I got an email from FL Fish and Wildlife today regarding proposed hunting changes. In a quick review I noticed several WMA's, especially in the south zone, are proposing bans on non-resident hunting for the first three days of the season.
I kind of don't blame them, but I kind of don't like this trend. At least it's only a three day thing and appears to be on WMA's who don't require a draw to hunt there. If you hunt FL, you may want to monitor this as it goes through the process of review.
As someone who lives in a destination hunt area, I say good for them and they should go further. It is sickening to see your local hunting ruined due to a plague of non-resident hunters.
Quote from: chow hound on October 02, 2024, 12:45:55 PMAs someone who lives in a destination hunt area, I say good for them and they should go further. It is sickening to see your local hunting ruined due to a plague of non-resident hunters.
I understand your feelings. I feel a bit sorry for FL turkey hunters. They often can't hunt turkey anywhere near where they live due to the draw system and non residents.
As a traveling hunter I hate to see these changes and how they impact my hunting. FL isn't the first to try and get a handle on non-resident turkey hunters, sadly they won't be the last. Look at what the elk hunting states deal with to get a look at where it all may head in the future.
I would rather have a turkey to hunt as no turkey at all... Times are changing...
I remember the early days of a few turkeys to hunt and I remember the days of hearing a lot of gobblers to hunt ... Hopefully the plan will help the turkeys for further hunters / hunts ...
Again time will tell...
Here is a list of the WMAs with the "prohibit non-residents from hunting wild turkey during the first 3 days of spring turkey season" proposal:
Big Cypress (non-quota portion)
Herky Huffman/Bull Creek
Jumper Creek
J.W. Corbett
Three Lakes
I know four of those WMAs see SIGNIFICANT amounts of NR pressure. I can't imagine how many NR man-days the proposal would take away.
There is also a turkey related quota proposal that is long overdue. See below:
QuoteIssuance of spring turkey quota permits to non-residents - establish that no more than 10% of spring turkey quota permits for each specific hunt may be issued to non-residents. Note: If the 10% calculation results in a number less than 1, then 1 permit could be issued to a non-resident.
This will be a significant blow to NR hunting, especially in the south zone. I've tracked quota draw data for years and years. One coveted WMA in particular routinely has half or more of the quota permits going to non-residents. Point creep will be SUBSTANTIAL in the south zone once this passes. All south zone quota hunts will take 5+ years to draw (not too far from it now) and opening hunts will take as many as 6-7 points as soon as this passes.
Lastly there is a license proposal to further milk money from non-residents:
QuoteLicense requirements for non-resident turkey hunters - require that non-resident turkey hunters purchase an annual non-resident hunting license to hunt wild turkey. Note: Currently, non-residents can purchase either a 10-day or annual non-resident hunting license to hunt wild turkey.
As a non-resident who was hunted Florida WMAs a bunch in my lifetime, I fully support ALL of these proposals.
Everything was fine and dandy up until about 2018 when something magical happened. Suddenly, South Florida began to be pimped out on YouTube. I tracked quota applications, NR license sales, etc and it is simply amazing what happened in a span of a few years in this social media era.
A few of us on this very forum warned of what all was to come. And now here we are! Hunting opportunity is diminishing at an astonishing pace and I'm not the least bit surprised as I predicted a lot of it.
It should be every state's priority to protect their resident hunting opportunities and hunt quality. Glad to see Florida has finally stepped up to the plate to do so. I got to have my fun there while it lasted. Although it makes me quite sad knowing future generations will never get to experience what some of us have in Florida due to the greed and lust for attention of a few folks.
I took the survey earlier and it made me sick. To think of what we had and what we now have on the turkey hunting horizon is truly devastating. The little money these fools made is being paid 100x in lost opportunities by blue collar hunters.
F THEM
LOOSE LIPS SINK SHIPS. SURELY YOU UNDERSTAND BY NOW.
Lots of positives in many of the proposals especially on the quota hunts, preference points, and redraws. NOTE - these don't appear to apply to the upcoming spring 2025 turkey season and would not be effective, for turkey, until the 2026 spring season. The 2025 Florida Spring Rules already posted on their web site. The private land "guides" should love this. They can now double their already exorbitant fees and have a captive audience. Be interesting how many of these changes will actually pass. There is still an extreme need for actual physical turkey tags and accountability of the unknown number of over 65 exempts.
Quote from: deerhunt1988 on October 02, 2024, 06:03:01 PMtil about 2018 when something magical happened. Suddenly, South Florida began to be pimped out on YouTube
What kills me is that it is almost always the non-residents pimping on social media and fielding all the non-resident questions for "where to go". No one ever pimps their home spot that they have hunted the last 10 years and plan to hunt for the next 10.
Quote from: chow hound on October 04, 2024, 03:20:41 PMQuote from: deerhunt1988 on October 02, 2024, 06:03:01 PMtil about 2018 when something magical happened. Suddenly, South Florida began to be pimped out on YouTube
What kills me is that it is almost always the non-residents pimping on social media and fielding all the non-resident questions for "where to go". No one ever pimps their home spot that they have hunted the last 10 years and plan to hunt for the next 10.
While I agree that YouTube, and hunting videos and shows in general, have fueled the problems we have on public lands nowadays, in my experience around here, the problem has been exacerbated by Facebook groups that are comprised of new/casual turkey hunters that are perfectly willing to announce to anyone looking at the page as to where to go hunting.
Many of the guys that frequent those FB groups just do not understand that telling anybody that wants to know exactly where they found birds to hunt...thinking they are doing a great service to their fellow hunters...are just eventually going to ruin those hunting locations for everybody.
I just shake my head every time I look at one of those Facebook groups and see someone...who I assume just doesn't know any better...telling the whole world exactly where he killed his gobbler. ::)
This would have been unheard of back in the early days of turkey hunting.
Social media , Facebook, videos aren't to blame. It's just the ignorance, stupidity of the people. We as a society are getting dumber with each generation. Social media is just the avenue they prefer to display their ignorance to the whole world. It's the "Look at me" generation.
Quote from: Ihuntoldschool on October 06, 2024, 02:57:30 PMThis would have been unheard of back in the early days of turkey hunting.
Social media , Facebook, videos aren't to blame. It's just the ignorance, stupidity of the people. We as a society are getting dumber with each generation. Social media is just the avenue they prefer to display their ignorance to the whole world. It's the "Look at me" generation.
There are a whole lot of people who's self-worth is determined by the "likes" or views they are getting on social media. Unfortunately, it spills over onto hunting and leads to an "ends justifies means" mentality where "ends" is a post on social media. Lots of unethical practices and no respect for the resources they pursue - all that matters is limits.
So living here in Florida I am glad state is attempting to do something. I doubt anything passes as our state leaders only care about dollars. Out of state hunting license needs to match our boarding states. $350 or more just for hunting license. Then up fees on every permit needed. Need to do the same with fishing license sales as well. The open comment section is wrote a nice list of changes that I feel are necessary. The survey didn't cover just our turkeys, most of my comments where about deer. Our pathetic way of logging deer and turkeys needs to change. I know this will get a bunch of non residents and residents mad. But it's beyond time to protect our wildlife. Might as well close the 1st 10 days of season to residents only. Up here in the north end we get blasted by out of staters until alabama opens up.
Sent from my SM-S918U1 using Tapatalk
To reiterate the current "Mandatory Reporting" is considered a big joke to many of the old school private land turkey hunters from rumors I have been hearing. Physical tags required for all, even the old geezer exempts, are needed in a big way. Florida has a long way to go for true accountability.
Quote from: joey46 on October 07, 2024, 07:19:07 AMTo reiterate the current "Mandatory Reporting" is considered a big joke to many of the old school private land turkey hunters from rumors I have been hearing. Physical tags required for all, even the old geezer exempts, are needed in a big way. Florida has a long way to go for true accountability.
People keep saying that but what is the real difference between physical tags or on line reporting? Get caught without a tag or unreported is the same thing. Outlaws will be outlaws regardless of the method they use to get around the law.
Everything is going digital, the states are pushing it. I don't see this one changing.
Thank goodness we have online tagging. We have no places left to carry game with physical tagging. The days of maw and paw country stories are a thing of the pass,for game checking stations. Before they decided to go to the mobile app, you could drive several miles and a couple of hours trying to find a place to physically check your kill. They tried a couple of our local convenience stores, but the help changed so much that it was pretty much useless...An outlaw will always be an outlaw regardless of what you do... So don't punish the good guys all the time. Mobile App checking is awesome ....
First off, I agree with the sentiment that there is no fool-proof system that will keep poachers from finding a way to get around any kind of tagging system. The best thing each of us can do is act as eyes and ears in an effort to report potential game law violators and hope the authorities follow up on it.
Having said that, assuming by "online tagging" we are referring to using either a cell phone or immediately available computer (or something similar), the question becomes what is the solution for those folks who do not live where there is uninterrupted cell service? Where some of us hunt, immediate online reporting is not possible because of that.
So...what happens to the guy who is trying to get to where he has cell service to legally report his kill and gets stopped and checked by a warden? ...Ticketed and game confiscated? ...Or not? Is the warden supposed to guess if this individual is "legal"...or is he supposed to assume everybody in this situation is a potential poacher?
I am not against online reporting, but I am firmly in the camp that some sort of physical tagging should be required at least until that online reporting can be completed with appropriate verification.
Personally, I prefer a physical tag that is attached to the game animal (small game excluded) wherever I hunt so that there is no question about my legality in any situation. I get stopped, I show the properly-filled-out tag on the tagged animal...and no questions asked... :icon_thumright:
Quote from: GobbleNut on October 07, 2024, 05:39:18 PMFirst off, I agree with the sentiment that there is no fool-proof system that will keep poachers from finding a way to get around any kind of tagging system. The best thing each of us can do is act as eyes and ears in an effort to report potential game law violators and hope the authorities follow up on it.
Having said that, assuming by "online tagging" we are referring to using either a cell phone or immediately available computer (or something similar), the question becomes what is the solution for those folks who do not live where there is uninterrupted cell service? Where some of us hunt, immediate online reporting is not possible because of that.
So...what happens to the guy who is trying to get to where he has cell service to legally report his kill and gets stopped and checked by a warden? ...Ticketed and game confiscated? ...Or not? Is the warden supposed to guess if this individual is "legal"...or is he supposed to assume everybody in this situation is a potential poacher?
I am not against online reporting, but I am firmly in the camp that some sort of physical tagging should be required at least until that online reporting can be completed with appropriate verification.
Personally, I prefer a physical tag that is attached to the game animal (small game excluded) wherever I hunt so that there is no question about my legality in any situation. I get stopped, I show the properly-filled-out tag on the tagged animal...and no questions asked... :icon_thumright:
So the online tagging. If you open the app you can add your kill. It automatically uploads when you get signal. But is stored in case you get stopped. My complaint with our tagging, I can tag it on paper and have to upload before I begin the cleaning process. Same as deer, hypothetically I get home without being stopped then I just throw tge paper in the fire. Animal not tagged and nobody knows any different.
Sent from my SM-S918U1 using Tapatalk
Quote from: roberthyman14 on October 07, 2024, 06:17:52 PMQuote from: GobbleNut on October 07, 2024, 05:39:18 PMFirst off, I agree with the sentiment that there is no fool-proof system that will keep poachers from finding a way to get around any kind of tagging system. The best thing each of us can do is act as eyes and ears in an effort to report potential game law violators and hope the authorities follow up on it.
Having said that, assuming by "online tagging" we are referring to using either a cell phone or immediately available computer (or something similar), the question becomes what is the solution for those folks who do not live where there is uninterrupted cell service? Where some of us hunt, immediate online reporting is not possible because of that.
So...what happens to the guy who is trying to get to where he has cell service to legally report his kill and gets stopped and checked by a warden? ...Ticketed and game confiscated? ...Or not? Is the warden supposed to guess if this individual is "legal"...or is he supposed to assume everybody in this situation is a potential poacher?
I am not against online reporting, but I am firmly in the camp that some sort of physical tagging should be required at least until that online reporting can be completed with appropriate verification.
Personally, I prefer a physical tag that is attached to the game animal (small game excluded) wherever I hunt so that there is no question about my legality in any situation. I get stopped, I show the properly-filled-out tag on the tagged animal...and no questions asked... :icon_thumright:
So the online tagging. If you open the app you can add your kill. It automatically uploads when you get signal. But is stored in case you get stopped. My complaint with our tagging, I can tag it on paper and have to upload before I begin the cleaning process. Same as deer, hypothetically I get home without being stopped then I just throw tge paper in the fire. Animal not tagged and nobody knows any different.
Thanks for the clarification. I was not aware that the harvest report could be stored online without cell service. If that is the case, then the online tagging system makes complete sense (obviously requires each hunter to carry a cell phone with an adequately-charged battery to report, I would guess ;D ).
In my state, we have the choice between online reporting via "E-Tag" or getting a physical tag. I always request the physical tag mainly because I just feel more comfortable with it.
Either system can be circumvented by those who are inclined to do so, I suppose, but if there is a time stamp associated with the online system such that the harvest time was noted even without cell service, that would be a good deterrent for those who might try to get an animal home without reporting the kill immediately.
Quote from: GobbleNut on October 08, 2024, 09:40:53 AMQuote from: roberthyman14 on October 07, 2024, 06:17:52 PMQuote from: GobbleNut on October 07, 2024, 05:39:18 PMFirst off, I agree with the sentiment that there is no fool-proof system that will keep poachers from finding a way to get around any kind of tagging system. The best thing each of us can do is act as eyes and ears in an effort to report potential game law violators and hope the authorities follow up on it.
Having said that, assuming by "online tagging" we are referring to using either a cell phone or immediately available computer (or something similar), the question becomes what is the solution for those folks who do not live where there is uninterrupted cell service? Where some of us hunt, immediate online reporting is not possible because of that.
So...what happens to the guy who is trying to get to where he has cell service to legally report his kill and gets stopped and checked by a warden? ...Ticketed and game confiscated? ...Or not? Is the warden supposed to guess if this individual is "legal"...or is he supposed to assume everybody in this situation is a potential poacher?
I am not against online reporting, but I am firmly in the camp that some sort of physical tagging should be required at least until that online reporting can be completed with appropriate verification.
Personally, I prefer a physical tag that is attached to the game animal (small game excluded) wherever I hunt so that there is no question about my legality in any situation. I get stopped, I show the properly-filled-out tag on the tagged animal...and no questions asked... :icon_thumright:
So the online tagging. If you open the app you can add your kill. It automatically uploads when you get signal. But is stored in case you get stopped. My complaint with our tagging, I can tag it on paper and have to upload before I begin the cleaning process. Same as deer, hypothetically I get home without being stopped then I just throw tge paper in the fire. Animal not tagged and nobody knows any different.
Thanks for the clarification. I was not aware that the harvest report could be stored online without cell service. If that is the case, then the online tagging system makes complete sense (obviously requires each hunter to carry a cell phone with an adequately-charged battery to report, I would guess ;D ).
In my state, we have the choice between online reporting via "E-Tag" or getting a physical tag. I always request the physical tag mainly because I just feel more comfortable with it.
Either system can be circumvented by those who are inclined to do so, I suppose, but if there is a time stamp associated with the online system such that the harvest time was noted even without cell service, that would be a good deterrent for those who might try to get an animal home without reporting the kill immediately.
Our other option is to write it on a piece of paper. Then call it in or use online app when home. But before beginning to process or clean animal. If we had a true tag to place around animal plus call in to report. It would slow down the poachers a little bit.
Sent from my SM-S918U1 using Tapatalk
Yes, regardless of cell service or not you can still open the app and put the information into your tagging app. You also have the option to print off manual tags days before going hunting if you don't own a cell phone and write down the information on your manual tag.
My experiences with the FWC
1 the south zone was originally only 1 week before the central 35 years ago they moved it 2 weeks early , I told them this would happen with everyone in the whole state would booty call the south zone ..not to mention the rest of the country
2 )every near state has moved their seasons forward a few weeks , this makes it even more tempting to travel to fl south zone
3) the fwc are going to do whatever they deem fit , the public comment section is purely for show , 1 person out 100 will agree with what they want and then go for it, seen it many times, it's as good as done
4) the fwc are IDIOTS there are countless loopholes to apply for permits without even buying a license, fix that
5) no more Jake's...fix that just like Arkansas and Mississippi did
6 ) make the entire state 1 zonebwith the same opening date
Whew! Little strong there OG. I personally agree that a one date start for the entire state would really spread the pressure and help enormously. Adding a preference point only option to the quota draws would help also. I know several that know they won't have enough points to draw what they want but put in for lesser areas just to get the year's point. If they do draw then they return the permit and it goes into a no point lottery. The Florida system has a long way to go but for my hundredth time will emphasize that until all the unknown number of exempts are accounted for, with even a free required license, the harvest totals will always be suspect.
Quote from: Tail Feathers on October 07, 2024, 09:18:06 AMQuote from: joey46 on October 07, 2024, 07:19:07 AMTo reiterate the current "Mandatory Reporting" is considered a big joke to many of the old school private land turkey hunters from rumors I have been hearing. Physical tags required for all, even the old geezer exempts, are needed in a big way. Florida has a long way to go for true accountability.
People keep saying that but what is the real difference between physical tags or on line reporting? Get caught without a tag or unreported is the same thing. Outlaws will be outlaws regardless of the method they use to get around the law.
Everything is going digital, the states are pushing it. I don't see this one changing.
Harder to cheat with physical tags
You at least have to actually have one on you, and once attached, you can't remove it.
Online, you can technically have everything typed in ready to hit save at a moments notice. Get to car, see it's clear and key without reporting.
Think of it like paper you just write on (which is worse). Get home and throw it away and start over
There's just more ways to cheat when it's not a physical hard tag.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro