is there orgazations that help stop logging there destroying our hunting in va
Is the land owned by the paper company?
try greenpeace,peta,friends of animals,audubon,save the planet,ect.... their websites will give you info on how you can help stop ''logging''... :anim_25:
public or private you left out major details with your blanket statement
its gov land theres a guy on here called outlaw hes trying to stop it he probly will to he dont play games
I wouldnt stop it,cuz then you'll have a habitat problem thats really big. Plus if you get it stopped it will mostlikely never start again. And you'll be the one begging to have them log it. If anything you should try to get them to do some selective logging. Trust you dont want it to turn into San Bernardino national forest in california. Now all the trees are sick and theyre ripping that forest apart to rebuild it.
I hope not, I live in VA but my dads job is a logger
I dont think the logging makes for bad hunting in MHO. I think not logging an area is bad for habitat,since Ive seen it first hand in some of the areas in so.cal.
Well, if its government land they are probably NOT going to quit. Its a revenue stream for our government and money is pretty tight. I just wish they would quit selective burning throughout the month of April in SC. No telling how many nests get toasted...
I am a fan of logging 100%!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I am not a fan of Clear Cutting 100%!!!!!!!!!!!!! The only time I have seen where the woods & wildlife has benefitted from clear cutting was after hurricanes Katrina, Rita, & Gustave. Some blocks of woods was so torn up from the wind it wouldn't have been beneficial to a rabbit...............
They do it in conjunction with wildlife department down in southeast Oklahoma. Ony certain areas are harvested and then replanted each year...lending to some pretty nice and diverse habitat. You want good distribution of age classes inall types of nature...trees included. Nothing worse than a monoculture of old pines and nothing in the understory.
I could only wish they'd start logging again on some of our NF land here in NC. Tree huggers have helped to eliminate all 2nd growth forest and have helped in damaging major amounts of grouse and quail habitat. Give Smokey a drip torch and lets fire up some saws. Old growth forest don't sustain wildlife populations easily.
You aint gonna stop it. You aint gonna slow it down. They still use trees to make stuff, and that aint never gonna stop. It is a renewable resource.
Quote from: BowBendr on February 23, 2011, 09:58:54 PM
I could only wish they'd start logging again on some of our NF land here in NC. Tree huggers have helped to eliminate all 2nd growth forest and have helped in damaging major amounts of grouse and quail habitat. Give Smokey a drip torch and lets fire up some saws. Old growth forest don't sustain wildlife populations easily.
:you_rock:
Quote from: TANK on February 23, 2011, 09:43:20 PM
I am a fan of logging 100%!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I am not a fan of Clear Cutting 100%!!!!!!!!!!!!! The only time I have seen where the woods & wildlife has benefitted from clear cutting was after hurricanes Katrina, Rita, & Gustave. Some blocks of woods was so torn up from the wind it wouldn't have been beneficial to a rabbit...............
There is absolutely nothing wrong with clear cutting. The problem is clear cutting and not putting back into the land with proper prep treatment and replanting.
From a timber management viewpoint, clear cutting is a necessity at times. Seems most people like to take from the land, but not give anything back to it. Just my opinion.
God Bless,
David B.
Quote from: BOFF on February 23, 2011, 11:35:58 PM
Quote from: TANK on February 23, 2011, 09:43:20 PM
I am a fan of logging 100%!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I am not a fan of Clear Cutting 100%!!!!!!!!!!!!! The only time I have seen where the woods & wildlife has benefitted from clear cutting was after hurricanes Katrina, Rita, & Gustave. Some blocks of woods was so torn up from the wind it wouldn't have been beneficial to a rabbit...............
There is absolutely nothing wrong with clear cutting. The problem is clear cutting and not putting back into the land with proper prep treatment and replanting.
From a timber management viewpoint, clear cutting is a necessity at times. Seems most people like to take from the land, but not give anything back to it. Just my opinion.
God Bless,
David B.
well said David.
Ever use plastic toilet paper?
Quote from: CASH on February 24, 2011, 12:42:35 AM
Ever use plastic toilet paper?
nope but plenty of t-shirt pockets :TooFunny: :TooFunny:
He was only joking! :)
Quote from: mossybird on February 23, 2011, 09:29:40 PM
I hope not, I live in VA but my dads job is a logger
Same here. My uncles have been logging for 33 years. I wish they would log some of the federal land around here. Woods are too open now with no underbrush. Deer and grouse are gone. Turkey come and go depending on mast crop. They whack sections of state land (WMA) here all the time.
Quote from: TANK on February 23, 2011, 09:43:20 PM
I am a fan of logging 100%!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I am not a fan of Clear Cutting 100%!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Ditto .. logging is a good thing if it is done correctly .. benefits all the wildlife..
Quote from: saltysenior on February 23, 2011, 09:21:58 PM
try greenpeace,peta,friends of animals,audubon,save the planet,ect.... their websites will give you info on how you can help stop ''logging''... :anim_25:
O and peta will help you ban HUNTING also :you_rock:
Quote from: yellowacorns on February 24, 2011, 10:18:57 AM
Quote from: saltysenior on February 23, 2011, 09:21:58 PM
try greenpeace,peta,friends of animals,audubon,save the planet,ect.... their websites will give you info on how you can help stop ''logging''... :anim_25:
O and peta will help you ban HUNTING also :you_rock:
Yeah I would call PETA and ask them if they can help stop logging so the hunting is better. Wonder what they would say?? Maybe :chucknorris: can help
Climb the tree and they will eventually leave you alone
Quote from: BOFF on February 23, 2011, 11:35:58 PM
Quote from: TANK on February 23, 2011, 09:43:20 PM
I am a fan of logging 100%!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I am not a fan of Clear Cutting 100%!!!!!!!!!!!!! The only time I have seen where the woods & wildlife has benefitted from clear cutting was after hurricanes Katrina, Rita, & Gustave. Some blocks of woods was so torn up from the wind it wouldn't have been beneficial to a rabbit...............
There is absolutely nothing wrong with clear cutting. The problem is clear cutting and not putting back into the land with proper prep treatment and replanting.
From a timber management viewpoint, clear cutting is a necessity at times. Seems most people like to take from the land, but not give anything back to it. Just my opinion.
God Bless,
David B.
How is clear cutting necessary from a timber managment viewpoint at times? What would be some of the times you are talkin about? Like I said after the hurricanes it was more of a timber recovery than anything else. We didn't have beetles killing the trees. The "necessity" was $$$$$$. I understand thats the business they are in but they also preach this crap about how they give back to the land & wildlife, I'll tell you what they gave us back, they left about a 20 yard strip around the creeks of whatever vegatation that was growing there to prevent erroision and keep the DEQ off their behinds. When I got in our hunting club almost 20 years ago we had mixed oaks, pines, cypress, gum, etc on the land. Weyerhauser Timber purchased the property about our second year and began raping the land. The previous owner had a select cut program established, the woods was thick enough for deer, and open enough for turkeys. They logged it every so many years. When Weyerhauser came in they have cut evertything and planted it back in only pine trees. They are now clear cutting the pines that they replanted. Our turkey numbers went to crap. We have at the present time about 3 thousand acres of fresh to 3 year old clear cuts. The fresh clear cuts are ok the first year, but after that its usless for turkeys, squirrels, doves, etc. I'm just venting on the topic......................
Quote from: TANK on February 24, 2011, 04:36:39 PM
Quote from: BOFF on February 23, 2011, 11:35:58 PM
Quote from: TANK on February 23, 2011, 09:43:20 PM
I am a fan of logging 100%!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I am not a fan of Clear Cutting 100%!!!!!!!!!!!!! The only time I have seen where the woods & wildlife has benefitted from clear cutting was after hurricanes Katrina, Rita, & Gustave. Some blocks of woods was so torn up from the wind it wouldn't have been beneficial to a rabbit...............
There is absolutely nothing wrong with clear cutting. The problem is clear cutting and not putting back into the land with proper prep treatment and replanting.
From a timber management viewpoint, clear cutting is a necessity at times. Seems most people like to take from the land, but not give anything back to it. Just my opinion.
God Bless,
David B.
How is clear cutting necessary from a timber managment viewpoint at times? What would be some of the times you are talkin about? Like I said after the hurricanes it was more of a timber recovery than anything else. We didn't have beetles killing the trees. The "necessity" was $$$$$$. I understand thats the business they are in but they also preach this crap about how they give back to the land & wildlife, I'll tell you what they gave us back, they left about a 20 yard strip around the creeks of whatever vegatation that was growing there to prevent erroision and keep the DEQ off their behinds. When I got in our hunting club almost 20 years ago we had mixed oaks, pines, cypress, gum, etc on the land. Weyerhauser Timber purchased the property about our second year and began raping the land. The previous owner had a select cut program established, the woods was thick enough for deer, and open enough for turkeys. They logged it every so many years. When Weyerhauser came in they have cut evertything and planted it back in only pine trees. They are now clear cutting the pines that they replanted. Our turkey numbers went to crap. We have at the present time about 3 thousand acres of fresh to 3 year old clear cuts. The fresh clear cuts are ok the first year, but after that its usless for turkeys, squirrels, doves, etc. I'm just venting on the topic......................
I understand your frustration. Did you ever consider some clear cuts which are not planted, provide a safe nesting ground for the turkeys? Clear open hardwoods and open planted pines provide no nesting grounds.
Weyerhaeuser doesn't have to lease the land, which it purchased to make money off of to begin with in the first place. I hope you don't think the money you pay for the lease is enough to cover the expenses of the land Weyerhaeuser purchased, and the taxes on the land. Have you every payed for the machinery, diesel fuel, tools, prep treatment, labor for workers, pine seedlings, chemicals, taxes etc., to manage the land with trees? It is not cheap!!
As for the stream side management techniques, that is NOT REQUIRED!!!!! It is a technique most timber companies elect to take, but not all of them do it. As for a management of better timber, it's not the best idea in my opinion, due to regeneration of trees not wanted in the pines.
For the select cut, particularly hardwoods, one can only cut so many times before nothing is left. Hardwoods just take too long to grow from a business standpoint. Buy the time interest is paid on the land bought, over a period of years, there is no way hardwoods are going to pay for the land. Pines, even now with the poor prices, don't pay for the land.
As for clear cutting the pines, it is best practice to clear cut them, burn, poison, and replant to keep other seedling from intermixing in the forest. Yes it is from a money viewpoint, but it takes money to be able to hold onto the land YOU hunt. Why do you think the previous land owner sold the land to Weyerhaeuser? It could be he/she/they didn't have enough money to manage the land, or hold on to it, and it was sold for the MONEY.
If you are so upset about the land being managed the way it is, buy your own land, manage it the way you want to, and pay for it at the same time. I understand the frustration you may have, but it can always get worse. The land companies don't have to lease the lands. The land companies could develop the lands for commercial sites, residential sites, etc. and then it isn't even piece of land suitable for ANY wildlife.
Just my thoughts as well. I'm not attempting to be a rear end, and I do understand the disappointment of not having a familiar, reliable place to hunt, particularly at the beginning of season. :-[
God Bless,
David B.
David you are absolutly positively 100 percent right on.
Quote from: BOFF on February 24, 2011, 08:14:19 PM
Quote from: TANK on February 24, 2011, 04:36:39 PM
Quote from: BOFF on February 23, 2011, 11:35:58 PM
Quote from: TANK on February 23, 2011, 09:43:20 PM
I am a fan of logging 100%!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I am not a fan of Clear Cutting 100%!!!!!!!!!!!!! The only time I have seen where the woods & wildlife has benefitted from clear cutting was after hurricanes Katrina, Rita, & Gustave. Some blocks of woods was so torn up from the wind it wouldn't have been beneficial to a rabbit...............
There is absolutely nothing wrong with clear cutting. The problem is clear cutting and not putting back into the land with proper prep treatment and replanting.
From a timber management viewpoint, clear cutting is a necessity at times. Seems most people like to take from the land, but not give anything back to it. Just my opinion.
God Bless,
David B.
How is clear cutting necessary from a timber managment viewpoint at times? What would be some of the times you are talkin about? Like I said after the hurricanes it was more of a timber recovery than anything else. We didn't have beetles killing the trees. The "necessity" was $$$$$$. I understand thats the business they are in but they also preach this crap about how they give back to the land & wildlife, I'll tell you what they gave us back, they left about a 20 yard strip around the creeks of whatever vegatation that was growing there to prevent erroision and keep the DEQ off their behinds. When I got in our hunting club almost 20 years ago we had mixed oaks, pines, cypress, gum, etc on the land. Weyerhauser Timber purchased the property about our second year and began raping the land. The previous owner had a select cut program established, the woods was thick enough for deer, and open enough for turkeys. They logged it every so many years. When Weyerhauser came in they have cut evertything and planted it back in only pine trees. They are now clear cutting the pines that they replanted. Our turkey numbers went to crap. We have at the present time about 3 thousand acres of fresh to 3 year old clear cuts. The fresh clear cuts are ok the first year, but after that its usless for turkeys, squirrels, doves, etc. I'm just venting on the topic......................
I understand your frustration. Did you ever consider some clear cuts which are not planted, provide a safe nesting ground for the turkeys? Clear open hardwoods and open planted pines provide no nesting grounds.
Weyerhaeuser doesn't have to lease the land, which it purchased to make money off of to begin with in the first place. I hope you don't think the money you pay for the lease is enough to cover the expenses of the land Weyerhaeuser purchased, and the taxes on the land. Have you every payed for the machinery, diesel fuel, tools, prep treatment, labor for workers, pine seedlings, chemicals, taxes etc., to manage the land with trees? It is not cheap!!
As for the stream side management techniques, that is NOT REQUIRED!!!!! It is a technique most timber companies elect to take, but not all of them do it. As for a management of better timber, it's not the best idea in my opinion, due to regeneration of trees not wanted in the pines.
For the select cut, particularly hardwoods, one can only cut so many times before nothing is left. Hardwoods just take too long to grow from a business standpoint. Buy the time interest is paid on the land bought, over a period of years, there is no way hardwoods are going to pay for the land. Pines, even now with the poor prices, don't pay for the land.
As for clear cutting the pines, it is best practice to clear cut them, burn, poison, and replant to keep other seedling from intermixing in the forest. Yes it is from a money viewpoint, but it takes money to be able to hold onto the land YOU hunt. Why do you think the previous land owner sold the land to Weyerhaeuser? It could be he/she/they didn't have enough money to manage the land, or hold on to it, and it was sold for the MONEY.
If you are so upset about the land being managed the way it is, buy your own land, manage it the way you want to, and pay for it at the same time. I understand the frustration you may have, but it can always get worse. The land companies don't have to lease the lands. The land companies could develop the lands for commercial sites, residential sites, etc. and then it isn't even piece of land suitable for ANY wildlife.
Just my thoughts as well. I'm not attempting to be a rear end, and I do understand the disappointment of not having a familiar, reliable place to hunt, particularly at the beginning of season. :-[
God Bless,
David B.
I understand what you are saying. Everything revolves around the dollar. My Great Grandpa, Grandpa, and Dad have all been loggers. We could go back and forth on this for a long time. We both have different opinions on this. I'm not agreeing or disagreeing with you either way......... As for the land I will never be able to afford a 9000 acre piece like our lease, but one day I will purchase property when I can afford it and do the things you suggested. The streamside management practice sounds good on tv and in magazines, about leaving mast trees for the wildlife and all, but the wildlife doesn't really get that much use from what we get left, sweet gum, japanese tallow, elm, etc. After they clear cut, they wind row and burn within 3-4 months, then row and plant with illegal imegrant labor (seen the Border Patrol get after 'em), maybe grade the roads, then furtilize with a plane 2-3 times before they start over again........They have never came back and done a controlled burn, that would help tremindusly! You seem like a pretty good fella, so I hope you don't think I'm sounding like a rear end either, just venting a little..........Our engineer at work used to work for Weyerhauser. He said one of the reasons we get as much clear cutting here was because we are suppose to have this "Super Soil" that grows pine trees very very fast. I can't remember all the details but yall had better be glad we are the lucky ones with dirt the pines love!!!!! lol
if i had my way there would never be another tree cut period.the big trees are all gone.every tree we cut now our kids, there kids, will never see a big old tree again..i plant trees every year they are all put in the ground at a angle so they will grow crooked..they will be good for wild life but not good for the chain saw..here in s.e.ohio there are very very few trees big enough to set your back against and be safe hunting turkey
Quote from: TANK on February 24, 2011, 09:05:21 PM
Quote from: BOFF on February 24, 2011, 08:14:19 PM
Quote from: TANK on February 24, 2011, 04:36:39 PM
Quote from: BOFF on February 23, 2011, 11:35:58 PM
Quote from: TANK on February 23, 2011, 09:43:20 PM
I am a fan of logging 100%!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I am not a fan of Clear Cutting 100%!!!!!!!!!!!!! The only time I have seen where the woods & wildlife has benefitted from clear cutting was after hurricanes Katrina, Rita, & Gustave. Some blocks of woods was so torn up from the wind it wouldn't have been beneficial to a rabbit...............
There is absolutely nothing wrong with clear cutting. The problem is clear cutting and not putting back into the land with proper prep treatment and replanting.
From a timber management viewpoint, clear cutting is a necessity at times. Seems most people like to take from the land, but not give anything back to it. Just my opinion.
God Bless,
David B.
How is clear cutting necessary from a timber managment viewpoint at times? What would be some of the times you are talkin about? Like I said after the hurricanes it was more of a timber recovery than anything else. We didn't have beetles killing the trees. The "necessity" was $$$$$$. I understand thats the business they are in but they also preach this crap about how they give back to the land & wildlife, I'll tell you what they gave us back, they left about a 20 yard strip around the creeks of whatever vegatation that was growing there to prevent erroision and keep the DEQ off their behinds. When I got in our hunting club almost 20 years ago we had mixed oaks, pines, cypress, gum, etc on the land. Weyerhauser Timber purchased the property about our second year and began raping the land. The previous owner had a select cut program established, the woods was thick enough for deer, and open enough for turkeys. They logged it every so many years. When Weyerhauser came in they have cut evertything and planted it back in only pine trees. They are now clear cutting the pines that they replanted. Our turkey numbers went to crap. We have at the present time about 3 thousand acres of fresh to 3 year old clear cuts. The fresh clear cuts are ok the first year, but after that its usless for turkeys, squirrels, doves, etc. I'm just venting on the topic......................
I understand your frustration. Did you ever consider some clear cuts which are not planted, provide a safe nesting ground for the turkeys? Clear open hardwoods and open planted pines provide no nesting grounds.
Weyerhaeuser doesn't have to lease the land, which it purchased to make money off of to begin with in the first place. I hope you don't think the money you pay for the lease is enough to cover the expenses of the land Weyerhaeuser purchased, and the taxes on the land. Have you every payed for the machinery, diesel fuel, tools, prep treatment, labor for workers, pine seedlings, chemicals, taxes etc., to manage the land with trees? It is not cheap!!
As for the stream side management techniques, that is NOT REQUIRED!!!!! It is a technique most timber companies elect to take, but not all of them do it. As for a management of better timber, it's not the best idea in my opinion, due to regeneration of trees not wanted in the pines.
For the select cut, particularly hardwoods, one can only cut so many times before nothing is left. Hardwoods just take too long to grow from a business standpoint. Buy the time interest is paid on the land bought, over a period of years, there is no way hardwoods are going to pay for the land. Pines, even now with the poor prices, don't pay for the land.
As for clear cutting the pines, it is best practice to clear cut them, burn, poison, and replant to keep other seedling from intermixing in the forest. Yes it is from a money viewpoint, but it takes money to be able to hold onto the land YOU hunt. Why do you think the previous land owner sold the land to Weyerhaeuser? It could be he/she/they didn't have enough money to manage the land, or hold on to it, and it was sold for the MONEY.
If you are so upset about the land being managed the way it is, buy your own land, manage it the way you want to, and pay for it at the same time. I understand the frustration you may have, but it can always get worse. The land companies don't have to lease the lands. The land companies could develop the lands for commercial sites, residential sites, etc. and then it isn't even piece of land suitable for ANY wildlife.
Just my thoughts as well. I'm not attempting to be a rear end, and I do understand the disappointment of not having a familiar, reliable place to hunt, particularly at the beginning of season. :-[
God Bless,
David B.
I understand what you are saying. Everything revolves around the dollar. My Great Grandpa, Grandpa, and Dad have all been loggers. We could go back and forth on this for a long time. We both have different opinions on this. I'm not agreeing or disagreeing with you either way......... As for the land I will never be able to afford a 9000 acre piece like our lease, but one day I will purchase property when I can afford it and do the things you suggested. The streamside management practice sounds good on tv and in magazines, about leaving mast trees for the wildlife and all, but the wildlife doesn't really get that much use from what we get left, sweet gum, japanese tallow, elm, etc. After they clear cut, they wind row and burn within 3-4 months, then row and plant with illegal imegrant labor (seen the Border Patrol get after 'em), maybe grade the roads, then furtilize with a plane 2-3 times before they start over again........They have never came back and done a controlled burn, that would help tremindusly! You seem like a pretty good fella, so I hope you don't think I'm sounding like a rear end either, just venting a little..........Our engineer at work used to work for Weyerhauser. He said one of the reasons we get as much clear cutting here was because we are suppose to have this "Super Soil" that grows pine trees very very fast. I can't remember all the details but yall had better be glad we are the lucky ones with dirt the pines love!!!!! lol
You don't read like a rear end at all. You read like a turkey hunter having great expectations of the season, which have suddenly been taken from him without any of his control. As for the controlled burns, being an individual like myself instead of a company, and the property's location, makes it easier to do. I won't get into the reasons.
Good luck in your season. May you find new ground, or find the old, to produce a successful season.
God Bless,
David B.
You 2 BOFF!
Quote from: nstrut on February 24, 2011, 09:24:58 PM
if i had my way there would never be another tree cut period.the big trees are all gone.every tree we cut now our kids, there kids, will never see a big old tree again..i plant trees every year they are all put in the ground at a angle so they will grow crooked..they will be good for wild life but not good for the chain saw..here in s.e.ohio there are very very few trees big enough to set your back against and be safe hunting turkey
Hate to tell you but that's not going to make a crooked tree. And BOFF and TANK you are both to be commended for having a reasonable back and forth dialog on an internet forum and it didn't turn into a pizzing match. Good for you (yall).
I guess I'd have to rate clear cutting as a necessary evil. The NF does a pretty good job on the pieces i hunt in Va. 10 to 60 acre blocks of clear cut. Seems to help the deer and turkey hunting. The blocks of land set aside for wilderness seem to have the least game of any land in Va. Just my .02
Logging is wildlife's and a hunters best friend. Yes, we need clearcutting because wildlife need new grouth as well as mature timber. I wish they would cut and cut and then cut some more in kentucky.
I guess to me, forestry is an intigral part of wildlife management. There are things a timber company does strictly for the bottom line $. There are ways to help wildlife by cutting timber also. Different species need different stages of forests. If you were to take an open field of bare dirt and let it go it would eventually (in several thousand years) be an old growth forest. That is unless something happened to set back natural succession. Fires, tornados, hurricanes, etc all set back succession. Take the red cockaded wood precker. It needs older aged (mature) pine stands with a 3 year rotational burn. The burn is necessary to remove hardwood competition. This also leaves a grassy understory. This type of habitat is also great for turkeys and quail. The old mature hardwood stands are ok for turkeys, but can be poor for deer. Deer need thick areas to hide. Small openings such as a tree falling of a small patch cut (.25 to .5 acres) allows spots to be reset to an early successional stage. This provides the ground cover for deer browse and nesting habitat for turkeys. It also provides for diversity in a stand. This is both horizontal (differences along the ground), and vertically (structure from floor to crown). THese "Old Growth" stands everyone refers to are usually not the best over all forest conditions. You can see what are referred to as DFC's (desired forest conditions) for hardwood management at this link. http://www.lmvjv.org/library/DFC%20Report%20to%20LMVJV%202007.pdf
Now my take on clearcuts:
All about the $. Clearcuts are a boom and bust when it comes to wildlife habitat. Here in the south this is the life of a clearcut.
year 1 the forest is cut to the ground. this sets everything back to early succession. you get grasses and forbs. great for deer and good nesting habitat if there is adjacent areas to hold turkeys.
year 2 it has been planted and usually no doubt sprayed. This reduces the quality of the habitat. Depending on how intense the spray is, you can be left with pine trees and dirt.
for the next 10 years you go from boom to bust as the quality of the habitat degrades. this happens as the pine thicket closes up and shades out all competition. by 10 to 12 years you are left with pine trees and pine straw
you are SOL for the next 5 to 10 years.
year 15 to 20 you get the first thinning. This allows light to hit the ground. Browse and other valued plants start to come back in to the understory. This is usually good for deer and turkeys (and other non game species). This lasts for appx another 10 to 15 years. Then the canopy closes back up and you are left with poor habitat again.
year 30 to 45 (time frame) it is time for either a second thinning or clearcut depending on what the company wants out of the logs.
Time to cut again. Start this over again.
Clear cutting is one of the worst things for turkeys IME. Yes, it is good for one year of hunting and one year of nesting, but it's toast for over a decade afterwards. I've seen it ruin our lease. We have an 8500 acre lease that was once wrapped up in birds. Many years ago the timber co came in and cleared everything and now 90% of that 8500 acres is nothing but dense small pines with no undergrowth or solid briar thickets. The turkeys are nothing, not even close, to what they once were when we had large sections of large pine and oak that were open under the canopy. Turkeys do not like thickets at all and they hate dense small pine tracts as well. The few that remain are forced to move around each year to wherever the few cutovers or thinnings are. It's a joke, you have maybe 3-4 small areas on that size lease holding the few birds and about 30-40guys pounding the same places over and over on top of each other.
The best turkey management(or wildlife management for that matter) here is to leave a certain percentage of hardwood, a certain percentage of large pine, control burn under the large pine on rotation, cutover a certain percentage, thin a certain percentage, plant enough food plots, etc. Very few timber cos around here do this, they all come in a wipe out everything bigger than your leg, replant in dense qty, thin as soon as they can make a buck, and wipe it out again a few years later. No control burns, no food plots, no large trees, and no good turkey habitat. Private land is about the only way to manage anything the proper way.
The deer don't even care for the dense pine tracts, there's nothing to browse.
The good ole days of large timber and beatiful turkey habitat are gone in alot of areas soley due to the timber cos.
There is nothing wrong with timber operations, but there is a right way to help wildlife and a wrong way.
Have a good one,
Reloader
Quote from: Reloader on February 25, 2011, 11:08:49 AM
Clear cutting is one of the worst things for turkeys IME. Yes, it is good for one year of hunting and one year of nesting, but it's toast for over a decade afterwards. I've seen it ruin our lease. We have an 8500 acre lease that was once wrapped up in birds. Many years ago the timber co came in and cleared everything and now 90% of that 8500 acres is nothing but dense small pines with no undergrowth or solid briar thickets. The turkeys are nothing, not even close, to what they once were when we had large sections of large pine and oak that were open under the canopy. Turkeys do not like thickets at all and they hate dense small pine tracts as well. The few that remain are forced to move around each year to wherever the few cutovers or thinnings are. It's a joke, you have maybe 3-4 small areas on that size lease holding the few birds and about 30-40guys pounding the same places over and over on top of each other.
The best turkey management(or wildlife management for that matter) here is to leave a certain percentage of hardwood, a certain percentage of large pine, control burn under the large pine on rotation, cutover a certain percentage, thin a certain percentage, plant enough food plots, etc. Very few timber cos around here do this, they all come in a wipe out everything bigger than your leg, replant in dense qty, thin as soon as they can make a buck, and wipe it out again a few years later. No control burns, no food plots, no large trees, and no good turkey habitat. Private land is about the only way to manage anything the proper way.
The deer don't even care for the dense pine tracts, there's nothing to browse.
The good ole days of large timber and beatiful turkey habitat are gone in alot of areas soley due to the timber cos.
There is nothing wrong with timber operations, but there is a right way to help wildlife and a wrong way.
Have a good one,
Reloader
I think we belong to the same club! :lol: Hey Forester, I added BOFF to my Buddy List, thanks for your positive comment!