deep clean. Says could be a light primer strike due to the fact these shells need a very solid primer strike to thoroughly set off all the heavy slow burning powder.
I give my guns a good deep cleaning every spring but that did not include taking out the firing pin which I have never done, probably because I've never had issues with it.
He said this issue has happened even during their own testing of the boss Tom shell and it was due to firing pin being even the slightest bit oily/dirty.
What do you guys think about that??
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I'd avoid any shell that was that close to a failure mode due to a firing pin being even the slightest bit oily/dirty. Take a look at your primers on the fired hulls. Do they look like light strikes?
Quote from: Rapscallion Vermilion on April 08, 2019, 03:44:51 PM
I'd avoid any shell that was that close to a failure mode due to a firing pin being even the slightest bit oily/dirty. Take a look at your primers on the fired hulls. Do they look like light strikes?
I brought that up with him because I mentioned that neither of the primers looked like light strikes. He said it's likely that the strike was enough to partially but not completely ignite the powder. But either way, I agree with you, I don't really want to be hunting with any shell that is that finicky
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I think I would have to call BS on the light strike. I have loaded hundreds of thousands of target loads and have had some primer issues. Light strikes due to primers set to deep, weakened hammer springs, dirty firing pins, or some combination of all these factors. A primer either goes off or it does not. A primer that is struck hard enough to go off only has one "speed"!
Quote from: WAGinVA on April 08, 2019, 04:37:24 PM
I think I would have to call BS on the light strike. I have loaded hundreds of thousands of target loads and have had some primer issues. Light strikes due to primers set to deep, weakened hammer springs, dirty firing pins, or some combination of all these factors. A primer either goes off or it does not. A primer that is struck hard enough to go off only has one "speed"!
I also just got home and pulled the bolt to look at the area the firing pin sits. You can eat off this bolt, there's nothing to clean or excess oil to wipe. I also knocked the retaining pin out and pulled the firing pin off. Its clean as a whistle. So I'm back at square one
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I agree BS....a primer fires or it doesn't he's playing you as a fool. I will never buy these shells if that's what they call customer service. There are way to many other options out there, so they best get their act together or they will be a has been.
The proper response would have been an apology and send me your remaining shells for us to test, but we'll refund you for all you purchased. If you don't want to return the shells keep them as a gift and we'll still send you a refund.
I make maple syrup and I replace any that people are dissatisfied with, but I have only replaced one bottle ever. A lady bought one and dropped it on the way out the door....I got another one and handed to her and said I'll clean up the mess. She wanted to pay, but I said no and she has been a customer for many years. She told a lot of other people how great I treated her and they now buy from me......that's how you build respect for your business.
Quote from: eggshell on April 08, 2019, 05:30:21 PM
I agree BS....a primer fires or it doesn't he's playing you as a fool. I will never buy these shells if that's what they call customer service. There are way to many other options out there, so they best get their act together or they will be a has been.
The proper response would have been an apology and send me your remaining shells for us to test, but we'll refund you for all you purchased. If you don't want to return the shells keep them as a gift and we'll still send you a refund.
I make maple syrup and I replace any that people are dissatisfied with, but I have only replaced one bottle ever. A lady bought one and dropped it on the way out the door....I got another one and handed to her and said I'll clean up the mess. She wanted to pay, but I said no and she has been a customer for many years. She told a lot of other people how great I treated her and they now buy from me......that's how you build respect for your business.
I get where he's coming from in attempting to inform me of some other possibilities of why the issues are occurring but I kind of already knew that it wasn't an issue with my gun or firing pin or oil/gunk. He even sent me a video of the same issue happening during their testing, which they supposedly confirmed was in fact due to dirty firing pin, as the issues ceased after cleaning. I sent him one right back showing the bolt and firing pin being spotless and informed him that's how it was when the shells malfunctioned and that there's nothing for me to clean. They will be getting one more call from me tomorrow asking for a refund and that's it. I'll let you all know what happens.
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Agree with other posts - a primer either goes off or it doesn't. A light strike will lightly dent the primer, not setting it off. If the firing pin hits it hard enough to go off, it will go off full speed ahead.
They have a problem with too slow a powder or poor obturation by the wad. Super slow burning powders need a certain amount of resistance to ensure complete ignition. A low pressure load (too much cushion or too light a payload) or powder or gas bypassing the base of the wad is the culprit. These issues are exacerbated by cold weather.
Another example of why I handload.
It's very rare, but hang fires do happen. That's why it is recommended that whenever the trigger is pulled and the shell doesn't go off to keep the gun pointed in the safe direction and count to 20 before extracting the shell. That's not what's happening here though. These sound like badly loaded shells.
So after talking with the owner yesterday and that whole gig, I sent a video to him showing that the bolt and firing pin were clean, with no excess oil to wipe off, and no burrs/issues to be corrected. Read receipt verified they saw this almost immediately upon sending it. I received no response. This was last night about 2 hours after we talked on the phone. I decided to also email the above to Megan at Boss as she seemed to be the one responding most consistently. I further stated that I would like them to figure out a solution and call me tomorrow (now today). I again said I'm happy to return the 3 boxes of shells I have remaining, provided I am given a prepaid shipping label, and that I believe I should be given a refund at this time. I have received no email, no text, no call from Boss.
Funny how when I was initially inquiring about the shells, they responded almost immediately and went above and beyond, and now it's like pulling teeth to get them to talk. Not a good experience. Not sure what else I can do at this point.
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I checked their website and noticed they do not have a way to post reviews. They have reviews on facebook though. I think your doing your part sharing. I know I will not even try them knowing your problems
Quote from: eggshell on April 09, 2019, 06:41:16 PM
I checked their website and noticed they do not have a way to post reviews. They have reviews on facebook though. I think your doing your part sharing. I know I will not even try them knowing your problems
I figured I should at least share what's going on here with you guys, as we are the ones who would be most likely to try a new turkey load! Haha. I guess if I ever decide to reload, I have 22.5 oz of some nice HTL shot! I took one apart and the shot is really nice and uniform.
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Typical of them to blame the gun. I'm not surprised one bit.
Thanks for posting! I'll stick to loading my own one shells at a time.
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