Where is this ship headed?

[Gooserbat]

Truth is the reason we don't use Flint locks is because something more efficient came along.  Then the muzzleloader was replaced by the cartage.  The single shot by the repeater.  Technology evolves efficiency.  Diaphragm calls aren't washers and condoms anymore.  So yes as time marches on so will the efficiency of the weapons we hunt with. 

[shaman]

If Fred Bear were alive today. . .

. . . he'd still be really mad at the guys who tried shove him that crematory oven.

I'm just saying.

You guys are killing me!!!

Funny, that's what Fred said!

Up here in the Trans-Bluegrass, food plots are the least of our worries.

You all talk about loss of habitat and loss of hunting land.

I've got my own 200 Acres.  However, how I got it is indicative of how things are changing.  The family I bought from had been on the land since settlement.  When I got there, the land had been for sale for several years and had not been worked for almost 20 years.   For the longest time, the old lady had given permission to hunt to anyone who asked.  When I took possession, everyone treated it as an unofficial WMA. 

I put the clamps on right away.  I restricted access to just my family.  I put up signs. I chased off poachers.  The process took about 3 years all told.

That's how a lot of land in the state  is going.  I'm going to move there in a few years when I retire .


Here's something I see or more rather hear.  When I first got on the land,  the Opener had lots of shots being taken.  In recent years the number of shots has dwindled.  On the other hand, the number of turkeys taken on the Opener and for the season as a whole has increased.  The number of shots at other times of the season have also gone way down. 

1)  It could be, I'm going deaf, but I don't think that's the case.
2)  There are fewer birds taken in my part of the county, but they're doing better elsewhere.
3)  There may be fewer hunters around my neck of the woods.

I don't know.  What I do know is that the overall trend for the county and the region are trending slightly upwards after dwindling for the better part of the previous decade.  It could be that the habitat is changing, and as all these fallow farms age, they're becoming less productive for turkeys.

[Happy]

...Now, what was the original post about again?....   

If there was a ship load of deer, and EHD broke out, what was the cause and affect?  And what role did the Drury's play?

Leave it to Ronnie to break the tension with a good ole belly laugh!!!

Tense? No sir, I am way less tense than Tiffany Lakosky on an elevator.

[dublelung]

I believe it was Dan Infalt who said that 10% of hunters kill 90% of game. I know he's mainly a deer hunter, but I think this applies across the board. I like to think that those 10% are the good woodsmen, who become part of the woods, as opposed to an intruder in them.

In my opinion, no technology can expedite the process of becoming a good woodsman. It takes time, patience, and an insatiable will to learn every time you are in the woods, and a good mentor never hurts either. As a matter of fact, I would say that when this new technology is used as a crutch, it severely limits the ability to become a better hunter. ("Scent Control" technology for deer hunting instead of knowing how to play the wind; plopping a decoy down 15 yards in front of you instead of being sure to have a good setup)

I'm only 24, and have so much to learn when it comes to being a woodsman and hunter, but I have gotten to the point where I feel like I am more part of the woods, and it is almost a spiritual experience every time I go. Success rates aside, I feel sorry for the people who were introduced to the idea that only gizmos, gadgets, and kill rates were what is important instead of becoming students of the outdoors. Hopefully, shows like the Hunting Public and Pinhoti Project, which get away from the advertisement heavy cable shows, will help show people there is a different way to hunt. We as hunters play a big part of that as well. Personally, I know I can do a better job of trying to share my love of the outdoors with others.

At only 24 years old you are very wise beyond your years. There's a lot of people twice your age who still don't get it.

[kjnengr]

Truth is the reason we don't use Flint locks is because something more efficient came along.  Then the muzzleloader was replaced by the cartage.  The single shot by the repeater.  Technology evolves efficiency.  Diaphragm calls aren't washers and condoms anymore.  So yes as time marches on so will the efficiency of the weapons we hunt with.

Truth....

Just like a gun..... It's not the technology that's evil.  It's the nut behind the tool that uses it in the right or wrong way.

That being said, I turkey hunt for the experience.  Sometimes I win, but most of the time he wins and that's OK.  Getting the quick and easy kill doesn't build the experience or the memory.  I liken the experience of turkey hunting to climbing Mt Everest with respect to Yvon Chouinard's quote about the whole experience of Mt Everest. 

"Taking a trip for six months, you get in the rhythm of it. It feels like you can go on forever doing that. Climbing Everest is the ultimate and the opposite of that. Because you get these high-powered plastic surgeons and CEOs, and you know, they pay $80,000 and have Sherpas put the ladders in place and 8,000 feet of fixed ropes and you get to the camp and you don't even have to lay out your sleeping bag. It's already laid out with a chocolate mint on the top. The whole purpose of planning something like Everest is to effect some sort of spiritual and physical gain and if you compromise the process, you're an asshole when you start out and you're an asshole when you get back."

He also said.......  "You learn that how you got there was what's important. Not what you accomplished."

[Happy]

Lot of good thoughts. I honestly wonder when the native Americans first got their hands on firearms if their hunting got a Lil sloppy. I bet it did. And to be honest I am a product of my generation to an extent. And yes I am not big on change. This isn't a rant just an observation. As long as I can hunt the way I deem sporting then all is well. Someone else's hunt is their business. I just hope we never loose sight of the fact that hunting is meant to be a challenge and a chance to hold on to something that has been around as long as we have existed. This is not about an image or how we look on tweeter.

[g8rvet]

I have sorta kept up with this thread and get a chuckle when folks talk about technology and are against it.  What they really mean is they are against anything newer than when they were taught how to hunt.  It makes you feel more sporting and like you are special.  It would be interesting to hear from some real old timers about what they thought of you guys that think you are old time turkey hunters.  Reminds me of my Great Uncle back in the early 70s that thought we were idiots for deer hunting.  He used to say when he was a pup and they wanted a deer they grabbed a flashlight and sat in the loft of their barn and shot one - it was a harvest, not a hunt and the thought of chasing deer for sport was odd to him.  It is all about perspective.  My son and nephews think anyone that would turkey hunt without a Thermacell would be crazy, cause they don't recall the days before they were around.

[jrinny]

As much as technology has increased in hunting over the years.... I try to embrace both the traditional as well as technology. I was the first one in my family that had a rifled barrel on their shotgun for deer hunting. But I was also the first to use a bow or muzzleloader. While I have a 7 mm magnum with a 3-15 power scope- I would typically grab my grandfathers 1953 Savage 99 and head out deer hunting. I feel that everyone goes through stages in their hunting time.... and technology is part of the stages. Now- taking my kids and paying respect to those who taught me (taking guns of theirs or going to woods I used to hunt with them) is an important part of the hunt.

[LaLongbeard]

I'm not sure how Charles L Jordan killed his last turkey but he writes at length about a few in his journal which  McIlhinny used to write the book. He hunted La in the Spring used no decoy, no blind no food plots  and used  a bamboo yelper(trumpet) to call the Gobbler into range and shot him with a rifle.

My last Gobbler in La was killed in the Spring without decoys, blinds, or food plots and I used a wooden Trumpet yelper to call him to 30 yards and killed him with a shotgun.

The only differences are he used a rifle and wore a grey or brown wool suit.
I used a shotgun and wore camouflage.
Jordan died in 1909 I don't know how much older school Turkey hunter your going to find than that.  Not everybody is chasing the latest fad or trying to make it easier.

[310 gauge]

We, thank God, have the freedom to choose the way we pursue this wonderful gift of Nature. We can't keep up with technology, but we don't have to use it if we prefer to go old school. I know people from 5 to 95 who own cell phones. And I know one real up close and personal like that will tell you if you take one afield without putting it at least on vibrate it can ruin a big Tom Turkey hunt inside of 90 yards!

[shaman]

I'm not sure how Charles L Jordan killed his last turkey but he writes at length about a few in his journal which  McIlhinny used to write the book. He hunted La in the Spring used no decoy, no blind no food plots  and used  a bamboo yelper(trumpet) to call the Gobbler into range and shot him with a rifle.

My last Gobbler in La was killed in the Spring without decoys, blinds, or food plots and I used a wooden Trumpet yelper to call him to 30 yards and killed him with a shotgun.

The only differences are he used a rifle and wore a grey or brown wool suit.
I used a shotgun and wore camouflage.
Jordan died in 1909 I don't know how much older school Turkey hunter your going to find than that.  Not everybody is chasing the latest fad or trying to make it easier.

Read Frederick Gerstacker's memoir-- much earlier.  Gerstacker hunted with a double-barrel flinter. One barrel was rifled and loaded with ball. The other was smooth and loaded with shot.  He hunted everything with it.  This was in the 1830's and early 40's   He spent 5 years hunting all up and down the Ohio and Mississippi, but mostly in Arkansas.

Gerstacker killed most of his turkeys by standing underneath them on the roost.


An even earlier account of taking turkey was by Mishack Browning. However, the bulk of his writing concerned deer and bear.


This was all shooting the birds for food. There wasn't much sport in it.  McIlhinny is the first record I've seen of folks calling turkeys. 

[eggshell]

before we go to far in glorifying the old-timers, remember this was also the generation that cut our forest down to bare ground for miles upon miles. They hunted game to near extinction, they invented such things as punt guns and slaughtered buffalo juts for a hide and it's tongue (and to starve the American Indian). Technology comes in many forms, including the tools and methods of modern conservation. These tools do not make us necessarily less skilled or lazy, they simply change our approach and efficiency. As many have said it's at what level you want to experience your hunt your choice as to how you use the tools

[shaman]

As I said on my first post on this thread, the whole idea of modern turkey hunting resembling the good old days is completely whacked.

It's a fairly common phenomenon.

What we think of "Merry Olde Englande" is a fiction developed by Victorians.  Modern interpretations of King Arthur, Ivanhoe, and Robin Hood, and our modern Renaissance Festivals, are completely fictional.  It just wasn't like that back then.

What we think of as Bluegrass music is a fairly new phenomenon. It all started when folks came North to work in the factories.  They wanted a sound that reminded them of back home. 

We probably are living in the Golden Age of Turkey Hunting.  We are making the myth as we go along.

[GobbleNut]

Here's a question to ponder? 

Who's the "better" sportsman? ...The guy who uses all the latest gadgets, kills a gobbler or two each spring, and leaves the rest in the name of conservation or not being a "game hog"?  ...Or the "traditional" guy who uses nothing but a call, but has the attitude that he is going to kill every single gobbler that he calls in every spring,...limits, conservation, and concern for fellow sportsmen (or the well-being of the turkey population) be damned? 

[eggshell]

  ...Or the "traditional" guy who uses nothing but a call, but has the attitude that he is going to kill every single gobbler that he calls in every spring,...limits, conservation, and concern for fellow sportsmen (or the well-being of the turkey population) be damned?

This guy seldom holds it to just birds he called in. I call them tally masters. All they want is to brag about their kills. To some extent a lot of hunters go through this as they feel they need some validation. I think it matters who mentored them, if anyone. It's called principles. This hunter will kill any bird that appears in range anytime anywhere anyway! He still considers himself a sportsman because he generally obeys game laws and limits, but will occasionally commit a transgression. They will jump property lines and crowd other hunters and then go to the local gathering place and extol the virtues of a good hunt, but they never forget their "Tally". I will confess I had to learn some of these principles through my youth, but aging has brought me more wisdom. I'll tell you how you know when your dealing with a sportsman. when you pull into a WMA parking lot at the same time as another hunter and there is a bird just hammering away up on the ridge. He was actually pulling in first, but as you get out and say, "man that bird is ready to die". He turns and says, go kill  him, I'll set here and listen to the hunt". That guy may have all the gadgets you can imagine or he may not, but the one thing he has that is as old as time is integrity!