Finally patterned the Federal 3in, 2oz, 7.5 loads. The star dot put up 200, Mad Super Max 162, SSX 136. All from taped 40 yards, 10in circle. It was very warm ~70 degrees, but windy. I had to compensate for the wind a little in order to hit the center of the cardboard. I boresnaked the barrel in-between shots.
Man that Star Dot's got it going on. Those are awesome patterns. Those were great old shells in all the shot sizes. I know a guy that claims to have killed a lot of turkeys at 40 and beyond with those shells, but IME lead 7.5s run out of gas at 35 yds. I have had great success shooting them through the open barrel of my O/U, but I limit my shots with the choke tube I have selected to 30 yds.
Til I switched to nitro this is the only load I ever used killed several with them and let me tell you they will smoke a bird at 40 yards
alot of it has to do with the trauma of so many hits at one time.I used these shells for several years,and I know they are 7.5's,but they will smoke one at 40yds,I know.
What gun and choke did you guys shoot these Federal 7.5's thru??? :OGturkeyhead:
Most of mine were shot from an Inv+ BPS with a .670 Comp-n-Choke. They actually shot a slightly denser core out of my 835 with a .695 Rhino, but the BPS was a little more evenly distributed. And yes, they do pack a wallop at 40 yards. ;)
The above patterns came from a Mossberg 835. I also shot these from a Truglo Bansner and Rhino .695 choke but the patterns were more spread out at 40 yards. The star dot definitely gave the best 10" pattern. Interesting to add that with 4 of the 5 chokes the wads only landed about 10 yards from the gun. The star dot wad went a lot further, like 20-25 yards.
7.5 at 40 killing turkey's.. No way aparently #6 won't kill pass 40 either must be the magical mark at witch lead falls to the ground :drool:
Quote from: meat grinder on March 14, 2014, 10:00:45 PM
7.5 at 40 killing turkey's.. No way aparently #6 won't kill pass 40 either must be the magical mark at witch lead falls to the ground :drool:
Ha ha. This it so true and it's sad. There really is not a lot of difference between hevi and lead. (HW and TSS are a different story) Hevi 7's will kill as far as the pattern will allow, but lead 6's will not. Come on. They both have more than enough energy at 40 yards to kill a bird.
When the 3.5 inch guns became popular, all I heard was how much more powerful the shells were. Somehow a 3 inch shell with 2 ounces wont cut it, however a 3.5 inch shell with 2 ounces was scary good. Good to 60 easy. I had to waste quite a few 3 and 3.5 inch shells, cutting them apart to show people the same amount of powder in each. Simply would not believe me otherwise. They read something and it is true to them. No need to think about it, just take it as fact. This is why those marketing guys get paid the big bucks.
The internet is a great place to find information. Here lies the problem - people can claim anything they want. It's like chasing that crazy 40 yard pattern. Someone posts 400 hits at 40 yards. Well now it's possible I guess. I gotta do everything I can to get there. But wait, maybe the guy shot at 25 and just said it was 40. You need to decide if these outliers are true or are you just believing some made up hype.
Sorry. Rant over.
no doubt lead 6 runs out of energy quicker than HTL loads but that doesn't mean it won't do...much of my issue with guys shooting lead 6's is they would shoot 2 3/4 lead 6 loads that were 5 dollars a box at WalMart out of a modified barrel Remington 1100. Guess what at 40 yards that is most likely not a consistent killing pattern. Out of almost any turkey choke/gun combo Full, XF, with the 3" or 3 1/2" loads and the new chokes it works fine. That's what scares me about posting info on 7 1/2 lead and even the Hevi 7's is that someone will get confused and go buy dove loads and try to shoot a turkey at 40-45 yards cause he misjudged yardage. Somewhere in between the innovations in chokes and shells the HTL loads came in and made that guy shoot a killing pattern with his old set up and he's happy. And I'm happy cause anything that stops guys from wounding birds makes me happy. :you_rock:
Stinkpickle has used the Federal 3" #7.5 lead loads before and he has attested to the fact that they had more than enough energy to kill gobblers @ 40 yards. Nuf said. :OGturkeyhead:
shot them for some years myself,and yes they killed birds at 40
looks like your ready
Quote from: surehuntsalot on March 24, 2014, 10:35:38 PM
shot them for some years myself,and yes they killed birds at 40
Again I don't doubt the pellet size capability as much as the lack of availability of power loads...I think the average turkey hunter or novice might see 7.5 and think they ought to just grab their 2 3/4" Winchester Universals and go to town...obviously that would be OK to a point, could lead to wounded birds. I'm not sure I've ever seen the load you are describing above for sale, a 3" 2oz Lead 7...just not used to seeing that anywhere.
Quote from: KYStalker on March 12, 2014, 11:19:20 PM
Finally patterned the Federal 3in, 2oz, 7.5 loads. The star dot put up 200, Mad Super Max 162, SSX 136. All from taped 40 yards, 10in circle.
There's 682 pellets in 2oz of #7.5 lead. The number of hits in the 10" circle seem pretty miniscule to me for shooting bird shot.
200 (29%) 162 (24%) 136 (20%)
It is peculiar that time and time again on this forum you hear guys preach that #6 lead is almost insufficient at 40 yards because it begins to run out of energy (pellet for pellet). The discussion nearly always turns one of two ways: either go up in lead shot size to at least #5 or shoot an HTL load that "surely guarantees" a dead bird at this mythical, ethical, and physical limit or turkeydom.
Now a poster puts up a 40 yard pattern with #7.5 loads riddled with nostalgia, and post less than mediocre patterns even for larger shot sizes............and everybody's OK with this???
Where is ILIKEHEVI-12 to talk some sense into this thread???
How far can we push the limits in both directions???? That seems to be the goal!
I'm going to search for some #12 Steel shot. Wait until you see the patterns I put up at 40 steps.....er, I mean Taped & Lasered yards.
I just take it for what it is. Patterns on a forum. I never heard the OP say he was going turkey killing at 40 with any of those loads. I do like to see the patterns being put up here though. I like to see the data of what various loads and chokes produce...nothing more...nothing less.
Quote from: BowBendr on March 26, 2014, 12:30:50 PM
I just take it for what it is. Patterns on a forum. I never heard the OP say he was going turkey killing at 40 with any of those loads.
No, you didn't, but a few other guys have recalled their successful hunts where this smaller shot fit the bill at the predetermined maximum limit of 40 yards.
I would assume that on a turkey hunting website, under the turkey gun pattern forum, where a fellow posts a picture of a pattern from his turkey gun, he most likely has intentions of shooting at a turkey with that set up. That has to be the most logical conclusion right?
I like seeing patterns as well, but you've got to weed out the top few and weed out the bottom few, to get a true understanding of what these shells, barrels, and chokes are capable of.
I thought the members of this forum had a near innate grasp on the concept that lead #6 shot is the minimum pellet a shooter should launch at a live turkey, if they choose to shoot at the agreed upon range limitation of 40 yards.
When I was about 10 years old, I watched my brother kill a groundhog with a single BB fired from a Crossman air rifle. That BB went right in its ear canal, left a single droplet of blood, and that groundhog never twitched. And yet to this day, I won't consider a 10 pump Crossman BB gun to be a very good groundhog gun.
well, I can see where this thread is headed...... :popcorn:
Quote from: learn2hide on March 25, 2014, 10:43:58 PM
Quote from: surehuntsalot on March 24, 2014, 10:35:38 PM
shot them for some years myself,and yes they killed birds at 40
Again I don't doubt the pellet size capability as much as the lack of availability of power loads...I think the average turkey hunter or novice might see 7.5 and think they ought to just grab their 2 3/4" Winchester Universals and go to town...obviously that would be OK to a point, could lead to wounded birds. I'm not sure I've ever seen the load you are describing above for sale, a 3" 2oz Lead 7...just not used to seeing that anywhere.
(http://i254.photobucket.com/albums/hh97/STRIKER1300/002-8.jpg) (http://s254.photobucket.com/user/STRIKER1300/media/002-8.jpg.html)
Number17, have you ever heard of a famous turkey hunter by the name of Ray Eye? He used that exact load, Federal "Premium" 12 ga. 3 inch 2 oz load of 7 1/2 shot. It was one of his favorite turkey loads until it was discontinued by the factory. I myself found three boxes that I am itching to try on a big old tom. I am sure the load is more than up to the task at hand and will SMOKE a turkeys head at 40 yards!
I don't care who promotes it and I don't care who uses it. Just because somebody promotes it doesn't change the physics of what is going on with the pellets.
Throughout these "Longbeard XR" threads, nearly every argument against them being an "extended range" load was that a #6 Lead runs out a juice at 40 yards.
And now all the sudden #7.5 lead will kill gobblers all day long at 40 yards?
What was the velocity on those Federal 2oz?
I'm not arguing about it personally as I've never shot it and I've never run penetration tests for myself, but I just find it peculiar that penetration and lethality seems to have more to do with a opinion over science.
How small can we go with lead shot? If multiple jabs adds up to the same amount of damage as a few overhand rights, can we expect Lead #10s to kill reliably at 40 yards?
:
Quote from: WildTigerTrout on March 26, 2014, 02:20:35 PM
Number17, have you ever heard of a famous turkey hunter by the name of Ray Eye? He used that exact load, Federal "Premium" 12 ga. 3 inch 2 oz load of 7 1/2 shot. It was one of his favorite turkey loads until it was discontinued by the factory. I myself found three boxes that I am itching to try on a big old tom. I am sure the load is more than up to the task at hand and will SMOKE a turkeys head at 40 yards!
Ray Eye...hadn't heard that name in a long time. Yea he could kill a turkey in Wal Mart parking lot with a broom. He was or maybe still is a turkey killing machine. I know several old school guys that used to be in the hunting business that hunted with these shells. I have two boxes myself. Was gonna hunt with them this year but got sidetracked with LB's.
Quote from: learn2hide on March 25, 2014, 10:43:58 PM
Quote from: surehuntsalot on March 24, 2014, 10:35:38 PM
shot them for some years myself,and yes they killed birds at 40
Again I don't doubt the pellet size capability as much as the lack of availability of power loads...I think the average turkey hunter or novice might see 7.5 and think they ought to just grab their 2 3/4" Winchester Universals and go to town...obviously that would be OK to a point, could lead to wounded birds. I'm not sure I've ever seen the load you are describing above for sale, a 3" 2oz Lead 7...just not used to seeing that anywhere.
This is a full fledged turkey load. 3/2/7.5 of copperplate shot. (4 dram eq)
Quote from: Number17 on March 26, 2014, 03:53:01 PM
I don't care who promotes it and I don't care who uses it. Just because somebody promotes it doesn't change the physics of what is going on with the pellets.
Throughout these "Longbeard XR" threads, nearly every argument against them being an "extended range" load was that a #6 Lead runs out a juice at 40 yards.
And now all the sudden #7.5 lead will kill gobblers all day long at 40 yards?
What was the velocity on those Federal 2oz?
I'm not arguing about it personally as I've never shot it and I've never run penetration tests for myself, but I just find it peculiar that penetration and lethality seems to have more to do with a opinion over science.
How small can we go with lead shot? If multiple jabs adds up to the same amount of damage as a few overhand rights, can we expect Lead #10s to kill reliably at 40 yards?
This was one of those turkey loads that folks used to wear the turkeys out with before we got all smart about it and involved science. Back in these days 40 yds was considered stretching it with any gun/shell and most of the guys I hunted with were looking to get turkeys inside 30yds. I can't comment on killing turkeys at 40+ yards with them cause I don't know. I would probably try to get em closer to be honest.
Ray Eye spent a lot more time working on calling birds into a real hunting range then he did trying to figure out how far he could shoot them. Quite a concept. Gets pretty fun inside of 30...and really fun at 10. Every once in a while they hang up at 50 and 60. Makes hunting kinda enjoyable when you finally get him in.
Just for the record to all of those that say they have killed turkeys with 7.5 lead at 40 yards and beyond. Dont kid yourself you just got lucky and stunned the bird long enough to KILL him with your foot. 7.5 lead isnt a turkey load and never will be. Hell I shoot a big 10 and I could get a 3oz load of it from nitro but wont ever dream of using it. Its a 30 yard shell plain and simple. Some people need to reevaluate there methods. And I dont care what red dog or red wing or whoever said I wont even feel comfortable taking them 3/2/7.5 federals squirrel hunting because theyd be lucky to kill a tree rat at 40 and beyond ranges. If you kill them close then great use the dove loads but if your gonna try to take long shots do everyone a favor including the turkey at get something with more lead in its pencil.
Quote from: highwaygun on March 26, 2014, 07:43:18 PM
Just for the record to all of those that say they have killed turkeys with 7.5 lead at 40 yards and beyond. Dont kid yourself you just got lucky and stunned the bird long enough to KILL him with your foot. 7.5 lead isnt a turkey load and never will be. Hell I shoot a big 10 and I could get a 3oz load of it from nitro but wont ever dream of using it. Its a 30 yard shell plain and simple. Some people need to reevaluate there methods. And I dont care what red dog or red wing or whoever said I wont even feel comfortable taking them 3/2/7.5 federals squirrel hunting because theyd be lucky to kill a tree rat at 40 and beyond ranges. If you kill them close then great use the dove loads but if your gonna try to take long shots do everyone a favor including the turkey at get something with more lead in its pencil.
I can see why you carry a 10,I don't know and really don't care where you got your opinion on this subject.I have used this shell on several birds in the past,and none were stunned,or stepped on with a foot,they were dead.Some were taken between 30-35yds,some were between 35-40yds.
I don't need to reevaluate any methods,I have been hunting and shooting at these birds for 35-40 years,
in that time I have shot at one time or another just about every shell that has been made for turkey hunting,and some that were not.Have never lost a bird (because I don't take 50+yd shots), have missed 4 times,but those were my fault,not the shells.
If people turkey hunted,instead of turkey shooting,you could use 2-3/4 High Brass shells,which by the way has killed several birds for me over the years,and you're going to love this,the 2-3/4" 1-1/4oz #7.5 was one of my favorites.
My pawpaw swears by 2.75 and 3in shells. He laughs at me for buying 3.5in shells. I laugh at him because none of the shells in his turkey vest are even the same color. But that old man kills turkeys.
Quote from: surehuntsalot on March 26, 2014, 09:25:56 PM
Quote from: highwaygun on March 26, 2014, 07:43:18 PM
Just for the record to all of those that say they have killed turkeys with 7.5 lead at 40 yards and beyond. Dont kid yourself you just got lucky and stunned the bird long enough to KILL him with your foot. 7.5 lead isnt a turkey load and never will be. Hell I shoot a big 10 and I could get a 3oz load of it from nitro but wont ever dream of using it. Its a 30 yard shell plain and simple. Some people need to reevaluate there methods. And I dont care what red dog or red wing or whoever said I wont even feel comfortable taking them 3/2/7.5 federals squirrel hunting because theyd be lucky to kill a tree rat at 40 and beyond ranges. If you kill them close then great use the dove loads but if your gonna try to take long shots do everyone a favor including the turkey at get something with more lead in its pencil.
I can see why you carry a 10,I don't know and really don't care where you got your opinion on this subject.I have used this shell on several birds in the past,and none were stunned,or stepped on with a foot,they were dead.Some were taken between 30-35yds,some were between 35-40yds.
I don't need to reevaluate any methods,I have been hunting and shooting at these birds for 35-40 years,
in that time I have shot at one time or another just about every shell that has been made for turkey hunting,and some that were not.Have never lost a bird (because I don't take 50+yd shots), have missed 4 times,but those were my fault,not the shells.
If people turkey hunted,instead of turkey shooting,you could use 2-3/4 High Brass shells,which by the way has killed several birds for me over the years,and you're going to love this,the 2-3/4" 1-1/4oz #7.5 was one of my favorites.
I call bs that you are knocking them stiff at 40 yards with 7.5's. You need to get a range finder because your mistaken. We are talking real yards here. We are not measuring with same ruler you used to convince the wife its 12 inches. These shells are sub par and shouldnt be used with all the better options out there. People like you are the ones that setup newcomers on this site and to the sport for failure. The correct response from a person with your experience should be " yes they will kill a turkey but use your head and take high percentage shots because the pellets are small and they lose KE quick. If you miss judge the yardage and take a shot thats to far you wont like the outcome." And to the point of why I use a ten is because it is superior to any 12 ga combo on the market. if you dont believe me ill send you pattern pics or you can check the 10ga section on this site. Oh yeah and about you never losing a bird I say you need to reevaluate that one also because if you pull the trigger and he doesnt ride in the truck you lost him. Now ask me how many I have lost with the 10 and youll know now why I use it.
Quote from: highwaygun on March 26, 2014, 11:21:39 PM
Quote from: surehuntsalot on March 26, 2014, 09:25:56 PM
Quote from: highwaygun on March 26, 2014, 07:43:18 PM
Just for the record to all of those that say they have killed turkeys with 7.5 lead at 40 yards and beyond. Dont kid yourself you just got lucky and stunned the bird long enough to KILL him with your foot. 7.5 lead isnt a turkey load and never will be. Hell I shoot a big 10 and I could get a 3oz load of it from nitro but wont ever dream of using it. Its a 30 yard shell plain and simple. Some people need to reevaluate there methods. And I dont care what red dog or red wing or whoever said I wont even feel comfortable taking them 3/2/7.5 federals squirrel hunting because theyd be lucky to kill a tree rat at 40 and beyond ranges. If you kill them close then great use the dove loads but if your gonna try to take long shots do everyone a favor including the turkey at get something with more lead in its pencil.
I can see why you carry a 10,I don't know and really don't care where you got your opinion on this subject.I have used this shell on several birds in the past,and none were stunned,or stepped on with a foot,they were dead.Some were taken between 30-35yds,some were between 35-40yds.
I don't need to reevaluate any methods,I have been hunting and shooting at these birds for 35-40 years,
in that time I have shot at one time or another just about every shell that has been made for turkey hunting,and some that were not.Have never lost a bird (because I don't take 50+yd shots), have missed 4 times,but those were my fault,not the shells.
If people turkey hunted,instead of turkey shooting,you could use 2-3/4 High Brass shells,which by the way has killed several birds for me over the years,and you're going to love this,the 2-3/4" 1-1/4oz #7.5 was one of my favorites.
I call bs that you are knocking them stiff at 40 yards with 7.5's. You need to get a range finder because your mistaken. We are talking real yards here. We are not measuring with same ruler you used to convince the wife its 12 inches. These shells are sub par and shouldnt be used with all the better options out there. People like you are the ones that setup newcomers on this site and to the sport for failure. The correct response from a person with your experience should be " yes they will kill a turkey but use your head and take high percentage shots because the pellets are small and they lose KE quick. If you miss judge the yardage and take a shot thats to far you wont like the outcome." And to the point of why I use a ten is because it is superior to any 12 ga combo on the market. if you dont believe me ill send you pattern pics or you can check the 10ga section on this site. Oh yeah and about you never losing a bird I say you need to reevaluate that one also because if you pull the trigger and he doesnt ride in the truck you lost him. Now ask me how many I have lost with the 10 and youll know now why I use it.
I don't know who you are buddy, but that post was way over the line.
Easy now fellas. If you don't like 7 shot , don't use it.
Besides they haven't made this shell for years and years?? Not sure why?
I like 5 lead if using lead, so do a lot of others , they still make it, it is my choice and it works for me.
Don't see many turkey hunters grabbin up field loads with any size shot. Most like big power loads .
The flashier the better.
Not much longer to wait til season now. :anim_25: :z-twocents:
Quote from: highwaygun on March 26, 2014, 11:21:39 PM
Quote from: surehuntsalot on March 26, 2014, 09:25:56 PM
Quote from: highwaygun on March 26, 2014, 07:43:18 PM
Just for the record to all of those that say they have killed turkeys with 7.5 lead at 40 yards and beyond. Dont kid yourself you just got lucky and stunned the bird long enough to KILL him with your foot. 7.5 lead isnt a turkey load and never will be. Hell I shoot a big 10 and I could get a 3oz load of it from nitro but wont ever dream of using it. Its a 30 yard shell plain and simple. Some people need to reevaluate there methods. And I dont care what red dog or red wing or whoever said I wont even feel comfortable taking them 3/2/7.5 federals squirrel hunting because theyd be lucky to kill a tree rat at 40 and beyond ranges. If you kill them close then great use the dove loads but if your gonna try to take long shots do everyone a favor including the turkey at get something with more lead in its pencil.
I can see why you carry a 10,I don't know and really don't care where you got your opinion on this subject.I have used this shell on several birds in the past,and none were stunned,or stepped on with a foot,they were dead.Some were taken between 30-35yds,some were between 35-40yds.
I don't need to reevaluate any methods,I have been hunting and shooting at these birds for 35-40 years,
in that time I have shot at one time or another just about every shell that has been made for turkey hunting,and some that were not.Have never lost a bird (because I don't take 50+yd shots), have missed 4 times,but those were my fault,not the shells.
If people turkey hunted,instead of turkey shooting,you could use 2-3/4 High Brass shells,which by the way has killed several birds for me over the years,and you're going to love this,the 2-3/4" 1-1/4oz #7.5 was one of my favorites.
I call bs that you are knocking them stiff at 40 yards with 7.5's. You need to get a range finder because your mistaken. We are talking real yards here. We are not measuring with same ruler you used to convince the wife its 12 inches. These shells are sub par and shouldnt be used with all the better options out there. People like you are the ones that setup newcomers on this site and to the sport for failure. The correct response from a person with your experience should be " yes they will kill a turkey but use your head and take high percentage shots because the pellets are small and they lose KE quick. If you miss judge the yardage and take a shot thats to far you wont like the outcome." And to the point of why I use a ten is because it is superior to any 12 ga combo on the market. if you dont believe me ill send you pattern pics or you can check the 10ga section on this site. Oh yeah and about you never losing a bird I say you need to reevaluate that one also because if you pull the trigger and he doesnt ride in the truck you lost him. Now ask me how many I have lost with the 10 and youll know now why I use it.
Now I can't tell what range I'm shooting at,ok you think what you want to,you don't seem to have a problem with that.I know why you carry a 10,because it's about the size of your mouth,loud and makes noise that is not needed. I don't think that I am the problem to the newcomers,to me it's the one's that get on here and talk about cramming the guns full of any of the HTL shells and blasting away as soon as they see the head pop up.We know who we are don't we??? I don't shoot long range,can you say the same???I doubt it,you are one of the ones I'm referring to.
Everyone might need to calm down a bit...didn't realize my comment about confusing novices would start off such a storm. :-) For the record guys, done some research, now I know why I don't see that shell around here in MO for sale...as you stated, discontinued. Also doesn't appear anyone else makes one like it. I said before I have no doubt that load would smoke a gobbler in a good line of sight/range shooting situation. But I do believe given what we know now and the options that are available there is no reason to risk it. I personally don't even like lead 6's...not cause they can't do the job just prefer bigger shot. I shoot HTL 6's and 7's and can attest to both of them crushing birds. I also shoot lead 5's and have shot lead 4's before but prefer pellet counts. Saw my dad shoot a fall turkey once with a dove load cause he forgot his shells at home...but she was also about 17 yards away. I even do the same thing with ducks, shooting #1 steel almost always, not because it's required but when they get hit with it by and large they don't cripple, they go down. That's the key for us veterans or novices right?...gear up with the equipment you need to take out a bird quick and clean at the range you are practiced and comfortable with. Obviously that can change depending on the guy...just be accountable for your choices. If you are a guy that likes to push that 40 yard envelope or just makes a mistake then the #7 lead is going to be an issue for you and your target eventually.
Somebody says this:
"I call bs that you are knocking them stiff at 40 yards with 7.5's. You need to get a range finder because your mistaken. We are talking real yards here"
So he gets a reply like this:
Quote from: surehuntsalot on March 27, 2014, 09:44:10 PM
Now I can't tell what range I'm shooting at................ I don't shoot long range,can you say the same???
When just a few hours ago, the same poster claimed this:
Quote from: surehuntsalot on March 13, 2014, 10:21:52 PM
alot of it has to do with the trauma of so many hits at one time.I used these shells for several years,and I know they are 7.5's,but they will smoke one at 40yds,I know.
Quote from: surehuntsalot on March 24, 2014, 10:35:38 PM
shot them for some years myself,and yes they killed birds at 40
This is exactly the stuff I'm talking about. And I'm not trying to specifically call anybody out, but this is a prime example of how confusing these discussions can become. Hypocrisy, for what it's worth.
Some people are gearing up for the year with little other guidance, and some others may be gearing up for the first time, and this is the kind of info they have to sort through from the "veterans".
Is 40yd long range or not?
Is a #7.5 lead load reliable enough for turkeys at that range?
If a pro used to shoot it, it must be a great choice..................right?
For the last few months we've heard over and over that #6 lead is still just #6 lead no matter what fancy new hull it's launched from, and that we should consider this the minimum payload for 40 yard turkey shots. But apparently there are some that don't agree with that.
When someone calls BS and says you need a rangefinder, I can see why a guy would get defensive...and there is some truth to the trauma with more pellets argument but the returns of kinetic energy diminish quickly with smaller and smaller shot...50 extra pellets that don't penetrate well amount to a slap upside the head rather than lights out. I don't think 40 yards is "long range" with a 12 gauge and a turkey choke but I've also shot birds that I knew were inside 40 and then realized they were a few more steps away than I thought. I think the message is pretty clear...if you're going to shoot inside 40 yards then find the load/choke that works for you and go to town. Biggest thing is take the ethics of being a hunter seriously and to do the work and get your pattern/POI/POA down and it honestly won't matter much what you pick. Unfortunately with the new shells and their marketing as well as these chokes there are a lot of guys reaching out further and further pushing it.
Quote from: Number17 on March 27, 2014, 11:19:03 PM
Somebody says this:
"I call bs that you are knocking them stiff at 40 yards with 7.5's. You need to get a range finder because your mistaken. We are talking real yards here"
So he gets a reply like this:
Quote from: surehuntsalot on March 27, 2014, 09:44:10 PM
Now I can't tell what range I'm shooting at................ I don't shoot long range,can you say the same???
When just a few hours ago, the same poster claimed this:
Quote from: surehuntsalot on March 13, 2014, 10:21:52 PM
alot of it has to do with the trauma of so many hits at one time.I used these shells for several years,and I know they are 7.5's,but they will smoke one at 40yds,I know.
Quote from: surehuntsalot on March 24, 2014, 10:35:38 PM
shot them for some years myself,and yes they killed birds at 40
This is exactly the stuff I'm talking about. And I'm not trying to specifically call anybody out, but this is a prime example of how confusing these discussions can become. Hypocrisy, for what it's worth.
Some people are gearing up for the year with little other guidance, and some others may be gearing up for the first time, and this is the kind of info they have to sort through from the "veterans".
Is 40yd long range or not?
Is a #7.5 lead load reliable enough for turkeys at that range?
If a pro used to shoot it, it must be a great choice..................right?
For the last few months we've heard over and over that #6 lead is still just #6 lead no matter what fancy new hull it's launched from, and that we should consider this the minimum payload for 40 yard turkey shots. But apparently there are some that don't agree with that.
you are 100% correct. the quotes you posted is why i add my .02! It just floors me that he can say that he doesnt take long shots but states that he has ground checked them with 7.5 lead. 40 yards with 7.5 lead is a long shot to long!
Quote from: highwaygun on March 28, 2014, 12:37:56 AM
Quote from: Number17 on March 27, 2014, 11:19:03 PM
Somebody says this:
"I call bs that you are knocking them stiff at 40 yards with 7.5's. You need to get a range finder because your mistaken. We are talking real yards here"
So he gets a reply like this:
Quote from: surehuntsalot on March 27, 2014, 09:44:10 PM
Now I can't tell what range I'm shooting at................ I don't shoot long range,can you say the same???
When just a few hours ago, the same poster claimed this:
Quote from: surehuntsalot on March 13, 2014, 10:21:52 PM
alot of it has to do with the trauma of so many hits at one time.I used these shells for several years,and I know they are 7.5's,but they will smoke one at 40yds,I know.
Quote from: surehuntsalot on March 24, 2014, 10:35:38 PM
shot them for some years myself,and yes they killed birds at 40
This is exactly the stuff I'm talking about. And I'm not trying to specifically call anybody out, but this is a prime example of how confusing these discussions can become. Hypocrisy, for what it's worth.
Some people are gearing up for the year with little other guidance, and some others may be gearing up for the first time, and this is the kind of info they have to sort through from the "veterans".
Is 40yd long range or not?
Is a #7.5 lead load reliable enough for turkeys at that range?
If a pro used to shoot it, it must be a great choice..................right?
For the last few months we've heard over and over that #6 lead is still just #6 lead no matter what fancy new hull it's launched from, and that we should consider this the minimum payload for 40 yard turkey shots. But apparently there are some that don't agree with that.
you are 100% correct. the quotes you posted is why i add my .02! It just floors me that he can say that he doesnt take long shots but states that he has ground checked them with 7.5 lead. 40 yards with 7.5 lead is a long shot to long!
I'm not the only one that has made a remark about using this shell and shooting 40 yds.
40 yds is not long range shooting with the proper choke. The ones that are shooting 50-70yds are the ones that are shooting long range.
No one should ever just take for granted some information typed on here and go hunting with it,you should always check out your gun and choke yourself.
I know what works for me and has worked for me in the past and will continue to hunt that way.
Just an update on these shells. I patterned them at 40 yards from an Indian Creek .675 in my 835 and got 224 in 10". I also used them all season and killed two birds with them. Both were around 35 yards and fell over dead as a hammer. Two shots, two kills. So far I love them, but I don't have any delusions of killing turkeys past 35-40 yards with them.
Saturday morning 9.35am dead tom on ground magically killed by a teenage girl with a 20 gauge shooting 7.5 shot at 38 yards ! I guess I'll have to tell her she will have to shoot 6s from now on because 7.5s won't kill that far ! Lol !
Quote from: Canteathorns on April 29, 2014, 10:10:33 PM
Saturday morning 9.35am dead tom on ground magically killed by a teenage girl with a 20 gauge shooting 7.5 shot at 38 yards ! I guess I'll have to tell her she will have to shoot 6s from now on because 7.5s won't kill that far ! Lol !
Congrats to her and you...as stated several times above if you are for sure not going to shoot past 40 yards then just get your pattern and POI right and you'll be good...
Quote from: KYStalker on April 29, 2014, 04:27:08 PM
Just an update on these shells. I patterned them at 40 yards from an Indian Creek .675 in my 835 and got 224 in 10". I also used them all season and killed two birds with them. Both were around 35 yards and fell over dead as a hammer. Two shots, two kills. So far I love them, but I don't have any delusions of killing turkeys past 35-40 yards with them.
Congrats, that's awesome! Way to get it done with the old 2 ounce 7.5's.
Quote from: KYStalker on April 29, 2014, 04:27:08 PM
Just an update on these shells. I patterned them at 40 yards from an Indian Creek .675 in my 835 and got 224 in 10". I also used them all season and killed two birds with them. Both were around 35 yards and fell over dead as a hammer. Two shots, two kills. So far I love them, but I don't have any delusions of killing turkeys past 35-40 yards with them.
Careful now,are you aware according to the expert turkey "shooters" on here that what you have done can't be done. Are you sure the birds are dead and not playing possum,after all you didn't blast at them with a 10ga stuffed with 3 oz's of nitros.
This thread has made me want to hunt with the 3/2/7.5's next year. Gonna take em out and do some patterning. Gonna shoot them through my 870 kicks .655 and see how they look at 20,30,40. Have two boxes, might as well use them.
Be sure to post your patterns! A friend of mine shot his turkey with them at 20 yards and said the turkey's head looked like meatloaf with a beak.
Quote from: KYStalker on May 15, 2014, 08:10:32 AM
Be sure to post your patterns! A friend of mine shot his turkey with them at 20 yards and said the turkey's head looked like meatloaf with a beak.
Killed some turkeys with them back in day out of a Browning Citori full choke. They should be business out of the rem 870/ kicks .655.
Excuse me...I have to run home to make sure all those birds I shot with #7.5s years ago haven't gotten up and run away. :TooFunny:
Quote from: stinkpickle on May 15, 2014, 02:41:42 PM
Excuse me...I have to run home to make sure all those birds I shot with #7.5s years ago haven't gotten up and run away. :TooFunny:
I got to reading this whole story this morning myself and although I admit that I never shot one at more than 30 yards using this shell the ones I took home sure appeared to be dead. One of the all time most deadly shells I ever used. I saw the one where if the shell had 600+ pellets and only 200 were in the 10" then that wasn't very good. What about all the area the other 400 or so pellets to cover the rest of the target?
A lot of turkeys wish these critics would have told a game warden back in the 50s and 60s that 2 3/4" magnum #7.5 shot weren't meant to kill turkeys. Of course 20-30 yard shots were the norm then. :z-dizzy: :fud: :OGani:
Yup, there was several years there when friends of mine in Missouri were hunting with these 3/2/7.5's. They were wearing the turkeys out with them. That's all they would hunt with but no one was looking to shoot a turkey out to 40yds. "Call them close" was the motto back then and we really didn't use decoys a whole lot. I now realize those were the good old days. Glad some folks on here still hunt that way. Just a few folks that I hunt with still hunt lead and are looking to get turkeys inside 30yds. They still limit out most years and rarely miss or lose a turkey. I found two boxes of these shells in an old country store and can't wait to shoot some patterns at 20,30,40 just to see what they do. The ground I am hunting now the shots are typically 15-25 yds due to the ridges and thick hardwood timber. These shells should be perfect but will probably hunt with a 35yd limit. Will give me a few yards extra for misjudged yardage. This is typically what I do with any lead load, 35 yards and 40 yds with HTL. Majority of my shots are still inside 30 but that's as far as I want to attempt a shot.( 35 Pb and 40 HTL)
Quote from: KYStalker on May 15, 2014, 08:10:32 AM
Be sure to post your patterns! A friend of mine shot his turkey with them at 20 yards and said the turkey's head looked like meatloaf with a beak.
MEATLOAF WITH A BEAK!!! I'm literally ROTFLMAO :TooFunny: :TooFunny:
I am amazed at the attention this load has drawn. Personally, I don't see the point.
There are better loads out there, and at less then 2 ounces, so less recoil to boot.
I can only surmise a lot of peeps are infatuated with lots of holes in paper instead of terminal performance.
Quote from: Loose Wire on May 28, 2014, 02:41:24 PM
I am amazed at the attention this load has drawn. Personally, I don't see the point.
There are better loads out there, and at less then 2 ounces, so less recoil to boot.
I can only surmise a lot of peeps are infatuated with lots of holes in paper instead of terminal performance.
More holes in paper=more holes in a turkey
I think it's one of those deals where if you have them, you might as well shoot them. They are good shells but handloading is the only way to reproduce them. Price of shells has everyone looking into shooting their old stockpiles of shells, including me. Hunting terrain where you are looking to shoot inside 35yds or so..the ole 7.5's are brutal on the turkey and hard to beat.
Quote from: Loose Wire on May 28, 2014, 02:41:24 PM
I am amazed at the attention this load has drawn. Personally, I don't see the point.
There are better loads out there, and at less then 2 ounces, so less recoil to boot.
I can only surmise a lot of peeps are infatuated with lots of holes in paper instead of terminal performance.
If its terminal performance kills birds, who cares?
7.5 lead will kill even the biggest toughest old gobbler graveyard dead at 40 yards and beyond if the pattern holds up. More often than not at 40 and beyond if you pattern 7.5 vs. 6 you will see that the lighter shot (7.5) starts to thin out and give way to the larger, heavier shot #6. Pattern fails before Penetration. It always has and always will, this has been proven many times over. Pattern density determines shotgun range. I realize people enjoy shooting soup cans and all kinds of things to compare penetration of various loads. That is great for comparison and all.
As far as the comment about not feeling comfortable squirrel hunting with the 3 inch 2 ounce load of Federal Premium 7.5 shot, I find that amusing. Anyone who has skinned a few squirrels and killed a few birds will know a squirrels hide (covered with fur) is a whole lot tougher to penetrate than a turkeys bare head and neck (not covered by even feathers, much less fur.
I run across a fellow many years back at a gunshow, he had some of these on his table for sale. I know this man through some other friends, and he was an avid turkey hunter, at the time I had no desire to hunt turkey's, but I did make the comment that I thought they were on the light side for such use, and he said that's why there on the table for sale! We talked for a few minutes on the subject, and his concern was the same as this whole thread. I feel this way, and say what you will there have been a lot of turkey's killed with 7.5 shot, but those folks back then used what they had to the best of there ability, there is better loads nowadays, and I do not wish to limit myself. I'm sure there's a reason these loads are discontinued. Not saying there not good loads for there intended purpose, I just do want to take the gamble. I only get a few days a year to hunt, and I like to make them count. Like my dad used say about fist fights, you got put them down fast and make every lick count! Kinda goes the same with turkey hunting.
If people today would learn to call and Hunt turkeys, instead of turkey sniping, you could kill them with #7-1/2 low brass dove shells
Quote from: surehuntsalot on January 18, 2015, 08:29:30 PM
If people today would learn to call and Hunt turkeys, instead of turkey sniping, you could kill them with #7-1/2 low brass dove shells
Amen and I'm a youngster! My pawpaw taught me to turkey hunt and daddy always stressed don't ever take a shot you have to think about, even when we squirrel hunted
Agree with surehuntsalot and turkey buster. If you go back and look at when they came out with "turkey loads", they were a solution without a problem. Of course the ammo companies want you to use different shells for each species, dove and quail loads, rabbit and squirrel loads, pheasant loads, turkey loads, predator loads, I am sure I am forgetting a few others. More ammo to sell you at a higher price of course. We have to pay extra for all that premium stuff like copper plated shot because we all know that turkeys now are so tough than plain lead would probably just bounce off their heads right?
Many turkeys have been killed with low brass 7.5 and even 8's with a single shot, flying none the less. But it is in the ammunition companies best interest to make people believe turkeys are armor plated of course.
If anyone has any of these non turkey killing pieces of junk please pm me I will gladly take them off your hands. Just looked in my beard box and told my wife to be careful the loads I hunted with years ago didn't really kill them they are just playing opossum LOL!!!!!!!! She laughed cause she killed a few with them too.
I have thought about shooting 7.5 lead a few times but it limits me to about 30 yards. I think it would not have enough steam to break a neck after that. But I was getting a great pattern out to 40 or 45 yards.
If you are getting "great" patterns out to 45 yds., why are you limited to 30 ?
Just curious....
I've killed several turkeys with Pb 7.5s @ 1200 fps from the open barrel of my O/U, and I consider 35 yds to be max with that shot size (although I know several folks that say they work fine @ 40 as well). Lead 7.5s drop below 1.25" of predicted ballistic gel penetration at 35 yds. Anything any further than 35 yds gets a face full of TSS 9s.
All I'm going to say is this long bread #6s will kill at 40 yards all day long and I am confident if I have to pull the trigger at that range.50 + yards is unethical to try need to work on ya calling or set up if u can't get him any closer.I say this yet every year I buy a different choke and different shells and hope I can achieve a 30 yard pattern at 50+ yards and for some unknown reason end up right back where I started.lmfao