I thought this was a great discussion from Cameron Weddington he shared on his Facebook page. We'll never agree on all the issues surrounding our turkey declines, public land, and social media now but I thought he made some great points. Specifically the commission all agreeing that there are some serious problems and that they need to take some actions steps to help the wild turkey, and then following it up with promoting the crap out of there public land turkey hunting. And paying a certain group to promote it on their YouTube channel. Cameron narrates this much better than I can. I'd encourage y'all to give it a watch. Maybe we can all get together and begin to effect some changes instead of bickering so much amongst ourselves. I don't know Cameron but I listen to some of his podcast and he seems like a pretty solid dude. I also appreciate they are taking steps in the podcast to not even mention state names and stuff like that. https://www.facebook.com/1203425438/posts/10227904478736369/?d=n
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It's all about money in Tennessee. They don't truly care about the resource they just want to act like they do. Look how they screwed up the duck hunting It's just money
Quote from: drake799 on February 05, 2022, 12:05:35 PM
It's all about money in Tennessee. They don't truly care about the resource they just want to act like they do. Look how they screwed up the duck hunting It's just money
I don't know about the duck hunting but it seems like there is a group that cares about hunting and then another group that does what they want to create revenue. They need to get together.
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The commission did not pay the you-tube influencers.... Agree it's a crap show tho...
Regardless of the eastern US state, until the game departments start to prioritize private land management outreach and assistance, turkey and upland hunting opportunity is going to continue to decline.
I know we don't like to think of our dollars going to help private land owners but when approx. 70-80% of the eastern us is privately owned, game management doesn't happen on public land.... it happens on private. Folks need to learn how to get off the bush hog, ID plants, gain some herbicide knowledge, harvest timber, control predators, and effectively apply prescribed fire. We used to do this... now everyone wants property that is like a park with big timber. Game mgt. is more than oak acorns, trigger control, and food plots.
Saw more turkeys this pass deer season, than i have in 2 years ... in Tenn.... I've also notice a lot of others during deer season have seen more turkeys this past season from posting video's and pictures on Facebook...
Many of us have been preaching the dangers of YouTube for years on this forum. Now we've lost a ton of public land turkey hunting opportunity across the eastern U.S., and it ain't over yet. Great video, maybe it will convince other turkey hunters start to pay a bit more attention about what's going on in their state agency and the other states they hunt. TN ain't the only state that paid them. There's more on the list.
Quote from: Lucky Goose on February 05, 2022, 12:26:04 PM
Regardless of the eastern US state, until the game departments start to prioritize private land management outreach and assistance, turkey and upland hunting opportunity is going to continue to decline.
I know we don't like to think of our dollars going to help private land owners but when approx. 70-80% of the eastern us is privately owned, game management doesn't happen on public land.... it happens on private. Folks need to learn how to get off the bush hog, ID plants, gain some herbicide knowledge, harvest timber, control predators, and effectively apply prescribed fire. We used to do this... now everyone wants property that is like a park with big timber. Game mgt. is more than oak acorns, trigger control, and food plots.
Totally agree.
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We can sit here and argue about YouTube and social media's effects on turkey hunting all day and night, the biggest problem here is that 10,000 dollars were spent paying a group to promote turkey hunting. I don't care if the money came from hard cards, wma stamp, etc etc. The issue is that is 10,000 dollars that could've been used in any other way that'd of been beneficial to the residents. Could've went towards timber management, maintenance of wma's trail systems , or hell even sponsoring a youth hunter safety program. I don't care, that YouTube group would've ended up in TN eventually and would have posted what state they are hunting and the same result would have occurred. I just can't wrap my head around why a state cutting seasons and bag limits would be promoting the hunting at the same time! Shame on TWRA for this, I can't blame THP for taking them up on the offer. The offer should've never been on the table to begin with!
As a TN Hunter I agree that there are better steps that TWRA could take with wildlife. Many of these YouTubers hunt public land in every state. So eventually they would have hunted TN and posted videos. That being said I think the money could have been spent on something different.
In my opinion the main problem with the turkey population in Tn is the completely out of control coon population. We can point out a lot of other problems but until we do something about the number of racoons in this state it not going to get any better
My answer to the discussion is that where is private found in Public Land? Public is what it says public. The non-resident pays 4-5 times what the resident pays for a license and sometimes more than resident permits. I'm from Massachusetts and hunt almost exclusively on public land. I get my turkey almost every year and when I don't it's usually my fault. You have to be persistent, turkeys don't walk saying shoot me you have to work for them. Stop whining and do your homework. My :z-twocents:
Quote from: kelley91 on February 07, 2022, 04:25:51 AM
In my opinion the main problem with the turkey population in Tn is the completely out of control coon population. We can point out a lot of other problems but until we do something about the number of racoons in this state it not going to get any better
I'm not sure where it lies in the overall list of impacts to the population, but I agree they are out of control. My kids have grown bored of trapping them. It's VERY rare that we set out a trap and don't catch one.
I remember not too long ago when all the talk on these forums were how "TV pros" should see how good they think they are on public land and so on.
Well it seems they do well enough to piss everyone off and kill all the critters!
Other than them showing spots I am not too concerned with them.
Predator populations tend to get really high when they have vast amounts of food! Many of these things will cycle, that is why I think habitat improvement is crucial, we can mange that quite well on a consistent basis.
I am not sure why TWRA spent the money to promote a resource after lowering the bag limit, especially after the huge increase in outdoor activities including hunting that came along with Covid in 2020.
While that may have been a foolish move, we got some other issues on the table that affect public land hunters in Tennessee and need quicker action.
Since public land has been brought up in this discussion more than once, we may want to focus on 2 current issues that need action first and foremost...these may have statewide repercussions if things aren't put to a stop. Give politicians and inch, and they'll run a mile.
1. Bridgestone Firestone WMA in White County just had a huge quail/native songbird habitat project shut down by state politicians and local hunters who didn't want the hardwoods to be cut. Apparently there is a lawsuit involved against TWRA. White county is mostly forested, and this project would greatly improve the habitat for quail and all kinds of other wildlife including deer. TWRA employs biologists and foresters to make these decisions, and people with no background in forestry or wildlife biology have simply shut down this very beneficial project with no scientific basis.
2. State rep. Scott Cepicky has introduced a bill to transfer ownership and management of the 12,000 acre Yanahli WMA from TWRA to Maury County. He claims it will remain a wildlife management area and open to hunting, and he also claims the county will manage it better than TWRA, who according to Cepicky, has "mismanaged" the WMA.
Yanahli is in the top 5 WMAs for deer AND turkey harvest statewide, and is loaded with all other kinds of small game and fish. It's kind of hard to say TWRA has "mismanaged" an area with the harvest numbers and habitat diversity found on Yanahli. And it's kind of hard to believe a county who employs no wildlife biologists will manage a WMA better than TWRA.
Knowing Cepicky's background and Maury county's recent growth in relation to Nashville urban sprawl, it's highly suspect handing over a 12,000 acres of land to the county, and I think we can all agree it will ultimately not end well for hunters or wildlife if the bill passes.
I am still researching and gathering info on both issues, and hope to have enough to put together a video of some sort in the next couple weeks or so, to raise awareness.
Like I said, I know the original poster's issue is an important one. But all of us who enjoy public lands are gonna have to side with TWRA for the time being, and fight these issues at hand. Turkeys are not going extinct. Yes the numbers aren't what they used to be, but we also had an exceptional hatch last year.
If you're a public land hunter who lives and/or hunts in Tennessee, I suggest doing some research on the Bridgestone and Yanahli issues, and contacting your state reps to respectfully voice your concerns. Our voice is louder in numbers.
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Quote from: catman529 on February 10, 2022, 10:30:55 PM
I am not sure why TWRA spent the money to promote a resource after lowering the bag limit, especially after the huge increase in outdoor activities including hunting that came along with Covid in 2020.
While that may have been a foolish move, we got some other issues on the table that affect public land hunters in Tennessee and need quicker action.
Since public land has been brought up in this discussion more than once, we may want to focus on 2 current issues that need action first and foremost...these may have statewide repercussions if things aren't put to a stop. Give politicians and inch, and they'll run a mile.
1. Bridgestone Firestone WMA in White County just had a huge quail/native songbird habitat project shut down by state politicians and local hunters who didn't want the hardwoods to be cut. Apparently there is a lawsuit involved against TWRA. White county is mostly forested, and this project would greatly improve the habitat for quail and all kinds of other wildlife including deer. TWRA employs biologists and foresters to make these decisions, and people with no background in forestry or wildlife biology have simply shut down this very beneficial project with no scientific basis.
2. State rep. Scott Cepicky has introduced a bill to transfer ownership and management of the 12,000 acre Yanahli WMA from TWRA to Maury County. He claims it will remain a wildlife management area and open to hunting, and he also claims the county will manage it better than TWRA, who according to Cepicky, has "mismanaged" the WMA.
Yanahli is in the top 5 WMAs for deer AND turkey harvest statewide, and is loaded with all other kinds of small game and fish. It's kind of hard to say TWRA has "mismanaged" an area with the harvest numbers and habitat diversity found on Yanahli. And it's kind of hard to believe a county who employs no wildlife biologists will manage a WMA better than TWRA.
Knowing Cepicky's background and Maury county's recent growth in relation to Nashville urban sprawl, it's highly suspect handing over a 12,000 acres of land to the county, and I think we can all agree it will ultimately not end well for hunters or wildlife if the bill passes.
I am still researching and gathering info on both issues, and hope to have enough to put together a video of some sort in the next couple weeks or so, to raise awareness.
Like I said, I know the original poster's issue is an important one. But all of us who enjoy public lands are gonna have to side with TWRA for the time being, and fight these issues at hand. Turkeys are not going extinct. Yes the numbers aren't what they used to be, but we also had an exceptional hatch last year.
If you're a public land hunter who lives and/or hunts in Tennessee, I suggest doing some research on the Bridgestone and Yanahli issues, and contacting your state reps to respectfully voice your concerns. Our voice is louder in numbers.
I'm not a res of tenn , but this is the type of info that needs to be posted.
Kudos for putting it out there .
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This is a perfect example of what the funds that went to promote an already strained resource (public land turkey hunting) could have gone to...promotional efforts and education of what denotes quality wildlife habitat. When the public (and politicians) hear that trees are being cut red flags go up, and lawsuits follow, because they do not know better. Trees equate to good habitat to most people, plain and simple.
Newspaper articles (web included) and news spots promoting habitat improvements to educate the GENERAL public make way for projects like this. The increased production and occurrence of non-game (song birds are a big deal, because bird watching is huge) and game species gets people on your side and makes these projects easier in the long run, all while guiding private land management as well: "Hmmm, if it worked on Bridgestone.... maybe it will work on my land..."
Educate and then ask the folks from White and Cumberland county what they want.... I bet it's NOT more trees, instead wildlife improvement and hunter dollars coming through their towns...
Maybe if we got more people on our side we wouldn't have so much trouble at the voting booth and wouldn't have so many fires to fight in terms of trapping, hunting, fishing, forestry.
Thanks for pointing out these issues Catman. Maybe you can bring some awareness to this and people will start applying pressure in the right places.
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I emailed my local reps about the Yanahli situation. The guy with the "R" beside his name didn't reply. The guy with the "D" beside his name did, and simply stated that the TWRA was mismanaging the WMA. I asked for evidence and got crickets. Emailed him again, pointing out some of the statistics about that particular WMA that catman pointed out above, still crickets. There's no way this is anything other than a land grab if you aren't willing to share your reasoning behind a statement like, "TWRA is mismanaging the land" with the people you represent. Cepicky and Joey Hensley (my local rep that I'm not really pleased with) won't give me any info. They just hide behind a vague statement and won't provide any evidence. I'm not a sheep. You shouldn't be either.
I do have major issues with giving THP $10K. I enjoy the THP videos, and can't really blame them for taking the money. That was a bad call by the state of Tennessee, though. Even if bird numbers weren't down across the majority of the state, I would not agree with promoting it like that. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but that's mine.
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it was a great video aclawrence. Cameron did a fine job.
If your watching these youtubers pimp out our public natural resources for profit on YouTube then your as irresponsible as the state of Tennessee. You can't have it both ways.
Sound advice, thanks for the information.
I think there is possible a bunch of people that have not looked at Tn. turkey population trending. Go to their website and look at the historical numbers and trending, it should show you some things.
Yup, population is down, yup they are promoting the hunting in TN. The problem is they are used to the money and want to keep it the same, if not more, flow of cash. So they are doing what they feel they need to do to Advertise.
Seems some are blaming someone for taking money for their service? Weird, I do that every day when I go to work. Don't you?
Have you Tennessee guys heard any more about Bridgestone Firestone
and Yanahli?
Quote from: Jimspur on March 02, 2022, 10:54:12 PM
Have you Tennessee guys heard any more about Bridgestone Firestone
and Yanahli?
Yanahli bill was withdrawn. Still don't trust Cepicky, but it's good for the time being.
Bridgestone Firestone is still up in the air. I plan on spending some time over there as well as talking to some knowledgeable people and hopefully can make some sort of a video to raise awareness.
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Quote from: catman529 on March 02, 2022, 11:40:59 PM
Quote from: Jimspur on March 02, 2022, 10:54:12 PM
Have you Tennessee guys heard any more about Bridgestone Firestone
and Yanahli?
Yanahli bill was withdrawn. Still don't trust Cepicky, but it's good for the time being.
Bridgestone Firestone is still up in the air. I plan on spending some time over there as well as talking to some knowledgeable people and hopefully can make some sort of a video to raise awareness.
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That's good news for Yanahli. Thanks.