I'm in the sporting goods business... Heard from great source FEDERAL is going to offer a 100% TSS load for spring 2018 for 12ga and 20ga.... Stay tuned!
Interesting. I am just waiting to see what happens in the next few years now that tss is going mainstream. I am kinda scared actually. I can see turkey hunting become a little more dangerous. I fear the idiot majority are going to ruin it for the responsible minority once again.
Sent from my SM-G800R4 using Tapatalk
Quote from: Happy on August 05, 2017, 08:41:37 AM
Interesting. I am just waiting to see what happens in the next few years now that tss is going mainstream. I am kinda scared actually. I can see turkey hunting become a little more dangerous. I fear the idiot majority are going to ruin it for the responsible minority once again.
Sent from my SM-G800R4 using Tapatalk
Well put.
Competition would be a good thing. If safety becomes a concern maybe it's use could be limited to sub gauge use only. It certainly isn't needed in a 12 gauge.
Quote from: TalksToTurkeys on August 05, 2017, 01:14:13 PM
Competition would be a good thing. If safety becomes a concern maybe it's use could be limited to sub gauge use only. It certainly isn't needed in a 12 gauge.
Lol. You can't really expect to limit a specific shot to a specific gauge!
Quote from: Happy on August 05, 2017, 08:41:37 AM
Interesting. I am just waiting to see what happens in the next few years now that tss is going mainstream. I am kinda scared actually. I can see turkey hunting become a little more dangerous. I fear the idiot majority are going to ruin it for the responsible minority once again.
Sent from my SM-G800R4 using Tapatalk
Most complain for spending $5 a shell, how many do you think will pay $8-10?
Hevi changed the waterfowl world, but how many still buy steel? Yes you shoot more at waterfowl but some will spend the money no matter what and some will not. There will be some that shoot TSS but most will stick to longbeards and other lead/HTL after buying a box or two.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
For me it's not the guns fault or any kind of shell...It's the person pulling the trigger who should be responsible for his or her action in taking game...any kind of hunting has been dangerous from the time of black powder until the modern shells we have now...So i really don't see more people getting shot ....but regardless we all need to remember the 10 commandments of hunting safety. Never point a firearm at anything you don't want to shoot. Identify your target and WHAT is beyond it....
Quote from: Greg Massey on August 05, 2017, 08:28:12 PM
For me it's not the guns fault or any kind of shell...It's the person pulling the trigger who should be responsible for his or her action in taking game...any kind of hunting has been dangerous from the time of black powder until the modern shells we have now...So i really don't see more people getting shot ....but regardless we all need to remember the 10 commandments of hunting safety. Never point a firearm at anything you don't want to shoot. Identify your target and WHAT is beyond it....
Great points, problem is some don't be careful enough and camouflaged hunters don't always get seen.Some states already limit shot size . Missouri is no larger than 4's.The extra energy of the larger sizes turned some injuries into fatalities .The extra energy/penetration of tss maybe a factor,guess time may tell .
Don't some states have min shot size I believe NY can't go smaller than 7.5s so most TSS loads at 8 & 9 wouldn't be legal.
Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk
Quote from: TalksToTurkeys on August 05, 2017, 01:14:13 PM
Competition would be a good thing. If safety becomes a concern maybe it's use could be limited to sub gauge use only. It certainly isn't needed in a 12 gauge.
It's not that it's not needed in a 12 but more that a 12 is not needed with TSS.
Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk
Yep it's coming
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170807/6f5789855fa7a4512533e2994ed74aca.jpg)
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Dang , they just can't get rid of everyone's favorite can they ::)
The flight control wad ;D
Quote from: owlhoot on August 07, 2017, 07:47:15 PM
Dang , they just can't get rid of everyone's favorite can they ::)
The flight control wad ;D
That says "works in all chokes". Wasn't the FCW intended for non ported and non wad stripping chokes? Maybe this is something different?
Flex wad? Put in waterfowl loads last year I do believe?Also don't believe that they said choke matters with the regular flight control wad. Anyway lots of good people on here have not been overjoyed with that wad to say the least.lol
Hey let's get Clark on it!
Quote from: owlhoot on August 07, 2017, 09:09:41 PM
Flex wad? Put in waterfowl loads last year I do believe?Also don't believe that they said choke matters with the regular flight control wad. Anyway lots of good people on here have not been overjoyed with that wad to say the least.lol
Hey let's get Clark on it!
The picture looks like a poster that would be used for display, maybe at a meeting of some sort. You can see the "Exit" sign at the top. I'd say someone took a picture of that display.
The new Flitecontrol "Flex" Wad first showed up in the Black Cloud waterfowl loads:
Several key changes have been made to the Black Cloud round, most significant being a redesign of the FLITECONTROL wad. The wad design has always hinged upon the deployment of its rear-mounted petals, which use muzzle pressure to pop open upon exiting the barrel. However, since ported chokes reduce muzzle pressure, they often didn't provide enough energy to deploy these petals in the original design, leading to inconsistent performance. The FLITECONTROL FLEX wad overcomes this with a more, as the name suggests, flexible set of petals with unique gussets that deploy with far less muzzle pressure. Also, whereas the original FLITECONTROL wad featured small, forward-opening vent wings on the side to allow the shot string to eventually separate from the wad itself, the all-new FLITECONTROL FLEX replaces them with strategically placed slits around the wad body, further enhancing compatibility with both ported and standard chokes.I have not fired any of those loads, so I can't comment on their performance. The wad, old or new Flitecontrol, is a kind of sabot that is supposed to retain the shot until it leaves the muzzle and then separate, leaving the shot charge largely intact. The first wads were very hard and stiff but the more recent models have been made of thinner and softer material. They worked better with the #7 Heavyweight shot but chokes that defeated the intended purpose still worked best.
There has been no "official" announcement of this new load by Vista Outdoor/Federal, so we'll just have to wait and see what happens.
Thanks,
Clark
Don't you know Apex is thrilled?
Guess some folks who have always pooh poohed TSS will be coming around? Perhaps even some websites that don't like it? ;)
Thanks again Clark and good information as always.
Quote from: owlhoot on August 08, 2017, 10:49:16 AM
Thanks again Clark and good information as always.
You're welcome. I have learned that the picture was of "a concept-art poster" taken at a presentation made by Federal. They will introduce their 2018 turkey loads this fall, most likely in October. Final product information will be available then. So, it may be another couple of months until specific information is made public. Patience is the key.
Thanks,
Clark
Quote from: BandedSpur on August 08, 2017, 07:59:26 AM
Don't you know Apex is thrilled?
Guess some folks who have always pooh poohed TSS will be coming around? Perhaps even some websites that don't like it? ;)
I think you got your exact particulars slightly off target
I don't have time or am willing to invest it into explaining several long standing issues , those with the folks buying tss in bulk and marking it up for considerable markup... and skirting every possible legal , liability, and even ethics issue known to turkey hunters ....
Making "longest shot threads"popping Jakes at 83 yards and then waiting for folks to come knocking at the door is a piss poor business model
I took the high road on the reseller issue
The attitude from the gang that wholesales tss for a considerable markup and runnning arround selling it to folks with next to zero loading experence. ...was markedly similar to the same cry babies that moan and groan about how hillary clinton lost the election , they just won't let it go.... just like your post to this thread
Quote from: davisd9 on August 05, 2017, 06:41:12 PM
Quote from: Happy on August 05, 2017, 08:41:37 AM
Interesting. I am just waiting to see what happens in the next few years now that tss is going mainstream. I am kinda scared actually. I can see turkey hunting become a little more dangerous. I fear the idiot majority are going to ruin it for the responsible minority once again.
Sent from my SM-G800R4 using Tapatalk
Most complain for spending $5 a shell, how many do you think will pay $8-10?
Hevi changed the waterfowl world, but how many still buy steel? Yes you shoot more at waterfowl but some will spend the money no matter what and some will not. There will be some that shoot TSS but most will stick to longbeards and other lead/HTL after buying a box or two.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
I agree! I've looked into Apex ammo's TSS offerings and I can't stomach the price. We will just have to wait and see.
Quote from: trkehunr93 on August 09, 2017, 11:19:05 AM
Quote from: davisd9 on August 05, 2017, 06:41:12 PM
Quote from: Happy on August 05, 2017, 08:41:37 AM
Interesting. I am just waiting to see what happens in the next few years now that tss is going mainstream. I am kinda scared actually. I can see turkey hunting become a little more dangerous. I fear the idiot majority are going to ruin it for the responsible minority once again.
Sent from my SM-G800R4 using Tapatalk
Most complain for spending $5 a shell, how many do you think will pay $8-10?
Hevi changed the waterfowl world, but how many still buy steel? Yes you shoot more at waterfowl but some will spend the money no matter what and some will not. There will be some that shoot TSS but most will stick to longbeards and other lead/HTL after buying a box or two.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
I agree! I've looked into Apex ammo's TSS offerings and I can't stomach the price. We will just have to wait and see.
I don't think you will be any happier with Federal's prices, even buying it direct from China TSS ain't cheap.
I love my federal Heviweight #7's.
Absolutely devestating on turkeys, and 7's are the smallest shot we can shoot in NH.
We killed 3 this season with them.
Quote from: turkeyinstrut on August 09, 2017, 08:19:30 PM
Quote from: trkehunr93 on August 09, 2017, 11:19:05 AM
Quote from: davisd9 on August 05, 2017, 06:41:12 PM
Quote from: Happy on August 05, 2017, 08:41:37 AM
Interesting. I am just waiting to see what happens in the next few years now that tss is going mainstream. I am kinda scared actually. I can see turkey hunting become a little more dangerous. I fear the idiot majority are going to ruin it for the responsible minority once again.
Sent from my SM-G800R4 using Tapatalk
Most complain for spending $5 a shell, how many do you think will pay $8-10?
Hevi changed the waterfowl world, but how many still buy steel? Yes you shoot more at waterfowl but some will spend the money no matter what and some will not. There will be some that shoot TSS but most will stick to longbeards and other lead/HTL after buying a box or two.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
I agree! I've looked into Apex ammo's TSS offerings and I can't stomach the price. We will just have to wait and see.
I don't think you will be any happier with Federal's prices, even buying it direct from China TSS ain't cheap.
buying tss directly from China (tss garage operation ressellers)in bulk is a process that was just recently exposed as having upwards of a 300% markup is some cases , if I remember correctly a individual showed pictures of the invoices but that's a story for another day ... and you know what I'm just putting that behind me , between apex , nitro and what looks to be federal .....the small "garage operations " ..individuals reselling raw tss to newbies for profit are going to see greattly reduced business in the future
Federal allready produces in vast quantities the15gg densities ,and does so for as cheap as 19.99 a box in the 20 gauge offerings my bet is the 20 gauge 18gg will go for 30$ and the 12 for arround 40$ a box and people will line up to get it
My only hope is that federal continues to do what thier doing and have a responsible advertizing campaign that doesn't cause" issues "
Quote from: turkeyinstrut on August 09, 2017, 08:19:30 PM
Quote from: trkehunr93 on August 09, 2017, 11:19:05 AM
Quote from: davisd9 on August 05, 2017, 06:41:12 PM
Quote from: Happy on August 05, 2017, 08:41:37 AM
Interesting. I am just waiting to see what happens in the next few years now that tss is going mainstream. I am kinda scared actually. I can see turkey hunting become a little more dangerous. I fear the idiot majority are going to ruin it for the responsible minority once again.
Sent from my SM-G800R4 using Tapatalk
Most complain for spending $5 a shell, how many do you think will pay $8-10?
Hevi changed the waterfowl world, but how many still buy steel? Yes you shoot more at waterfowl but some will spend the money no matter what and some will not. There will be some that shoot TSS but most will stick to longbeards and other lead/HTL after buying a box or two.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
I agree! I've looked into Apex ammo's TSS offerings and I can't stomach the price. We will just have to wait and see.
I don't think you will be any happier with Federal's prices, even buying it direct from China TSS ain't cheap.
Thats why I'm staying with old school lead
QuoteMy only hope is that federal continues to do what thier doing and have a responsible advertizing campaign that doesn't cause" issues "
That is truly the real issue. I don't think anyone argues with promoting/advertising a shell that delivers tight/dense patterns with knock-down power at responsible ranges. The objection is promoting/advertising shooting at turkeys at ranges that are better left to those who shoot rifles.
We have worked too long to rescue and grow the resource to become a generation of shooters whose only interest is in long range turkey killing, forgetting the hunting aspect.
Thanks,
Clark
I will give Apex my business. Done with Federal after chasing LOT numbers and having them completely blowing me off after a LONG talk with customer service.
Apex might not be in business for long after Federal gets going
Quote from: surehuntsalot on August 13, 2017, 08:59:46 PM
Apex might not be in business for long after Federal gets going
[/quote
I wouldn't bet on that.
Quote from: turkeyinstrut on August 14, 2017, 12:11:05 PM
Quote from: surehuntsalot on August 13, 2017, 08:59:46 PM
Apex might not be in business for long after Federal gets going
[/quote
I wouldn't bet on that.
Hevi shot is doing good .
Nitro is too. Apex should be ok .
This development is scary to me. But I can recall 3" then 3 1/2" shells coming out which was scary too. We also have superior turkey decoys some of which are motorized! A really scary development is people using tail fans to hide behind while sneaking up on gobblers --- this is so dangerous and, IMO, should be outlawed. In Texas I believe they allow hunting turkeys with a rifle which really is untraditional and, IMO, not a good method.
I would prefer that traditional turkey hunting methods were practiced by all. However, I believe that is an up-hill battle that will ultimately be lost.
Quote from: Dermott on September 20, 2017, 03:01:42 PM
This development is scary to me. But I can recall 3" then 3 1/2" shells coming out which was scary too. We also have superior turkey decoys some of which are motorized! A really scary development is people using tail fans to hide behind while sneaking up on gobblers --- this is so dangerous and, IMO, should be outlawed. In Texas I believe they allow hunting turkeys with a rifle which really is untraditional and, IMO, not a good method.
I would prefer that traditional turkey hunting methods were practiced by all. However, I believe that is an up-hill battle that will ultimately be lost.
If you don't like new advancements, then maybe hunting isn't your gig! Lol. I'm 36 and have seen tons of changes in hunting. Some I like, some I hate. If you can recall the advent of 3" shells, then you have been around a lot longer than me. I bet you even use some of the products that have come along since you started. It is the way of the world. New products come along and offer a better way. People buy them. End of story. As far as fanning, it's not a new tactic. It's been done for years. As far as shotguns being the traditional way to shoot turkeys? Man you're way off base on that! Years back, turkeys were traditionally shot with the best and easiest weapon to kill them with. Lots of times that was a rifle. TSS is nothing new. And the fact that federal may be loading it will not cause a revolution, nor will it cause the apocalypse. It will just be another product offered to hunters willing to pay for it. If you don't like it, don't worry. Next year there will be dozens of other new products to take your mind off of it!
I see Dermott's point.. At the end of day the wildlife is not "innovating" near as quick as humans. So the million dollar question remains.. where does it end? When do we reach a point where zero sport is left?
This is a separate, and very long conversation. But at the end of the day it will be decided by individual hunters. Some will always choose to sit in a blind with their motorized decoys, drones and a 12 gauge 3.5in shooting a cannon sized load of TSS. Then others will choose to shoot only a long bow and not much more, like the Indians did.
No right or wrong, just personal choice.
Time will prove out if any concerns stated here are valid or not. I agree that I don't like the idea of a guy on public land possessing an 80-90 yard lethal weapon that could kill me through foliage across a river bottom by an unethical hunter stalking a tom I might be working. Not at all a methods issue for me and honestly don't care if it offends anyone here, just the truth. With these loads being more commercially available will mean an increase in those using it, simple for me to understand. For states that outlawed rifle hunting for turkeys this is just another step back in the direction they tried to get away from IMO. I remember when rifle hunting was still legal here in SC and why it was outlawed, folks were getting shot. So what's the difference then and now? Nothing really, a load that kills at extended range during a season that allows fully camo clad hunters.
Quote from: THattaway on September 21, 2017, 11:02:02 AM
Time will prove out if any concerns stated here are valid or not. I agree that I don't like the idea of a guy on public land possessing an 80-90 yard lethal weapon that could kill me through foliage across a river bottom by an unethical hunter stalking a tom I might be working. Not at all a methods issue for me and honestly don't care if it offends anyone here, just the truth. With these loads being more commercially available will mean an increase in those using it, simple for me to understand. For states that outlawed rifle hunting for turkeys this is just another step back in the direction they tried to get away from IMO. I remember when rifle hunting was still legal here in SC and why it was outlawed, folks were getting shot. So what's the difference then and now? Nothing really, a load that kills at extended range during a season that allows fully camo clad hunters.
Great post. This sums up my feelings on the subject 100%
Quote from: lunghit on August 07, 2017, 08:08:08 PM
Quote from: owlhoot on August 07, 2017, 07:47:15 PM
Dang , they just can't get rid of everyone's favorite can they ::)
The flight control wad ;D
That says "works in all chokes". Wasn't the FCW intended for non ported and non wad stripping chokes? Maybe this is something different?
YESSIRRR.....I have it on ROCK SOLID authority the flex wad will be loaded with heavyweight shot!!!!! Look for it this spring. BTW.....I also have it on ROCK SOLID authority the flight control wad CAN INDEED be shot thru ported choke tubes.....and with GREAT RESULTS!!!!!
:turkey2:PLEASE EVERYONE.....chime in on what I'm sayin. How dead do we as sportsmen & WOMEN NEED OR WANT to kill turkeys? I firmly believe in a humane & ethical way to take game....be it turkeys or deer. I also believe it is up to each hunter to use their own judgement on the how what when and where about what is "ethical" on taking ANY game . I ask y'alls opinion on how far is too far? Also,when do we stop being " killers " and start being HUNTERS again? I thought the whole point and concept is to "HUNT" and not just kill. Am I wrong for thinking this way??? When do we go back to CALLIN a bird in so close you can see the whites of his eyes,and see those magnificent colors???!!! At what point do we stop trying to kill birds at rifle range and actually "HUNT" them again? Anyways,lets hear those opinions....on WHATEVER!!!!! Huntin em.,the new or existing ammo or whatever!!!!! Only ONE rule....we ALL STICK TOGERTHER.
Oh boy, here we go. This one deserves it's own thread but I'll chime in. To me, ethics encompasses many points, including common courtesy, safety and clean kills. I think that your post referred to ethics as far as clean kills. That comes down to knowing your equipment and your own abilities. For me, it's about the hunt, not the kill and I realize that for some it's just the opposite. I didn't fire a shot this season but I guarantee that I enjoyed it as much as those who tagged out. I don't have a problem with anyone shooting the "new and improved" loads as long as they know what they're shooting at and what's behind it. The last sentence should have included knowing your equipment and your own abilities.
To me there are different choices for different people. Some want to challenge themselves and some want instant success. I know folks who are just happy to kill a turkey any way possible. I know others that are very old school and won't have it any other way. Most have to run through a bloodthirsty phase and some stay in it. Is there a right or wrong? I don't know. All I know is how I feel. I enjoy hunting, I enjoy getting away and into the woods. There is peace and quiet and I feel at home. It is a retreat for me. I can sit and ponder life, what improvements I can make as a husband, as a father and as a person. Am I there to kill? Yes. I am very serious about it. I want to enjoy the experience the hunt and I personally feel that a surplus of technology and gadgets cheapens it for me. I get more of a satisfaction from skill and dedication for the most part anyways. I shoot a specialized turkey gun, a nice compound bow and a good deer rifle. The stick bow fellows, and flintlock hunters have me beat and I tip my hat to them. At my skill level things aren't a gimme or easy. I don't like trail cameras, crossbows, ozonics, blinds, or 60+ yard turkey guns. I believe as hunters we need to practice conservation and good game management. That is our going to be our saving grace if hunting is to continue. It won't be tv shows or commercials. That's for sure. The mindset of people in general is troubling to me for sure. We have become greedy and selfish and willing to do whatever it takes as long as we get what we want and the less effort the better. This is carrying over to hunting and it worries me. This is not saying my way is right at all. It is just one man's opinion. I think we all have to think and decide what matters to us the most. Some will always get a kick out of the latest and greatest and some will just be happy with what we have. As long as we are hunting legally and with conservation in mind then I think we will be ok. It's the ones that kill just to satisfy a deficiency in their self esteem that bug me. I hunt for me, no one else and encourage everyone else to do the same. An animals life is to be valued and respected. I may not kill a turkey at all next year. I am sure gonna have fun trying though.
Sent from my SM-G800R4 using Tapatalk
Well said Happy. I try to teach my children not to get caught up in the killing part of it but to take in the whole experience.
I'm interested in seeing how much these will be a shell. I would think a company like Federal is going to get TSS at a far cheaper pricer per pound that anyone else out there will. Still not going to be cheap but I would be surprised if Apex or Nitro end up being cheaper.
Quote from: Old Gobbler on August 11, 2017, 10:41:56 AM
Quote from: turkeyinstrut on August 09, 2017, 08:19:30 PM
Quote from: trkehunr93 on August 09, 2017, 11:19:05 AM
Quote from: davisd9 on August 05, 2017, 06:41:12 PM
Quote from: Happy on August 05, 2017, 08:41:37 AM
Interesting. I am just waiting to see what happens in the next few years now that tss is going mainstream. I am kinda scared actually. I can see turkey hunting become a little more dangerous. I fear the idiot majority are going to ruin it for the responsible minority once again.
Sent from my SM-G800R4 using Tapatalk
Most complain for spending $5 a shell, how many do you think will pay $8-10?
Hevi changed the waterfowl world, but how many still buy steel? Yes you shoot more at waterfowl but some will spend the money no matter what and some will not. There will be some that shoot TSS but most will stick to longbeards and other lead/HTL after buying a box or two.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
I agree! I've looked into Apex ammo's TSS offerings and I can't stomach the price. We will just have to wait and see.
I don't think you will be any happier with Federal's prices, even buying it direct from China TSS ain't cheap.
buying tss directly from China (tss garage operation ressellers)in bulk is a process that was just recently exposed as having upwards of a 300% markup is some cases , if I remember correctly a individual showed pictures of the invoices but that's a story for another day ... and you know what I'm just putting that behind me , between apex , nitro and what looks to be federal .....the small "garage operations " ..individuals reselling raw tss to newbies for profit are going to see greattly reduced business in the future
Federal allready produces in vast quantities the15gg densities ,and does so for as cheap as 19.99 a box in the 20 gauge offerings my bet is the 20 gauge 18gg will go for 30$ and the 12 for arround 40$ a box and people will line up to get it
My only hope is that federal continues to do what thier doing and have a responsible advertizing campaign that doesn't cause" issues "
The last time I checked, a business can mark up something whatever they damn well please.
Quote from: donjuan on October 10, 2017, 03:48:47 PM
The last time I checked, a business can mark up something whatever they damn well please.
I may be wrong but I'm expecting Federal to be cheaper than even the guys hand loading can load them for. If that happens things will get very interesting.
Quote from: Gobble! on October 12, 2017, 10:08:57 PM
Quote from: donjuan on October 10, 2017, 03:48:47 PM
The last time I checked, a business can mark up something whatever they damn well please.
I may be wrong but I'm expecting Federal to be cheaper than even the guys hand loading can load them for. If that happens things will get very interesting.
Agreed.....
Anybody seeing these yet?
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
I spend way to much time on the net every day, I have not seen anything yet.
They say it is on the way. I cant see why they do it because the HWT 7s is a bad boy. I would keep the $$$ down and roll with them. The TSS is like anything else new. You will have a group that will keep loading and some that will keep buying it but it will settle down after the 1st year. Look at the Long Beard 20 this time last year. It was the big thing now it just a shell.
There is an article showcasing Federal Grand Slam, Federal 3rd Degree, and Federal HeavyWeight TSS located on page 94 of the Jan/Feb NWTF Magazine which is available to view online now on their website. It says all loads will come with the new Flite Control Flex Wad. They meantion 18 g/cc as density and the box shows No 7 shot but they also mention that a #9 Federal TSS has the same knockdown as #5 lead at all ranges. So Im assuming they will have #7 and #9. No mention of anything in between.
Quote from: rbreedi1 on December 15, 2017, 10:29:48 AM
There is an article showcasing Federal Grand Slam, Federal 3rd Degree, and Federal HeavyWeight TSS located on page 94 of the Jan/Feb NWTF Magazine which is available to view online now on their website. It says all loads will come with the new Flite Control Flex Wad. They meantion 18 g/cc as density and the box shows No 7 shot but they also mention that a #9 Federal TSS has the same knockdown as #5 lead at all ranges. So Im assuming they will have #7 and #9. No mention of anything in between.
Good intel. Any mention of or thoughts on pricing, particularly relative to Apex?
There was no mention of price. I got my NWTF magazine in the mail today and also noticed the 3rd degree ammo will also feature TSS instead of regular heavyweight
I'll know something on price next few days
I have been evaluating the new Federal TSS loads for the past 30+ days or so. We have been restricted from publishing any information on our findings but that "blackout" will soon be lifted and I can publish a "Product Test" article as soon as that happens.
I will have full details on what will be available at that time as well.
Thanks,
Clark
Quote from: allaboutshooting on December 16, 2017, 11:29:15 AM
I have been evaluating the new Federal TSS loads for the past 30+ days or so. We have been restricted from publishing any information on our findings but that "blackout" will soon be lifted and I can publish a "Product Test" article as soon as that happens.
I will have full details on what will be available at that time as well.
Thanks,
Clark
Clark as always look forward to your findings. Keep us posted.
Will do.
Thanks,
Clark
Quote from: Gobble! on October 12, 2017, 10:08:57 PM
Quote from: donjuan on October 10, 2017, 03:48:47 PM
The last time I checked, a business can mark up something whatever they damn well please.
I may be wrong but I'm expecting Federal to be cheaper than even the guys hand loading can load them for. If that happens things will get very interesting.
I beg to differ, I don't think Federal will be able to sell TSS loads cheaper than we can load them ourselves and even if they could I would not buy them and I think 95% of the TSS handloaders would agree with me on this. The thing about loading them yourself is you know EXACTLY what is going into each shell and they will be consistent from shot to shot, when you shoot commercial ammo there isn't near the consistency and you end up chasing lot numbers and Federal is the worlds worst about that. JMHO
I see Federal has released some info in the TSS, not seeing and 20ga 9 shot
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=2035420826671912&set=gm.1769560563063933&type=3
Looks like $49.95 for 3.5" and $44.95 for 3". Looks like they have .410 ga as well as 20 ga. Thanks for sharing Full Fan
I can't get to that link for whatever reason. Oh well
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Quote from: rbreedi1 on December 21, 2017, 09:46:55 AM
Looks like $49.95 for 3.5" and $44.95 for 3". Looks like they have .410 ga as well as 20 ga. Thanks for sharing Full Fan
I'm hoping the price keeps the general public from buying these up, just hope they don't advertise it like hevi did as a long range cartridge last thing we need is public land filled with guys reading how their new load is lethal to 100yds or some BS
I've seen the ad now. I think there's a mistake. A model number implies 9 shot for the 20 gauge but the corresponding description says 7. So I'm not sure.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
I don't see the general public standing in line to buy these at this price but I may be wrong.
Quote from: buzzardroost on December 21, 2017, 10:57:26 AM
I've seen the ad now. I think there's a mistake. A model number implies 9 shot for the 20 gauge but the corresponding description says 7. So I'm not sure.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
I saw that too.. I would think they will have 7 and 9 for 20 as well. May just be a typo
I have been told by a reliable source that there was an error, and 20ga 9's will be available.
Like someone else said they won't be legal in all states, New York is nothing smaller than 7.5 for turkey
Quote from: allaboutshooting on December 16, 2017, 11:29:15 AM
I have been evaluating the new Federal TSS loads for the past 30+ days or so. We have been restricted from publishing any information on our findings but that "blackout" will soon be lifted and I can publish a "Product Test" article as soon as that happens.
I will have full details on what will be available at that time as well.
Thanks,
Clark
Looking forward to your thoughts Clark.
Looking foward to getting some for my .410 . Shooting lead Federal 7.5 now with success.
Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk
Quote from: TauntoHawk on December 22, 2017, 10:36:08 AM
Like someone else said they won't be legal in all states, New York is nothing smaller than 7.5 for turkey
It's no smaller than #8 in NY... I was hoping to see them load #8 tss just for that reason. Im not so sure the new 20 ga #7 TSS load will pattern as well as my beloved 20 ga HW #7s due to a lower pellet count. But theres only one way to find out, i look forward to trying these when they hit the shelves.
Quote from: jordanz7935 on December 24, 2017, 09:57:27 PM
Quote from: TauntoHawk on December 22, 2017, 10:36:08 AM
Like someone else said they won't be legal in all states, New York is nothing smaller than 7.5 for turkey
It's no smaller than #8 in NY... I was hoping to see them load #8 tss just for that reason. Im not so sure the new 20 ga #7 TSS load will pattern as well as my beloved 20 ga HW #7s due to a lower pellet count. But theres only one way to find out, i look forward to trying these when they hit the shelves.
Ok I knew it was something like that. Yeah 7 in tss is gonna be a tougher pattern and overkill on energy the 9's will be solid but not eligible in many some places. I'm on the fence on these..
One side says they aren't worth the money when HW is gonna kill em as dead as dead needs to be in any reasonable range with the 20 and these loads aren't worth the extra $$$... On the other hand I buy $$$$$ worth of calls each year that aren't necessary or even sometimes don't even make it to the field cuz I have too many so why split hairs over ammo price and shoot the best of the best.
Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk
Going by the MSRP on these, I'm guessing the street price won't be much different.
[/quote]One side says they aren't worth the money when HW is gonna kill em as dead as dead needs to be in any reasonable range with the 20 and these loads aren't worth the extra $$$... On the other hand I buy $$$$$ worth of calls each year that aren't necessary or even sometimes don't even make it to the field cuz I have too many so why split hairs over ammo price and shoot the best of the best.
Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk
[/quote]
I know what you mean, the HW #7s are great loads in the 20 ga, im kind of ticked they are discontinuing them.IMO they were priced very reasonably. I have a small stash and plan on buying every box i can find in the near future.But its inevitable that im eventually gonna have to switch over to tss, im certainly not downgrading to any flavor of hevishot in my 20's. I have a hard time believing any encon officer would write you a ticket for having your gun loaded with tss #9s , but the law is the law. Hopefully federal adds tss #8s to the lineup for next year.
I am reasonably sure that any NY encon officer would write you for having the wrong size shot. Certainly not worth chancing. I wasnt aware federal was doing away with HW7. Thats a terrible idea!
Quote from: jordanz7935 on December 25, 2017, 07:23:03 PM
One side says they aren't worth the money when HW is gonna kill em as dead as dead needs to be in any reasonable range with the 20 and these loads aren't worth the extra $$$... On the other hand I buy $$$$$ worth of calls each year that aren't necessary or even sometimes don't even make it to the field cuz I have too many so why split hairs over ammo price and shoot the best of the best.
Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk
[/quote]
I know what you mean, the HW #7s are great loads in the 20 ga, im kind of ticked they are discontinuing them.IMO they were priced very reasonably. I have a small stash and plan on buying every box i can find in the near future.But its inevitable that im eventually gonna have to switch over to tss, im certainly not downgrading to any flavor of hevishot in my 20's. I have a hard time believing any encon officer would write you a ticket for having your gun loaded with tss #9s , but the law is the law. Hopefully federal adds tss #8s to the lineup for next year.
[/quote]
https://www.outdoorhub.com/reviews/2017/12/27/first-look-federal-premiums-3-high-performance-turkey-loads-2018/
Well crap. The 20 gauge #9's are a reduced recoil offering. Wonder how much effect that lower speed has?
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
It may be a good thing for your pattern if they stay just below speed of sound.
Quote from: buzzardroost on January 02, 2018, 07:45:21 AM
Well crap. The 20 gauge #9's are a reduced recoil offering. Wonder how much effect that lower speed has?
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
None whatsoever. TSS 9s @ 1,000 fps will penetrate 1.25" of ballistic gel waaaay beyond 40 yds.
Quote from: buzzardroost on January 02, 2018, 07:45:21 AM
Well crap. The 20 gauge #9's are a reduced recoil offering. Wonder how much effect that lower speed has?
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
To me it sounded like there will be an additional low recoil load and a normal #9 load.
I wanna see these put against Apex loads
Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk
Apex and Nitro along with the hand load guys are going to be above them. Federal should have stayed with the HWT and gave the guys that dont want to put $$$$$ in a shell.
Quote from: buzzardroost on January 02, 2018, 07:45:21 AM
Well crap. The 20 gauge #9's are a reduced recoil offering. Wonder how much effect that lower speed has?
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Anything 1,000 FPS or over is plenty fast enough with TSS, even with 9's or 9.5's.
Quote from: turkeyinstrut on January 04, 2018, 01:46:18 PM
Quote from: buzzardroost on January 02, 2018, 07:45:21 AM
Well crap. The 20 gauge #9's are a reduced recoil offering. Wonder how much effect that lower speed has?
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Anything 1,000 FPS or over is plenty fast enough with TSS, even with 9's or 9.5's.
20s are offered in 1200 fps and 1000 fps.
Thanks,
Clark
Its unfortunate, but that's the direction Federal went.That is also the reason once i find a shell i like i stock up on it. I have 25 boxes of the 20 ga. Fed hvy #7. That will probably last me a lifetime , however i am always looking.Lee
Quote from: SumToy on January 03, 2018, 09:46:49 AM
Apex and Nitro along with the hand load guys are going to be above them. Federal should have stayed with the HWT and gave the guys that dont want to put $$$$$ in a shell.
I would agree.
Quote from: wvnut3 on January 04, 2018, 07:33:29 PM
Its unfortunate, but that's the direction Federal went.That is also the reason once i find a shell i like i stock up on it. I have 25 boxes of the 20 ga. Fed hvy #7. That will probably last me a lifetime , however i am always looking.Lee
I was thinking the same thing, unfortunately I only have 4 boxes of them, so when they run out I'm going to revert back to the 12ga, or maybe try something else.
Quote from: Izzyjoe on January 06, 2018, 12:41:43 AM
Quote from: wvnut3 on January 04, 2018, 07:33:29 PM
Its unfortunate, but that's the direction Federal went.That is also the reason once i find a shell i like i stock up on it. I have 25 boxes of the 20 ga. Fed hvy #7. That will probably last me a lifetime , however i am always looking.Lee
I was thinking the same thing, unfortunately I only have 4 boxes of them, so when they run out I'm going to revert back to the 12ga, or maybe try something else.
There are still plenty of the discontinued shell out there . stock up while you can. Lee
It may be premature ....but from everything ive seen this far from company literature and staff videos ...I would like to take this opportunity to thank federal ammunition for taking the high road on this , and not doing what several other ammunition companies did(and some garage operations ) in the past and not promote this as some "hail Mary " long shot product --everything I've seen thus far looks responsible from federal --
Will the product be safe, for you and your firearm ? I'm almost 100% assuming and assured it is. unlike what was going on in the past....with other operations, but you know what , I'm not gonna go into that ..
It will take a few weeks, months. ...whatever and somebody(s) will do the homework and figure out what choke ...load combination makes the product perform the best , when it gets warmer ...
For the folks shooting heavyweight. ...go out get some more , cause by the time the regular public(not the fanatics here on OG) figure out the heavyweight is no longer , a panic will ensue , the shelves will be striped bare , especially the 20ga
$10 a round kinda seems pricey , but I'm sure if the product is as good quality as they say , a pocket full of these will last you all season and perhaps the next.I'm sure Federal will do well with thier offering , they have access to thousands upon thousands of retail and online operations plus marketing. ...they will sell plenty of it
I am actually pretty excited about the new Grand slam lead loads federal is bringing out. They are using the new flex wad in them, and they are making them in 10 gauge also. The old Turkey thugs shot very well for such an inexpensive shell, and I'm really curious as to how these will shoot. Nice to see a new 10 gauge load coming out, but that probably means no more heavyweight 10 loads if they are discontinuing the 15g loads in the other gauges.
I dont think the wad is going to change things much. It should work in the same set up you have now. :icon_thumright:
Quote from: SumToy on January 06, 2018, 10:48:27 AM
I dont think the wad is going to change things much. It should work in the same set up you have now. :icon_thumright:
Thanks for the info. That choke setup is great. It puts up some good numbers with pretty much anything I've tried, and some of the magblend patterns were unreal!
Us ole turkey hunters are definitely a different bunch .So says a friend of mine .lol
9 bucks a shot for turkey with tss! He said good night I shot elk ,moose and grizzly and the most expensive loads he used were under 3 bucks a shot! Of course I said yep and would be getting.410 and maybe 20 maybe not as the already 4 bucks a shot Federal Hw7 20 gauge stock should cover me , my kid and grandkids .lol.
Yes us turkey hunters are nuts! Come on spring!
Cabela's got um but they on back-order.
http://www.cabelas.com/product/shooting/ammunition/shotgun-ammunition/pc/104792580/c/104691780/sc/104567580/federal-premium-tss-turkey-per-rd/2685621.uts?slotId=5
I hope they hit stores I'll be ordering a few to try
Rogers Sporting Goods has the Federal TSS 12 gauge 3" #7 and #9 loads available.
Wow 10-12 bucks a shot before tax, no thank you. I'll be sticking with LB's for years to come!
3" are 35.00 for five = 7bucks a shot
-5 dollar rebates =6 bucks a shot.
I get you,still not cheap!
$500 - $1000 gun - Check
$200+ lease - check
$50 in state tags and license - check
$100+ vest, clothes, boots, etc - check
$200+ worth of calls - check
$100+ worth of gas - check
$50 for 5 shells though the ammo is the make or break in the whole situation - way to expensive.
I can totally understand one wanting to shoot what has worked for them or fits their style, but for most of us the cost of a few shells a year really should not be a huge factor in the grand scheme of things.
Quote from: davisd9 on February 06, 2018, 09:53:51 AM
$500 - $1000 gun - Check
$200+ lease - check
$50 in state tags and license - check
$100+ vest, clothes, boots, etc - check
$200+ worth of calls - check
$100+ worth of gas - check
$50 for 5 shells though the ammo is the make or break in the whole situation - way to expensive.
I can totally understand one wanting to shoot what has worked for them or fits their style, but for most of us the cost of a few shells a year really should not be a huge factor in the grand scheme of things.
Preach it!!!
Almost like having a field champion and feeding him dog chow.
Quote from: davisd9 on February 06, 2018, 09:53:51 AM
$500 - $1000 gun - Check
$200+ lease - check
$50 in state tags and license - check
$100+ vest, clothes, boots, etc - check
$200+ worth of calls - check
$100+ worth of gas - check
$50 for 5 shells though the ammo is the make or break in the whole situation - way to expensive.
I can totally understand one wanting to shoot what has worked for them or fits their style, but for most of us the cost of a few shells a year really should not be a huge factor in the grand scheme of things.
amen, seeing as how the shot is what actually breaks his neck, $7 bucks doesn't begin to compare to the thousands I blow on hunting to begin with!!! :OGturkeyhead:
Actually if you are already using the Federal Hw7 15, this isn't too much more.
Now to see if this does perform like we all hope it will?
Quote from: davisd9 on February 06, 2018, 09:53:51 AM
$500 - $1000 gun - Check
$200+ lease - check
$50 in state tags and license - check
$100+ vest, clothes, boots, etc - check
$200+ worth of calls - check
$100+ worth of gas - check
$50 for 5 shells though the ammo is the make or break in the whole situation - way to expensive.
I can totally understand one wanting to shoot what has worked for them or fits their style, but for most of us the cost of a few shells a year really should not be a huge factor in the grand scheme of things.
Yep, I've said it for years.
Throw in the tobacco that people use, the beer that they drink, etc but they can't swing for a box of ammo.
Shooting lead because it works and you like it is great, fantastic even! Throwing out the I can't afford it card is probably incorrect.
I agree with a lot of the comments but there is a point where it seems the ammo companies are gouging us. At what point does it become cost prohibitive? When will the madness end? :funnyturkey:
Quote from: CrustyRusty on February 07, 2018, 08:04:03 AM
I agree with a lot of the comments but there is a point where it seems the ammo companies are gouging us. At what point does it become cost prohibitive? When will the madness end? :funnyturkey:
When people quit paying for it.
The price for bows with Matthews is crazy,but people pay for it.
Now it seems every dang bow company has to have a 1000 dollar bow.
Bennelli made a very expensive hunting shotgun and people buy it.Now others follow with their expensive shotgun .
It won't end! :z-dizzy:
Hand load them if you don't like the cost. My 3" 20ga 1 5/8oz TSS #9.5s cost me just under $5/round if I don't include my time to reload them.