Ok. Here's a topic to pass the time. Looking back on past hunts, how many of you that use htl shot (hevi shot, heavy weight, ect) feel that it truly made a differance in your success? I use hevi shot and have no intentions of changing, but most of my birds could easily have been killed with regular high brass loads. Heck, a lot could have been killed with dove loads! How about you guys?
I have been shooting Magnum Blend because of good rebates. I also like #5 lead shot. I shoot at 30 - 35 yards so both kill'm dead. I don't wait for Tom to attack my decoy because something might spook him and I'll miss an opportunity. Only birds I have missed are a couple that got too close and my pattern was too tight.
I think it has made a difference in several of my hunts. I travel somewhere every spring and usually don't have the advantage of knowing the terrain real well. Having absolute confidence in a full 40 yard shot is important to me.
I went to HTL early in my turkey hunting for the better patterns. I'm set up for it now don't want to buy new chokes to try Longbeards or another lead load. I'll stick with what I have confidence in and know works for me.
I'd agree, but I have noticed "how dead" they are when I pull the trigger. Since I switched to hevi I've rarely had them flop. Here's a near example, they are about 20 yards, bird on the left killed with lead, bird on the right hevi shot.
https://youtu.be/NF7gdr8oBIk
Had two toms that required follow up shots at 40 yards with my old federal #6 loads. I may have pulled the shot some so I am not going to blame the shells. However since switching to HTL I have never needed a follow up shot.
I'll be honest. I switched to fed HW then tss and I have no intention of going back. I can do with my 20 GA what I did with a 3.5" 12 GA and lead so yes I believe it has been a benefit. I don't think made me a better hunter but it certainly has made things a little easier.
With the 20 gauge hevi or heavyweight , use the latter now, it does make a difference in my opinion . Sure a lot of birds could have been killed using lead and even low brass.
But a lot of them killed isn't what we want . When we decide to shoot we want all of them killed DRT.
Also I think getting away from a 3 1/2 " 12 is a good thing . Some can't use one and some don't care to anymore. A 20 with htl allows that and with a 12 you just get a lot more gun with the htl loads without all the hassles and the problems associated with the new technology lead loads.
In reality I keep my shots at reasonable distances by making sure I set up where a turkey is at or inside the 40 yard mark. That being said I hunted with hevi 13 for about 7 years but the more I thought about these turkeys were not anymore dead then they were with lead loads so I didn't see the need for the added cost so I went back to lead. I never noticed them flopping any less than they did with lead. Completely a personal choice for me.
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I've killed a few with HTL that I wouldn't have shot at using lead. Started using TSS last year and definitely killed a couple I'd have to pass on using lead. Ever since I start chasing numbers I take shots I'd have passed on years ago. Got confidence in my rigs that I didn't have before using lead.
When I consider what I spend to hunt each spring with everything I do, a 5-8 $ she'll is pretty cheap for me. I'm not saying that anything is guaranteed, but I have absolute confidence in hw 7 after using it for 2 years in the 20. It's enabled me to carry a little bitty light weight head smasher that is all business. So for me, yeah it's made a difference, besides just killing authority.
I like swarms of small shot lol
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I will never go back to lead unless I have no other choice. I spend way to much time from my family and too much money on other portions of the hunt to skim on the most important thing on the hunt. I believe in being prepared for the worst situations and not just the ideal situations. I have no problem with anyone that shoots lead, but I will stick with HTL.
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As a guy that's killed most of his birds with a rifle (again, most within shotgun range) I can't comment much on the use of lead turkey loads. I've shot several birds with a shotgun and all have been with HTL loads. No complaints. I'd not complain about the patterns that the Winchester LB's were throwing either. For the ranges I've killed birds with shotguns, one is just as good as the other. Having said that, I load TSS so you see where I stand amongst the two.
After using my 20 gauge for the first time this season and killing birds with the federal Hw 7 , i'm thinking i may want to try them in my 12 gauge. In the past i've always shot federal 12, 3in. 2 oz. number 5 shot and the 2 oz. number 6 federal.. i still have a lot of these in stock , but i'm still thinking on trying the 12, ga, federal Hw...federal HW are great shells...
The difference between flop and no flop.
Gman
Quote from: Gamblinman on August 16, 2016, 12:41:13 PM
The difference between flop and no flop.
Gman
The "flop" is a nerve thing. You can shoot deer in the head and watch them flop all over the place and that's shutting the CNS down right now. You can shoot them with lead or HTL and still get the same reaction. All of the birds I've killed with a shotgun (save but one that I just recalled while typing this) have flopped with the exception of one. Again, I've not shot many with a shotgun but the ones I have have all done the dead turkey flop except one.
Quote from: wvmntnhick on August 16, 2016, 02:32:09 PM
Quote from: Gamblinman on August 16, 2016, 12:41:13 PM
The difference between flop and no flop.
Gman
The "flop" is a nerve thing. You can shoot deer in the head and watch them flop all over the place and that's shutting the CNS down right now. You can shoot them with lead or HTL and still get the same reaction. All of the birds I've killed with a shotgun (save but one that I just recalled while typing this) have flopped with the exception of one. Again, I've not shot many with a shotgun but the ones I have have all done the dead turkey flop except one.
x2
Ya Cant Stop the Flop !!!
As stated earlier... Lead does the job, but the HTL shot gives you some margin for error... It certainly will kill birds more consistently a bit further, and turns an "iffy" 40 yard shot with lead into a consistent killer with HTL...
The only disadvantage I see with the denser shot is less margin for error at closer ranges, cause it does hold a tighter pattern.
As much as I spend in gas per trip, and all the other things that go along with hunting, that little bit extra per shell seems worth it to me... I shoot 3 shells on a good year, so a box of ten will last me at least 3 years... Cost me about $35 in gas each trip to go hunting, so spending an extra $3 for that one shot is not very much in the scheme of things (and that is only if I get a shot).
And, in a couple years, it will be illegal for me to shoot lead at turkeys anyways, so switching over is a no-brainer for me.
Quote from: Marc on August 16, 2016, 05:46:40 PM
As stated earlier... Lead does the job, but the HTL shot gives you some margin for error... It certainly will kill birds more consistently a bit further, and turns an "iffy" 40 yard shot with lead into a consistent killer with HTL...
The only disadvantage I see with the denser shot is less margin for error at closer ranges, cause it does hold a tighter pattern.
As much as I spend in gas per trip, and all the other things that go along with hunting, that little bit extra per shell seems worth it to me... I shoot 3 shells on a good year, so a box of ten will last me at least 3 years... Cost me about $35 in gas each trip to go hunting, so spending an extra $3 for that one shot is not very much in the scheme of things (and that is only if I get a shot).
And, in a couple years, it will be illegal for me to shoot lead at turkeys anyways, so switching over is a no-brainer for me.
Where do you hunt that they're making lead illegal for turkey hunting? just curious.
Quote from: wvmntnhick on August 16, 2016, 05:53:24 PM
Where do you hunt that they're making lead illegal for turkey hunting? just curious.
California...
By 2019, it will be illegal to shoot any lead projectiles at any type of game (bullets, shotguns, pellets, etc.)
It is widely thought that many other states will soon follow.
Quote from: Marc on August 16, 2016, 09:48:50 PM
Quote from: wvmntnhick on August 16, 2016, 05:53:24 PM
Where do you hunt that they're making lead illegal for turkey hunting? just curious.
California...
By 2019, it will be illegal to shoot any lead projectiles at any type of game (bullets, shotguns, pellets, etc.)
It is widely thought that many other states will soon follow.
well at least you have good loads from hevi ,heavyweight or loading tss and the copper bullets for larger game. Does stink you have to spend the extra bucks to hunt if you chose not to though.
Quote from: owlhoot on August 16, 2016, 10:16:35 PM
well at least you have good loads from hevi ,heavyweight or loading tss and the copper bullets for larger game. Does stink you have to spend the extra bucks to hunt if you chose not to though.
Laws just passed this year that make it illegal to purchase or carry on you more than 50 rounds of ammunition, and mail-ordering ammunition will also be illegal (as of January 1st of next year).
Oddly, outside of LA and Frisco, California is largely agricultural, with a majority of people being conservative... Those two big towns control the politics of California, and more and more of the people actually paying taxes (rather than living off the taxes of others) are leaving...
If these laws (which have passed) actually go through, it could be real bad news for other parts of the country as well.
I've kept very detailed records of every hunt, both deer and turkey, since 1985. I know of 2 specific hunts that HW 7's in my 20 ga. helped tremendously in taking 2 nice toms. The other truck load of birds killed since then could have been killed with dove loads to be perfectly honest about it.
Quote from: Marc on August 16, 2016, 10:50:31 PM
Quote from: owlhoot on August 16, 2016, 10:16:35 PM
well at least you have good loads from hevi ,heavyweight or loading tss and the copper bullets for larger game. Does stink you have to spend the extra bucks to hunt if you chose not to though.
Laws just passed this year that make it illegal to purchase or carry on you more than 50 rounds of ammunition, and mail-ordering ammunition will also be illegal (as of January 1st of next year).
Oddly, outside of LA and Frisco, California is largely agricultural, with a majority of people being conservative... Those two big towns control the politics of California, and more and more of the people actually paying taxes (rather than living off the taxes of others) are leaving...
If these laws (which have passed) actually go through, it could be real bad news for other parts of the country as well.
Not too many states seem to follow the way-out-side the box California...
To me its not about the 99% that would have still been stone dead with a cheaper lead shell, it's that 1% when you're glad its the first shell coming out of the gun every time. These improved loads have allowed me to use a 20ga as effectively as a 12
I could probably kill lots of birds by just carrying a single call to the woods but im not gonna start doing that either lol.
Its not that much money honestly, gas costs me more in turkey season.
Quote from: M Sharpe on August 17, 2016, 12:45:25 PM
Quote from: Marc on August 16, 2016, 10:50:31 PM
Quote from: owlhoot on August 16, 2016, 10:16:35 PM
well at least you have good loads from hevi ,heavyweight or loading tss and the copper bullets for larger game. Does stink you have to spend the extra bucks to hunt if you chose not to though.
Laws just passed this year that make it illegal to purchase or carry on you more than 50 rounds of ammunition, and mail-ordering ammunition will also be illegal (as of January 1st of next year).
Oddly, outside of LA and Frisco, California is largely agricultural, with a majority of people being conservative... Those two big towns control the politics of California, and more and more of the people actually paying taxes (rather than living off the taxes of others) are leaving...
If these laws (which have passed) actually go through, it could be real bad news for other parts of the country as well.
Not too many states seem to follow the way-out-side the box California...
I don't know about all that... Looks like this country is getting ready to elect Hilary Clinton... Who adamantly supports more gun regulation (including the elimination of all hand-guns)... Her anti-gun stance is one of her top political agenda's on her platform, and I would guess she will gain enough support to beat out Trump for the presidency....
If Trump somehow does miraculously get elected, I would guess we have a good chance of getting some of the new California gun reform laws reversed... If Clinton gets elected, I would guess we will be stuck with them, and and least some other states will follow suit.
Sorry for the O.T, but it is worth some consideration...