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Turkey Guns & Shooting => Turkey Guns => Topic started by: Borden811 on March 10, 2016, 12:40:43 PM

Title: Short barreled m2, what now?
Post by: Borden811 on March 10, 2016, 12:40:43 PM
So, over the past 2 days, I've burned through roughly 70-80 rounds of 3" #4 Longbeards 3" and magnum blends in my m2 with a 21" barrel. I tried 7 different chokes, all at a lasered 40 yards. I'll post the 3 shot average numbers of the choke/shell combos below that performed best(either clean or dirty) since posting pics, and every pattern number would be labor intensive. The barrel was deep cleaned prior to shooting, and the chokes were tested both with a clean and dirty barrel. Weather was between 60-70 degrees, with a slight breeze both days.

Longbeard 3" #4:

Indian Creek .665  126

Sumtoy .650   115

Wrights no. 3  104

Kicks GT .655   102

Pure Gold .670   100

Jellyhead .660   93

Hevi 13 Dead Coyote  90




Hevi 13 3" Magnum Blend

Sumtoy .650   156

Indian Creek .665   145

Hevi 13 Dead Coyote   142

Wrights no.3   120

Pure Gold .670  118

Jellyhead .660   117

Kicks GT .655   79

The LB #4s out if the I.C. I can live with, as 130+ was my goal. However, I'm pretty duds appointed with the Mag Blends. I've got a Rob Roberts Final Strut .655 on the way to try. Any other suggestions? Especially for the mag blends?

Title: Re: Short barreled m2, what now?
Post by: Longshanks on March 10, 2016, 12:54:46 PM
Shoot Indian Creek .665 and try Hevi 13 7's as well.
Title: Re: Short barreled m2, what now?
Post by: Borden811 on March 10, 2016, 01:15:12 PM
I did shoot the I.C. .655. I have a large supply of both the mag blends and the LB #4s, so those are what I'm working with. Need to find a choke that will put up decent numbers with the mag blends, and would like to pick up about 15-20 more pellets withe 4s.
Title: Re: Short barreled m2, what now?
Post by: dirt road ninja on March 10, 2016, 01:59:43 PM
Looking at all your numbers along with the number of chokes you've tried. I'm going to say you are probably looking at about the best she is going to do with the ammo you are using regardless of what choke is in there. Some barrels just won't throw up big numbers. Your shoulder must be about ready to fall off.
Title: Re: Short barreled m2, what now?
Post by: the Ward on March 10, 2016, 02:20:01 PM
Borden, the best #s with the magblend 3" shells I got was with the Sumtoy .650 in my Vinci, but it has a 28" barrel. Did around 200-220s with it. I also have a Rob Roberts .655 I also tried, it did around the 160s to 170s range. I also tried a couple of the Longbeard 4s out of a Kicks .665 and if I remember right it turned #s in the  120 range, but the patterns were not very even, which i thought was odd as that choke puts up very even patterns with other shells I have run thru it but it has never put up as big #s as my other chokes. Haven't tried those shells in my other chokes though. Could it be the lot #s of the shells maybe? 
Title: Re: Short barreled m2, what now?
Post by: mrclif on March 10, 2016, 03:00:16 PM
Been having issues with short barrel benelli's myself. Ive shot probably 20 different choke combos with tss and long beards. Best patterns have come with factory full flush choke with LB's and TSS. Not getting the numbers I was getting with longer barrel Benelli's but I'm experimenting with loads to try to bring numbers up but looking like its gonna be a summer project. I'm shooting a 18.5" vinci and my buds shooting a 18.5" m2 both will kill turkeys but pellet count in the 10" is less than normally expect. I was 4 for 4 with the vinci lastyear jus tryn to improve if possible.
Title: Short barreled m2, what now?
Post by: BrowningGuy88 on March 10, 2016, 03:05:19 PM
I'm struggling with numbers right now in a 18.5" pump myself. I think it is just difficult with short barrels sometimes. You can kill turkeys with those numbers though...


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Title: Re: Short barreled m2, what now?
Post by: Borden811 on March 10, 2016, 03:06:30 PM
Thanks for the info guys. I have a SBE II that's shoots great with a variety of those chokes I tried in the m2, and several different loads. It has a 26" barrel. Always wanted a short light gun, and now I have it. Just need to find the magic combo! I was aware of different lot #s with the Hevi 13#7 shells. Didn't know if the mag blends had the same issues or not. Anyone know? I have 2 cases of them, all the same lot #s.
Title: Re: Short barreled m2, what now?
Post by: mrclif on March 10, 2016, 03:18:48 PM
It totally shocks me how well factory full does in mine honesty suggest you try in yours. The long beard #5 did great at 40, TSS 1oz of 9 and 1oz of 8s is around 250 in the 10 but has a solid 20 with factory choke also. Plenty to kill a turkey just use to better numbers with tss.
Title: Re: Short barreled m2, what now?
Post by: Swather on March 10, 2016, 03:36:39 PM
Those heavier loads may not be the best option in that gun.

It is cheaper to try alternate ammo than alternate chokes.  You might try shooting some Winchester Double X loads (successor to Supreme) or some Super X.  The point would be to see if plated lead shoots better.

After that, you might consider sending the gun off to get the cones lengthened, the barrel over/back bored, and see what a choke maker like Roberts, SumToy, etc. can do with it.

Or skip the gunsmith work and acquire a different gun.

I know more than one guy that started off with a Benelli, was dissatisfied, sold, downscaled, and now carries a Rem 870 or Mossy pump and throws a better pattern. 
Title: Re: Short barreled m2, what now?
Post by: Borden811 on March 10, 2016, 04:17:47 PM
It's not going anywhere. And I doubt I'll be getting any gunsmith work done to it. I have 3 benellis, and have set up/patterned 6 more for friends. They all shoot excellent, and all have either 24 or 26 inch barrels. This is the first one I've had trouble with. I'm assuming it's the shorter barrel that causing me a bit if trouble. Cost isn't a big factor, shooting guns and figuring out what makes them shoot the best is almost as much fun as killing turkeys with them. I'll eventually run across a combo that gets me what I want. I might grab a couple boxes of longbeard 5s, just to see what they do.
Title: Re: Short barreled m2, what now?
Post by: owlhoot on March 10, 2016, 04:43:22 PM
have you tried the standard hevi- tube ? Not the coyote one.
3" magblends in the 200's with old sbe, 26" barrel though.
Short 21" barrel 870's like them too.
Title: Re: Short barreled m2, what now?
Post by: allaboutshooting on March 10, 2016, 06:37:00 PM
Quote from: Borden811 on March 10, 2016, 12:40:43 PM
So, over the past 2 days, I've burned through roughly 70-80 rounds of 3" #4 Longbeards 3" and magnum blends in my m2 with a 21" barrel. I tried 7 different chokes, all at a lasered 40 yards. I'll post the 3 shot average numbers of the choke/shell combos below that performed best(either clean or dirty) since posting pics, and every pattern number would be labor intensive. The barrel was deep cleaned prior to shooting, and the chokes were tested both with a clean and dirty barrel. Weather was between 60-70 degrees, with a slight breeze both days.

Longbeard 3" #4:

Indian Creek .665  126

Sumtoy .650   115

Wrights no. 3  104

Kicks GT .655   102

Pure Gold .670   100

Jellyhead .660   93

Hevi 13 Dead Coyote  90




Hevi 13 3" Magnum Blend

Sumtoy .650   156

Indian Creek .665   145

Hevi 13 Dead Coyote   142

Wrights no.3   120

Pure Gold .670  118

Jellyhead .660   117

Kicks GT .655   79

The LB #4s out if the I.C. I can live with, as 130+ was my goal. However, I'm pretty duds appointed with the Mag Blends. I've got a Rob Roberts Final Strut .655 on the way to try. Any other suggestions? Especially for the mag blends?

That's some very good work. As one who does that on almost a daily basis, I really appreciate all that you've done.

I'd be very interested in the "quality" of the patterns with those shells and chokes. I measure quality by looking at the number of 2" gaps in a 10" circle at 40 yards.

If you can find one, I'd really recommend that you try a Bone Collector choke with that gun. It was one of the most neglected chokes, as far as marketing, in the last 20 years. The folks who have them don't often let them go but you may be able to find one.

Thanks,
Clark
Title: Re: Short barreled m2, what now?
Post by: Borden811 on March 10, 2016, 08:07:49 PM
Clark,

I'll put a few pics up tomorrow. There weren't a lot of gaps, but there were some areas with clusters of a lot of pellets together. Still had good coverage though for the most part. Found a truglo bone collector choke on eBay, it's on the way!
Title: Re: Short barreled m2, what now?
Post by: allaboutshooting on March 10, 2016, 08:13:48 PM
Quote from: Borden811 on March 10, 2016, 08:07:49 PM
Clark,

I'll put a few pics up tomorrow. There weren't a lot of gaps, but there were some areas with clusters of a lot of pellets together. Still had good coverage though for the most part. Found a truglo bone collector choke on eBay, it's on the way!
Congratulations! They are the "collector's items" of the next few years.

Thanks,
Clark
Title: Re: Short barreled m2, what now?
Post by: owlhoot on March 10, 2016, 08:26:04 PM
Quote from: allaboutshooting on March 10, 2016, 08:13:48 PM
Quote from: Borden811 on March 10, 2016, 08:07:49 PM
Clark,

I'll put a few pics up tomorrow. There weren't a lot of gaps, but there were some areas with clusters of a lot of pellets together. Still had good coverage though for the most part. Found a truglo bone collector choke on eBay, it's on the way!
Congratulations! They are the "collector's items" of the next few years.

Thanks,
Clark
Would that be the same chokes you sell on your sight, ClarK?? :)
Title: Re: Short barreled m2, what now?
Post by: Borden811 on March 13, 2016, 11:15:57 AM
Here are a couple pics. First one is the Indian Creek with the 3" 4s, second one is the sumtoy with the mag blends. Both are more then huntable, but I'd like to do better :)

(http://i444.photobucket.com/albums/qq164/borden811/image_zpsqhxov5ts.jpeg) (http://s444.photobucket.com/user/borden811/media/image_zpsqhxov5ts.jpeg.html)

(http://i444.photobucket.com/albums/qq164/borden811/image_zps2dft5t4k.jpeg) (http://s444.photobucket.com/user/borden811/media/image_zps2dft5t4k.jpeg.html)
Title: Re: Short barreled m2, what now?
Post by: catclr on March 13, 2016, 01:21:37 PM
Quote from: Borden811 on March 13, 2016, 11:15:57 AM
Here are a couple pics. First one is the Indian Creek with the 3" 4s, second one is the sumtoy with the mag blends. Both are more then huntable, but I'd like to do better :)

(http://i444.photobucket.com/albums/qq164/borden811/image_zpsqhxov5ts.jpeg) (http://s444.photobucket.com/user/borden811/media/image_zpsqhxov5ts.jpeg.html)

(http://i444.photobucket.com/albums/qq164/borden811/image_zps2dft5t4k.jpeg) (http://s444.photobucket.com/user/borden811/media/image_zps2dft5t4k.jpeg.html)


I would try some shells using #5 or #6 shot.  Not sure why your using #4 for head shot. That's more for body shots. I shot the LB with Sumtoy out of Nova and does 25-30 head-neck kill area.
Title: Re: Short barreled m2, what now?
Post by: allaboutshooting on March 13, 2016, 01:34:14 PM
I see what you mean about the patterns. They look irregular but I don't see what appear to be 2" gaps in them. I think the "secret" will the choke that has a long parallel section and no internal wad stoppers. I'll be interested to see how that BC choke you found on ebay works for you.

I'd make sure that choke is very clean for your first shot with it and then I would not clean it between shots. I'd also "deep clean" bore of your M2 prior to the patterning session. My collection of Benellis are all different in what they like.

Thanks,
Clark
Title: Re: Short barreled m2, what now?
Post by: Borden811 on March 13, 2016, 02:46:31 PM
I don't know a single person that uses 4s for body shots, or for that matter would even take a body shot on a turkey. I'm using them because I like the energy they carry, ave because i have a large quantity of them on hand. Also, the mag blends have 5, 6, and 7 shot in them. My SBE II will easily put 25-30 #4s in the head and neck of a gobbler target, but it has a 26" barrel and shoots 3.5 inch shells. Clark, when the BC coke and the RR choke get here I'll test them both and report back.
Title: Re: Short barreled m2, what now?
Post by: lunghit on March 13, 2016, 03:50:47 PM
Quote from: allaboutshooting on March 13, 2016, 01:34:14 PM
I see what you mean about the patterns. They look irregular but I don't see what appear to be 2" gaps in them. I think the "secret" will the choke that has a long parallel section and no internal wad stoppers. I'll be interested to see how that BC choke you found on ebay works for you.

I'd make sure that choke is very clean for your first shot with it and then I would not clean it between shots. I'd also "deep clean" bore of your M2 prior to the patterning session. My collection of Benellis are all different in what they like.

Thanks,
Clark
Clark you don't clean between shots? I always did but if there is no benefit I will skip that part of the process.
Title: Re: Short barreled m2, what now?
Post by: SumToy on March 13, 2016, 04:37:24 PM
with our 650 you need 6's or hv13 7's  the mags work but I have never been one to put them on paper.   Now if you want 4s we need to goo 660 to 665
Title: Re: Short barreled m2, what now?
Post by: Borden811 on March 13, 2016, 04:55:29 PM
William,
I used the .650 Sumtoy I got from you in my SBE II last year with the Longbeard 4s, 5s, and 6s. It shot great patterns with all three loads. I was hoping for the same with this m2 and the 4s. I'll post a link to those patterns below. What numbers do you think I could realistically expect out of a 21" barreled m2 with the 3" Longbeard 4s at 40 yards and one of your chokes in the 660-665 range?
Title: Re: Short barreled m2, what now?
Post by: cuppednlocked on March 14, 2016, 04:10:58 PM
I put ~180 LB #6 in a 10" circle at 40 with the kicks choke.
Title: Re: Short barreled m2, what now?
Post by: SumToy on March 15, 2016, 11:29:03 AM
Quote from: Borden811 on March 13, 2016, 04:55:29 PM
William,
I used the .650 Sumtoy I got from you in my SBE II last year with the Longbeard 4s, 5s, and 6s. It shot great patterns with all three loads. I was hoping for the same with this m2 and the 4s. I'll post a link to those patterns below. What numbers do you think I could realistically expect out of a 21" barreled m2 with the 3" Longbeard 4s at 40 yards and one of your chokes in the 660-665 range?


I have not shot the 4s and counted them.  I know what guys are telling.   I got a guy with 660 and he was just playing around and  got 70 at 60 yards with 31/2.    Now the 6s should go 200 to 220. 
Title: Re: Short barreled m2, what now?
Post by: Chesterfield on March 18, 2016, 07:26:45 AM
Borden -  Have you had an opportunity to pattern the Tru glo choke yet in your setup?  Looking forward to the results.
Title: Re: Short barreled m2, what now?
Post by: CrustyRusty on March 18, 2016, 08:06:12 AM
I actually have tried both the turkey and coyote hevichokes in my benellis. They produce almost identical numbers. I wished I had tried turkey loads thru my coyote choke before I had bought the turkey choke because I would have saved the money.

Quote from: owlhoot on March 10, 2016, 04:43:22 PM
have you tried the standard hevi- tube ? Not the coyote one.
3" magblends in the 200's with old sbe, 26" barrel though.
Short 21" barrel 870's like them too.
Title: Re: Short barreled m2, what now?
Post by: Borden811 on March 20, 2016, 11:19:50 AM
I haven't had a chance to make it to the range again yet. Should make it Wednesday of this week. I have the Truglo and Roberts chokes, and longbeards in 4, 5, 6 shot, and the blends to try. I shot the Hevi13 turkey and coyote chokes in my SBE  II, and both shot identical patterns. Kept the coyote, sold the turkey.
Title: Re: Short barreled m2, what now?
Post by: owlhoot on March 20, 2016, 11:30:20 AM
Quote from: Borden811 on March 20, 2016, 11:19:50 AM
I haven't had a chance to make it to the range again yet. Should make it Wednesday of this week. I have the Truglo and Roberts chokes, and longbeards in 4, 5, 6 shot, and the blends to try. I shot the Hevi13 turkey and coyote chokes in my SBE  II, and both shot identical patterns. Kept the coyote, sold the turkey.
dang, had no idea they were the same, or at least shot the same.  ???
Title: Re: Short barreled m2, what now?
Post by: Borden811 on March 24, 2016, 09:10:49 AM
Ok, made it to the range for a quick session. The Truglo bone collector choke wasn't very impressive. It shot the LB 4s in the 70s, 5s in the 120s and 6s in the 150s. It shot the mag blends in the 130s. Th RR shot the mag blends in the 160s, the longbeard 4s in the 80s, the 5s in the 120s and the 6s in the 170s. All of those patterns were nice an even, just not as dense as I was looking for. I shot the sumtoy with the LB 6s right at 200-205, and the LB 5s at 145-150. The Indian creek shot the LB 6s at 215-220, and the 5s at 160-165. The 6s were so tight at 40 out of both chokes it was literally a 10" circle with scattered pellets outside it. The 5s were a tad more even out of the I.C. So, I'm settling on the I.C. With the 3" 5s for now. 5s in the 160s(out of a dirty gun, which seems to shoot a little better squeaky clean) seems good for a short barreled benelli. If anyone is interested in some 3" #4 Longbeards, I'll have some for sale ;). I'll get some pics up in the pattern section when I get a chance today or tomorrow.