After recently reading an article about the rather new TSS shot and the extended range capabilities, I came to wonder at what point will the line be drawn of how far is too far to shoot a turkey? The article said that the TSS has the potential to take turkeys out to 60 even 70 yards. How far will you be able to take a turkey in the near future? I personally take great pride in being able to draw turkeys in within 40 yards. This is what makes turkey hunting so special to me. I love interacting with turkeys and sitting just feet away from a wild animal that knows nothing about your whereabouts. This is just an opinion but I feel that extended shots take the fun out of turkey hunting and even if I could shoot to 70 yards I refuse to do so because that's not what turkey hunting means to me. Turkey hunting to me is not about "killing" a turkey. I could go the rest of my life without ever killing a turkey and not be upset. The opportunity to chase turkeys and enjoy nature is what it is all about. Not only this but when will turkey hunters have to start wearing orange with how far their turkey shotguns are becoming lethal? What do you all think? How far out are we willing to go just to kill a turkey?
It's the same with everything kind of weaponry in hunting.
Bow sights that range the target for you and give you a luminated dot to aim with.
Guys building 600 yard muzzle loaders.
2000 yard hunting rifles.
It was only a matter of time before shotguns was part of the game too. I don't think we can do anything about it besides being true to yourself and hunt how you want and how you enjoy.
Many years ago my line was about 30, that's the range we felt comfortable shooting at with the guns/ammo we had. Then about 20-25 years ago I moved it back to 40. I still let them come as close as they want, but once they step inside my perceived 40 I do my best to not let them get back to 41. I really don't see myself shooting any further than that, ever. At least in purpose.
Everybody has their own ethical max range they're willing to shoot. If 40 is someone's max I absolutely will respect them for that, if another's is 60 yards I'll will also respect you. My biggest gripe is with people who have absolutely no idea what their own gun is capable of or where the pattern is even hitting. As long is you follow the 100/10 rule and can do it consistently in all conditions, then I wont judge what you do.
Also I think for many hunters TSS will dramatically help with the problem of lost birds due to misjudged range. Even the very best of us will misjudge from time to time. Finally I believe the people who intend to plunk tss in their guns and think they can start sniping turkeys 70+ yards away will prove to be in the minority for which I'm grateful.
100% agree with deerpoo22. I live where rifles are legal and know farmers who "tag out" every spring from their tractor seats with anything from a 22-250 to a 30-06 at 100-300 yards while working the farm. I hate that big strutters have to go this way, a lost opportunity for a great hunt, but it's legal (except for being on the tractor, but maybe they get down). I knew guys hand loading tss long ago claiming 70 yards no problem. Never interested me. Still I switched to hevi-shot from lead, and will probably switch to tss. I don't shoot enough shells a spring to mind the price, not when compared to the hunting license and tanks of gas to get there and back. I guess I just like the idea of that 35 yard gobbler being deader, when dead just ain't enough. My big gripe is also the guys hunting, and shooting, who don't know what their gun and load really does. Just pattern the darn thing and shoot at distances it is a guaranteed kill.
Quote from: Premier Turkey Calls on March 27, 2018, 05:35:51 PM
After recently reading an article about the rather new TSS shot and the extended range capabilities, I came to wonder at what point will the line be drawn of how far is too far to shoot a turkey? The article said that the TSS has the potential to take turkeys out to 60 even 70 yards. How far will you be able to take a turkey in the near future? I personally take great pride in being able to draw turkeys in within 40 yards. This is what makes turkey hunting so special to me. I love interacting with turkeys and sitting just feet away from a wild animal that knows nothing about your whereabouts. This is just an opinion but I feel that extended shots take the fun out of turkey hunting and even if I could shoot to 70 yards I refuse to do so because that's not what turkey hunting means to me. Turkey hunting to me is not about "killing" a turkey. I could go the rest of my life without ever killing a turkey and not be upset. The opportunity to chase turkeys and enjoy nature is what it is all about. Not only this but when will turkey hunters have to start wearing orange with how far their turkey shotguns are becoming lethal? What do you all think? How far out are we willing to go just to kill a turkey?
:z-winnersmiley: :z-winnersmiley: X2, well said
40yds is my max line,
I feel 35 yards is plenty myself, I bow hunt to get animals that close as well because it is a true challenge.
Many if not most on this forum are ethical. However the pressure to bring game home will always overcome common sense in some.
Basically you draw your own line.
My line is 40, but I prefer them inside 30. The closer they are, the more excitingthe hunt. JMHO!!!!
Check pattern at 40 and keep shots 35 and under. (5 yard buffer)
Quote from: Premier Turkey Calls on March 27, 2018, 05:35:51 PM
After recently reading an article about the rather new TSS shot and the extended range capabilities, I came to wonder at what point will the line be drawn of how far is too far to shoot a turkey? The article said that the TSS has the potential to take turkeys out to 60 even 70 yards. How far will you be able to take a turkey in the near future? I personally take great pride in being able to draw turkeys in within 40 yards. This is what makes turkey hunting so special to me. I love interacting with turkeys and sitting just feet away from a wild animal that knows nothing about your whereabouts. This is just an opinion but I feel that extended shots take the fun out of turkey hunting and even if I could shoot to 70 yards I refuse to do so because that's not what turkey hunting means to me. Turkey hunting to me is not about "killing" a turkey. I could go the rest of my life without ever killing a turkey and not be upset. The opportunity to chase turkeys and enjoy nature is what it is all about. Not only this but when will turkey hunters have to start wearing orange with how far their turkey shotguns are becoming lethal? What do you all think? How far out are we willing to go just to kill a turkey?
.
First of all , all this talk of tss is beating a dead horse. Just because tss has the density and energy to take birds at those ranges do not mean that's what we do. I handload my own tss and it's enjoyable. You can easily form a opinion with having no first hand knowledge of the effectiveness of the load or the people who shoot it. I have 40 years of turkey hunting and I have killed around 150 Gobbler's , all called to the gun and in reasonable shotgun range. I started shooting tss for the pattern density and retained energy. I love to turkey hunt and do not mind using the best equipment I can to ensure that when I pull the trigger , I will not cripple that bird. Before getting on a high horse , think about all the modern equipment that you use to help you harvest a bird. Leave that camo at home , break out a crack barrel with a brass bead sight , some lead shot 4s and the list goes on. You draw the line where your ethics and morals tell you to. Good luck
I like to challenge myself. I did that with deer hunting. Finally got the M/L, archery, pistol, etc. Got bored with it. My second bird will be shot with a M/L this year or not shot at all. With duck hunting, I like to get away from the crowds, even if it means getting away from the birds. I am not into "trophy" ducks, I am into trophy shoots. Challenging shooting is what I enjoy now.
I say do what is within your ethics. But I must admit I do judge others making crazy long shots. Just admit all you care about is the bag and not the effort and it makes it easier to take for me. It is legal to kill on private where I am with a rifle. The only person I have not judged is a guy I know with Parkinsons so bad, he can only sit in a stand and shoot one with a rifle from a rest-could not hardly walk very far at all. God bless him and more power to him.
Quote from: Spitten and drummen on March 27, 2018, 07:47:17 PM
Quote from: Premier Turkey Calls on March 27, 2018, 05:35:51 PM
After recently reading an article about the rather new TSS shot and the extended range capabilities, I came to wonder at what point will the line be drawn of how far is too far to shoot a turkey? The article said that the TSS has the potential to take turkeys out to 60 even 70 yards. How far will you be able to take a turkey in the near future? I personally take great pride in being able to draw turkeys in within 40 yards. This is what makes turkey hunting so special to me. I love interacting with turkeys and sitting just feet away from a wild animal that knows nothing about your whereabouts. This is just an opinion but I feel that extended shots take the fun out of turkey hunting and even if I could shoot to 70 yards I refuse to do so because that's not what turkey hunting means to me. Turkey hunting to me is not about "killing" a turkey. I could go the rest of my life without ever killing a turkey and not be upset. The opportunity to chase turkeys and enjoy nature is what it is all about. Not only this but when will turkey hunters have to start wearing orange with how far their turkey shotguns are becoming lethal? What do you all think? How far out are we willing to go just to kill a turkey?
.
First of all , all this talk of tss is beating a dead horse. Just because tss has the density and energy to take birds at those ranges do not mean that's what we do. I handload my own tss and it's enjoyable. You can easily form a opinion with having no first hand knowledge of the effectiveness of the load or the people who shoot it. I have 40 years of turkey hunting and I have killed around 150 Gobbler's , all called to the gun and in reasonable shotgun range. I started shooting tss for the pattern density and retained energy. I love to turkey hunt and do not mind using the best equipment I can to ensure that when I pull the trigger , I will not cripple that bird. Before getting on a high horse , think about all the modern equipment that you use to help you harvest a bird. Leave that camo at home , break out a crack barrel with a brass bead sight , some lead shot 4s and the list goes on. You draw the line where your ethics and morals tell you to. Good luck
I don't think there is a turkey hunter I would respect that would disagree with your reason for shooting it, or your ethics. I don't think the OP would at all. It is not about the load, but the use of it to snipe.
I misjudged a bird badly. He was standing next to a different tuft of weeds that I knew were 36 yards from me, but he was actually about 46. Because I was using #6 Hevi, he met his maker. His buddy came over and stomped him a while and left the field gobbling. I feel bad I misjudged that bad, but I was shocked when I stepped it off. I use better loads so that I kill instead of cripple as well. And try my dangedest to shoot them inside of 35, I prefer 30 and that is the majority of my birds (no where near 150 though).
Man, I am too wore out from the reaping thread to start this fight today. I will wait till gobblenut wakes up from his nap and jumps in. Ronnie didn't give me much opportunity to be a wise elbow.
Here the problem with 60 yd. shots...less than 5% of the turkey hunter/gun/load/choke combinations will be consistent at this range. Way too many variables at this range.
I've just about been run off Facebook trying to explain this to the " I'm going to shoot something" crowd.
Turkey hunting is changing...and it's not for the betterment of the sport
As long as there are hunters and companies competing for there business, there will be no line drawn. To each his own. Im getting them in close. No rifle shots, no blinds, no decoys, no hunting over food plots. Its just not me, whatever everyone else does I don't care. Everyone has to choose their own set of ethics
Here we go again.............. :TrainWreck1:
I changed my game almost 20 years ago, and needing to have this ammo or that choke and all don't even get to play... don't make a difference for me and those that hunt with me. My game is under 20 yards (I love the in your face), It took some time for me to get there but once I learned how to play, where to and picking the "right" place to set and with a lot of scouting too. I/We consistently kill at this range and closer, like I said this is "my" game. At this range birds are just dead, I did need to put a scope on the gun and make sure I am Dead-On at 15 yards = Game Over :)
MK MGOBL
Why is it that everyone that comments here assumes that a person that uses tss don't play the game and call them in close. I assure you , for myself and several others I know that shoot tss is very effective at calling them in close and are well above average turkey hunters.
One word, Conscience ", that is all. Al Baker
Quote from: Spitten and drummen on March 27, 2018, 08:50:02 PM
Why is it that everyone that comments here assumes that a person that uses tss don't play the game and call them in close. I assure you , for myself and several others I know that shoot tss is very effective at calling them in close and are well above average turkey hunters.
It's assumed because the stuff isn't cheap and it's assumed that if your willing to spend the extra money, your going to push the product to it's limits given the chance. It's assumed because lead has been getting the job done for so many hunters under 40 yards for so long and TSS can do 40 yards and then some. It's like owning a Barnett 50 caliber and taking 100 yard shots when it has the potential to be taking 1000 yard shots and no one understands why it isn't being used to it's maximum potential when you could be using an everyday rifle to achieve similar results for what you are trying to achieve. I'm all for taking ethical shots and I think that it's great that you use TSS for 40 yards and less for a more guaranteed kill but many are going to push the limits because it costs so much more when you could use cheap lead all day with great success for your average shot.
Well said!
Quote from: Spitten and drummen on March 27, 2018, 08:50:02 PM
Why is it that everyone that comments here assumes that a person that uses tss don't play the game and call them in close. I assure you , for myself and several others I know that shoot tss is very effective at calling them in close and are well above average turkey hunters.
Same for me...I shoot TSS for the dense pattern. The fun of turkey hunting for me is the challenge of calling the gobbler up in my face. Based on so many comments I've read on Facebook turkey hunting pages, its becoming apparent that turkey hunting is becoming a pass shooting sport for many.
I draw the line at what I am willing to do to legally kill a bird.
As long as it's legal I do not draw your line for you, it's not my place to make your rules for you.
Seems like there's quite a few liberals on here in that they think you can believe however you want as long as it's how they believe and if it's different then you're a lazy slob and hopefully you'll get shot.
I'm fixing to start marketing 4x16 shotgun scopes...
Quote from: Premier Turkey Calls on March 27, 2018, 09:14:46 PM
Quote from: Spitten and drummen on March 27, 2018, 08:50:02 PM
Why is it that everyone that comments here assumes that a person that uses tss don't play the game and call them in close. I assure you , for myself and several others I know that shoot tss is very effective at calling them in close and are well above average turkey hunters.
It's assumed because the stuff isn't cheap and it's assumed that if your willing to spend the extra money, your going to push the product to it's limits given the chance. It's assumed because lead has been getting the job done for so many hunters under 40 yards for so long and TSS can do 40 yards and then some. It's like owning a Barnett 50 caliber and taking 100 yard shots when it has the potential to be taking 1000 yard shots and no one understands why it isn't being used to it's maximum potential when you could be using an everyday rifle to achieve similar results for what you are trying to achieve. I'm all for taking ethical shots and I think that it's great that you use TSS for 40 yards and less for a more guaranteed kill but many are going to push the limits because it costs so much more when you could use cheap lead all day with great success for your average shot.
Reminds me when compound bows came on the scene. People with recurves jumped on a high horse and said the same thing. Then crossbows came around and compound bow hunters looked down their noses. I am guilty of this also because I don't like crossbows and Dont Consider that bow hunting. Same could be said about decoys and blinds and reaping.
I've only killed one bird over 40, and that with a bow, most of my birds are shot inside 30 and when I exclusively bowhunted them for 8 or 9 seasons most were killed at 5 steps.
I really do not care how far a guy chooses to kill a bird as long as it's within the weapon of choices effective range and not just a hail marry. Why is forty yards so much more "pure" than fifty?
Kill how you like, decoys no decoys, tss, lead, steel a pellet rifle whatever, I have even stooped so low as to have bushwacked a few and OMG even stalked a few, sure calling them in hammering all the way is by far the best, but those birds are few and far between even for a guy who spends the better part of 2 months straight in the turkey woods on prime real estate!
I started loading tss last year simply to carry a light weight 20ga to the woods with the same confidence I had in a 3.5 inch 12, I enjoy loading them, they are not that much more money compared to the grand scheme of things, it's not like we are shooting doves and burning up 100 rounds a day, I think I shot 10 rounds last year total. 2 at the pattern board and 8 birds at an average distance of at an average of 24 yards estimated.
Quote from: Spitten and drummen on March 27, 2018, 09:43:25 PM
Quote from: Premier Turkey Calls on March 27, 2018, 09:14:46 PM
Quote from: Spitten and drummen on March 27, 2018, 08:50:02 PM
Why is it that everyone that comments here assumes that a person that uses tss don't play the game and call them in close. I assure you , for myself and several others I know that shoot tss is very effective at calling them in close and are well above average turkey hunters.
It's assumed because the stuff isn't cheap and it's assumed that if your willing to spend the extra money, your going to push the product to it's limits given the chance. It's assumed because lead has been getting the job done for so many hunters under 40 yards for so long and TSS can do 40 yards and then some. It's like owning a Barnett 50 caliber and taking 100 yard shots when it has the potential to be taking 1000 yard shots and no one understands why it isn't being used to it's maximum potential when you could be using an everyday rifle to achieve similar results for what you are trying to achieve. I'm all for taking ethical shots and I think that it's great that you use TSS for 40 yards and less for a more guaranteed kill but many are going to push the limits because it costs so much more when you could use cheap lead all day with great success for your average shot.
Reminds me when compound bows came on the scene. People with recurves jumped on a high horse and said the same thing. Then crossbows came around and compound bow hunters looked down their noses. I am guilty of this also because I don't like crossbows and Dont Consider that bow hunting. Same could be said about decoys and blinds and reaping.
Well said, very true
Not sure how guys using a decoy set worth 100s of dollars "to get them close" can complain about a guy using a $6 shell.
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Quote from: davisd9 on March 27, 2018, 09:49:29 PM
Not sure how guys using a decoy set worth 100s of dollars "to get them close" can complain about a guy using a $6 shell.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Thank you and well said.
Just a question as good for thought..........
How come the vast majority of states do NOT allow the use of #2 lead, but have not said a word about #7 TSS ?? Both appear to have nearly identical effective ranges on turkeys.
A whole lot more pellets in a 7 than in #2 lead making it actually more effective pattern wise. Also some was known back in the day to shoot deer with the number 2 while turkey hunting. Who knows. That's almost like asking why you can't shoot turkeys with 00 buckshot .
due to terrain, my average shot is 30 ft not 30 yds. I cant remember the last bird ive killed past 25 yds.
It's simply know your gun. Not all gun/choke/load combo's will produce a 60 consistant yard pattern. With that in mind there are those who put forth the effort to create such a combo, and to censor them and their knowledge of what it takes to get it done is no different than the left-wing media. Just because you don't like the way someone else is hunting doesn't make their way wrong. Couple of years ago it was fanning, before that it was blinds and decoys, now it's tss and legit 60 yard guns.
The biggest hurdle faced by the outdoor community today is internal division. Trad bowhunters don't like compounds, and all bowhunters don't like crossbows. Flintlock shooters say in-lines and scopes have no place during "their" season, now turkey hunting is becoming a segmented sport. All the while we're loosing casual hunters and thus loosing the segment of the population that makes the difference at the polls. Remember you'll never encounter 99.9% of those people who don't hunt like you when you are afield.
Quote from: Gooserbat on March 28, 2018, 02:58:42 AM
Just because you don't like the way someone else is hunting doesn't make there way wrong. Couple of years ago it was fanning, before that it was blinds and decoys, now it's tss and legit 60 yard guns.
The biggest hurdle faced by the outdoor community today is internal division. Trad bowhunters don't like compounds, and all bowhunters don't like crossbows. Flintlock shooters say in-lines and scopes have no plans during "their" season, now turkey hunting is becoming a segmented sport. All the while we're loosing casual hunters and thus loosing the segment of the population that makes the difference at the polls. Remember you'll never encounter 99.9% of those people who don't hunt like you when you are afield.
There's a lot of truth to this...
How one hunts should make NO difference to anyone as long done so legally and ethically.
It is your decision (freedom) to do so, some may choose an alternate method to "hunt" in a manner than what you or I do and I'm ok with that and really makes no difference to me.
Now when it comes to "opinions" and we ask it a lot here, I have some interest in that. All in a good read and I that's what I share as well, just my personal opinion nothing more nothing less...
MK M GOBL
I try to avoid these topics, but will throw in my 2 cents.
I hunt with a 20 gauge with Federal Heviweights, or Hevi-13's in #7 shot, and if I could get my hands on Federal TSS, I would hunt with it in a heartbeat.
I hunt over decoys in fields, but rarely use them in the woods.
If it's pouring out, I will hunt in a blind because it's still better than not being out there at all.
99% of my kills have been 30 yards and under with either lead #4, Hevi-13, or Federal Heviweights.
The common denominator with the exception of the yardage distance, is they are all legal.
I don't fan or reap not because it's immoral or illegal, but because I was taught to call them in to 40 and under or they win. I don't need to go home with a turkey over my shoulder to have a great day in the woods.
Last spring, Harrison and I called one over 600 yards right into Harrison's lap, and he pulled the trigger at about 20.
Nothing was more exciting than watching that bird commit to the call, and come in on a rope.
I feel if he had shot him way out at 50, it would've not been as satisfying to us.
However, that's the way I learned, and that's how I taught him.
I will not tell another person how to hunt. If it's legal, and it brings you joy and you are happy with how you harvest your bird, I'm happy for you, but don't judge me on my methods.
Quote from: Gooserbat on March 28, 2018, 02:58:42 AM
It's simply know your gun. Not all gun/choke/load combo's will produce a 60 consistant yard pattern. With that in mind there are those who put forth the effort to create such a combo, and to censor them and their knowledge of what it takes to get it done is no different than the left-wing media. Just because you don't like the way someone else is hunting doesn't make there way wrong. Couple of years ago it was fanning, before that it was blinds and decoys, now it's tss and legit 60 yard guns.
The biggest hurdle faced by the outdoor community today is internal division. Trad bowhunters don't like compounds, and all bowhunters don't like crossbows. Flintlock shooters say in-lines and scopes have no plans during "their" season, now turkey hunting is becoming a segmented sport. All the while we're loosing casual hunters and thus loosing the segment of the population that makes the difference at the polls. Remember you'll never encounter 99.9% of those people who don't hunt like you when you are afield.
. Yes sir my thoughts exactly. I appreciate your stance. I ordered 2 calls from ya and had no plans on doing so before reading this post.
"Together we stand, divided we fall". Good post Gosserbat :smiley-patriotic-flagwaver-an
I want to point our and should have pointed out that one of the other reasons I do not shoot further is my eyes simply suck, even with glasses so when I finally do get the chance for a turkey I will have to limit myself to this. Partially the same reason with bow but also because I believe they are more likely to jump the string (Deer) at longer distances. As far as shotgun with sabot and rifle go I am not a great shot so I limit myself more than most people would because I want to be fair to the animal. I do prefer to get something in close though, really gets the heart pumping!
As far as the united we stand divided we fall comment above I do agree with that and that is why I am going for my trapping license this year though I doubt I will ever do much trapping because of some physical issues. (Hard to work a trap when you can't kneel) I will also start buying the waterfowl stamp.
Quote from: Gamblinman on March 27, 2018, 08:13:16 PM
Here the problem with 60 yd. shots...less than 5% of the turkey hunter/gun/load/choke combinations will be consistent at this range. Way too many variables at this range.
I've just about been run off Facebook trying to explain this to the " I'm going to shoot something" crowd.
Turkey hunting is changing...and it's not for the betterment of the sport
I agree with you!! It seems like turkey hunting has become turkey "killing" vs "hunting. Too many hunters want that instant gratification picture on FB, instagram, or whatever social media they use and will take less than optimal shots at turkeys to get that hey look at me picture. Unfortunately, I don't see this situation improving.
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I will sum up my opinion and keep it short and sweet. It will be used poperly by the minority and abused by the majority.
Quote from: Gooserbat on March 28, 2018, 02:58:42 AM
Just because you don't like the way someone else is hunting doesn't make there way wrong. Couple of years ago it was fanning, before that it was blinds and decoys, now it's tss and legit 60 yard guns.
The biggest hurdle faced by the outdoor community today is internal division. Trad bowhunters don't like compounds, and all bowhunters don't like crossbows. Flintlock shooters say in-lines and scopes have no plans during "their" season, now turkey hunting is becoming a segmented sport. All the while we're loosing casual hunters and thus loosing the segment of the population that makes the difference at the polls. Remember you'll never encounter 99.9% of those people who don't hunt like you when you are afield.
What Gooserbat said is right on. There will always be differences of opinion and styles.
I have no problem with someone who knows what their gun will do with said load and can confidently kill the bird at 60yds. I do think people should be responsible enough not to just take "advertisement" at its word but pattern their gun. Know for sure what it will do.
Furthermore, if they want to use decoys and/or blinds have at it. I don't personally use them but I have several friends that do. I'm not about to tell them they're wrong because their opinion/style is different than mine.
I agree with Gooserbat's take.
Personally, I shoot Hevi shot because I want to see the leaves and brush shake after it passes through the far side of the gobbler I'm shooting at. I never had a problem killing turkeys with lead shot, but the patterns I get with Hevi are superior AND I get improved knockdown power with a size smaller shot. WIN/WIN! I know TSS outperforms Hevi shot, I just own too much Hevi to switch.
I know a guy who hunts turkeys about like he hunts doves...Opening Day and not much more. He doesn't bother to pattern his gun and will bum shells off whoever is hunting his property, so he doesn't have to spend any of his money. He's also wounded or lost more gobblers than anybody else I know. He doesn't care enough to get his mess together. That's also why I'm glad he gives up when the hunting gets more difficult. He has it leased to some other guys, so I don't hunt there much anymore and I'm glad to say he doesn't either.
Jim
Awesome post! I have never used Tss but probably will when I switch to a 20 gauge. Not trying to get personal but I don't give a dam what anyone thinks when I use decoys or take longer than normal shots. I have used blinds too. I participate in this forum to learn and share. How I hunt is only my bussiness so long as it is legal.
Disciplined.
I guess I may have a different view than others, I like them in close also but what I didnt like was people claiming 40+ yard shots with insufficient equipment and getting lucky and killing one out of who knows how many hail marry shots from lead and even hevishot, I know some hevi loads extended the range past 40, but with tss and yes I shoot tss it makes your gun capable for killing a turkey at 60 now with the right setup and that's fine with me, I haven't shot a long range turkey yet but if he hangs up at 60 my gun will do the job and I'm fine with that.
Quote from: appalachianassassin on March 28, 2018, 02:39:15 AM
due to terrain, my average shot is 30 ft not 30 yds. I cant remember the last bird ive killed past 25 yds.
Exactly! And thats what I love about turkey hunting the Missouri Ozarks. They are in your face before you get a shot opportunity.
I worry about making a clean shot on my standards.I don't need to worry about or set somebody else's standards.This same old played out topic gets re-hashed with bowhunters as well.I only police myself and not worry about being the county sheriff when it comes to hunting ethics.People will never change,live and hunt for yourself and enjoy the woods.
I am ok with whatever you set for your own limits and equipment as long as you have done your homework and know your effective range. Life is a collection of choices and this is just that a choice and it is each person's to make. I have no skin in your choices unless they unduly impose on me and cause me harm.
Just a thought on the use of the long range loads. They can be pretty good insurance. I like my birds 35 yards or less and shoot Remington nitros in #5 shot and 3" 12 gauge. I just can't swallow paying $4.00 -6.00 for a single shell when at my range I don't need it. Now enter a scenario I encountered last spring. I had a bird come in and started to flank me and go away. I looked and I figured the range at 40 yards and knew at 40 I was good, so I dropped the hammer on him. He popped up and was on his way directly away from me and making the distance greater with each step. My only option was to jump up and chase him. Well I lost that bird, my first loss in a very long time. I was mad, embarrassed and whatever emotion you can imagine. I went back and ranged it and to my surprise it was 52 yards..how could I have misjudged so badly! My buddy was all over me when I got back to the vehicle. He has lectured me for years to use the extended range shell even though I shoot bird close. I had no rebuttal. So it's still a good tool even if you shoot close, it can save some pretty sad feelings if you misjudge distance.
Quote from: eggshell on March 29, 2018, 08:37:02 AM
I am ok with whatever you set for your own limits and equipment as long as you have done your homework and know your effective range. Life is a collection of choices and this is just that a choice and it is each person's to make.
Well said.
Quote from: eggshell on March 29, 2018, 08:37:02 AM
I am ok with whatever you set for your own limits and equipment as long as you have done your homework and know your effective range. Life is a collection of choices; I have no skin in your choices unless they unduly impose on me and cause me harm...I went back and ranged it and to my surprise it was 52 yards..how could I have misjudged so badly! My buddy was all over me when I got back to the vehicle. He has lectured me for years to use the extended range shell even though I shoot bird close. I had no rebuttal. So it's still a good tool even if you shoot close, it can save some pretty sad feelings if you misjudge distance.
Another timely message from the Crippler family. I mean it is only a turkey. It is not like it is a Pitt Bull Dog or something.
Quote from: silvestris on March 29, 2018, 11:58:48 AM
Quote from: eggshell on March 29, 2018, 08:37:02 AM
I am ok with whatever you set for your own limits and equipment as long as you have done your homework and know your effective range. Life is a collection of choices; I have no skin in your choices unless they unduly impose on me and cause me harm...I went back and ranged it and to my surprise it was 52 yards..how could I have misjudged so badly! My buddy was all over me when I got back to the vehicle. He has lectured me for years to use the extended range shell even though I shoot bird close. I had no rebuttal. So it's still a good tool even if you shoot close, it can save some pretty sad feelings if you misjudge distance.
Another timely message from the Crippler family. I mean it is only a turkey. It is not like it is a Pitt Bull Dog or something.
Did you even read the rest of what he said or just want you wanted to read? He misjudged a distance. Most of us have been there. His point was he was using crap ammo which he knew was good at 40 but not beyond. He misjudged a shot and a bird got away. Sounds like he learned his lesson. With a better quality shell he may have had that extra insurance for a misjudged shot.
THIS is why I like over kill. If my gun was only putting 100 pellets in a 10" circle a 40 yards I'd limit myself to 30 yards unless I had ranged the area before a bird walked into it. The 100 pellets in a 10" circle is nice until you push beyond that limit with a misjudged shot.
I'm just glad I've spent my turkey hunting years being a turkey killer not a turkey hunter! Nothing beats the thrill of shooting a hung up 60yard bird so I can take some pics to send out to my expanse of friends on the internet for self gratitude and if I miss no big deal I just go back to the house and practice on my pit bull. Any turkey I have killed over 40yards was only for the satisfaction of killing something and to gain social prominence!!! I honestly I mean honestly wonder how many of the people who tell other turkey killers how wrong they are for doing something actually have the right to tell them! What are the standards? The amount of birds you've killed??? How long you've been doing it? Were you doing it back in the old days??? How close you get to them???? Do I gain hunting points for the numbers I've killed? Do I lose points because I've knowingly killed past 40? Do I gain points cause most were not in a blind. Do I loose points cause some were over decoys? Do I gain points because a few have been with a bow? Do I loose points because some were in a blind? Do I gain or loose points cause I don't hunt turkeys in the fall? I killed my first bird when I was 11yrs old by myself, I shot that bird and a few others with a Springfield single shot 20ga with a modified barrel and who knows what kind of shell. Since that time I have been a part of a very large number of turkey deaths, I'm not trying to brag but at some point it is no longer just about killing them but I will still today shoot a bird at whatever range the hunt calls for. There are some days I don't shoot. I'd say last year was a pretty typical year, I killled 2 birds and called in 3 others. I only got to hunt Missouri. I killed one bird that was very close and one that was not. You know what I did with the one that was not close? I ran my bare hands over his feathers and I thanked god for an awesome bird, the exact same way I did the other 4 that were shot under 30yards. I am going to let everyone know what makes you a turkey hunter..... Your MONEY! When you buy tags or land or take trips out of state or buy a new gun or a $60 box of shells you are a turkey hunter! Nothing you can do will benefit the wild turkey or wild turkey hunting more than that. As long as we spend our money the wild turkey will remain a resource, and until that resource is outweighed by something else we will remain turkey hunters. So thank you for all that ALL of you do for turkey hunting! Take someone out let them hear a turkey gobble maybe even shoot one then you will become as good of a turkey hunter as you could possibly ever become! Nothing you do,not how you choose to hunt, not how far you decide to shoot matters except the fact that you are out there doing it! I wish everyone luck out there. Stay Legal and Safe!
Quote from: POk3s on March 27, 2018, 05:52:43 PM
It's the same with everything kind of weaponry in hunting.
Bow sights that range the target for you and give you a luminated dot to aim with.
Guys building 600 yard muzzle loaders.
2000 yard hunting rifles.
It was only a matter of time before shotguns was part of the game too. I don't think we can do anything about it besides being true to yourself and hunt how you want and how you enjoy.
So true unfortunately. The hunt part of hunting has taken a back seat to shooting IMO.
As I read all this I wonder if anyone ever paces off their effective distance when they set up to call. It's easy and eliminates all the guess work. We all know the effective distance of our gun and ammo. All you have to do is pace off the farthest effective shot. If you know it's 40 yards, great! The jam a stick in the ground or lay a branch there. Do another one at 30 yards on the way back and try to wait for that shot. Do it in a couple directions if you want. Then back up your first shot with the heaviest size shot and load that's legal in case you have to shoot at one that's wounded and getting away.
Quote from: idgobble on March 29, 2018, 08:13:46 PM
As I read all this I wonder if anyone ever paces off their effective distance when they set up to call. It's easy and eliminates all the guess work. We all know the effective distance of our gun and ammo. All you have to do is pace off the farthest effective shot. If you know it's 40 yards, great! The jam a stick in the ground or lay a branch there. Do another one at 30 yards on the way back and try to wait for that shot. Do it in a couple directions if you want. Then back up your first shot with the heaviest size shot and load that's legal in case you have to shoot at one that's wounded and getting away.
Good suggestion: although I use a range finder to mark my distance and use decoys to mark distance in the hay field. I think misjudging distance is primarily due to anxiety and adrenaline and possible inexperience. As a bow hunter I learned very quickly how important it is judging distance. Dispite all the hype Turkey hunting remains a short range sport unless you use a rifle.
Quote from: idgobble on March 29, 2018, 08:13:46 PM
As I read all this I wonder if anyone ever paces off their effective distance when they set up to call. It's easy and eliminates all the guess work. We all know the effective distance of our gun and ammo. All you have to do is pace off the farthest effective shot. If you know it's 40 yards, great! The jam a stick in the ground or lay a branch there. Do another one at 30 yards on the way back and try to wait for that shot. Do it in a couple directions if you want. Then back up your first shot with the heaviest size shot and load that's legal in case you have to shoot at one that's wounded and getting away.
I have a string in my backpack with a rock tied to one end that I leave directly in front of blind and take the decoys to end of string which is 30 yards and set them up there. Not always easy to judge distance in the light let alone in the dark when I am normally setting up so this really helps.
If I am where I want to be then pacing off 40 yards is going to lead to a busted gobbler. It ain't that hard to learn to judge 40 yards and if you know your gun and load combination then you should be fine. Just cheat your shots well inside your max range. For example I patterned my gun at 40 yards and got 200 pellets in the ten. And then I checked at 50. This is not condoning 50 yard shots but I need to know these details. I had 100 pellets in the ten. So by limiting my shots to 40 and in I have a 10 yard lead way for error. Now as long as I stay at a self imposed 40 yard estimated shot I will be fine. But the thing to remember is that a typical pattern starts loosing pellet count rapidly past 40 yards (at least in my experience) just cause you have a great pattern at 40 doesn't mean it will be good at 60 or even 50 yards. We may not agree on "proper" range at which turkeys should be killed but I would hope we all want to make sure we do not go wounding turkeys. If you think it's pushing your guns limits it then it is to far.
Ima chime in and may get scolded but all of us and I mean everyone here who has turkey hunted has misjudged yardage's at one time or another, even the old timers with their non choke Remington 11-87 12 gauge's and their Winchester supreme #4s. I had one of the greatest turkey hunters in our area With me hunting with last year he missed a bird we worked for 2.5 hours he missed him at 11 yards. I've also seen folks get so tore up they miss or don't shoot. We all have missed, we all have misjudged, we all have spooked birds, we all have locked our keys in our car, we all have sinned. Everyone of us has made mistakes. Success comes by learning from our mistakes!
I last year without tss misjudged a bird it was an open field and as many 3D archery tournaments I have shot in I have learned it is completely different when you are sitting down at a tree looking out into an open field. I hear the saying well why didn't you use a range finder. Well I ain't got time for all that when the bird came out of the woods to my left and straight into the open field and presented a clean shot that I thought was closer then what it was, I shot and yes the bird was further then I wanted to shoot but it was a clean ethical kill with non tss shot.
So my line is where do I feel comfortable shooting? For me that is within 30 yards. However what does my hunting setup do past 30 yards? Why would anyone shoot a bird last 40 yards? If he's a bird you have hunted and hunted and hunted and he gives you 40.1 yds and that's it are you going to shoot? We are worried about a guy making a clean ethical kill on a bird at a misjudged distance but don't make a big deal out of the guy who shoots them off the limb! To me it is a little crazy, I do not recommend or condone shooting birds past 40 yards, however if we were all honest and not prideful and braggers and so macho we all can admit we have all messed up!
I say practice, know your setup, and make clean ethical kills. I think shooting birds at 50+ yards is crazy but I am honest and I have accidentally misjudged and did it! I am not proud of it, but it happened to me! All of my other birds have been within 17 yds, Lord willing I hope they stay within that range I rally prefer to shoot at 20-25 yards it's where my gun performs best. So I will shoot a bird before he comes in and flogs my decoys if he is a shooter.
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Quote from: BottomLand54 on March 29, 2018, 09:06:10 PM
Ima chime in and may get scolded but all of us and I mean everyone here who has turkey hunted has misjudged yardage's at one time or another, even the old timers with their non choke Remington 11-87 12 gauge's and their Winchester supreme #4s. I had one of the greatest turkey hunters in our area With me hunting with last year he missed a bird we worked for 2.5 hours he missed him at 11 yards. I've also seen folks get so tore up they miss or don't shoot. We all have missed, we all have misjudged, we all have spooked birds, we all have locked our keys in our car, we all have sinned. Everyone of us has made mistakes. Success comes by learning from our mistakes!
I last year without tss misjudged a bird it was an open field and as many 3D archery tournaments I have shot in I have learned it is completely different when you are sitting down at a tree looking out into an open field. I hear the saying well why didn't you use a range finder. Well I ain't got time for all that when the bird came out of the woods to my left and straight into the open field and presented a clean shot that I thought was closer then what it was, I shot and yes the bird was further then I wanted to shoot but it was a clean ethical kill with non tss shot.
So my line is where do I feel comfortable shooting? For me that is within 30 yards. However what does my hunting setup do past 30 yards? Why would anyone shoot a bird last 40 yards? If he's a bird you have hunted and hunted and hunted and he gives you 40.1 yds and that's it are you going to shoot? We are worried about a guy making a clean ethical kill on a bird at a misjudged distance but don't make a big deal out of the guy who shoots them off the limb! To me it is a little crazy, I do not recommend or condone shooting birds past 40 yards, however if we were all honest and not prideful and braggers and so macho we all can admit we have all messed up!
I say practice, know your setup, and make clean ethical kills. I think shooting birds at 50+ yards is crazy but I am honest and I have accidentally misjudged and did it! I am not proud of it, but it happened to me! All of my other birds have been within 17 yds, Lord willing I hope they stay within that range I rally prefer to shoot at 20-25 yards it's where my gun performs best. So I will shoot a bird before he comes in and flogs my decoys if he is a shooter.
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No scolding from me. While I may not agree with all of your post. I do agree with your statement "Success comes by learning from our mistakes!"
Silvestris,
I really should have known better than be honest on here. Yes I crippled a bird, no I'm not proud of it, but I imagine it's happened to most of us who have hunted a long time. This will only be my 46th season turkey hunting so I'm still a little green and make mistakes. I still don't blame the shell and I'll probably hunt with the junk again this year. To call me "The Cripple Family" is a bit presumptuous since you know nothing about me or my hunting skills and ethics. However, I know it's the internet and I shouldn't be surprised. I have seen a lot of your post and I think your most likely a very good turkey hunter and I apologize that my honesty upset you. I wish I could say I never crippled a turkey, but that just would not be true. If you'll take my word for it I assure you it is the exception and not the norm.
Quote from: eggshell on March 29, 2018, 09:57:25 PM
Silvestris,
I really should have known better than be honest on here. Yes I crippled a bird, no I'm not proud of it, but I imagine it's happened to most of us who have hunted a long time. This will only be my 46th season turkey hunting so I'm still a little green and make mistakes. I still don't blame the shell and I'll probably hunt with the junk again this year. To call me "The Cripple Family" is a bit presumptuous since you know nothing about me or my hunting skills and ethics. However, I know it's the internet and I shouldn't be surprised. I have seen a lot of your post and I think your most likely a very good turkey hunter and I apologize that my honesty upset you. I wish I could say I never crippled a turkey, but that just would not be true. If you'll take my word for it I assure you it is the exception and not the norm.
Good to hear some TRUTH, happens to all of us if you play this game long enough. You can mark me down too...
MK M GOBL
Quote from: eggshell on March 29, 2018, 09:57:25 PM
Silvestris,
I really should have known better than be honest on here. Yes I crippled a bird, no I'm not proud of it, but I imagine it's happened to most of us who have hunted a long time. This will only be my 46th season turkey hunting so I'm still a little green and make mistakes. I still don't blame the shell and I'll probably hunt with the junk again this year. To call me "The Cripple Family" is a bit presumptuous since you know nothing about me or my hunting skills and ethics. However, I know it's the internet and I shouldn't be surprised. I have seen a lot of your post and I think your most likely a very good turkey hunter and I apologize that my honesty upset you. I wish I could say I never crippled a turkey, but that just would not be true. If you'll take my word for it I assure you it is the exception and not the norm.
Nothing wrong with being honest: you learned and hopefully many of us learned from your experience. Sniping is uncalled for and counter productive.
I think the thing to remember is none of us is perfect. However if by being honest it helps prevent someone else from making the same mistake then it's a good thing. I have never met anyone that as hunted a lot and hasn't screwed up.
I've heard Bow hunters say they have never lost a deer, I say you ain't Bow hunted long enough! lost a rough 140-145 class deer shot at 16.5 yards in 2014. I still replay it in my mind year after year. I was hurt it would have been my biggest buck with a bow. Any sportsman doesn't go to the woods to say today ima cripple the animal I spend so much time and money pursuing!
We all have missed, we all have misjudged, and at some point we all have injured an animal we never anticipated to cripple. Hunt long enough and be honest we all have those stories that hurt us. It breaks my heart to ever injure one of God's animals he put here for us men, women, and children to hunt!
I think advertising the 70 yard tss shots to me is crazy, but to me hunting turkeys with a rifle sounds crazy. At the end of the day it's just in how we all handle the information we receive.
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I believe that the vast majority of guys shooting TSS are doing so in order to shoot what gives them the best chance to kill a turkey...not to extend how far they shoot. Or maybe to lighten they weight of the guns they tote through the woods.
Something that I don't agree with 100% with is the idea that we are all in the same boat and shouldn't judge how others choose to hunt. Steve Renilla once said "If we are all in the same boat and someone is shooting holes in the bottom of the boat shouldn't we throw him overboard?"
And just because something is legal doesn't always make it right. It's legal to screw your buddy's wife, doesn't make it right.
Just my opinion.