:policeman: Is may be just me aging, and getting where I can't remember shiz, but after 40 years of chasing Eastern's in the mountains of Virginia, birds seem to be getting bigger. I can remember when if a person took a legitimate 20lb. bird, in all likelihood that would be the "blue-ribbon winner" for a small group of hunters. Seemed like about 18lbs. was a good solid mature bird 25 years ago. In contrast in the very same area today a 20lb bird is considered "average" where I hunt, and it is nothing special to take a 22-23lb bird, with 25lb birds being harvested weekly by various hunters. Curious if this seems like it applies to other hunters...or Is it Just Me? Thanks for your time.
20lbs has definitely become the average. Interesting question you pose....
This past Saturday a fella took a tom that missed the state record by 8 oz.Our record is 32 plus pounds.
Ive noticed it too and cant really explain it. When I first started the only place there was any birds was in the mountains to the east of me about 50 miles and those turkeys were put there by God, not man. Up there an average adult bird would weigh 16 to 18 lbs. I remember killing ONE up there that weighed 20 lbs and it was the largest checked in for the whole season on that WMA. Fast forward several years and several transplants later and we have birds here now. The birds here primarily were trapped up there and released here, so in essence, they are the same strain of birds. Well down here, they average well over 20lbs and 25 isnt unheard of. I attribute it to better terrain, less work, and more food sources here than they had in the mountains.
Yep. We use to kill a lot of 15-18 lb gobblers but now 20 is pretty common. I killed 2 last year that were 23.14 and 23.06 which is rare. No fields or anything for miles just mountains. This year in va only 1 has broke 20 but the others have flirted with it being 19+. I've only known one that hit 25 here ever but it was killed off a farm 6-7 years ago
I've noticed that since the invention of the InterWeb, both weights, spur lengthd and beard lengthd have increased on average. I can't quite put my finger on it. Maybe our scales and rulers were off in the past.............
While I hunt primarily in the Blue Ridge Mountains, I also hunt some farmlands in the mountain foothills. Seems this phenomenon of "Bigger than Yesterday" holds true for both areas. While the weights of the birds are remarkably consistent, the spur length is another thing. Seems the birds that reside in the foothill-farm country always have longer spurs. The "mountain dwellers" are constantly wearing theirs down on all the rough terrain/rocks. I have also noticed the birds from far Eastern Virginia where there is primarily flat agriculture (peanuts/soybeans)have even greater spur length...with mature birds often being razor sharp.
Quote from: st8tman on April 28, 2014, 07:34:50 PM
While I hunt primarily in the Blue Ridge Mountains, I also hunt some farmlands in the mountain foothills. Seems this phenomenon of "Bigger than Yesterday" holds true for both areas. While the weights of the birds are remarkably consistent, the spur length is another thing. Seems the birds that reside in the foothill-farm country always have longer spurs. The "mountain dwellers" are constantly wearing theirs down on all the rough terrain/rocks. I have also noticed the birds from far Eastern Virginia where there is primarily flat agriculture (peanuts/soybeans)have even greater spur length...with mature birds often being razor sharp.
I agree. 1 1/4" + spurs on a true mtn bird is rare. Also beards over 10.5". They drag em off in this steep stuff
I hunt the "hills" of SE Oklahoma and most birds that I kill are between 17-19 lbs and usually less than 10.5" beards and if you get better than 1" spurs you got something real special. Now I also hunt some prime farm country in central Missouri and 22-23 lbs is average as well as long whiskers and stilettos. I think it's just a factor of where they live and diet.
Quote from: Gooserbat on April 29, 2014, 03:24:12 PMI think it's just a factor of where they live and diet.
:icon_thumright: :agreed: :z-winnersmiley:
Global warming. Bigger bugs = bigger turkeys.
Setting aside whether or not global warming is "real and dangerous", Bergmann's Rule would indicate that it isn't responsible for bigger turkeys.
Bergmann's rule is an ecogeographic principle that states that within a broadly distributed taxonomic clade, populations and species of larger size are found in colder environments, and species of smaller size are found in warmer regions.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bergmann%27s_rule
Bergmann's rule explains why bucks in Saskatchewan often reach a live weight of over 300 pounds while bucks in Texas go 150 - 200.
agree getting bigger
Quote from: J-Shaped on April 28, 2014, 07:22:35 PM
I've noticed that since the invention of the InterWeb, both weights, spur lengthd and beard lengthd have increased on average. I can't quite put my finger on it. Maybe our scales and rulers were off in the past.............
Absolutely! Most people just guess and they aren't very good at it.
Quote from: trackerbucky on April 30, 2014, 12:23:27 PM
Setting aside whether or not global warming is "real and dangerous", Bergmann's Rule would indicate that it isn't responsible for bigger turkeys.
Bergmann's rule is an ecogeographic principle that states that within a broadly distributed taxonomic clade, populations and species of larger size are found in colder environments, and species of smaller size are found in warmer regions.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bergmann%27s_rule
Bergmann's rule explains why bucks in Saskatchewan often reach a live weight of over 300 pounds while bucks in Texas go 150 - 200.
^^^ This. It's postulated that Bergmann's rule is due to the relationship between volume and surface area. Higher surface area to volume ratios lead to greater heat loss. Larger things have a lower surface area to volume ratio. Thus the larger you are, the less heat you lose to surface area.
Turkeys may be getting bigger, but it's not because of a warming trend.
Here in Eastern NC I'd say the average weight for a gobbler in the two to three year class is 20 lbs with older and younger turkeys being under that. It is very rare see a turkey weigh in at over 23 lbs here. However, lots of turkeys are
assumed to weigh greater than 23 lbs prior to being weighed on certified scales.
I was just kidding about global warming resulting in bigger bugs. :) So much for humor.
What an old timer told me this year - not sure if it's accurate or not - but he said the size difference is a result of in-breeding w/domestic turkeys, and now our turkey "herd" is bigger than the original species were (he was referring to Eastern's down here in AL). He said, years ago, when he was killing the "original" Eastern species, a "good" bird was 18 lbs. max. Average was 14-16 lbs.
Again, don't know if there's any truth to this or not.
I first started hunting turkeys in 1996. Killed my first in 97. I knew very little about turkeys. I told my friend who was a turkey hunter it only weighed 19lbs.He said "only 19 lbs, how much did you want it to weigh"? Seems around 15 was average.