My hunting buddy just told me about hens being able to reproduce without the Toms. It's a process called parthenogenesis. Apparently when Toms are not available, a hen can produce fertilized eggs without mating with a male. If the eggs hatch, most will be toms.. In disbelief, I did a little research, and from what I can tell, it's true. Interesting!
What i believe they are capable of is storing semen. If they loose a couch of eggs they can self inseminate.
I think both are facts. Even the turkeys are trying to get rid of us 'useless men", LOL. Z
Depends what her pronouns are, I'd think.....
Quote from: mikejd on May 06, 2025, 08:34:13 AMWhat i believe they are capable of is storing semen. If they lose a clutch of eggs they can self-inseminate.
I agree with Mike. God made them male and female for a purpose and God never makes mistakes!
Here's a short read for domestic turkeys. https://backyardpoultry.iamcountryside.com/poultry-101/turkeys/breeding-hatching-and-brooding-turkeys/
Quote from: zelmo1 on May 06, 2025, 08:45:10 AMEven the turkeys are trying to get rid of us 'useless men", LOL. Z
Quote from: Yoder409 on May 06, 2025, 08:48:09 AMDepends what her pronouns are, I'd think.....
:TooFunny:
Did a little more checking, and according to Dr. Mike Chamberlain "The Wild Turkey Doc", this has never happened with wild turkeys. He said some guy talked about it on a podcast at one time, but just isn't true..and there you have it.
After the hen is mated, she'll lay fertile eggs for up to 10 days. The further out from the conception date, the lower the chance of fertility. If your tom is mating with your hens regularly, then eggs can be collected with consistent fertility.
Here's the part that tells us after mating, eggs CAN be fertilized by the hen and fertile for up to 10 days but are more fertile on day one and a lot less on day ten, so the tom maybe need to breed the hen multiple times to keep fertility high for each egg.
I wouldn't believe anything Mike Chamberlain said .
Not sure if it's possible or not but how could any "Dr" or anyone else say with any accuracy it's NEVER happened with wild turkeys?
Not sure where the 10 day limit was established. A hen can lose her clutch and re nest and hatch successfully without ever breeding again.
Most hens are bred by multiple Gobblers , not just one for genetic diversity.
A hen can lose her clutch and re nest and hatch successfully without ever breeding again.
No offence, but I find this to be an assumption. How do we know that the hen is never bred again when her clutch is destroyed? Any research? Tracking? Actual evidence? This is about fertility. An egg HAS to be fertile to develop into an embryo and into a living creature. No male, No fertility and Time diminishes fertility within the female. This is why the males seek out the females for long periods of time (several months), to copulate the species. Female turkeys do store semen to fertilize their eggs but as stated it is only for a very SHORT window of time. Then the hen must seek out the male to become fertile again, lay eggs that aren't fertile and never develop to maturity or go unbred the second go around for that year and not have a brood.
Quote from: turkeykiller41 on May 09, 2025, 05:33:52 PMI wouldn't believe anything Mike Chamberlain said .
Interesting statement. What is the reasoning behind your stance. Not trying to be argumentative as I just heard of the guy this spring and know very little about him.
I swear I learn a lot from posts on OG. I went down the rabbit hole on this one.
So yes, evidently parthogenesis in turkeys is a thing. Lots of scientific papers on it, all with domesticated turkeys. Parthenogenic eggs are rare, the ones that become parthenogenic have a low hatch rate, and only males are produced. It really has nothing to do with the hens being hermaphrodites. It's just that "some" unfertilized eggs will become parthenogenic. The explanation is more than I want to put in this post.
The reason parthenogenesis shouldn't occur in wild turkeys is that unbred wild turkey hens don't nest. Nesting requires breeding in wild turkeys. Domestic turkey hens will nest and sit on unfertilized eggs.
There's a long explanation there too. My own experience with raising wild and domestic turkeys side-by-side is that they act completely differently, even in a domesticated environment. Genetically they are the same species, behaviorally they are not.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Yeah research shows the sperm is viable up to 30 days. No offense but where did 10 days come from?
Any research? Studies? Actual evidence it's only 10?
No offense but I find this to be an assumption.
My statement of 10 days comes from the raising of domestic turkeys that I posted above. Domestic turkeys can be watched, studied and verified by breeders. I don't believe enough research and or verification can be associated with wild birds. As stated in this read, Fertility is the #1 reason for success or failure of a particular egg and #2 would be keeping the egg at the right temp. The longer, a hen stores the semen the less likely the egg will get fertilized and develop into an embryo. For this reason, it is important that the gobbler inseminate the hen multiple times to keep fertility HIGH. If a clutch of 10 to 12 eggs is destroyed and the hen only lays one egg per day (say 15 days from insemination), the hen needs to be bred more than once to ensure HIGH fertility. I believe that this is why, we as hunters, see Toms with hens for several months during our seasons before the males break up into their bachelor groups for the summer. :z-twocents:
Quote from: Ihuntoldschool on May 10, 2025, 09:55:05 AMYeah research shows the sperm is viable up to 30 days. No offense but where did 10 days come from?
Any research? Studies? Actual evidence it's only 10?
No offense but I find this to be an assumption.
Extrapolation from mammals and like you said, not accurate. 30 is pretty well accepted and it is quite possible it may be longer.
Quote from: g8rvet on May 10, 2025, 05:22:25 PM30 is pretty well accepted and it is quite possible it may be longer.
In the past, the accepted length of time hens could store viable semen after being bred was "up to" 60 days, plus or minus. Not sure how "they" determined that...and it seems a bit implausible to me...but that was the accepted (or at least speculated) number at that time.