One thing Florida FWC does that I really like is sends out e-mails/surveys where you can comment on proposed changes. I'm going through them now here is one of the items proposed:
(https://i.imgur.com/x3HdHQS.png)
Currently, a non-resident only needs a ~$27 WMA permit to apply for quota hunts. If this regulation passes, NR would need an additional $125 turkey permit each year just to apply! So NR would be looking at $150 each year to apply for WMA quotas. WOW! Seeing as a lot of quota hunts now take 2-3+ points to draw, a NR could easily be looking at $500 in fees to hunt their desired area.
Their draw system needs modifications, but I don't think this is the best route to start pricing out turkey hunters. They could simply put a cap on the amount of NR drawn per hunt. But that isn't going to make them as much money as this proposal would.
As many of us on here have been saying for years, the mass commercialization and exploitation of our public land resources is slowly turning wild turkey hunting into western big game hunting. I'd really like to see a proposal to prohibit commercial filming on Florida's WMAs. I can only imagine the extra interest in south Florida turkey hunting after the Meateater episode filmed down there on a WMA this past spring hits the air. One YouTube channel already did substantial damage, and there seems to be no end in sight.
For those of you who wish to comment on Florida's proposed rules, go to this link:
https://www.research.net/r/2024-25-FWC-Proposed-Rules
See reply above on same topic.
btw - I'm still waiting on my FOIA request for the totals from the 2023 spring Florida turkey season on ALL WMAs.
For assistance on turkey harvest in Florida contact the Florida state chapter nwtf they will help you.
Florida state chapter nwtf district biologists
I have 0 problems with that. Except....they will have to do this for all WMA and public, otherwise we all know what will happen to those.
They have the only Osceola turkey in the country, come and pay for it on public ground.
The question is to me, what will this do to lease prices if anything.
They have turkey harvest totals for all 67 counties and all 139 WMAs in the state since they implemented the mandatory check in system in the fall of 2022. They have the same for the mandatory checking of deer. The entire list of deer taken on all WMAs is posted on a thread on Floridaoutdoorforums.com. Why is this information so hard to obtain for turkeys? A guy on this forum has already mentioned he requested both deer and turkey harvest numbers but has only received deer. I don't believe they can legally ignore a FOIA request forever. Try as they may. Multiple states have mandatory check in systems. I haven't found any that hide their results and not have them posted on their web sites.
I go to FL most years. I feel for the FL resident turkey hunters. This doesn't upset me, FL will probably become more restrictive in coming years.
Quotas will be the wave of the future. Might go hand and hand in with the requirement to first buy a permit prior to application. Be interesting.
With the urban expansion in Florida and elsewhere, we one day may wish we'd have paid more if those lands get developed and lost. It does however seem a little expensive for a turkey but...
Buying, keeping, and managing public properties isn't cheap. The cost of the average wma permit is along the lines of thievery for what if provides us access too. Sadly that won't be realized until it's one day gone.
Nathan, and idea of what kind of money that would equate to yearly for the state? Anyone know how many NR been applying to do the math?
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That info availability probably requires a FOIA request. Over the years people have obtained the numbers that apply for various quota hunts. Whether they are broken down as resident or non-res I don't know. Under the current system it would not make any difference.
That's sad news! Now the outfitters will really jack up their already outrageous hunting prices. Unless I hit the lottery I will probably never go back.
There is a big difference between proposed and done. Wait and see how the politicians react. They love the non-res money.
For so many the Florida Osceola is a one and done (I PM a few guys every year). After getting that part of a slam they are satisfied and don't return anyway. This may not make as much difference as many think. If it takes four years and five hundred dollars to draw a hunt so be it. It would cost me close to that to hunt a few southern states now under some of these new restrictions and money grabs being implemented to discourage the non-res throughout the south. For the record I am a FL resident and have 7 preference points built up and may not draw the area I want this spring. Thinking two or three preference points will get you a "can't miss" Florida WMA is a pipe dream. The Osceola may become as hard to draw as a Big Horn Sheep. A once in a lifetime experience.
Seems shrewd to me. This is a good start at controlling Osceola public land craziness. Should satisfy residents by giving them an edge and stands to generate more money (who knows, maybe for tags and habitat work). I'll pay it and maybe have a chance at going back sooner. Hope they do more.
I don't like tit-for-tat but it cost $500 just for non-res licenses in GA. So seems like a small price to pay considering most states fees.
Quote from: Crghss on October 17, 2023, 07:39:13 PM
I don't like tit-for-tat but it cost $500 just for non-res licenses in GA. So seems like a small price to pay considering most states fees.
Georgia definitely needs to revamp their quota hunt system. I'm sitting on like 8 turkey points as a non-resident since its free to apply. Even collecting deer points now, because why not? It is free!
The Meateater episode mentioned just aired . Unless I missed it the specific WMA was not disclosed. Most can make educated guesses. Oh well.
I "voted" no on that. I don't think jacking up prices is the answer. We have enough inflation these days. NR permits should just be capped like other states do imo.
I wonder how many points Rinella had when he pulled that permit?
Yes they should cap the non-resident numbers but that money may be too good for it to happen. As for Meateater I watched it again and the specific WMA would only be a guess. Betting it is a two per permit but only per hunter area since his buddy Janis also had a permit which would narrow it down some. There was never a mention of the 2023 mandatory call in system so it was probably a 2022 or earlier hunt. The local guy was carrying a Thermocell. I don't get out of the truck in the pre dawn without one. Good luck.
Quote from: FLTurkHntr on November 12, 2023, 07:15:45 PM
I "voted" no on that. I don't think jacking up prices is the answer. We have enough inflation these days. NR permits should just be capped like other states do imo.
I wonder how many points Rinella had when he pulled that permit?
I didn't see anything in their proposal about increasing ANY of the prices of permits. The permit prices haven't changed in years, while everything else certainly has. Instead, it's a proposal to require a permit (that is already required anyway when hunting) when applying.
Like you, I'm okay with capping the number of permits but that apparently isn't on the table. Something needs to be done. For those reasons, I "voted" yes.
They are going to do it ...they are in a funding crisis and money talks , and they fully well know how valuable the permits are. ...don't even get me started on antis getting permits
People have done all kinds of nefarious activities with the permits up to and including all out selling them
The other major loophole is that Florida residents have been applying with just a 26 dollar management stamp and not buying the rest ...underfunding the fwc , and pushing out real hunters
Yeah, Florida is not Hunter friendly for a red state imo. Lots of issues. There should be plenty of money for a robust FWC.
I know I'm repeating myself but the "Exempts" are the biggest hole in the FWC system. The over 65 resident pays ZERO to hunt, fish or apply for the regular quota hunts. ZERO and this in a state with a big population way over 65. That's a political move and nothing more. Most aren't even counted for matching PR money. It's a joke to then whine about no money.
If you didn't apply for Florida spring 2024 quota hunts you missed the boat. Deadline was 11/30. Now we sit back and wait to see who got drawn and hope for no glitches. There were glitches for some Special Op deer draws recently. Fingers crossed that my 6 preference points were enough. Results probably out early tomorrow.
I don't see this as a problem to curtail Nonresidents since many states are already doing this. My question is to the residents of Florida is, what are these fees going to be used for??? It's all well and good to raise and collect these fees but DNR needs to be accountable to the people of Florida and ONLY use these fees to keep and restore the Osceola Turkey population. Has DNR given an answer to this question or have the Resident Hunters ask for specifics???
Quote from: bbcoach on December 03, 2023, 07:30:24 AM
I don't see this as a problem to curtail Nonresidents since many states are already doing this. My question is to the residents of Florida is, what are these fees going to be used for??? It's all well and good to raise and collect these fees but DNR needs to be accountable to the people of Florida and ONLY use these fees to keep and restore the Osceola Turkey population. Has DNR given an answer to this question or have the Resident Hunters ask for specifics???
Hopefully more of the same type of habitat work... This is good use of permit money, in my opinion.
https://myfwc.com/media/30017/2021-22wildturkeypermitreport.pdf
alot of good info in that report
"FLNWTF contributed $65,500"
That was something that stuck out to me, that number is alot lower than I expected it to be
Nice report!
NWTF used to support a few southern WMAs so I supported; not so much now.
Quote from: joey46 on December 03, 2023, 07:09:31 AM
If you didn't apply for Florida spring 2024 quota hunts you missed the boat. Deadline was 11/30. Now we sit back and wait to see who got drawn and hope for no glitches. There were glitches for some Special Op deer draws recently. Fingers crossed that my 6 preference points were enough. Results probably out early tomorrow.
Results just posted. I did get the hunt I wanted. The 6 preference points were enough. Whew!
Swing and a miss with 0 points
Quote from: squidd on December 06, 2023, 07:15:06 PM
Swing and a miss with 0 points
Good luck in the future. Between myself and my buddy (when drawn we go as each other's guest and the other banks his points) we figure one good draw every four years minimum. I drew in 2017, he drew in 2022, I drew for 2024 with the 6 points built from 2017. Hope everyone is noticing the results of Grand Slam Fever. It is a very frustrating game at times especially for the residents who get no edge in these type drawings.
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Quote from: joey46 on December 07, 2023, 05:18:54 AM
Quote from: squidd on December 06, 2023, 07:15:06 PM
Swing and a miss with 0 points
Good luck in the future. Between myself and my buddy (when drawn we go as each other's guest and the other banks his points) we figure one good draw every four years minimum. I drew in 2017, he drew in 2022, I drew for 2024 with the 6 points built from 2017. Hope everyone is noticing the results of Grand Slam Fever. It is a very frustrating game at times especially for the residents who get no edge in these type drawings.
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When the subject came up earlier this year on how to do a records request, I requested the applicants for the special opportunity hunts. I was blown away by the amount of out of state people pouring money into that system for only 10% of the permits. I was even more blown away by seeing the same names (locals) putting up piles of money on every single wma, especially knowing one of them sells Osceola hunts. Makes we wonder how long it will be before more of our WMA's are in the special opportunity system
With Special Op Permits being transferrable there will always be shenanigans with that system. It is obviously why you see outfitters trying to draw them. There have always been rumors that a S O permit for some areas can bring big $$$. Even the current general quota system has it's flaws with many "guiding", unofficially of course (LOL), with their guest permits. There is big money involved in the Osceola. Too bad.
Quote from: joey46 on December 07, 2023, 05:18:54 AM
Hope everyone is noticing the results of Grand Slam Fever. It is a very frustrating game at times especially for the residents who get no edge in these type drawings.
.
Not just grand slam fever. I've been tracking draw data for a long time. Just so happens non-resident applications to south zone WMAs started to sky rocket when those WMAs started being pimped out on YouTube. Drastic difference in NR applicants once we entered the YouTube/social media era. One particular south zone WMA saw non-resident apps increase 8x from 2018 to 2021. The increase was 230% for all south zone WMAs combined.
At this point it is like modern day market hunting. Pimping out public lands and killing wildlife for profit.
I often read comments on other forums whining that FWC severely limits hunter numbers with the current quota system. With the information you received with your FOIA request maybe they don't limit them enough for some areas. Be interesting how this all shakes out over the next few seasons.
Quote from: deerhunt1988 on December 07, 2023, 07:52:00 PM
Quote from: joey46 on December 07, 2023, 05:18:54 AM
Hope everyone is noticing the results of Grand Slam Fever. It is a very frustrating game at times especially for the residents who get no edge in these type drawings.
.
Not just grand slam fever. I've been tracking draw data for a long time. Just so happens non-resident applications to south zone WMAs started to sky rocket when those WMAs started being pimped out on YouTube. Drastic difference in NR applicants once we entered the YouTube/social media era. One particular south zone WMA saw non-resident apps increase 8x from 2018 to 2021. The increase was 230% for all south zone WMAs combined.
At this point it is like modern day market hunting. Pimping out public lands and killing wildlife for profit.
Dwindling supply in a what's basically free market economy has a way of doing that. There might be a few things to slow it down but it's foolish to expect the trend will reverse.