Just finished shooting my Bobwhite today. Trulock Imp Mod in one barrel, Trulock TSS choke in the other (the constriction is on their site).
Shot #8 birdshot at 15 steps with both barrels. Tiny bit, but good pattern.
Left barrel with IM choke - Shot #6 1.25 ounce Prairie Storm at 20 steps. A little lower, pattern good. Shot #6 1 ounce Prairie Storm. Also good and a little low.
Shot TSS choke with Fed HW #7 at 25 steps in right barrel, but aimed at the birds head instead of waddles - poison.
Switched the chokes and shot left barrel aimed at bird's head with TSS choke and HW#7 at 40 steps (did this because my finger tended to go to back trigger more naturally). TERRIBLE. Unhuntable pattern. WTH? No way this was possible. The 25 was awesome. Made sure the chokes were tight. Got to wondering and said well, let's switch chokes back (IM in Left and TSS in right). Aimed at head - dead on and excellent pattern. No idea unless it was a bad shell.
Final result - IM in left barrel, Prairie Storm 3" #6 with 1.25 ounce - killer at under 25 yards.
TSS choke in right barrel, HW#7 3" - stone killer from 25-40. No sights needed, just aim at his head.
Took the gun to a smith today to have a sling mount drilled and tapped and had them put a mid bead on it to make sure I keep the gun square when mounted (since we sometimes get in weird positions on birds). I am gonna shoot one more 40 once the new bead is on, just to be sure.
Sorry, I forgot to take pics, but wanted to share in case anyone is setting one up in the future.
Thanks for sharing this with us!!! I am loving my CZ Sharptail 20 gauge. I really want to sling mine as well. Just don't know if I really want to drill it or not. They're good looking guns for sure. This year I will be toting the CZ SxS or my 28 gauge. The struggle is real!!!
Have a good one, Bo
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I have a Bobwhite 20 I got when my son was born that I'll eventually pass down to him. I got it for a quail/woodcock gun, but I'd like to take a turkey with it. Did you shoot through the included Full choke at all?
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I did not. I am quite sure it would be a good 30 yard gun with that choke though.
I did real well with it on live quail too, but that double trigger is my first and whooped me that day. Not a lot of doubles!
The Sharptail is nice. I just picked up a CZ Drake in 28 and broke 92 on a sporting clay course (it was the easy course - but I was still happy with that).
This is my first double trigger, but I got used to it fairly quick. Pumps on the other hand....
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Good info. Waiting for my Bobwhite G2 to come in, and this will be very helpful
Currently trying to decide between flush or extended chokes. Any benefits one way or the other? I like the aesthetics of extended chokes, but with the 28" barrel already, I'm afraid it would make for too long of a barrel. Maybe not. May be overthinking it
I prefer the traditional look of this sxs, so I've never tried. There was a thread somewhere though that specified which worked without touch each other, which you have to worry about with ext chokes in sxs's. Again, I like the traditional look.
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I got the extended. I just know how well the Trulocks perform and went with that and they worked well on the gun, so I am good. With Trulock or Sumtoy if the choke is not what you want, you are not stuck with it.
I really like the looks of flush chokes in a sxs better, but did get better patterns with ext.chokes.
my gun has a Truloc in the left and a Carlsons in the right, both extended, they don't touch.
I talked with both choke makers, you can put 2 extended Carlsons in without them touching and the same For 2 extended Trulocs
A 28" barrel in a break open gun is shorter than the same barrel in a pump or semi, I don't notice the extra length of an ext.
g8rvet,
It sounds like you got a good one as far as barrel regulation.
I did as long as I put tight in the right and open in the left. The other way stunk.
That is weird, the reversed chokes would have me messed up in the heat of the moment
I tried the flush Truloc .581 first and patterns weren't bad just not quite there, talked with George and went with the ext. .571, This was for TSS in the left barrel. This left barrel/choke combo patterns 1 7/16s oz better than 1 5/8oz or 1.5oz, barrels can be weird.
In the spring in more open hardwoods the right barrel has a Carlsons .575, it didn't do that great with HVWT 7's or 6's
For fall turkey I set the gun up like yours except chokes reversed, lead 6's in the right for jumping a grouse or pheasant, close turkeys or shooting to break a flock
I think I am gonna switch them back and waste one more shell. I just can't imagine it could be that different and wonder if it was a bad shell. I am talking at 40 yards the left barrel having like 8 pellets hit one of the Birchwood Casey target (all on the fringes) vs 150+ in the 10 inch circle with the right barrel-same choke, screwed in tight.
As a two trigger shooting though, let me ask you. When I pop that thing up to my shoulder, I almost always went to the back trigger on the quail rise, which put me behind the curve on a second bird having the kind of find the front instead of sliding off to the back. Makes me think I should have it the way it is now with the more open choke in the back trigger. Most likely to rush/panic on a close bird.
Could be a bad shell, I have had occasional poi vs poa with older Fed HVWT shells, not sure if the flight control wad being compressed over time interferes with the design. I reload but bought some of the Fed TSS several years ago during that special sale, they patterned great when new, but have also had poi issues with them. I was a big fan of the HVWT before reloading tss, but if you try tss maybe get away from the flight control wad.
With the situation of you naturally going to the back trigger first with quail, it almost sounds like the front trigger pull length is too long, or if your not used to the straight stock maybe not sliding your hand up close enough to the trigger guard.
My BW has the same trigger length as other guns that fir me well but something in the design makes it feel a little longer.
Traditionally the majority of sxs's were set up with front trigger/right barrel as the more open choke and most people find it faster to go to the front trigger first and slide back to the back trigger for the 2nd shot. There were some English guns made for driven hunts that were built with the tighter choke in the right barrel, The shooter still shot the front trigger first as birds were coming towards him and then a more open choke for the 2nd shot as birds kept getting closer.
I have thought about your way for turkeys, the shorter trigger pull is handy when shooting like a rifle in awkward positions and the front trigger (normal trigger pull length) for wingshooting if a fast followup shot is needed.
I had an issue with my CZ Sharptail with the right barrel and improved cylinder choke. The reason I had the improved cylinder in was my fault. I thought I was shooting the modified. Shooting Federal 8/10s at 40 yards blew a hole in the paper like a slug. Did this twice, same shells before I figured out that I had the wrong choke in. Very few BBs on target, just a slug hole, I guess the shot didn't separate from the wad.
Have a good one, Bo
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That sounds like a bad shell/shells more than just a slightly less constricted choke
I had the same problem with reloads using blackpowder and the flight control wads, the shot stayed in the wad and hit the 40yd pattern paper like a slug. apparently the black powder didn't generate enough pressure for the back fin design to open. this was a 12 gauge blackpowder cartridge gun
A friend had the same slug issue using 20 gauge flight control wads in a muzzleloader with blackpowder
Not so good results today. Got a little frustrated as it looks like I am having the same issue as you crow. Not sure how to proceed. There are not commercially available fiber optic style rifle sights that fit this squared rib.
The Imp Mod is on at 20 with #6 lead.
Here is the 40 with the POA high and right.
This is my Weatherby SA 459 for comparison.
Looks like if I can get the POA higher, I will be good to go. Could probably bring it back to square on as it looks like the best pattern is just low.
Your gun is much better than mine was for both elevation and windage, I think you'll be able to get POI centered.
For height adj.,-- if you're already using your mid bead as a rear sight with the fr bead sitting on top the mid bead "8" and it's shooting low as in the pattern pic. One option would be to put the bigger front bead back in (the one the gunsmith had in) as your mid bead, the larger diameter bead may give all the height adj necessary.
2nd option would be to file your choke, it won't take much, my first filing moved the pattern almost twice as far as yours needs to move.
3rd option, probably back to the gunsmith. you could get a 3/8ths dovetail cut into the rib and slide a rear sight right on. you won't need a rear sight with much height. I did this to a different gun and put a traditional type of muzzleloader rear sight on it. just flat across the top, no buckhorn sticking up. I didn't cut a "U" notch in it, just left it flat across the top. The front bead sits on top the rear sight, you eye will automatically center the bead, very fast and accurate.
In the off season for wing shooting, tap it out, you could have your gunsmith make you a flat base to slide in that he has drilled and tapped for a mid bead
there is a aftermarket fiberoptic front, I think mine is HighViz, I'll look tomorrow. You unscrew the front bead and the fiber optic is on a little black frame which screws right into the front bead hole, no drilling or tapping. I couldn't find a fiber optic rear that clamped onto the rib either.
For your adjustment to the left, it would take very little filing or if you went with a dovetail rear sight it would only have to be very slightly off center to the left to move the pattern over.
Nice even HVWT #7 pattern
Thanks, getting closer. SIL had a sight that actually fits on the gun. I am having some consistency issues with the patterns. I think the Trulock TSS choke is too constricted (555) and maybe blowing the pattern some - so I ordered a 571. I am gonna keep the 555 in case I ever try it with TSS and see how the 571 dose. Season opens Saturday, but this one is staying on the shelf until I get it right.
I just shot my new CZ Bobwhite G2 20ga this weekend. Great looking gun. I was only able to shoot it a few times, but it seemed to shoot a little low at 35 using Federal tss 7's 1 1/2. I'd hunt with it tomorrow if I had to, but really need to shoot it a few more times (would probably tote my 870 20 if I were hunting tomorrow honestly)
Good info above, Crow. I'm thinking I'll put a mid bead on first, to try to raise it. Don't need much, but I definitely think I could come up a bit. May need to read up on choke filing if it comes to that
Any remedies for patterning wide right/left?
Really excited about this gun. The all-terrain version definitely is a looker. Now to make it a shooter
Let us know how it goes when you pattern it. These forums are great for shortening the learning curve on a new gun.
g8rvet, it looks like if you raised the POI about 8" or so, then you'd be good to go...would that be a fair assessment? Pattern looks okay, just low.
I was only able to shoot a handful of times this past weekend, but my results seem pretty similar. Taking it tomorrow to get a mid bead installed
Also, what type of sight did your SIL have that fit?
Crow, could you explain the mid bead/figure 8 a little more? When you're looking down the barrel and are stacking the two beads over the bird's head, are you using the bottom (mid) bead as your POA? Or covering the POI with the middle of the 8?
I'm sure shooting it a few times will determine the correct answer, but just want to get an idea of where to begin.
As g8rvet said, this forum discussion is great for navigating the patterning process
Quote from: Fillmoregandt on March 17, 2023, 11:49:18 AM
Also, what type of sight did your SIL have that fit?
It was an older version of this one:
https://www.truglo.com/tru-point-xtreme/
I just slid it along the rib until it was tight and then cranked it down. The front bead will not work though as there is not enough rib to attach. I am trying it using the existing front bead.
Quote from: Fillmoregandt on March 17, 2023, 11:49:18 AM
g8rvet, it looks like if you raised the POI about 8" or so, then you'd be good to go...would that be a fair assessment? Pattern looks okay, just low
That is what I am thinking. I did have some issues with it being inconsistent on the paper though. Gonna try a 571 and see how the pattern is as well. Read some folks have better luck getting consistent pattern with 562-572. The Weatherby is a 560 I believe.
If I can get 130s and no holes at 40 yards I will be happy.
Season opens tomorrow but I will leave it at home. Wish I had it dialed in, it is supposed to rain for much of the day.
In my long barrel, I'm using the Carlson flush XF, which is .585. My pattern looked good, just low.
Next time I'll be able to shoot will be next weekend, so will get to get some pics then.
Thanks for everyone's info in the thread. Very helpful for my first time dialing in a sxs
Quote from: g8rvet on March 16, 2023, 01:00:29 PM
Thanks, getting closer. SIL had a sight that actually fits on the gun. I am having some consistency issues with the patterns. I think the Trulock TSS choke is too constricted (555) and maybe blowing the pattern some - so I ordered a 571. I am gonna keep the 555 in case I ever try it with TSS and see how the 571 dose. Season opens Saturday, but this one is staying on the shelf until I get it right.
The fiber optic front I put on is a HI VIZ "Flashpoint front sight", on the back of the box above the barcode it is (FP1001) I think I got it at Midway but not sure.
It comes with 7 interchangeable fiber rods, some are tall which will make you shoot even lower. It has several screws, 1 of them will fit the threads on the Bobwhite. Was very simple, cz bead unscrewed, then screw the new bracket in existing hole.
according to the chart on Trulocs website the bobwhite bore is .626. Mossberg 500 and Rem 870 are .620
so the BW is a little bit overbored and .555 is more of a constriction in it than in the others, .555 may be too tight for the old HVWT 7's and TSS 7's, probably will be great with tss 9's.
my BW with the Truloc .571 in the distance barrel with 1 5/8oz of #9 TSS is around 300 in the 10" at 40yds. the .571 also patterns TSS 8's very well.
If you file your choke, what I was told and read it will slightly open your pattern so start with a tighter choke than you want to end up with. Mine did not seem to noticeably open up.
an example, for the Bantam, truloc made a specific choke for the old HVWT 7's, patterned great, consistent in the mid 150's in 10" 40yds. it blew patterns with the Fed HVWT #6's and also blew Patterns on TSS 7's, same 1.5oz of shot.
Your so close if that new rear site has adj. I think that should do it
Quote from: Fillmoregandt on March 16, 2023, 08:28:09 PM
I just shot my new CZ Bobwhite G2 20ga this weekend. Great looking gun. I was only able to shoot it a few times, but it seemed to shoot a little low at 35 using Federal tss 7's 1 1/2. I'd hunt with it tomorrow if I had to, but really need to shoot it a few more times (would probably tote my 870 20 if I were hunting tomorrow honestly)
Good info above, Crow. I'm thinking I'll put a mid bead on first, to try to raise it. Don't need much, but I definitely think I could come up a bit. May need to read up on choke filing if it comes to that
Any remedies for patterning wide right/left?
Really excited about this gun. The all-terrain version definitely is a looker. Now to make it a shooter
Some of this is in past threads and should come up in the archives.
SXS's are regulated with target loads of a certain shot charge amount of lead, as a rule when you increase the amount of shot charge the left barrel will shoot to the left, right barrel to the right. any type of shot that is harder or denser than lead will exaggerate it even more.
I wanted to stay with a front bead or mid bead, there may be more ways than this but this is what worked for me, for moving left-Right point of impact (POI) with out a red dot, scope or adjustable iron sights. first way is to shoot less TSS in your shot charge than 1.5oz or 1 5/8 oz
In my BW dropping the shot charge down to 1 oz of TSS#9 the close barrel averages in the low 150's in the 10" at 40 yds with a tight choke and it brought POI almost centered for left and right, a little choke filing brought it "on". If you wanted to shoot a more open pattern no choke filing would of been necessary.
The 2nd way if you wanted to shoot a heavier shot charge (1 5/8 oz. or 1.50z) would be choke filing.
Search on here for info from Doc Holliday, he has set up a bunch of BW's, I believe he sets his tighter choked distance barrel to shoot "on" with an adjustable peep sight and shoots a more open choke in his close barrel.
Quote from: Fillmoregandt on March 17, 2023, 12:40:26 PM
Crow, could you explain the mid bead/figure 8 a little more? When you're looking down the barrel and are stacking the two beads over the bird's head, are you using the bottom (mid) bead as your POA? Or covering the POI with the middle of the 8?
I'm sure shooting it a few times will determine the correct answer, but just want to get an idea of where to begin.
As g8rvet said, this forum discussion is great for navigating the patterning process
The front bead is always the front sight, and is used as POA
the mid bead is taking the place of a rear sight, if you are shooting low you either need to lower the front sight or raise the rear sight. By setting the front bead on top of the rear sight (mid bead) you are raising your POA. The sight picture you get when setting the front bead on top of the mid bead resembles the number eight 8, you are putting the top of the eight where you want the center of you pattern to go.
If you can't get enough raise in elevation and are still shooting low you have a couple of options, #1, if you normally aim by putting the front bead at the base of the neck or mid neck you may have to aim at the head which should have the 10" covering the head and most of the neck. If shooting at the base of the neck is ingrained into your muscle memory, making yourself aim at the head when the heat is on can be hard for some people.
#2, you could also have a bigger (taller) front bead installed in the mid bead position which will give you more raise in elevation.
#3 if you don't already have a mid bead hole drilled and tapped you can stick on a temporary bead, shoot the gun, if center of pattern is too low slide mid bead a little closer to front bead. This will raise your POI and you can combine this with option #2
This is what I did with my BW.
To keep track of moving POI you don't need to shoot turkey loads for this or choke filing. I would buy a box of good quality trap/target loads, Fed gold medal, Top gun or Win. AA.
Once you have shot your turkey load and see how far off it is for POAvsPOI, shoot a trap load at 15-20 yds so you can clearly see a dense core and see where it is compared to your turkey load, now you have a basis for comparison and can keep roughing in your adjustments with the cheaper loads.
all target loads (or turkey loads) will not shoot to the same poi, that is why you want to start with a full box and only shoot them when doing the sighting in process.
Dropped it off this morning to have a mid bead installed. Will update when I get it back and can shoot a few more times