This is why I wear snake gaiters. I was reading this post the other day in a National snake bite support group on Facebook. Wow these two stories are scary. I have heard of other people having a fast reaction like this. I I know it's pretty rare but be careful out there.
From Chris Harper, a paramedic with austere medicine training:
"In actuality I think species is going to be the most important aspect of the snakebite situation in the north Georgia mountains. With a copperhead, you're probably going to be able to make it out on your own. Probably. Maybe. With the timber rattlesnake, location being hand-foot-leg-arm, you can certainly be incapacitated within 15 to 30 minutes. But yes, size of the snake, location of the bite, and amount of venom injected are all paramount variables. A memorable case that I consulted on was a 30-year-old male bitten on the calf by a snake that he did not see. He arrived at the emergency room by car within 20 minutes of the bite, eyes rolled back in his head, foaming at the mouth with no palpable radial pulses. In that area that could only be a timber rattlesnake, and I suspected he was transported in a sitting position, which is not conducive to perfusion of the brain when you are in profound shock. Initially, the drop in blood pressure seems to be the biggest issue with timber rattlesnakes in Georgia, and that's what was going on with him. They were able to get 10 vials of anti-venom in him and get him shipped to a larger hospital. In a personal conversation with venom toxinologist Dr. Bryan Fry many years ago, he advised me that the most likely culprit causing this massive blood pressure drop was a very tiny molecule, about 10 amino acids long, that perfused readily throughout the body. Another bite that I consulted on was to a healthy 25-year-old male patient, bitten on the hand, and he was incapacitated within 10 minutes or so. His buddy could not get him out. EMS had to extricate him and fly him out. So personally, if I were out in the mountains alone and I was bitten by timber rattlesnake, I would just make sure that I had a way to call for help, using one of the Spot GPS satellite devices maybe. Then I would lie down in the "recovery position" [Google it] and hope someone got to me. Preferably, put yourself in a location where you can be found easily. If you have a cell phone signal, call 911 and give a description of your location. If you have barely a signal, try texting to someone you trust. It takes a lot less power to text via radio signal than it does to carry a voice signal.
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(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20230426/ce550481f239812f23beed824c6eb9b5.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20230426/6a60e5c36e0e86088daf2dcfc73474e1.jpg)
A couple snakes from the last few turkey seasons
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I sat down next to a timber rattler last week . I was lucky it was a cool morning and he never moved nothing but his tongue.
I scooted over a bit to give him room , I got the gobbler , then got him to . I run into snakes here in the dirty south regularly, but this one was a little to close .
Quote from: Howieg on April 26, 2023, 05:30:04 PM
I sat down next to a timber rattler last week . I was lucky it was a cool morning and he never moved nothing but his tongue.
I scooted over a bit to give him room , I got the gobbler , then got him to . I run into snakes here in the dirty south regularly, but this one was a little to close .
I've almost stepped over two in cooler weather. As long as they are frozen up we're ok. If it's hot I'd appreciate a courtesy rattle.
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Recovery Position.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GmqXqwSV3bo&t=1s
Yes the timber rattler scares me being if they are laying straight out they blend in so well with leaves and are prone to not rattle until you are inches away. If they are already in a coiled position you get a lot more warning.
I've been in the woods and swamps all over this nation for most of my 67 years along with several foreign countries.
Surprisingly, I have had only a few scary snake encounters, but had a close call last week in the Gila NF in NM. My wife and I had hiked about 2 miles from our vehicle and climbed a fairly steep mountain to better hear and prospect.
We were coming out along a narrow game trail with my wife maybe a couple feet in front. As my wife stepped forward, I heard a rattle very close and instantly jumped forward and to my left. My wife's boot track was within a foot of a coiled and angry rattlesnake that was partially under a rock with about 6" of space underneath it. Fortunately it was 55 degrees that midmorning rather than 75-77 that afternoon.
It all happened so fast, but we both realized it would have been a bad predicament for either of us had we been bitten. There was no cell service and it would have taken quite a while for one of us to make it out, drive for a place with cell service and hopefully get a helicopter in.
It would have been about 90 minutes just to get to cell coverage.
We were wearing low cut hikers. I'll probably continue that but it does make me consider reevaluating things.
I was made fun of when hunting Ocellated turkeys with Lovett Williams in Guatemala 20 or so years ago. It was incredibly hot, but there was a very lethal snake there called a fer-de-lance. In less than an hour you would most likely be dead if bitten. Most guys were wearing low top shoes, even canvas shoes. I wore snake boots for insurance. We actually killed a fer-de-lance in camp and the other camp had 6 play a visit.
When hunting a remote area where help is going to be difficult, one has to make a decision on risks vs comfort. Perhaps in my old age, I'm not afraid of dying, but in reality probably should wear protection.
Never understood how an outdoorsman can be afraid of a snake.
They can make fun of me all they want for wearing snake boots; I'll even wear the T shirt. I realize that I have hunted for 50+ years and never been bitten but it only takes one misstep. I want to be able to move quickly without having to guard every step I take. I have taken care of many snake bites over the years and they are not pretty. In Tennessee, they are mostly copperheads and water moccasins. These snakes have the blood and tissue toxins. They are extremely painful and there can be a lot of a local tissue swelling and death. The timber rattler also has a neurotoxin which can be markedly more dangerous, even deadly. Most of us spray our clothes with permethrin to avoid tick borne diseases and they are a lot less dangerous and easier to treat than snake bites. For me, snake boots are just as comfortable and provide incredible piece of mind.
Quote from: davisd9 on April 26, 2023, 08:47:52 PM
Never understood how an outdoorsman can be afraid of a snake.
Lol ,, huge difference in sceard and respect ...
I read a book about ten different fellows who had been snake bit (about half of them were game wardens), and reading what happened to them and how fast it happened made me get some snake boots (About half of them died). But Never wore snake boots until about four years ago, but now would not wear anything else. Not just for the protection, but you get used to wearing them and the extra support through your ankles, and as a result, regular 8-9 inch hiking boots just do not feel right to me anymore.
Do your research and make sure the boots you choose have been truly tested to stand up to a snake's fangs. From what I found; some are more resistant than actually snake proof. I hunt mtns, and if a timber rattler bites me, I know I am not going to make it out alive. Just too far off the beaten path and I am bad to hunt alone.
Hunted for right at 30 years without them and had a few close calls, even stepping on one one day and somehow, he did not bite me, but decided about four years ago to just wear them all the time, even in deer season when it is pretty cold.
On very steep hills and such or crossing creeks with a higher bank, make a conscious effort about where you place your hands as well.
Fortunate to receive the courtesy rattle last year in Pennsylvania....
https://youtube.com/shorts/40bzC5PkRls?feature=share
**camera phone on ZOOM - I was NOT that close!
Quote from: Howieg on April 26, 2023, 09:02:54 PM
Quote from: davisd9 on April 26, 2023, 08:47:52 PM
Never understood how an outdoorsman can be afraid of a snake.
Lol ,, huge difference in sceard and respect ...
I'm not afraid of guns, but I also do not play Russian Roulet either. Had a good buddy bitten by a timber rattler on the foot. He was to the hospital within 15-20 minutes, and he died. Rattle snakes are a killer unless you get medical attention real fast. If a person is hunting several thousand feet up in elevation on the mtn and they get bit by a rattler, they are very likely not going to make it.
And whether they scare someone or not, I just can think of a multitude of ways to die that sound better than dying in extreme pain by myself on the side of a mtn from a rattle snake bite. Snake boots have came along way in recent years. The ones I wear are as comfortable as a pair of tennis shoes.
Don't forget timber rattlers can climb trees just like any other snake. GON reported sometime ago one being found in deer stand.
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Quote from: PalmettoRon on April 26, 2023, 08:38:02 PM
I've been in the woods and swamps all over this nation for most of my 67 years along with several foreign countries.
Surprisingly, I have had only a few scary snake encounters, but had a close call last week in the Gila NF in NM. My wife and I had hiked about 2 miles from our vehicle and climbed a fairly steep mountain to better hear and prospect.
We were coming out along a narrow game trail with my wife maybe a couple feet in front. As my wife stepped forward, I heard a rattle very close and instantly jumped forward and to my left. My wife's boot track was within a foot of a coiled and angry rattlesnake that was partially under a rock with about 6" of space underneath it. Fortunately it was 55 degrees that midmorning rather than 75-77 that afternoon.
It all happened so fast, but we both realized it would have been a bad predicament for either of us had we been bitten. There was no cell service and it would have taken quite a while for one of us to make it out, drive for a place with cell service and hopefully get a helicopter in.
It would have been about 90 minutes just to get to cell coverage.
We were wearing low cut hikers. I'll probably continue that but it does make me consider reevaluating things.
I was made fun of when hunting Ocellated turkeys with Lovett Williams in Guatemala 20 or so years ago. It was incredibly hot, but there was a very lethal snake there called a fer-de-lance. In less than an hour you would most likely be dead if bitten. Most guys were wearing low top shoes, even canvas shoes. I wore snake boots for insurance. We actually killed a fer-de-lance in camp and the other camp had 6 play a visit.
When hunting a remote area where help is going to be difficult, one has to make a decision on risks vs comfort. Perhaps in my old age, I'm not afraid of dying, but in reality probably should wear protection.
They have a handful of different rattle snakes out that way. They have the Mojave whose venom is a blend of hemotoxin and neurotoxin which makes them really dangerous. Glad y'all got by without an incident.
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Quote from: mountainhunter1 on April 26, 2023, 09:17:45 PM
Quote from: Howieg on April 26, 2023, 09:02:54 PM
Quote from: davisd9 on April 26, 2023, 08:47:52 PM
Never understood how an outdoorsman can be afraid of a snake.
Lol ,, huge difference in sceard and respect ...
I'm not afraid of guns, but I also do not play Russian Roulet either. Had a good buddy bitten by a timber rattler on the foot. He was to the hospital within 15-20 minutes, and he died. Rattle snakes are a killer unless you get medical attention real fast. If a person is hunting several thousand feet up in elevation on the mtn and they get bit by a rattler, they are very likely not going to make it.
And whether they scare someone or not, I just can think of a multitude of ways to die that sound better than dying in extreme pain by myself on the side of a mtn from a rattle snake bite. Snake boots have came along way in recent years. The ones I wear are as comfortable as a pair of tennis shoes.
That's awful. Sorry to hear about your friend. Your story is proof that it is a serious situation. I always assumed I could at least get back to my truck but sometimes I'm over a mile away. I'm going to keep wearing my gaiters and praying for those angels to watch over me out there. I think I also need some prayer help to kill a gobbler this year or I'm going to strike out.
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Quote from: davisd9 on April 26, 2023, 08:47:52 PM
Never understood how an outdoorsman can be afraid of a snake.
I'm not really scared of snakes, I just don't won't to step on one. Now I'll be honest I don't like spiders. Black Widows and Brown Recluses, I hate those things.
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Quote from: Howieg on April 26, 2023, 05:30:04 PM
I sat down next to a timber rattler last week . I was lucky it was a cool morning and he never moved nothing but his tongue.
I scooted over a bit to give him room , I got the gobbler , then got him to . I run into snakes here in the dirty south regularly, but this one was a little to close .
My friend, I hope you got a dandy hat band out of him.
I hunt in Florida, i don't go into the woods without my snake boots. I look at it like I do must insurances. Hope I never have to use it, but glad I have it if I do.
Ive had a few sets, mostly bc of the timber rattlers in VA mountains I hunt.... Im an OOS there.... dont get too mad LOL
Just got the lacrosee snake knee boots... pretty comfy and light! We have copperheads in MD also so why not.
Quote from: Muzzy61 on April 28, 2023, 01:42:55 PM
I hunt in Florida, i don't go into the woods without my snake boots. I look at it like I do must insurances. Hope I never have to use it, but glad I have it if I do.
Yeah we have a few snakes in Florida. Its usually warm so they are active
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Ive only had one close call while hunting and it was a copperhead. Ive been struck at by massassagua rattlesnakes at work multiple times. We've had 2 on our front porch. Also had the biggest I have ever seen in a scrap wood pile while we were building our house. I dug through it to get out the choice scraps, then set it on fire. That big SOB came out. How I didnt get bit is beyond me.(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20230429/bfd746ec97221fbd1fc21c20c4f24064.jpg)
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I've eaten rattlesnake. It's kinda bland. Use a lot of your favorite seasoning.
Quote from: davisd9 on April 26, 2023, 08:47:52 PM
Never understood how an outdoorsman can be afraid of a snake.
Back in college was salmon fishing near a popular dam, and a couple guys my age were literally tossing around a baby rattler... I made a wide girth around them, and they accused me of having a phobia... I politely expressed, that I did not, as a phobia is an irrational fear of something, and fear of a rattler is completely rational.
My youngest daughter once sat on a squirrel hole with a rattler in side while dove hunting, and this season my oldest daughter had a rattlesnake in her duck blind on opening day... Later that same day, I killed another one near my hunting shack.
I have had a lot of run-ins with snakes, and have even been struck on the leg (without getting bit)...
Glad that we only have to deal with our rattlers, as they are typically not looking for a fight, and let you know when they are there with that obvious rattle...
I am far more afraid of sitting on one, or disturbing one after sitting... Walking through the woods for turkey, I am paying close attention to the ground as not to make noise. I feel like I am more likely to sit on or near one in a hasty set-up of a close bird.
And... My father got bit by a gopher snake on the hand... Horrible infection, and the doctor did not believe it was a gopher snake that bit him.... I'll investigate any snake I see and try to pick up most non-venomous snakes, and if I am in an isolated area, I generally do not kill even rattelsnakes... But I have a healthy respect for any snake.
Quote from: davisd9 on April 26, 2023, 08:47:52 PM
Never understood how an outdoorsman can be afraid of a snake.
You probably never saw firsthand the misery a poisonous snake bite causes. Some of us have and the recipient was a longtime outdoorsman. Thankfully, that person was with someone who could get them out and rushed them to a hospital. Bitten on the fleshy part of the hand. Between the thumb and forefinger. Hand and arm all the way to the shoulder swollen so tight it looked fake. Almost looked like a balloon. Couldn't open or close the hand or flex the fingers. Did I mention that it also turned black, blue and purple way up the arm as well? I use utmost caution when in snakey places because of this.
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Quote from: aclawrence on April 26, 2023, 10:28:34 PM
Quote from: mountainhunter1 on April 26, 2023, 09:17:45 PM
Quote from: Howieg on April 26, 2023, 09:02:54 PM
Quote from: davisd9 on April 26, 2023, 08:47:52 PM
Never understood how an outdoorsman can be afraid of a snake.
Lol ,, huge difference in sceard and respect ...
I'm not afraid of guns, but I also do not play Russian Roulet either. Had a good buddy bitten by a timber rattler on the foot. He was to the hospital within 15-20 minutes, and he died. Rattle snakes are a killer unless you get medical attention real fast. If a person is hunting several thousand feet up in elevation on the mtn and they get bit by a rattler, they are very likely not going to make it.
And whether they scare someone or not, I just can think of a multitude of ways to die that sound better than dying in extreme pain by myself on the side of a mtn from a rattle snake bite. Snake boots have came along way in recent years. The ones I wear are as comfortable as a pair of tennis shoes.
That's awful. Sorry to hear about your friend. Your story is proof that it is a serious situation. I always assumed I could at least get back to my truck but sometimes I'm over a mile away. I'm going to keep wearing my gaiters and praying for those angels to watch over me out there. I think I also need some prayer help to kill a gobbler this year or I'm going to strike out.
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He got bit at his house and that was how he was able to be at the hospital so fast. His wife had him in the car within a minute or two and drove him, but still he did not make it. Sometimes they give a dry bite, but if they load you up you are in likely DOA trouble if you are a mile or two from the truck. Been a tough spring for many in the south. It was decent gobbling the first week on public, but then went ice cold and no one is hearing gobbling since. They birds were just so far along due to the very warm February and March we had. You may have to break out that Lonnie Mabry cedar pot of yours at this point in the season because desperate times call for desperate measures. Good luck and I pray that all on here stay clear of those timber rattlers. They are a pretty docile snake by nature, in that they really want to avoid you as bad as you want to avoid them, - but if you stumble on them and catch them just right, they are suddenly your worst nightmare.
Y'all gonna wear snakeproof gauntlets, too? I've been struck twice. Both were when I was a little fella roaming barefoot over the county side. I just can't take this seriously.
Results of quick search, nothing verified:
On average, five Americans die from a snake bite every year.
Honey bee stings and lightning strikes kill 20 times more people annually than all the rattlesnake bites combined.
Venomous snakes bite 7,000–8,000 people in the US every year.
28% of those bitten by a snake are intoxicated.
In 2018, North Carolina had the most snake bites.
During 2004–2018, an average of 702 heat-related deaths (415 with heat as the underlying cause and 287 as a contributing cause) occurred in the United States annually. Natural heat exposure was a contributing cause of death attributed to certain chronic medical conditions, alcohol poisoning, and drug overdoses.
I haven't heard anyone say they're afraid to go in the woods due to snakes. It's more why risk it when you can wear some protection as comfortable as any other boot. Just Saying
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Quote from: howl on April 29, 2023, 08:44:34 AM
Y'all gonna wear snakeproof gauntlets, too? I've been struck twice. Both were when I was a little fella roaming barefoot over the county side. I just can't take this seriously.
Results of quick search, nothing verified:
On average, five Americans die from a snake bite every year.
Honey bee stings and lightning strikes kill 20 times more people annually than all the rattlesnake bites combined.
Venomous snakes bite 7,000–8,000 people in the US every year.
28% of those bitten by a snake are intoxicated.
In 2018, North Carolina had the most snake bites.
During 2004–2018, an average of 702 heat-related deaths (415 with heat as the underlying cause and 287 as a contributing cause) occurred in the United States annually. Natural heat exposure was a contributing cause of death attributed to certain chronic medical conditions, alcohol poisoning, and drug overdoses.
Those statistics in the real world are ignoring a lot of factors. Naturally a lot more people are affected by bee and wasp stings since they are everywhere and so is lightning. Yet, rattlesnakes are not in many areas of the country - and even then they are close to being eradicated in the more urban areas even if they were there originally. So naturally more folks statistically will be affected by lightning and bee stings. As far as snakes, Most of the number that are bitten are pretty near an area where they can get some help quick. But - the deer and turkey hunters I know who hunt public mtn land do not hunt near hospitals, they are hunting two to three miles from the truck in steep elevations, and if they or myself get bit, we are most likely facing a bad ending. We may be a very minority group that is statistically very different from the rest of the nation, but for us getting bit that far from help is likely a death sentence. That said, I rarely ever think about rattle snakes when hunting, and am sure enough not walking around the woods in fear.
Do you own a home? Total home loss in our country statistically is a very tiny percentage just like snake bites, but surely you do have insurance on your home? You are not living in fear of losing your home, but you have insurance if God forbid it does happen to you. I can tell you one thing for certain - even if it never happens to anyone else because statistically the odds are against it, if it happens to you, it will be a big deal. I know personally because lightning struck our home, and it burned while we were out of town on vacation. I Did not live in fear of a house fire, and honestly never even thought about it or ever expected it to happen to us but thank God we had insurance when it did.
My snake boots are my insurance if by chance I am the only one out of five thousand other hunters who steps on one in the dark one morning two miles from the truck when alone and I either have no signal on my phone to call for help, or if I have a signal it is going to take two plus hours for paramedics to get to my location even if they come break neck speed. Even then, the final locating of me in any kind of timely fashion will depend on if they can ping my phone then due to terrain and them not knowing the woods. Even if all that goes as good as it can go time wise, they will still more than likely have to carry me out by hand since they won't be able to get a helicopter anywhere near the area and that is going to add another hour plus to the mix. I would be willing to bet you any amount of money that the person who is bit in that hunting setting I just described is likely not going to survive 80-90 + percent of the time. Statistically, I do not care if it is only a small percentage of hunters who might find themselves in that situation, I just don't want to be one of them and I surely do not want to miss turkey season in the process. :turkey:
Quote from: davisd9 on April 26, 2023, 08:47:52 PM
Never understood how an outdoorsman can be afraid of a snake.
.
If you have ever been bitten you may have a different outlook. They make me very nervous. I'm not afraid of them but I have a healthy respect for them. Every time I see a poisonous snake I think about the week I was laid up in the hospital along with the bills that I received due to the bite , not to mention it is very let's say uncomfortable. You could buy a lot of Zach Farmer and Neil Cost calls for the price of anti venom lol.
Quote from: Spitten and drummen on April 29, 2023, 02:44:42 PM
Quote from: davisd9 on April 26, 2023, 08:47:52 PM
Never understood how an outdoorsman can be afraid of a snake.
.
If you have ever been bitten you may have a different outlook. They make me very nervous. I'm not afraid of them but I have a healthy respect for them. Every time I see a poisonous snake I think about the week I was laid up in the hospital along with the bills that I received due to the bite , not to mention it is very let's say uncomfortable. You could buy a lot of Zach Farmer and Neil Cost calls for the price of anti venom lol.
I am glad that you are ok after being bitten and pray that no one else on this board ever has to go through that.
Quote from: mountainhunter1 on April 29, 2023, 03:29:37 PM
Quote from: Spitten and drummen on April 29, 2023, 02:44:42 PM
Quote from: davisd9 on April 26, 2023, 08:47:52 PM
Never understood how an outdoorsman can be afraid of a snake.
.
If you have ever been bitten you may have a different outlook. They make me very nervous. I'm not afraid of them but I have a healthy respect for them. Every time I see a poisonous snake I think about the week I was laid up in the hospital along with the bills that I received due to the bite , not to mention it is very let's say uncomfortable. You could buy a lot of Zach Farmer and Neil Cost calls for the price of anti venom lol.
I am glad that you are ok after being bitten and pray that no one else on this board ever has to go through that.
I appreciate that my friend. I hope no one has to go through that. I really try to persuade people , especially hunting , to have some insurance. I wear snake gaiters whenever I'm hunting.
I have a friend who ran over a rattlesnake and decided to handle it. After about 30 min he got bit partially on the hand after thinking it was dead. Led to hospital had to cut his arm from elbow to hand and lay this cut open for a week due to the swelling would have caused more damage. He now has very limited use of that hand with chronic nerve pain in that arm. Jody, glad to hear you recovered from your bite
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Plenty of videos and stories showing a snake decapitated head being able to inflict bites even up to a few hours. I do think most bites come from messing with or handling them.
Quote from: worth612000 on April 29, 2023, 04:08:00 PM
I have a friend who ran over a rattlesnake and decided to handle it. After about 30 min he got bit partially on the hand after thinking it was dead. Led to hospital had to cut his arm from elbow to hand and lay this cut open for a week due to the swelling would have caused more damage. He now has very limited use of that hand with chronic nerve pain in that arm. Jody, glad to hear you recovered from your bite
Thank you my friend. I had it rough with the possibility of infection. Snakes mouths are nasty and full of bacteria. I had constant bags of IV fluid loaded with antibiotics. Seemed they were more concerned about that than the venom.
Vaportreks finally worn out and will try the Irish Setter Mudtreks.
I haven't had any close calls yet and feel it's better safe than sorry!
Quote from: howl on April 29, 2023, 08:44:34 AM
Honey bee stings and lightning strikes kill 20 times more people annually than all the rattlesnake bites combined.
Just ask Reg....
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2VWl1dK6pc4
I always knew statistically the numbers were very low. I'm honestly surprised how many people in this small forum group have first hand accounts of these incidents. I also have a friend who was bitten by a copperhead at our WMA. He just happened to get out of his truck at his parking spot and got bit on the foot. After making this post I'm taking this more seriously. I always wear gaiters so my main concern is when sitting down at a tree or crawling and repositioning. For anyone who is interested I just ordered this book from Amazon. It's being recommended in the National snakebite support group I'm in on Facebook. I think it was recently written and is supposed to have all the correct info based on the situations. I've always heard so many different things you're supposed to doing if you get bit that I'm unsure of what the best thing to do is. Also I'm didn't join that group because I'm afraid. Honestly I like snakes and learning about them. I've gotten really good at identifying different snake species. I'm very confident now in telling the difference between water snakes and cottonmouths. Keep spraying your clothes with permethrin and watch out for old no shoulders.
What To Do If You've Been Bitten By A Snake: Read before your journey and don't forget to pack it just in case https://a.co/d/9XdBkEX
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