I've learned on the Refuge forum that duck calling isn't about realism primarily, but the ability to manipulate birds. Often, less-than-accurate sounds work better to this end.
I'm curious to what extend you believe the same holds for turkeys. Maybe big game is just different, and realism is everything—but I am reminded about the way people talk about longboxes. Seems people tend to try to "manipulate" more than imitate a real hen.
Can you draw a parallel between a cutdown duck call and a long box in this regard? Are they are other "manipulator" calls (or calling surfaces/materials) where one sacrifices realism for effectiveness?
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Most real bird would never place in a calling contest.
I think the cadence, rhythm of "How a turkey talks" is more important. I have used clear calls, raspy calls and all can do the same thing. It's about learning to talk turkey and what to say, when say and when not to call.
MK M GOBL
Quote from: MK M GOBL on March 23, 2021, 11:34:27 AM
I think the cadence, rhythm of "How a turkey talks" is more important. I have used clear calls, raspy calls and all can do the same thing. It's about learning to talk turkey and what to say, when say and when not to call.
MK M GOBL
X2 and also knowing it's time to stop calling.
The emerging synthesis is "birds are birds." Lot of the cadence, knowing when to call and when not to has direct parallels in duck hunting.
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Sounding like a real hen is what its all about , thats how you trick gobblers
Not that im a judge of sorts...but my decades of hunting around the country , selling calls and running OG ive met a considerable amount of turkey hunters , ..the absolute most skilled among the group had a few things in common , and not in any order
1 determination
2 extremely good woodsman ship and common sense in the woods , very quiet walker ....doest spook game ever , knows how to pick the perfect spot for various setups etc..
3 they were incredibly good callers , im saying GOOD ..the type you hear close or far in the woods and you are 100% tricked into thinking they are a actual wild turkey ... most hunters sound like a ...hunter , and that works most of the time for most of the gobblers...but not all the time , the guys that sound authentic are the" Killers " some guys are utterly lethal cause they know how to do the most realistic kee kee or cluck and nothing else notable..and they play those strong points to deadly effectiveness...
These are the types of hunters that kill plenty of gobblers
IMO Shannon
I agree Shannon. All the points you listed are goals for anyone who wants to consistently kill Gobblers.
Learn to be highly skilled with as many types of calls possible.
To refer to the longbox , I had the pleasure of meeting Niel Cost many moons ago , he was always with Lamar Williams
Anyways I could talk for a spell about his personal boatpaddle (no spring)call he showed me and demonstrated its running he was GOOD , if I picked up with little practice and tried to mimic what I thought was a turkey in a novices ears I would have turkeys running from me in short order...you have to practice with that call , record yourself , play it back , listen to recordings of real turkeys not other turkey call salesmen ....Mr Cost was a expert on what he knew best and I am sure many a Gobbler was laid to rest because of it
... guys its the operator , you have to apply yourself to the given tool to bring out its effectiveness, there is a champion in every call ...with that said about 1 million diaphragm calls are sold to people who have mastered the perfect highlands chimpanzee..and will never progress past that ..truth ...but if you practice, you will be a killer
Don't get me started about how at some turkey conventions have the largest collection of tone deaf individuals I've ever seen ..aimlessly yodeling on a call with a huge grin of satisfaction, there i said it ...got it off my chest
But anyways whatever tool you use master it , identify your strong points with it and exploit it to its fullest effectiveness
There's calling to make them gobble and there's calling to bring them to the gun.. that's where manipulation comes in, you can use some less than "real" sounding calls to pull gobbles when nothing else will but it doesn't mean he's on his way but just like a locator call can be useful information.
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I listen to turkey sounds and practice everyday. Although you may not need to sound perfectly like a turkey, sounding perfectly like a turkey helps more than it hurts. Crappy sounding calling and great sounding calling both kill turkeys. I imagine the great sounding turkey calling has a higher percentage chance of success. I want to call turkeys well, period.
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Quote from: ol bob on March 23, 2021, 10:54:16 AM
Most real bird would never place in a calling contest.
I respectfully disagree.
Quote from: Old Gobbler on March 23, 2021, 05:02:18 PM
Sounding like a real hen is what its all about , thats how you trick gobblers
Not that im a judge of sorts...but my decades of hunting around the country , selling calls and running OG ive met a considerable amount of turkey hunters , ..the absolute most skilled among the group had a few things in common , and not in any order
1 determination
2 extremely good woodsman ship and common sense in the woods , very quiet walker ....doest spook game ever , knows how to pick the perfect spot for various setups etc..
3 they were incredibly good callers , im saying GOOD ..the type you hear close or far in the woods and you are 100% tricked into thinking they are a actual wild turkey ... most hunters sound like a ...hunter , and that works most of the time for most of the gobblers...but not all the time , the guys that sound authentic are the" Killers " some guys are utterly lethal cause they know how to do the most realistic kee kee or cluck and nothing else notable..and they play those strong points to deadly effectiveness...
These are the types of hunters that kill plenty of gobblers
IMO Shannon
Excellent post, boss !!
I hear hunters in the woods that have, apparently, have never heard an actual wild turkey hen in their lives. Some are off on tone. Some are off on cadence. Some aren't even speaking turkey language. Yet, some of these guys still kill some birds. A lot of these same guys are the ones who say that some of the worst callers they ever heard were real hens. Or that a real hen would never win a calling contest.
But the guys who will CONSISTENTLY get on a bird and hang a tag on him are guys who SOUND LIKE A REAL HEN. I'll never be a competition caller. But I've been running a diaphragm call for over 40 years and I still strive to improve my craft and up my game each year. I take about as much pride in having a guy say "Holy crap !!! I thought you were really a turkey !! " as I do killing a gobbler.
A hunter with determination and great woodsmanship skills will kill a lot of birds. I know a lot of these guys.
A hunter with determination a nd great woodsmanship skills who can call lights-out.........will kill MORE birds than that.
Quote from: Old Gobbler on March 23, 2021, 05:14:20 PM
To refer to the longbox , I had the pleasure of meeting Niel Cost many moons ago , he was always with Lamar Williams
Anyways I could talk for a spell about his personal boatpaddle (no spring)call he showed me and demonstrated its running he was GOOD , if I picked up with little practice and tried to mimic what I thought was a turkey in a novices ears I would have turkeys running from me in short order...you have to practice with that call , record yourself , play it back , listen to recordings of real turkeys not other turkey call salesmen ....Mr Cost was a expert on what he knew best and I am sure many a Gobbler was laid to rest because of it
... guys its the operator , you have to apply yourself to the given tool to bring out its effectiveness, there is a champion in every call ...with that said about 1 million diaphragm calls are sold to people who have mastered the perfect highlands chimpanzee..and will never progress past that ..truth ...but if you practice, you will be a killer
Don't get me started about how at some turkey conventions have the largest collection of tone deaf individuals I've ever seen ..aimlessly yodeling on a call with a huge grin of satisfaction, there i said it ...got it off my chest
But anyways whatever tool you use master it , identify your strong points with it and exploit it to its fullest effectiveness
There is soooooo much truth in this post. Bringing the heat!
I'm struck by how the Shannon himself lists determination, woodsmanship, (and setup) ahead of calling realism.
Let's put it this way: which of the following is more likely?
1 - Gobbler gets roped in to the gun from 300 yards away, despite the lack of good setup, because of that extra edge from ultra-realistic calling.
2 - Gobbler gets called in from 100 yards away by "bleh" calling coming from good position with an easy path.
Obviously the question isn't whether a good setup or good calling are both desirable. They are. It's why we buy custom calls and play them all year, but also scout and study our quarry.
The question is ultimately how do the marginal effects of what makes an ideal turkey hunter rank? Are turkeys that much pickier for realism than ducks? Or, as with ducks, is context king?
It's admittedly purely academic. Nobody would choose to call worse than they could. But it's a useful question insofar as it makes us understand the birds themselves better.
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IMO it takes more than good calling but combine good realistic calling with good woodsmanship and that fellow will kill a lot of turkeys.
Quote from: WildTigerTrout on March 23, 2021, 10:19:37 PM
IMO it takes more than good calling but combine good realistic calling with good woodsmanship and that fellow will kill a lot of turkeys.
Totally agree. In addition, I will add the following from my own perspective. I will take the average caller that knows what to say and when to say it over the great caller that does not any day of the week in the turkey woods.
Furthermore, I will also take the average caller on the "right" gobbler over the best caller on the "wrong" gobbler any day of the week, as well. :D
Quote from: GobbleNut on March 24, 2021, 09:16:38 AM
Furthermore, I will also take the average caller on the "right" gobbler over the best caller on the "wrong" gobbler any day of the week, as well. :D
That may be the most important variable of all.
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Quote from: WildTigerTrout on March 23, 2021, 10:19:37 PM
IMO it takes more than good calling but combine good realistic calling with good woodsmanship and that fellow will kill a lot of turkeys.
Question completely answered in 25 words or less.
Yep.
:icon_thumright:
Some years back I had a hen hustle past me, less then 10ft, chasing after a Tom. It was yelping, clucking all the way down the hill trying to catch up.
Fortunately I pulled out my phone and filmed as she went. I've used that video to compare my calling too, along with others from the net.
Couple weekends ago was sitting along field. An Osceola hen come of the woods walking towards me. As she passes by (again less then 10ft) I record her clucking.
I have great fun watching these video's and mimicking their sound while remembering the hunt that day.
There are lots of true statements when it comes to being better turkey killers in this thread. However, the question was is sounding like a real turkey overrated. The plain and simple answer is no, it is not overrated. Sounding like a real hen will NEVER be a detriment. In NO way is it overrated to sound like a real turkey.
Quote from: Jbird22 on March 24, 2021, 10:21:31 PM
There are lots of true statements when it comes to being better turkey killers in this thread. However, the question was is sounding like a real turkey overrated. The plain and simple answer is no, it is not overrated. Sounding like a real hen will NEVER be a detriment. In NO way is it overrated to sound like a real turkey.
Very, VERY true story.
Yep.
You don't have to be capable of winning calling competitions to be a successful turkey hunter, but it doesn't hurt.
I'm not anyone who could win a competition, but I fill my tags. I have a son who could win competitions if he tried, but he's busy with other things-- mostly bagpipes. He was a child prodigy. He's in his 20's now. He plays, but he's busy with work, etc. He doesn't play as much anymore. When he was a little kid, I gave him some calling tapes and some calls. Within a few hours, he was sounding like a real turkey. What makes him so good is his ability to play in ensemble-- being able to play with others. If he hears something, he can play it and not just match it, but also harmonize with it and move the music along. He doesn't just do this with bagpipes, but he also does Rock and Bluegrass quite well.
I watched him once as a wee kid with one of my box calls. He sat out in the grass around sunset shortly before season and called in three gobblers-- right up to the house. The kid can crawl inside a gobbler's skull.
Is that skill of benefit to a turkey hunter? You bet. Is it all there is? No way.
I represent the reverse. I'll probably never amount to much as a caller, but I get the job done. I know how to read a gobbler fairly well, I can be where I need to go and make myself a part of the forest, I can close the deal. I can still close the deal better than my son, but it all has to do with decades more exposure to the birds. It also has to do with patience. My son will hear a gobbler coming to his back door, and he can't help himself and try turning around. He hasn't learned yet to keep his back to the tree.
Is calling overrated? It is in the respect that a lot of novice hunters think it's the most important aspect. To me, the most important thing is scouting and exposing myself to the birds. I need to know what they're up to. I need to be where they're going to be instead of chasing after them. If you're not a great caller, you can still be a good turkey hunter. You just have to rely on other skills. Can calling alone assure success? Probably not. I've known a bunch of really good turkey hunters over the years. They all had a bag full of tricks beyond just calling.
No it's underrated, assuming you're not using visual aids. If you're using a visual aid it's easier to get away with not sounding like a real turkey.
It's rare that I can't tell you if what you are hearing in the woods is a hunter or a real turkey. If I can tell the turkeys can tell, most gobblers are just so darn horny they don't care. Kind of like a 18-22 year old human male, if there's a possibility it'll spread it's legs he'll go after anything. Then there's the few who are more picky and she better be pretty and have some sense. Then there's the older guys that have already hitched up and it takes a real temptress to get him to stray. I want to sound like that hot arse temptress, all the guys flock to her, even if it's just for a look, unless they're gay.
I had a crystal once that sounded absolutely horrible. Didn't sound like a turkey in any way shape or form. Anyhow, one day I was calling for a buddy and there was a gobbler hung up on a strut zone maybe 75yds up the mountain. Well I backed down the mountain trying to pull the bird with me. Still just kept hammering at each end of that strut zone. I take this crystal out and start wailing on it. Sounds like hell but he starts going nuts. About five minutes in a bird fires up at the bottom of the mountain and starts coming. As that bird gets near I hear my buddy shoot. I turn and the bird from the bottom of the mountain is passing to my left and I shoot him. Now what got that bird that was hung up to commit was that other gobbler coming up the mountain, I think, but what got them both fired up was a call that sounded like a baby screaming. Don't know why. Didn't sound like a turkey to my ear, but something did it for them. Maybe the pitch, maybe it just being something they'd never heard, I don't know.
Now all that said if I've got the choice of carrying that call or a call that sounds like a real hen, I'm taking the hen. Most mornings that's your better bet. But there's always some mornings and some birds where it takes something wild to kill them. I think that's why us pot call guys carry so many surfaces and so many strikers. There's a few pots I save just for those days when nothing else works. They're buried in the back of my vest with my sandwiches.
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ChesterCopperpot, I have witnessed the same sort of scenario many times over the decades. In my opinion, it is a lot more common (and normal) than most hunters think it is. Personally, I think it all falls back on the premise that turkeys can (and do) recognize other turkey voices among the other turkeys they associate with.
Granted, I don't think successful turkey calling, in general, is entirely a function of that premise, but I do think it comes into play once in a while in situations like you describe.
To put it in terms many of us male turkey hunters can understand, I recognize my wife's voice even if I can't see her,....and when she says, "come here", I best be listening to her and obeying! ;D :toothy12: :angel9:
The way I look at it, I want to be as realistic as possible. I have a high standard in calling, and expect myself to be better than most people around me. I feel being extremely realistic gives you an edge that may or may not overcome a slightly, and I'm talking very slight here, mediocre set up or situation.
Calling is a part of turkey hunting, and to me the most important and enjoyable part.
I am blessed with a very very good ear for tone and sound. I also have excellent hearing despite loud music, shotgun blasts, playing in bands and ticking my wife off.
I am a very very good duck caller, and while I understand calling ducks at a high level, I feel even in duck calling realism works better than just cadence. I am also a pretty good turkey caller, and I feel that as I have improved, my success has as well. But I am also serious about woodsmanship, scouting, set up, etc.
If you listen to hens, both ducks and turkeys, and then listen to guys blowing cut downs in the woods, or good calls on open water or fields, or a good box, or good diaphragm or whatever very well- they all have the same thing in common. They possess the same cadence and rythm. The sounds of each hen, are a little different, but just like ducks and duck calls, the cadence and rythm are identical.
I also feel that those who say things like " a real hen would never win a contest" or " the worst calling I've ever heard came from a real hen" generally suck, period. Hey, I'm a blunt guy, and that's how I see it and it's proven itself over and over.
Frankly, I think comments like that are excuses to be mediocre and not try to be as good as they can be.
Or they are field bushwhackers, or reapers.
Quote from: Scottyb on March 25, 2021, 07:21:45 PM
I also feel that those who say things like " a real hen would never win a contest" or " the worst calling I've ever heard came from a real hen" generally suck, period. Hey, I'm a blunt guy, and that's how I see it and it's proven itself over and over.
Frankly, I think comments like that are excuses to be mediocre and not try to be as good as they can be.
Or they are field bushwhackers, or reapers.
Well, some hens don't sound like the "ideal" hen should sound. I imagine they get bred and produce broods just like the "ideal-sounding" hens do.
My hearing in my left ear was ruined by the time I was in my 20s from shooting without hearing, but I hear well enough. I can't carry a tune and I could care less about music. It's a me thing.
So far as calling goes I have no idea if I'm a good caller or not. No one but my son has ever heard me use a turkey call and he hasn't hunted with anyone else. I can say at 16 he's an effective duck caller and I leave the duck calling to him. I call the turkeys.
I practice turkey calling a lot during the year and this time of year I practice multiple times a day, everyday. I listen to turkey sound clips on the internet and I try my best to sound exactly like them. Those hens on the internet sound different from each other as well. I also have the benefit of raising eastern wild turkeys before releasing them to the wild. They are different from domestic turkeys right out of the egg. To think of it, I got my duck calling down by hatching and raising mallards. The damned things would fly around my house and the ones on the ground would call to those flying and vice versa. It's not so much about having an ear for things for me as hearing the same thing everyday for a few years.
All that being said I really like to think I sound as realistic as possible. I enjoy it and practice it a lot, but that's a me thing too. I could care less what anyone else does.
What I do notice amongst hunters is that with some there appears to be an elitist attitude about the proper way to hunt. To me the proper way to hunt results in success and enjoyment by the hunter. We all like and dislike different things. I dislike poaching and trespassing. Other than that folks can harvest turkeys anyway they like so long as it's legal. One statement I've never understood is "this or that should be done the way it was meant to be" or "the way nature intended." I keep waiting for the all encompassing lexicon telling me definitively how things are "meant to be" or how something was "intended to be." The Bible covers a lot of those things and some folks twist that all up to fit how they look at things. The state hunting regulations are what I follow for hunting. Anything beyond that is someone's opinion, and you know what's said about opinions. Some of these opinions are of an elitist nature, if I may be so blunt.
I don't reap turkeys because I simply don't want to. Just like I don't eat tomato pudding because I don't like it. I've had people tell me something was wrong with me because I didn't like tomato pudding. I haven't told or thought anyone was wrong for reaping. I'm not sure what "field bushwhacking" is, but if it's legal and folks are successful doing it I really don't care.
I kill turkeys every year, a few of them are killed in cookie-cutter hunts where everything happens the way you thought it would. A good many are killed in situations that I could not have foreseen. Many times I ride home empty-handed and I'm pumped up over the hunt I had and I can't wait to tell someone about it. Having fun is success too. I'm about done with my feelings on the subject for now.
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Meleagris gallopavo
I agree with you. I have killed birds almost every way imaginable and have narrowed my techniques down to what I enjoy most. I never ask anyone's opinion on if I done it right, I done it my way. On the flip I realize everyone else is free to hunt in a way they enjoy, as long as they are legal. Same with calling, some are very focused on their calling and some focus on woodsmanship and some just don't care and are satisfied to just be in the woods. It's all good. I like being realistic, but I rarely ever practice. If I have a call in my hand or mouth, I am most likely hunting.
So I say realism as to tone, cadence and proper timing are very important, but perfect calling won't bring one into your living room. I'd rather be in the woods in a good set up on a hot gobbler with a marginal call than have a perfect call and be in the wrong place and time. So yes it's important, but somewhat over rated.
I think the last sentence sums it up to a degree- to answer the original question is it important- yes. Is it over rated- also yes, to a degree, but not much.
But, my response was what I want to achieve. I know guys killing lots and lots of birds with what I would consider mediocre calling. And, my level of calling, to a top pro, would probably be considered better than average, maybe even good- but not great. It's a personal thing to me, to be the most realistic I can be.
I should have expanded also- realism isn't always just about sound. Timing, is crucial. Being a realistic caller may include scratching, moving, etc.
But, I stand by the statement that anyone saying a real hen wouldn't win a calling contest probably isn't very good. I really feel that it is a statement to overcome their shortcomings on a call. I've seen it Over and over and over. Most of these guys -and it's almost always men- have killed very few birds, have hunted a short time, or have really only ever bushwhacked a field bird over decoys. They tend to purposely hunt in situations where they don't have to call, and have success. And by doing so, can hold up a bushwhacked field turkey and say " see, calling doesn't matter". Put one of these guys up in the woods and they would be so lost, they might quit. Actually, that's a good idea...
seriously though, where I live I know people who have never shot a turkey inside a block of woods. There are even people out here that have never set foot in the timber once in their lives to turkey hunt. Some even go so far as to saying they have no idea that you can turkey hunt in the woods. Most of these people are terrible callers, and kill turkeys every spring. They are almost all deer hunters as well.
I would be willing to bet, that any real hen calling vs Matt VanCise for a gobbler would win the battle. And yet I consider him the beat there is in realism and ability. Real turkey hens sound great. They sound like turkeys, because they are turkeys. The attitude of them sounding terrible is so far fetched and asinine that it borders pure stupidity. They ARE the standard, period. We as humans can not reproduce their sounds exactly like they can, and never will. But, the closer we are to sounding like them, the better off we are.
As Ray Eye says " Calling is everything". I take that to mean good realistic calling, whether it's turkey or locater calling, scratching in the leaves, flying down with a wing, the way you walk, and so on. Good woodsmanship only gets you so far, and I feel does have a little edge in importance over calling, but not much. It does put you into position to be able to call, but unless you are a crawler, doesn't always seal the deal, all of the time.
This has been a good discussion thread. I thank everyone for their thoughts (and those who will weight in).
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Quote from: Jbird22 on March 24, 2021, 10:21:31 PM
There are lots of true statements when it comes to being better turkey killers in this thread. However, the question was is sounding like a real turkey overrated. The plain and simple answer is no, it is not overrated. Sounding like a real hen will NEVER be a detriment. In NO way is it overrated to sound like a real turkey.
There's the answer.
There's hen calling, then there's hen calling with realism and emotion. If you don't know the difference, just listen or watch Denny Gulvas. That guy transforms into a hen turkey. No way is that level of calling a detriment, and couple that realism with woodsmanship, birds are in trouble spring and fall.
Quote from: Greg Massey on March 23, 2021, 01:43:58 PM
Quote from: MK M GOBL on March 23, 2021, 11:34:27 AM
I think the cadence, rhythm of "How a turkey talks" is more important. I have used clear calls, raspy calls and all can do the same thing. It's about learning to talk turkey and what to say, when say and when not to call.
MK M GOBL
X2 and also knowing it's time to stop calling.
All times 10
It helps a caller to be around vocal Turkeys as often as possible. The 24 Eastern hens presently in my pens have great variation of tone. Cadence only changes with excitement or distress.
While I enjoy yelping to a gobbling Tom to make him speak, the clucks bring them to the gun most often. Especially on those hardheaded Toms'.
Shannon, you are spot on.
My fundamental thoughts on this subject are these:
1) Yes, being able to call "realistically" is important.
2) With today's calling instruments that are available to anybody that wants to hunt turkeys, learning to call and sound like a real turkey is probably the easiest part of the entire turkey hunting process.
...The End...
The key the past 5-7 years for me was knowing when to be a subtle very realistic sounding turkey and then be realistically quiet like real turkeys that has brought the gobbler in for a kill. I like him to hunt for me. Just need to learn the quavy confidently on the mouth call now.
Sounding like the boss hen note for note with cadence, emotion and inflection is never a bad thing. Sometimes she does all the hard work for you.
If I'm out hunting and find myself with a gobbler in front of me gobbling. And theres a hen behind me calling. I'm shutting up :).
Some very good comments here.
I think it can be overrated. Let's face it, if you call and he gobbles you sound like a hen. Simple? Lol
Sounding more realistic can help you convince more birds, maybe more educated birds that your a real hen. Very true. But most people don't think about what a real hen does besides just calling.
Sometimes you gotta move.
I'm not talking about crawling towards the gobbler. What I'm saying is left or right or around him. Maybe 15 -20 yards maybe less. That little bit of movement can make the difference, peak his curiosity.
Answer this question ...
How many real hens stay in the same place and call to or answer a gobbler, for as much as 2 hours? MOVE. Sometimes just 2 maybe 3 trees over. Move and sound like a real hen feeding. If your set up is right, he will come take a peek at some point. I hunt 95 % big timber. Set up so when he peaks his head up, he's in range. Make him look for you. Listen for foot steps.
You'll know when he answers if you have time to move without being seen, crawl over a few trees and cluck and purr as you crawl.
If you got a bird responding but holding tight sometimes it's for other reasons besides hens.
Two or three weeks into a season, how many guys have worked this bird? How many guys spooked or shot at this bird? How many sit calling from the same place and never move?
I say be more realistic over all, not just your calling.
If moving didn't work cut him off. Nothing. This this the patient part. Keep your gun up and wait. May be 30 minutes or a hour. You just gave him everything you needed too. Curiosity will get the best of him.
Is calling overrated? More than you might think. But sounding better than your average caller and doing things differently will help you.
Quote from: perrytrails on April 01, 2021, 03:24:16 AM
Some very good comments here.
I think it can be overrated. Let's face it, if you call and he gobbles you sound like a hen. Simple? Lol
Sounding more realistic can help you convince more birds, maybe more educated birds that your a real hen. Very true. But most people don't think about what a real hen does besides just calling.
Sometimes you gotta move.
I'm not talking about crawling towards the gobbler. What I'm saying is left or right or around him. Maybe 15 -20 yards maybe less. That little bit of movement can make the difference, peak his curiosity.
Answer this question ...
How many real hens stay in the same place and call to or answer a gobbler, for as much as 2 hours? MOVE. Sometimes just 2 maybe 3 trees over. Move and sound like a real hen feeding. If your set up is right, he will come take a peek at some point. I hunt 95 % big timber. Set up so when he peaks his head up, he's in range. Make him look for you. Listen for foot steps.
You'll know when he answers if you have time to move without being seen, crawl over a few trees and cluck and purr as you crawl.
If you got a bird responding but holding tight sometimes it's for other reasons besides hens.
Two or three weeks into a season, how many guys have worked this bird? How many guys spooked or shot at this bird? How many sit calling from the same place and never move?
I say be more realistic over all, not just your calling.
If moving didn't work cut him off. Nothing. This this the patient part. Keep your gun up and wait. May be 30 minutes or a hour. You just gave him everything you needed too. Curiosity will get the best of him.
Is calling overrated? More than you might think. But sounding better than your average caller and doing things differently will help you.
Great post.
Is sounding like a real turkey overrated?
Yes!
The calls that work best for me don't sound like turkeys at all! They call all the turkeys in not just Toms.
I've used rubber bands, balloons, ocarina, Jews harp, a drum, a kalimba, chimes none of which sound like a turkey plus I have used an aluminum can, copper pipe, ceramic tile, the back of a mirror, an aluminum channel and other things that sound similar to turkeys.
I posted elsewhere here about turkey hearing. They don't hear what we hear.
Some say turkeys aren't curious I say they are extremely curious and come to sounds because of curiosity.
Turkey's hear turkeys all day every day. They are creatures of sight and sound. When they hear different sounds, they want to see whats making the sound.
I've spent to many hours in the woods with a frequency generator app. I've played ranges of frequencies that sound like something that you would expect to hear in an outer space movie and the flocks show up. Some of the frequencies make tree frogs croak like crazy.
Check this short video out...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nVrQypTa8oQ
Quote from: CrankyTom on April 04, 2021, 01:58:47 PM
Is sounding like a real turkey overrated?
Yes!
The calls that work best for me don't sound like turkeys at all! They call all the turkeys in not just Toms.
I've used rubber bands, balloons, ocarina, Jews harp, a drum, a kalimba, chimes none of which sound like a turkey plus I have used an aluminum can, copper pipe, ceramic tile, the back of a mirror, an aluminum channel and other things that sound similar to turkeys.
I posted elsewhere here about turkey hearing. They don't hear what we hear.
Some say turkeys aren't curious I say they are extremely curious and come to sounds because of curiosity.
Turkey's hear turkeys all day every day. They are creatures of sight and sound. When they hear different sounds, they want to see whats making the sound.
I've spent to many hours in the woods with a frequency generator app. I've played ranges of frequencies that sound like something that you would expect to hear in an outer space movie and the flocks show up. Some of the frequencies make tree frogs croak like crazy.
Check this short video out...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nVrQypTa8oQ
were you in western md. a couple of years ago using a call that sounded like a high pitched constipated seagull?
whoever it was did not think sounding like a real hen was over rated
Quote from: crow on April 04, 2021, 08:25:11 PM
Quote from: CrankyTom on April 04, 2021, 01:58:47 PM
Is sounding like a real turkey overrated?
Yes!
The calls that work best for me don't sound like turkeys at all! They call all the turkeys in not just Toms.
I've used rubber bands, balloons, ocarina, Jews harp, a drum, a kalimba, chimes none of which sound like a turkey plus I have used an aluminum can, copper pipe, ceramic tile, the back of a mirror, an aluminum channel and other things that sound similar to turkeys.
I posted elsewhere here about turkey hearing. They don't hear what we hear.
Some say turkeys aren't curious I say they are extremely curious and come to sounds because of curiosity.
Turkey's hear turkeys all day every day. They are creatures of sight and sound. When they hear different sounds, they want to see whats making the sound.
I've spent to many hours in the woods with a frequency generator app. I've played ranges of frequencies that sound like something that you would expect to hear in an outer space movie and the flocks show up. Some of the frequencies make tree frogs croak like crazy.
Check this short video out...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nVrQypTa8oQ
were you in western md. a couple of years ago using a call that sounded like a high pitched constipated seagull?
whoever it was did not think sounding like a real hen was over rated
:TooFunny: :TooFunny: :TooFunny:
Quote from: crow on April 04, 2021, 08:25:11 PM
Quote from: CrankyTom on April 04, 2021, 01:58:47 PM
Is sounding like a real turkey overrated?
Yes!
The calls that work best for me don't sound like turkeys at all! They call all the turkeys in not just Toms.
I've used rubber bands, balloons, ocarina, Jews harp, a drum, a kalimba, chimes none of which sound like a turkey plus I have used an aluminum can, copper pipe, ceramic tile, the back of a mirror, an aluminum channel and other things that sound similar to turkeys.
I posted elsewhere here about turkey hearing. They don't hear what we hear.
Some say turkeys aren't curious I say they are extremely curious and come to sounds because of curiosity.
Turkey's hear turkeys all day every day. They are creatures of sight and sound. When they hear different sounds, they want to see whats making the sound.
I've spent to many hours in the woods with a frequency generator app. I've played ranges of frequencies that sound like something that you would expect to hear in an outer space movie and the flocks show up. Some of the frequencies make tree frogs croak like crazy.
Check this short video out...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nVrQypTa8oQ
were you in western md. a couple of years ago using a call that sounded like a high pitched constipated seagull?
whoever it was did not think sounding like a real hen was over rated
Nope not me but I have a friend who's calling sounds like a kid scratching a chalk board with both hands and he calls the toms in.
Odd sounds calls whole flocks in not just toms.
Quote from: CrankyTom on April 04, 2021, 08:55:57 PM
Quote from: crow on April 04, 2021, 08:25:11 PM
Quote from: CrankyTom on April 04, 2021, 01:58:47 PM
Is sounding like a real turkey overrated?
Yes!
The calls that work best for me don't sound like turkeys at all! They call all the turkeys in not just Toms.
I've used rubber bands, balloons, ocarina, Jews harp, a drum, a kalimba, chimes none of which sound like a turkey plus I have used an aluminum can, copper pipe, ceramic tile, the back of a mirror, an aluminum channel and other things that sound similar to turkeys.
I posted elsewhere here about turkey hearing. They don't hear what we hear.
Some say turkeys aren't curious I say they are extremely curious and come to sounds because of curiosity.
Turkey's hear turkeys all day every day. They are creatures of sight and sound. When they hear different sounds, they want to see whats making the sound.
I've spent to many hours in the woods with a frequency generator app. I've played ranges of frequencies that sound like something that you would expect to hear in an outer space movie and the flocks show up. Some of the frequencies make tree frogs croak like crazy.
Check this short video out...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nVrQypTa8oQ
were you in western md. a couple of years ago using a call that sounded like a high pitched constipated seagull?
whoever it was did not think sounding like a real hen was over rated
Nope not me but I have a friend who's calling sounds like a kid scratching a chalk board with both hands and he calls the toms in.
Odd sounds calls whole flocks in not just toms.
:happy0167:,
I'll still take my chances on trying to sound like as real of a hen as possible, or a Jake or gobbler
Quote from: crow on April 04, 2021, 09:27:17 PM
I'll still take my chances on trying to sound like as real of a hen as possible, or a Jake or gobbler
I heard you were trying to find a chuck big enough to turn bass drums, lol.
Quote from: EZ on April 05, 2021, 01:24:55 PM
Quote from: crow on April 04, 2021, 09:27:17 PM
I'll still take my chances on trying to sound like as real of a hen as possible, or a Jake or gobbler
Oh come on, you know we all need one of those frequency generator apps to call turkeys. LMAO.
Quote from: EZ on April 05, 2021, 01:24:55 PM
Quote from: crow on April 04, 2021, 09:27:17 PM
I'll still take my chances on trying to sound like as real of a hen as possible, or a Jake or gobbler
I heard you were trying to find a chuck big enough to turn bass drums, lol.
I need one of those big trumpets like Heidi uses up in the Swiss alps. there is a new ostrich farm nearby and if one of those big bull ostriches escapes I want to be ready
Quote from: CrankyTom on April 04, 2021, 01:58:47 PM
Is sounding like a real turkey overrated?
Yes!
The calls that work best for me don't sound like turkeys at all! They call all the turkeys in not just Toms.
I've used rubber bands, balloons, ocarina, Jews harp, a drum, a kalimba, chimes none of which sound like a turkey plus I have used an aluminum can, copper pipe, ceramic tile, the back of a mirror, an aluminum channel and other things that sound similar to turkeys.
I posted elsewhere here about turkey hearing. They don't hear what we hear.
Some say turkeys aren't curious I say they are extremely curious and come to sounds because of curiosity.
Turkey's hear turkeys all day every day. They are creatures of sight and sound. When they hear different sounds, they want to see whats making the sound.
I've spent to many hours in the woods with a frequency generator app. I've played ranges of frequencies that sound like something that you would expect to hear in an outer space movie and the flocks show up. Some of the frequencies make tree frogs croak like crazy.
Check this short video out...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nVrQypTa8oQ
That might be one of the greatest trolls I've ever seen in my 10+ yrs of being on this site. Well done sir!
Unless you were really being serious... :z-dizzy:
:popcorn:
You may not need realism to strike a gobbler but when you are trying to call him in, the more real the better