Is anybody aware of data regarding the wounding and non-recovery rate of spring gobblers shot with archery equipment? I believe there are several states with archery-only spring hunts, any reports from them?
I haven't seen numbers but I had a turkey biologist tell me a wounded bird is pretty much a dead bird. I know there's pictures of a one legged hen out there or stories about pulling shot out of a turkey breast that had healed up but I'd say those are the rare exceptions. Me personally. I've only ever wounded one bird I didn't recover. Despite not recovering it I considered a kill and limited myself to my one remaining tag for that spring season.
I haven't seen any statistics on this, but I would suspect that, in terms of overall numbers, archery losses are a fraction of what firearms losses are. Not sure how many serious archery turkey hunters there are, but I guessing there are not a lot of them out there. Just can't imagine that wounding-loss rates are significant. It would be interesting to know if there are any statistics on it, however. :icon_thumright:
Imo statistics could only be a guess anyhow. Who's gonna report not killing, missing, etc. Imo we don't want that advertised anyway. Everything gets used against us and not a thing for us
I stopped trying for fall archery birds because my skills were not good enough. My bow shots on deer were within a pie plate at 30 yards but not within a softball at that range. Shoot and pray not the best scenario. The big birds deserve better
Quote from: joey46 on November 27, 2023, 05:32:18 PM
I stopped trying for fall archery birds because my skills were not good enough. My bow shots on deer were within a pie plate at 30 yards but not within a softball at that range. Shoot and pray not the best scenario. The big birds deserve better
Kudos to you my friend to know when to quit doing something when you skills are not what they used to be. I loved compound bow hunting for over 20 years, but realized as I got older, I couldn't group the arrows like I used to. I switched to crossbow now, it keeps me in the Archery woods every year, I love to hunt the rut.....be well
In my time bow hunting birds. I've personally only had 1 that I never recovered. It was also my first one I ever shot at. I was young and unaware on where to aim. I've got my "spot" on the bird now and I haven't lost a single one since.
I know plenty of people who lose them though. It's a shame. Lots don't care.
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Appreciate the open and honest comments by Brinkcalls and Joey46.
I have and continue to archery hunt for deer and elk. But hearing from folks I trust, and watching YouTube archery gobbler hunts... I can't help but wonder what the impacts would be should bowhunting gobblers become incentivized.
And I'm not necessarily concerned about hardcore bowhunters doing it because that's what they do. What gives me pause is thinking about turkey hunters who are ONLY archery hunting because of an incentive for increased opportunity, like an early season or an extra tag.
Agencies have made efforts to determine wounding loss in deer. Google: "Wounding Rates of White-tailed Deer with Modern Archery Equipment". Just haven't seen anything yet for turkeys, though I'm not surprised by that.
I thought about going out archery hunting for turkeys, but I know my limitations even with a crossbow.
I feel bad enough not recovering a deer I shot (for whatever reason) so I wouldn't want to fling an arrow or bolt at a turkey knowing my success rate isn't that high to begin with.
Kudos for those who do so consistently, but it's not cup of tea.
Fellas there's nothing mysterious bout shooting a bow. It's all about doing things the same and age has nothing to do with it. Many of us were not taught correctly and that becomes a problem. For instance non bone on bone shooting is less consistent and would change as we age, tire, etc Incorrect grips are also problematic, same for release, etc.
Not to toot any horn but I've got double certifications for archery instruction and would gladly help. I've taught plenty of people even with physical issues so that's not an issue. Want nothing in return so just ask. Be a pleasure to see guys stay with bows
I once knew a guy who hunted with one of the early big time video guys and a famous call maker. He traveled the country with them and he told me that crew lost more than half the birds they shot with bows. That was in the late 80s and 90s. He got so upset with the whole thing that he quit hunting with them. He was a sportsman's sportsman and loved turkey hunting and he thought it was just profiteering at the bird's expense. All that is kind of off topic, but the fact remains many birds are lost. I think modern equipment has improved the recovery rate, but it's still a problem. I wonder, do a lot of hunters bow hunt to get the recognition of a bow kill or just because they love bow hunting. I am against extra seasons just for archery, they do put people in the woods who are not true bow hunters, but opportunist.
Eggshell I hear you about the guys hunting archery aren't archers but how many gun hunt the same way? I can name plenty gun and archery guys that are equally bad. No excuses for them. They shouldn't be out there.
And Not discounting what you're saying but it's up to all of us to take only responsible shots within our and our chosen equipment's effective range. It should be noted, effective range under pressure.
The high loss in that scenario imo was guys forcing shots they shouldn't in order to get content
Quote from: Bowguy on November 28, 2023, 08:14:20 AM
Eggshell I hear you about the guys hunting archery aren't archers but how many gun hunt the same way? I can name plenty gun and archery guys that are equally bad. No excuses for them. They shouldn't be out there.
And Not discounting what you're saying but it's up to all of us to take only responsible shots within our and our chosen equipment's effective range. It should be noted, effective range under pressure.
The high loss in that scenario imo was guys forcing shots they shouldn't in order to get content
I agree Bowguy. I think back to my own history of turkey hunting. I had no mentors and was on my own as a young man. I have lost some birds with a shotgun and almost all of them were in my early days of turkey hunting. I would get so impatient and shook up I'd rush a shot or shoot too soon and lose birds. Thankfully I did learn from those experiences and with time I learned to calm down and be disciplined about my shooting a gobbler. After a few seasons I learned to enjoy the thrill but calmly make it business too. I still lost a bird or two in the last couple decades, but not because I got rattled. Everyone will have it happen some no matter how good you are, a pattern gets eat up by a branch, you misjudge distance or a bird moves suddenly....When I ran a check station it was unsettling how many times guys come in and said they took a long shot on a bird, but didn't get him. I will also tell you most misses are still hit birds. It may not be fatal, but it's a wound. What I consider lost is a bird severely injured but still can move good enough to get away. I have seen this on a bunch of commercial videos, especially peripheral birds. This spring will be my 53rd spring turkey season hunting 9 states and killing a couple birds along the way, and I worked for the Division of Wildlife 30+ years, so yes I have a pretty good perspective on what is going on
Imo it's not great when guys are starting out and make mistakes but with no mentor it's almost unfortunately a given. Thats why it's important we help new folks and pass on ethics. It's very lacking these days though. It's worse when experienced guys poke and hope like I bet the video guys were doing.
Good mentors are a big deal. When I take newbies and I sit them down I give them landmarks to shoot by. As in, "when he gets inside that tree take the first clean shot, no brush busting. I also tell them break my rules and your gonna get a butt chewing and I'll bring it up over and over. I don't abandon them but they might abandon me. I use the baseball method, three strikes and your out. Actually a friend and I just discussed starting a youth mentoring group for hunting and fishing the other day. Don't expect better from those never taught better, its a problem all through our culture right now.
In my experience. If they fly, and no legs are hanging, dude they're gone. They cover SO much ground, if it happens on a ridge. That bird could literally go a half mile plus!
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Quote from: eggshell on November 28, 2023, 12:40:21 PM
Good mentors are a big deal. When I take newbies and I sit them down I give them landmarks to shoot by. As in, "when he gets inside that tree take the first clean shot, no brush busting. I also tell them break my rules and your gonna get a butt chewing and I'll bring it up over and over. I don't abandon them but they might abandon me. I use the baseball method, three strikes and your out. Actually a friend and I just discussed starting a youth mentoring group for hunting and fishing the other day. Don't expect better from those never taught better, its a problem all through our culture right now.
I've never needed a 3 strikes rule. I never believe in warnings per se. A mistake will be explained though I've never had anyone child or adult not follow what I ask. Even asking kids wait for better opportunities when a decent one was already present. Point is we gotta show em right no matter how we achieve that. God Bless ya for doing so eggshell
Quote from: mcw3734 on November 27, 2023, 11:50:24 PM
Appreciate the open and honest comments by Brinkcalls and Joey46.
I have and continue to archery hunt for deer and elk. But hearing from folks I trust, and watching YouTube archery gobbler hunts... I can't help but wonder what the impacts would be should bowhunting gobblers become incentivized.
And I'm not necessarily concerned about hardcore bowhunters doing it because that's what they do. What gives me pause is thinking about turkey hunters who are ONLY archery hunting because of an incentive for increased opportunity, like an early season or an extra tag.
Agencies have made efforts to determine wounding loss in deer. Google: "Wounding Rates of White-tailed Deer with Modern Archery Equipment". Just haven't seen anything yet for turkeys, though I'm not surprised by that.
They are more likely to Archery hunt turkeys because their favorite YouTuber bow hunted them than they are based on season structure
When THP makes a fist pumping video over an archery killed gobbler, watch the **** out. Everyone will be asking "what bow do we (run) for turkey season"
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Quote from: sasquatch1 on December 04, 2023, 12:37:09 PM
Quote from: mcw3734 on November 27, 2023, 11:50:24 PM
Appreciate the open and honest comments by Brinkcalls and Joey46.
I have and continue to archery hunt for deer and elk. But hearing from folks I trust, and watching YouTube archery gobbler hunts... I can't help but wonder what the impacts would be should bowhunting gobblers become incentivized.
And I'm not necessarily concerned about hardcore bowhunters doing it because that's what they do. What gives me pause is thinking about turkey hunters who are ONLY archery hunting because of an incentive for increased opportunity, like an early season or an extra tag.
Agencies have made efforts to determine wounding loss in deer. Google: "Wounding Rates of White-tailed Deer with Modern Archery Equipment". Just haven't seen anything yet for turkeys, though I'm not surprised by that.
They are more likely to Archery hunt turkeys because their favorite YouTuber bow hunted them than they are based on season structure
When THP makes a fist pumping video over an archery killed gobbler, watch the **** out. Everyone will be asking "what bow do we (run) for turkey season"
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God I hope not... that would be a real kick in the knackers. The public land mobile deer hunting is getting out of hand as is.
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I think 3.5 shells and tungsten wound more birds because people think they can now blast one at 80-90 yards. Same with guys taking long shots on deer with a crossbow. I have no problem with crossbows or magnum shells. If the animal is inside an ethical range it'll help you get the job done, but it shouldn't be an excuse to extend your range.