Has anyone figured out what gauge sheet metal is about equal to what it takes to penatrate a turkeys skull or neck bone with consideration of skin and feathers?
If so or if not what gauge sheet metal is most often used for testing penatration?
Thanks
all the gun, pattern and shot gurus on here and no body can reccomened what gauge sheet metal or material I need to buy for a penetration test?
hmmm
how can you really compare a turkeys anatomy to sheet metal accurately??
Wasn't this post already responded to who said TSS #8 has enough energy to kill a turkey at 102 yards?
All the views and only two responses HMMM!! wonder why ???
i do not believe there is anyway to compare sheet metal to a turkey. unless they are wearing armore .
using most turkey loads including lead you will have enough penatration to kill futher than your pattern will hold up
I seen one last week with a sheet metal suit! :TooFunny:
Quote from: Dwnforce on April 11, 2011, 09:51:40 PM
I seen one last week with a sheet metal suit! :TooFunny:
:TooFunny: :TooFunny: :TooFunny: :TooFunny: :TooFunny: :TooFunny: :TooFunny:.
The idea that you've presented along with bashing the vast knowledge of the site because they don't know the thickness of sheet metal that will be the minimum standard to kill a turkey... :bike2:
Quote from: Dwnforce on April 11, 2011, 09:51:40 PM
I seen one last week with a sheet metal suit! :TooFunny:
hey i think we saw the same bird!!!!! :bike2:
Quote from: VAHUNTER on April 11, 2011, 09:46:43 PM
i do not believe there is anyway to compare sheet metal to a turkey. unless they are wearing armore .
using most turkey loads including lead you will have enough penatration to kill futher than your pattern will hold up
Yeppers!
I started to say the same thing this morning when I saw this, but I thought someone may have done some testing the hardness of turkey heads to sheet metal and had a conversion formula. :lol:
don't know about sheet metal but i believe it has been said on here before that they need to penetrate 1.5'' of gelatin to be lethal on a turkey an whatever range.
Quote from: gobbler336 on April 11, 2011, 10:46:20 PM
don't know about sheet metal but i believe it has been said on here before that they need to penetrate 1.5'' of gelatin to be lethal on a turkey an whatever range.
That's what some have said but if that's correct Hevi 7's will run out of range at 36.5 yards, or something like that. I am one that believes pattern density is as important as penetration. I'm not a math major but I have killed my fair share of birds.
Find any road sign in the country and try it out on it. From what I have seen over the years everyone sights in on road signs.
I'd recommend that you try some microcrystalline wax. It's very stable and reusable. I've used it for penetration studies and it works very well.
There is even a formula to convert penetration from the wax to ballistic gelatin so you can compare the two.
Thanks,
Clark
The last 3 posts on here is what type of info I was looking for. the above ones make me laugh.
I dont care one way or another but have some guns I would like to shoot hevi out of.
I have a personal and may add historical limit of 40 yds. I feel I have not done my job as a hunter with birds that hang up or walk by over that. Yes I know that is my personal limit.
Again I am suprised that there is no data for the hardness of turkey bones and or the force it takes to break it.
I figured with all the data floating around on the web there would have been some avaible. I explained it better and got a better answer on the handload section.
I wish you all
500 pellets in a 12 inch circle at 70 yds 15 years from now.
thanks for the info and sorry for the "bashing"
I created a chart for individual foot pounds of energy for pellets of lead, hevi, hevi13, and even heavyweight shot if anyone is interested. It is calculated with most commonly shot velocities and using the formula
1/2mass times velocity squared. Converted from joules to foot pounds of energy. Of course it pertains to muzzle energy, but very interesting.
Quote from: K9-Doc on April 13, 2011, 11:15:39 PM
I created a chart for individual foot pounds of energy for pellets of lead, hevi, hevi13, and even heavyweight shot if anyone is interested. It is calculated with most commonly shot velocities and using the formula
1/2mass times velocity squared. Converted from joules to foot pounds of energy. Of course it pertains to muzzle energy, but very interesting.
have that too, in an excel file. Common materials in all sizes at various velocities.
Quote from: Dwnforce on April 11, 2011, 09:51:40 PM
I seen one last week with a sheet metal suit! :TooFunny:
:TooFunny: :TooFunny: :TooFunny:
I know! LOL
All yalls turkeys are made of paper and have ten inch heads that move to the dense part of the pattern after the shot. LOL
What the heck was I thinking? I must be a complete fool to want to shoot something harder and thicker than paper. Dang me
Quote from: Spuriosity on April 14, 2011, 09:31:26 AM
Neckringer, if you truly limit yourself to 40 yd shots, I don't see why you don't just shoot lead 6s. With a 12 ga at least, it is easy to find a load and choke that will kill 100% of the turkeys 100% of the time at 40 yds as long as you shoot straight.
well said
Quote from: Spuriosity on April 14, 2011, 09:31:26 AM
Neckringer, if you truly limit yourself to 40 yd shots, I don't see why you don't just shoot lead 6s. With a 12 ga at least, it is easy to find a load and choke that will kill 100% of the turkeys 100% of the time at 40 yds as long as you shoot straight.
Exactly!
Sheet metal tells me nothing when shooting turkeys. Obviously if your shot is going through sheet metal at 40yds that it will easily kill a turkey at 40yds if the pattern density is there and you hit him of course in the head and neck. I've said this before and I will say it again. Gelatin mass experts say 1.5" of penetration is needed at 40yds from your shot. Well I say that is hogwash. They also say that Hevi-Shot #7' won't cleanly kill a turkey at 50yds and that you will wound some. Well if you got a gun and choke that will give you the 100 shot density in a 10" with them and you center that pattern over the neck and vertebrae of a bird at 50yds he is going to die. So the ballistic statiscians are lying to you and need to spend more time shooting turkeys instead of spreading rumors.
PS I don't care what hevi-shot #7's will do to sheet metal at 40yds by the way. I just know that it will blow plum through the head and neck of a gobbler at 45yds.
Before the crash I think it was ? that had a very long post comparing many different types of shot and sizes of TSS, Hevi and lead into sheet metal and what percentage of hits passed through etc. It was well recieved and had many replies, no one was questioning why he did it, I thought it was pretty cool.
Quote from: K9-Doc on April 13, 2011, 11:15:39 PM
I created a chart for individual foot pounds of energy for pellets of lead, hevi, hevi13, and even heavyweight shot if anyone is interested. It is calculated with most commonly shot velocities and using the formula
1/2mass times velocity squared. Converted from joules to foot pounds of energy. Of course it pertains to muzzle energy, but very interesting.
My brain hurts just thinking of this. My formula is: load shell in gun + point at turkeys head x squeeze trigger = turkey dinner.
QuoteMy formula is: load shell in gun + point at turkeys head x squeeze trigger = turkey dinner.
That's a good formula. Thanks for the info.
Reloader
Quote from: Reloader on April 14, 2011, 01:45:27 PM
QuoteMy formula is: load shell in gun + point at turkeys head x squeeze trigger = turkey dinner.
That's a good formula. Thanks for the info.
Reloader
We all learn great things from this site :icon_thumright:
hey ask the mythbusters
Quote from: jokasr07 on April 15, 2011, 01:02:41 PM
hey ask the mythbusters
Now we are cooking with fire :icon_thumright:
Quote from: NECKRINGER on April 13, 2011, 10:42:10 PM
I am suprised that there is no data for the hardness of turkey bones and or the force it takes to break it.
I figured with all the data floating around on the web there would have been some avaible.
Dave, pm Oth. His buddy Tom has all the info on this subject you could ever want, and more.
Quote from: NECKRINGER on April 14, 2011, 09:10:27 AM
I must be a complete fool
You've convinced me over the years,