Hi guys,
Have had a rough season but connected with a bird in the Northeast, state not be named ;). I really just started turkey hunting hard 5 years ago. So I've killed a few birds, but not as many as others on here so I'm not sure how this stacks up against the averages. But the bird I shot was probably 25 pounds, beard was okay at just shy of 9". The spurs are measuring right at 1 1/2" on the money. My question-do you find that it's a rarity to get to 1.5"? Or would you say 1 5/8" and beyond is really a big differentiator as far as what you'd consider big spurs?
1 1/2" + is a rate bird. Most 1 1/2 inchers I see or hear about don't quite hit that mark. Congrats on a way above average gobbler.
I've been doing this for 45 years and never put a tag a bird with 1 1/2'' spurs
1 7/16'' is my best :(
Maybe common in an Osceaola? But 1.5 spurs are no joke. I have killed my share(Easterns) but they are few and far between!
Its a odd thing to even measure given it has nothing to do with the age of the bird. That said, there really isnt anything that gauges the age of the bird aside from tail fan/wing barring for Jakes! THP method of overall bird length is kinda fun. I'm going to start measuring beak length or maybe foot circumference.
Maybe I should've gotten him mounted haha i'm not a mount guy. I will be proudly displaying those spurs on the double-fan shelf MK M Gobl made for me (he's on the forum). When you measure, do you go from the base of the spur along the outside of the spur with a paper tape so you can wrap it with the curve of the spur? or flat-line on a tape? it breaks 1 1/2" either way
Outside curve.
And spur length does have something to do with age. You can't pin point their age but you can eliminate jakes, two year olds and probably three year olds from the equation if you have a 1 1/2" spur. I'd say the majority of 1 1/2" spurred turkeys are 4 years of age minimum. I'm sure they're are a few exceptions
Around here 1.5 inch spurs on a eastern ky turkey are a rarity. That's an awesome bird you killed! Enjoy the meat and the memory.
Congrats on a true "limb hanger". post up some pictures and a little story.
25 lb bird with a 9" beard is no joke! Add to that 1.5" spurs and you got yourself a really good bird.
Congrats!
Quote from: guesswho on May 09, 2022, 11:56:22 AM
Outside curve.
And spur length does have something to do with age. You can't pin point their age but you can eliminate jakes, two year olds and probably three year olds from the equation if you have a 1 1/2" spur. I'd say the majority of 1 1/2" spurred turkeys are 4 years of age minimum. I'm sure they're are a few exceptions
This is incorrect per turkey biologist like CHamberlin that have seen way more turkeys then me. No/Short spurs doesnt even mean its for sure a jake, the Drurys just shot one with full fan/full beard and it had little jake bumps for spurs. Spur length has zero correlation to age even though folks really want it to!
Quote from: tbowers on May 09, 2022, 02:29:12 PM
Quote from: guesswho on May 09, 2022, 11:56:22 AM
Outside curve.
And spur length does have something to do with age. You can't pin point their age but you can eliminate jakes, two year olds and probably three year olds from the equation if you have a 1 1/2" spur. I'd say the majority of 1 1/2" spurred turkeys are 4 years of age minimum. I'm sure they're are a few exceptions
This is incorrect per turkey biologist like CHamberlin that have seen way more turkeys then me. No/Short spurs doesnt even mean its for sure a jake, the Drurys just shot one with full fan/full beard and it had little jake bumps for spurs. Spur length has zero correlation to age even though folks really want it to!
dude, you're trying too hard
nobody in this thread mentioned anything about age until you did.
big spurs are cool mementos to remember hunts by
now tell us how pressured "your" birds are
1 1/2" is supposedly a lot more common on osceolas but none of them I have killed have had that. The only 1 1/2" I have gotten was on a north Florida eastern, actually one of shortest beards ive gotten on a mature bird
I've got a buddy killed more than most, probably in the 250 neighborhood, and he's got maybe a dozen or so have broken 1.5". He doesn't have any greater than 1-5/8". Most the biggest spurred birds he killed was sandy soil ag country. Some places they just beat them up and round them off while other places tend to produce some bigger spurs, but all that to say, 1.5" and up is some gaffs!
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You may kill 4yo+ birds with nubs or short spurs, but you sure as heck aren't going to kill a jake, a 2yo, or a 3yo with 1.5in spurs.
1.25 to 1.5in spurs were common back in the mid 90s on my farms (very few turkey hunters back then). Now 1.5in spurs are quite rare. I've only killed 2 with over 1.5in spurs in the past 6 years. But most folks claiming to have 1.5in spurs are really stretching the tape.(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20220509/91b016ba3ce84941a4847cdf5f473cc3.jpg)(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20220509/337a8954f58e8aa4408bf8a6e65fdc66.jpg)
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I don't really have a great story that goes along with it to be honest. I knocked on this farm last year on May 30th (one day to go in the season). Drove up on Friday and got there around 430. This guy was strutting with 4,5 hens. There was another gobbler that looked to be fooling around with 3 jakes. I found it odd that he was essentially acting like a jake. Watched them all pitch up into a corner of a field, slept in the truck at the field because other hunters were watching these same birds. Got up at 410 and walked over to the field corner, sat down. Broke a stick to clear a shooting lane at around 430/440 and he hammered right behind me in the dark. Just sat down/didn't call. They eventually pitched into the field and the subordinate gobbler started strutting. When this big guy saw him pop into strut, he ran out of the woods right at the subordinate bird. I was afraid that I was going to not get a shot because a hen had just putted behind me in the tree line. I took a 60 yard shot with a 20 gauge (not proud of it, but I did it) and was lucky enough to take him
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Quote from: tbowers on May 09, 2022, 02:29:12 PM
Quote from: guesswho on May 09, 2022, 11:56:22 AM
Outside curve.
And spur length does have something to do with age. You can't pin point their age but you can eliminate jakes, two year olds and probably three year olds from the equation if you have a 1 1/2" spur. I'd say the majority of 1 1/2" spurred turkeys are 4 years of age minimum. I'm sure they're are a few exceptions
This is incorrect per turkey biologist like CHamberlin that have seen way more turkeys then me. No/Short spurs doesnt even mean its for sure a jake, the Drurys just shot one with full fan/full beard and it had little jake bumps for spurs. Spur length has zero correlation to age even though folks really want it to!
What you just posted above is incorrect per Guesswho. Read what I posted again. I never mentioned short spurs not showing up on older birds, happens pretty regular. I stand by what I said. If you have a bird with 1 1/2" spurs, then you can eliminate Jakes, two and the majority of three year olds from the equation. I'm pretty sure your biologist Chamberlin would agree with my statement. Look at Tasmaniacs photos, you can eliminate Jakes, 2, and 3 year olds from the age estimates on that gobbler. I think you just misread what I posted.
Oh, and Turkeyfool, congrats on a heck of a bird. Might be a while before you top that one.
Quote from: turkeyfool on May 09, 2022, 04:30:13 PM
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I don't really have a great story that goes along with it to be honest. I knocked on this farm last year on May 30th (one day to go in the season). Drove up on Friday and got there around 430. This guy was strutting with 4,5 hens. There was another gobbler that looked to be fooling around with 3 jakes. I found it odd that he was essentially acting like a jake. Watched them all pitch up into a corner of a field, slept in the truck at the field because other hunters were watching these same birds. Got up at 410 and walked over to the field corner, sat down. Broke a stick to clear a shooting lane at around 430/440 and he hammered right behind me in the dark. Just sat down/didn't call. They eventually pitched into the field and the subordinate gobbler started strutting. When this big guy saw him pop into strut, he ran out of the woods right at the subordinate bird. I was afraid that I was going to not get a shot because a hen had just putted behind me in the tree line. I took a 60 yard shot with a 20 gauge (not proud of it, but I did it) and was lucky enough to take him
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Heck of a bird any way you put it. You might kill some as nice as that one again but you won't kill very many any better. Enjoy it. And if you show them to anybody who comes with the, "Well, actually..." with regards to age and spurs just slap one of them hooks in his beady little eye and say, "Now does that feel like a jake to you, Jack?!?"
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Re:spurs my longest was 1 5/8". Now...as far as age, difficult to say. It would be easy if, say once after 1" for all 3 YO birds they gained 1/8" for every year thereafter but ain't so. Example: a banded MO bird years ago was killed and recorded. He was 7 YO and had 1 1/8" spurs. So how old is a bird with 1 1/2" spurs? He could be anywhere from 3, 4, 5, 6, 7...you get my point.
Oh I could care less about age, beard, and even spurs in most cases. I just thought it was pretty cool that they hit 1.5". I also noticed that were way more dense than other big spurs I've got in the past. May up here treats me way better than April down south
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A trophy bird. We all enjoy a large bird with rope/paintbrush beards but to me spurs are the tale of the tape. As already said spurs are not a definitive determination of age BUT... A 2 year old is not going to have 1 1/2" spurs (argue genetics all you want) and a 5 year old (unless he does live in the worst rocky soil ground in the country) is not going to have 1", with injury or genetics added to the mix.
I've killed some turkeys and never got one with 1.5" spurs. Got pretty close but not 1.5". My oldest grandson killed an Eastern here at home with genuine 1.5" spurs. Only ones I ever seen as far as I know.
Quote from: barry on May 09, 2022, 11:21:14 AM
I've been doing this for 45 years and never put a tag a bird with 1 1/2'' spurs
1 7/16'' is my best :(
Sounds like you have had a mirror image of my success. Killed a lot of birds and never have laid hands on an eastern bird with 1 1/2 inch spurs. I do hunt rocky mtn terrain, and that may have had something to do with it, but still - in way over three decades never a bird with spurs that long.
Quote from: turkeyfool on May 09, 2022, 04:30:13 PM
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I don't really have a great story that goes along with it to be honest. I knocked on this farm last year on May 30th (one day to go in the season). Drove up on Friday and got there around 430. This guy was strutting with 4,5 hens. There was another gobbler that looked to be fooling around with 3 jakes. I found it odd that he was essentially acting like a jake. Watched them all pitch up into a corner of a field, slept in the truck at the field because other hunters were watching these same birds. Got up at 410 and walked over to the field corner, sat down. Broke a stick to clear a shooting lane at around 430/440 and he hammered right behind me in the dark. Just sat down/didn't call. They eventually pitched into the field and the subordinate gobbler started strutting. When this big guy saw him pop into strut, he ran out of the woods right at the subordinate bird. I was afraid that I was going to not get a shot because a hen had just putted behind me in the tree line. I took a 60 yard shot with a 20 gauge (not proud of it, but I did it) and was lucky enough to take him
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Great bird - Congrats turkeyfool.
I seldom see anything over 7/8" or 1" here in the Appalachian mountains so anything over that is noteworthy in my world. As soon as I get out of the mountains then I start seeing bigger spurs. I think age, and location as well as genetics factor in, but I would say 1.5 spurs are definitely trophy class and I would say definitely older than 2 and even probably 3 years. Unless the gobbler was on roids.
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Quote from: Happy on May 09, 2022, 05:56:13 PM
I seldom see anything over 7/8" or 1" here in the Appalachian mountains so anything over that is noteworthy in my world. As soon as I get out of the mountains then I start seeing bigger spurs. I think age, and location as well as genetics factor in, but I would say 1.5 spurs are definitely trophy class and I would say definitely older than 2 and even probably 3 years. Unless the gobbler was on roids.
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A friend of mine killed a bonafide 1.5 inch spurred bird in the North Georgia Mountains last week, and he has not killed a ton of birds and even though I tried to tell him, not too sure he realized just what he had with a bird with spurs like that. That said, I agree with you as your comments are pretty much what I see on mtn birds. I occasionally will kill a bird with 1 1/8 spurs, but it must be those rocks on the ridges because most are usually just about an inch on a good looking mature mtn birds we harvest.
Nice one, congrats!
Killed a lot of turkeys hunting in rough rocky places in the mountains an inch and a quarter is my best.
Quote from: tazmaniac on May 09, 2022, 04:22:29 PM
You may kill 4yo+ birds with nubs or short spurs, but you sure as heck aren't going to kill a jake, a 2yo, or a 3yo with 1.5in spurs.
1.25 to 1.5in spurs were common back in the mid 90s on my farms (very few turkey hunters back then). Now 1.5in spurs are quite rare. I've only killed 2 with over 1.5in spurs in the past 6 years. But most folks claiming to have 1.5in spurs are really stretching the tape.(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20220509/91b016ba3ce84941a4847cdf5f473cc3.jpg)(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20220509/337a8954f58e8aa4408bf8a6e65fdc66.jpg)
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This is a very fair assessment of the situation.
Outside curve. It's pretty obvious where the base is in my opinion. Start at the ridge where the spur comes out the leg, measure the outside curve with a soft tape or even a string. No leg in the measurement.
Very few spurs truly meet the 1.5" length.
Thanks Turkeyfool for the pictures and story, Congrats again on a fine Tom.
This was my 37th season and I'm way past 100 birds. I've never gotten more than 1 7/16"...done that twice.
Everything is bigger in Florida in my experience. For years every Osceola we took on the place had over 11" beard and 1 1/2" spurs were par for about average. Somehow I've also managed a few that size in the WV mountains as well. Either way, impressive when you take one with hooks like that anywhere.
Social media sure has created a lot of internet turkey biologists.
But back to the original topic. Extremely rare for true 1.5", like everyone else has said. Have yet to hit it myself, can't seem to get past 1 3/8". I've made quite a few trips to Florida and see 1.25"+ there more often for sure.
I can only recall laying eyes on two true 1.5"+ on a dead turkey in front of me. Both were killed the same year, a couple days apart, in the rocky MO Ozarks.
only one I have ever gotten
Quote from: tbowers on May 09, 2022, 02:29:12 PM
Quote from: guesswho on May 09, 2022, 11:56:22 AM
Outside curve.
And spur length does have something to do with age. You can't pin point their age but you can eliminate jakes, two year olds and probably three year olds from the equation if you have a 1 1/2" spur. I'd say the majority of 1 1/2" spurred turkeys are 4 years of age minimum. I'm sure they're are a few exceptions
This is incorrect per turkey biologist like CHamberlin that have seen way more turkeys then me. No/Short spurs doesnt even mean its for sure a jake, the Drurys just shot one with full fan/full beard and it had little jake bumps for spurs. Spur length has zero correlation to age even though folks really want it to!
Why does it bother you that folks measure spurs? I've been killing turkeys 40 years and been measuring spurs 40 years. Up until the past few years spurs were considered the gospel on aging gobblers. Yeah, recent research has proven that to be a myth but a long spur is still a long spur and it won't cause you lost sleep over what another man's gobbler measures.
Quote from: Dtrkyman on May 09, 2022, 11:28:37 AM
Maybe common in an Osceaola? But 1.5 spurs are no joke. I have killed my share(Easterns) but they are few and far between!
I would not say common. Sharper spurred and hooked a lot of times, yes. I live in FL and killed my fair share and 1 3/8" is the mark I haven't yet broken. Killed a good amount of 1 1/4" but probably 1" to a little over is most common. My best was a long spur Eastern in other state and I got a really nice Rio as well a few years ago but one spur broke about 1/3 off.
A friend saw this post and reminded with photos of one he killed some years back. 1.5" spurs and a heckuva Rio.
A board member here just got one this morning with spurs bigger than 1.5". I hope he will post up pics soon, it is a most impressive gobbler!
The one I killed up here in the North Carolina mountains last week one side is just a fuzz over 1.5" (probably 9/16) and one side is just a fuzz under (probably 7/16). And what's odd is that there's very little curve to them at all. Most the ones posted above are curved and thin as scythes. These were more like big, thick spearheads. The second I showed it to my buddy who's got 25 years age on me and probably 35 years more experience he said flat out I'd never kill another bird that good here at home again and I'd say he's right. I like the crazy curved ones better but honestly if this bird's hadn't been as thick as they were he'd have surely busted them off someplace.
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Quote from: dublelung on May 10, 2022, 09:17:28 AM
Quote from: tbowers on May 09, 2022, 02:29:12 PM
Quote from: guesswho on May 09, 2022, 11:56:22 AM
Outside curve.
And spur length does have something to do with age. You can't pin point their age but you can eliminate jakes, two year olds and probably three year olds from the equation if you have a 1 1/2" spur. I'd say the majority of 1 1/2" spurred turkeys are 4 years of age minimum. I'm sure they're are a few exceptions
This is incorrect per turkey biologist like CHamberlin that have seen way more turkeys then me. No/Short spurs doesnt even mean its for sure a jake, the Drurys just shot one with full fan/full beard and it had little jake bumps for spurs. Spur length has zero correlation to age even though folks really want it to!
Why does it bother you that folks measure spurs? I've been killing turkeys 40 years and been measuring spurs 40 years. Up until the past few years spurs were considered the gospel on aging gobblers. Yeah, recent research has proven that to be a myth but a long spur is still a long spur and it won't cause you lost sleep over what another man's gobbler measures.
Not bothered, but clarifying that spur length has nothing to do with age. Measure them all you want!!!!
If they look over a inch ? I usually put a soft tape on them , but the true trophy when it comes to spring gobblers is the memory etched solid in your mind . IMO . Saying this , I've been lucky enough to get a few with 1 1/2 or better . But they are few and far between for certain!
For most you have a turkey of a life time. Enjoy!!
I've killed several with 1 5/8 spurs , it's a combination of several things , genetics---age- nutrition , my dad killed one with 1.75 , and a friend of mine killed one with 1.875 ...and we all hunt the same areas in central and south Florida..
To do it to need old ..old birds , and that's harder to come by these days then back in the 1980's to 1990's when there far less turkey hunters
I've seen examples of 2 year old Osceola's with 1 3/8 spurs , they were living in excellent habitat , and feeding on burns that are mineral rich ...had those gobblers hit 5 years old or older they would have hit 2 inches like the gobbler Lance Vincent killed that was a long standing NWTF record ...again Florida
Florida doesn't have a monopoly on long spurs you can get them elsewhere with luck
In 39 seasons I have only killed one bird that had 1.5" spurs. That is an incredible trophy, I am sure he was 4 years old at a minimum. I would imagine the best spur growth could be expected from the osceola and eastern strains, followed by the rio and lastly the merriams.
No doubt that 1.5" spurs are a trophy on any turkey!
Lots of factors in spur length: Age, genetics, diet, habitat, etc.
Spurs are not shed yearly, so the older the bird, the more likely he is to have longer spurs... Just like people, traits are passed on to offspring genetically; if mamma and daddy have genetics for longer spurs, the offspring is more likely to have longer spurs. Diet can certainly influence spur length as well, and it is my understanding that certain types of proteins can promote better and longer spur lenght.
Here in California in the rocky foothills, long spurs are rare... They get chipped and knocked off on the rocks before they get very long, and anything over an inch is noteworthy. I have killed some birds with squared-off spurs that were obviously recently knocked of, and over time these squared off tips will wear and become rounded.
The majority of birds I have killed were in taller grass, and I have not put eyes on the spurs... Even in cattle country (where the grass is eaten shorted by cattle) the hill terrain often does not allow for a good view of their feet. If I had several toms come into range, I will look for beard thickness and lenght, as I rarely get a peek at the spurs... Pure luck if I harvest a bird with good spurs....
Nice one OP! Congratulations.
I've been at it a while and 95% of my experience is south FL. I'll say that 1.25" are pretty common down here, but true 1.5" cannot be considered common. 2" are really rare. That said, they are out there, the ones in my avatar are 2.125" and 1.938".
I am primarily a Northeast hunter and 1.5" spurs are very rare here. I have hunted for over 20 years and my best spurs are 1.25" from the smallest Tom I ever shot. He also had the longest beard, 12". The average 2 year old here is approximately 19 pounds, 9" beard and .75" blunted spurs. These are averages in my areas only mind you but I am pretty sure most of New England is comparable. My 2 birds this year had 15/16th spurs and the other had 11/16th and 3/4 spurs. Sharp spurs over an inch are trophies in my book. Anything 1.5" or better might go on my wall, I will cross that bridge if I ever get there, LOL. Great bird and I hope you get more brother, Al Baker
Quote from: Old Gobbler on May 10, 2022, 01:53:39 PM
I've killed several with 1 5/8 spurs , it's a combination of several things , genetics---age- nutrition , my dad killed one with 1.75 , and a friend of mine killed one with 1.875 ...and we all hunt the same areas in central and south Florida..
To do it to need old ..old birds , and that's harder to come by these days then back in the 1980's to 1990's when there far less turkey hunters
I've seen examples of 2 year old Osceola's with 1 3/8 spurs , they were living in excellent habitat , and feeding on burns that are mineral rich ...had those gobblers hit 5 years old or older they would have hit 2 inches like the gobbler Lance Vincent killed that was a long standing NWTF record ...again Florida
Florida doesn't have a monopoly on long spurs you can get them elsewhere with luck
For my own education and curiosity.....how exactly did you know those birds were 2 year olds that you reference above?
Meaning what characteristics or traits did they have that helped you determine them to be 2 year olds?
Quote from: Jstocks on May 13, 2022, 12:35:09 PM
Quote from: Old Gobbler on May 10, 2022, 01:53:39 PM
I've killed several with 1 5/8 spurs , it's a combination of several things , genetics---age- nutrition , my dad killed one with 1.75 , and a friend of mine killed one with 1.875 ...and we all hunt the same areas in central and south Florida..
To do it to need old ..old birds , and that's harder to come by these days then back in the 1980's to 1990's when there far less turkey hunters
I've seen examples of 2 year old Osceola's with 1 3/8 spurs , they were living in excellent habitat , and feeding on burns that are mineral rich ...had those gobblers hit 5 years old or older they would have hit 2 inches like the gobbler Lance Vincent killed that was a long standing NWTF record ...again Florida
Florida doesn't have a monopoly on long spurs you can get them elsewhere with luck
For my own education and curiosity.....how exactly did you know those birds were 2 year olds that you reference above?
Meaning what characteristics or traits did they have that helped you determine them to be 2 year olds?
9 inch beards , with amber on the tips of the hair follicles like all the 2y/o we have here
I'm a taxidermist and had a 15 year old hunter and his dad bring me a turkey opening day of our (PA) season. Spurs were 1 11/16". Seen pictures of spurs like that but never laid eyes on a pair. I told him it was all downhill from here. Lol
Congratulations to the OP. That's a dandy for sure.
I've hunted Mississippi for 35 yrs and the Midwest for 22 years and have 3 that touch the 1.5" mark. They are hard to come by.
Congrats on a very rare bird indeed, as others have stated most 1.5 spurs are stretched a bit. I killed a nice bird this Friday in PA, and when I picked him up, I would have told you 1.5 spurs. But after getting him home and measuring them correctly they were 1 3/8, still a good bird. Only a 1/8-inch difference, but a very big 1/8-inch difference to reach the very rare 1 1/2-inch mark.
My buddy killed one last spring with 1 1/2"-1 5/8" spurs. He brought them to the house just so I could see, real deal! WV turkey.
There was a store up South Fork road at Rough run, Pendleton County WV. In the window beside the door this older than dirt guy had a matching set of 2"ers. Said it was a WV turkey. That was probably around 1996 I stopped in there, talked to that guy for a bit that day.
I have never killed a turkey with more than 1 3/8", a couple at 1 5/16 and a bunch at 1 1/4".
I do have a turkey that had 4 spurs, man that was a big bird. If I were to ever get one mounted that should have been the one. 25#, 10.5" beard and 4 spurs. One of the few sets I have not cut from the legs of the turkey, they are still intact on the leg.
Congrats to all that have found a long spurred turkey like that!
I have several that are 1 3/8 and 7/16, but last year I finally got a bona fide 1 1/2" set of Pennsylvania spurs
Only 2 of my gobblers have had 1-1/2" spurs. One was a Michigan stud, the other was an Osceola. I've also been on turkey hunting websites for many years, and the guys don't kill that many 1-1/2"s. So I'd say it is uncommon and you got a fine bird. Congrats!!
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