I came across this article in my American Hunter magazine and couldn't believe it when I read the following in an article about using home defense shotguns for turkey hunting.
the best performance came from Environ-Metal's 3" Hevi-13, which had 1 3/4 ozs. of the company's tungsten-based No. 6 shot; it delivered 26 pellets into a 10" circle. No gobbler would escape the swarm of shot, but I'd still opt for the bird to be a few yards closer for additional pellets on-target.
I don't believe that there is anyone on this forum who would consider that an acceptable hunting pattern. I'm not one to write to magazines, but I'm seriously considering writing to AH and asking them what they could be thinking.
Here's a link to the article...
http://www.americanhunter.org/articles/can-you-turkey-hunt-home-defense-gun (http://www.americanhunter.org/articles/can-you-turkey-hunt-home-defense-gun)
But at what distance?
says 35 yards in the srticle. bunch of wounded birds waiting to happen!
Typo maybe???
Years ago that's all we used to get. With #4's and the lack of choke technology.
I have an old turkey hunting book that says when you pattern with a turkey head target you need to put at least 3 pellets in the vitals.
the same article is in american rifleman. maybe 3 killzone strikes Is all thats needed but with only 26 hits in a 10 circle that leaves alot of dead areas qith the possibilty of no killzone hits.
Quote from: snapper1982 on May 23, 2014, 03:21:00 PM
the same article is in american rifleman. maybe 3 killzone strikes Is all thats needed but with only 26 hits in a 10 circle that leaves alot of dead areas qith the possibilty of no killzone hits.
Used to be an average of 3 hits would decide your max range.
with the intent to be closer. I remember the first time I put 54 hits in a 10" my dad and one of the old timers at the time almost fell over.
I figured out a long time ago a lot of outdoor writers have bachelor degrees in English literature or writing composition, but little outdoor experience and even less on the subjects they are assigned to wright about.
Not all, but to many.
Probably a typo , some of these outdoor writers are kind of more older in age and commonly refer back to more traditional standards (1980-90's ) like shot in the" head and neck "on a target he probably got the two mixed up , or someone proof read it that way and published it
Quote from: Gooserbat on May 23, 2014, 06:31:39 PM
I figured out a long time ago a lot of outdoor writers have bachelor degrees in English literature or writing composition, but little outdoor experience and even less on the subjects they are assigned to wright about.
Not all, but to many.
Follow the money. Look at who has adds in the magazine then read the article.
"If you consider how many turkeys and other game were taken for over 200 years with smooth bore fowlers and loose shot.....there is no problem. I used a Benelli M1 Super 90 combat/home defense 12 gauge (cylinder bore) last year with a Federal 3" turkey load, #4 shot.....dropped ol' Tom dead at 25 to 30 paces. Just a modern equivalent to that 17th, 18th and 19th century fowler...."
Quote from: Mason Dixon on May 29, 2014, 12:07:59 AM
"If you consider how many turkeys and other game were taken for over 200 years with smooth bore fowlers and loose shot.....there is no problem. I used a Benelli M1 Super 90 combat/home defense 12 gauge (cylinder bore) last year with a Federal 3" turkey load, #4 shot.....dropped ol' Tom dead at 25 to 30 paces. Just a modern equivalent to that 17th, 18th and 19th century fowler...."
that's not possible the only way to kill one of these terminator birds is with a shotgun that can achieve 200+ hits in a ten inch circle at 40 lol! At least that's what any noob turkey hunter coming onto this forum would think. I don't know why it is so obsessed about among most people on here. I kind of feel like it's more of a pissing contest than anything.
Quote from: Lukas929 on June 01, 2014, 09:09:28 PM
Quote from: Mason Dixon on May 29, 2014, 12:07:59 AM
"If you consider how many turkeys and other game were taken for over 200 years with smooth bore fowlers and loose shot.....there is no problem. I used a Benelli M1 Super 90 combat/home defense 12 gauge (cylinder bore) last year with a Federal 3" turkey load, #4 shot.....dropped ol' Tom dead at 25 to 30 paces. Just a modern equivalent to that 17th, 18th and 19th century fowler...."
that's not possible the only way to kill one of these terminator birds is with a shotgun that can achieve 200+ hits in a ten inch circle at 40 lol! At least that's what any noob turkey hunter coming onto this forum would think. I don't know why it is so obsessed about among most people on here. I kind of feel like it's more of a pissing contest than anything.
Actually what it really is is a way for most of us to extend our turkey hunting lifestyle. We really all know that we can take dads or grandads old fixed choke shotgun hit the turkey woods with a call or two in our pocket and fill a tag. But for most of us the actual harvest of the bird is probably the least most important factor in the hunt. Yes it is important but really only to justify that all our time planning and preparation has some Validity. (also to keep the wives believing that we are out providing for our families for 20 days a season ;)). Turkey hunting is really so much more then toppling a bird.
Ok I can understand most of that but if your gun shoots a great pattern with 200 hits in the 10" then what's the point of chasing after a better combo? Trust me I'm a diehard(mostly bow hunter) I fully understand the kill is just the icing on the cake but like I said you would think a .50 bmg was needed to kill one of these birds if you were new to turkey hunting and this forum. They are not hard animals to kill.
I just feel like it's so blown out of proportion an gives people (especially younger/new hunters) the wrong impression, and might even turn them off thinking that their only shotgun isn't fit for turkey, maybe they can't afford to buy ten different boxes of shells an 2-3 new chokes to try an get 200 hits. How is 250 hits any deader than 100? this is a very good forum but that was easily the first thing I noticed about coming on here is how most people only cared about their numbers, and it kind of irks me.
Quote from: Lukas929 on June 01, 2014, 10:11:32 PM
Ok I can understand most of that but if your gun shoots a great pattern with 200 hits in the 10" then what's the point of chasing after a better combo? Trust me I'm a diehard(mostly bow hunter) I fully understand the kill is just the icing on the cake but like I said you would think a .50 bmg was needed to kill one of these birds if you were new to turkey hunting and this forum. They are not hard animals to kill.
I just feel like it's so blown out of proportion an gives people (especially younger/new hunters) the wrong impression, and might even turn them off thinking that their only shotgun isn't fit for turkey, maybe they can't afford to buy ten different boxes of shells an 2-3 new chokes to try an get 200 hits. How is 250 hits any deader than 100? this is a very good forum but that was easily the first thing I noticed about coming on here is how most people only cared about their numbers, and it kind of irks me.
Agreed. The numbers game is just that a game. For my first 15yrs of turkey hunting I was only putting about 50 hits in a 10" circle and didn't even know it. Never missed a bird with those numbers. And actually a few I accidentally killed past 40 due to misjudgement so you are correct dead is dead. And when you read an article like this one in north American Hunter the reason they state that those numbers are sufficient is because they are.
A pattern only needs to be..........good enough.
26 pellets in 10" at 35 yards is good enough? Maybe if you rely on the golden pellet to find the brain. 26 pellets in a 10 inch circle is 1 pellet for every 3 square inches. A quick measurement of my turkey target give 4.3 square inches covered by the spine and brain, so the expected value for the number of pellets in an immediately vital zone with that pattern is 1.4 pellets. Of course that is if the pellets are absolutely uniformly distributed throughout the circle. It's possible to kill a turkey with that pattern at 35 yards. And you could win $500 on your next scratch ticket too.
My own minimum is 100 in 10" with even distribution. Whatever range up to 40 yards produces that is my ethical limit. That's enough pellets so that I am virtually assured of getting multiple lethal hits if my aim is true. Anything less is showing disrespect for a fine animal. Remember that when you shoot a turkey with a shotgun at a reasonable range and "miss" you seldom really miss. You just put pellets somewhere into the bird that is not immediately lethal.
That shotgun and load combination may be ethical to use at 20 yards and maybe even at 25 yards, but not at 35 yards and beyond.