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Would you guys be cool seeing a 1 bird limit for out of staters? I live in NJ, but have never hunted here. I do 100% of my hunting out of state and I'd be totally fine seeing this. Just keep the tag/license around $100-150 and not $250 or $300 for 1 bird.

What do you think?

Personally, I would be good with this,...under the circumstances that exist now in terms of declining turkey numbers and increasing hunting pressure.  A decade or two ago, I would probably have balked at it, but times have changed.   :icon_thumright:

It would suit me to limit nonresidents to one bird.   Wouldn't hurt my feelings to travel out of state and only have one tag.

Count me in. I traveled to a state with a one bird limit this season instead of going with my brother to a state with a 3 bird limit. Had a good time anyways. 

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I hunt states every year with a single bird limit, non issue for me!


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I have no turkey in the hunt, but i could go along with the one bird limit....

I'd be fine with it. I seldom hang around long enough to try to kill two birds when I'm
on the road.

100% good with it.  One of the reasons I picked the state I did for a western hunt last spring was the one bird reasonably priced tag.  Got one with a few days left and spent the rest of the time sightseeing and looking around for next season.  Getting one bird home on an aircraft was a chore.  Trying to get two or three wouldn't have worked for me.

I usually two to three other states each Spring and this would not affect my decision at all.  I have never killed more than one bird out of state anyway.  I think with the current population issue it would be a change that could help

yes.
im not a great turkey hunter.....id be thrilled with getting "just 1"

I'm all for it. Forces those that want to keep killing to travel and support local economies.

I belong to a hunting club out of state. We are allowed 2 spring gobblers, and one fall Turkey. I'd rather see a 2 bird total limit, 2 in spring, none in fall, or one and one. I think that would be fair, and help the population recover.

Pretty crazy to me how willingly we are now days to give up our hunting opportunities. If you look at the data, I'm willing to bet an extremely small percentage of non-resident hunters actually kill multiple birds in a given state. Especially on public lands. And saving a few birds from non-residents is going to do NOTHING at the landscape level to help populations. On small, localized areas it may could help with carryover (that is if another person doesn't kill that bird). But in the big picture, nada.

What it would also cause, is a chain reaction. We are currently seeing these chain reactions in regulations play out now. Many of us on this forum predicted this exact thing would happen. As one state implements non-resident/public land restrictions or reduces the bag limit, traveling turkey hunters focus elsewhere. Bama/Ga tighten down on public lands, more hunters head to TN. TN public lands get overwhelmed, they tighten down. We will see another shift in this pressure for 2023. The same thing will happen if states start going to 1 bird NR limits. Non-rez pressure will just inundate the next closest area with a multiple bird bag limit. When in reality, they won't kill multiple. It is more of a perception issue.

Before the social media/YouTube boom, (when turkey numbers still weren't doing so well in a lot of places) you'd never see a discussion like this get so much support. Once opportunity is taken away, you will likely never get it back. Regardless of how bird populations or hunter numbers are trending.

Regs like this would also affect non-resident landowners and leaseholders. On the bright side, I guess it could potentially lower turkey lease prices (I'm all for that!) and free them up for residents.

One thing I loved so much more about turkey hunting over deer hunting, was that it as an "everyman's game". No need for expensive leases, high price tags, or complicated draw systems. My oh my how quickly those days have ended! Just glad I got to experience the bountiful opportunities before social media, YouTube, and the commercialization of turkey hunting in general, all pissed in our Cheerios. You already need access to private land to hunt the season in its entirety in multiple states now (Alabama, Georgia) due to recent changes. South Carolina as well, but its been like that for a while. And we can brace for me. Turning into a rich man's game, fellas!

Quote from: deerhunt1988 on June 10, 2022, 12:59:09 PM
Pretty crazy to me how willingly we are now days to give up our hunting opportunities. If you look at the data, I'm willing to bet an extremely small percentage of non-resident hunters actually kill multiple birds in a given state. Especially on public lands. And saving a few birds from non-residents is going to do NOTHING at the landscape level to help populations. On small, localized areas it may could help with carryover (that is if another person doesn't kill that bird). But in the big picture, nada.

Before the social media/YouTube boom, (when turkey numbers still weren't doing so well in a lot of places) you'd never see a discussion like this get so much support. Once opportunity is taken away, you will likely never get it back. Regardless of how bird populations or hunter numbers are trending.

Regs like this would also affect non-resident landowners and leaseholders. On the bright side, I guess it could potentially lower turkey lease prices (I'm all for that!) and free them up for residents.

One thing I loved so much more about turkey hunting over deer hunting, was that it as an "everyman's game". No need for expensive leases, high price tags, or complicated draw systems. My oh my how quickly those days have ended! Just glad I got to experience the bountiful opportunities before social media, YouTube, and the commercialization of turkey hunting in general, all pissed in our Cheerios. You already need access to private land to hunt the season in its entirety in multiple states now (Alabama, Georgia) due to recent changes. South Carolina as well, but its been like that for a while. And we can brace for me. Turning into a rich man's game, fellas!

If there wasn't so many turkey hunters in general, no social media,  no YouTube, etc I'd agree with you 100%.  BUT there is...... who would of ever dreamed 20yrs ago so many guys would start turkey hunting not to mention travel to multiple states in one year.  People thought I was crazy 25yrs ago when I was hunting 2 or 3 states per year. 
I definitely miss the simpler times. 

Ohio dropped to one bird but kept the price over $200.  I didn't hunt there this year.

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Quote from: Roost 1 on June 10, 2022, 01:12:24 PM

Quote from: deerhunt1988 on June 10, 2022, 12:59:09 PM
Pretty crazy to me how willingly we are now days to give up our hunting opportunities. If you look at the data, I'm willing to bet an extremely small percentage of non-resident hunters actually kill multiple birds in a given state. Especially on public lands. And saving a few birds from non-residents is going to do NOTHING at the landscape level to help populations. On small, localized areas it may could help with carryover (that is if another person doesn't kill that bird). But in the big picture, nada.

Before the social media/YouTube boom, (when turkey numbers still weren't doing so well in a lot of places) you'd never see a discussion like this get so much support. Once opportunity is taken away, you will likely never get it back. Regardless of how bird populations or hunter numbers are trending.

Regs like this would also affect non-resident landowners and leaseholders. On the bright side, I guess it could potentially lower turkey lease prices (I'm all for that!) and free them up for residents.

One thing I loved so much more about turkey hunting over deer hunting, was that it as an "everyman's game". No need for expensive leases, high price tags, or complicated draw systems. My oh my how quickly those days have ended! Just glad I got to experience the bountiful opportunities before social media, YouTube, and the commercialization of turkey hunting in general, all pissed in our Cheerios. You already need access to private land to hunt the season in its entirety in multiple states now (Alabama, Georgia) due to recent changes. South Carolina as well, but its been like that for a while. And we can brace for me. Turning into a rich man's game, fellas!

If there wasn't so many turkey hunters in general, no social media,  no YouTube, etc I'd agree with you 100%.  BUT there is...... who would of ever dreamed 20yrs ago so many guys would start turkey hunting not to mention travel to multiple states in one year.  People thought I was crazy 25yrs ago when I was hunting 2 or 3 states per year. 
I definitely miss the simpler times.

I see both sides of the coin here,...BUT,  when all is said and done, I agree with Roost (and the consensus among other posters in this thread) on this one.  We have reached a point with hunter saturation and declining turkey numbers where a choice has to be made between quantity and quality.  At this point in time, quality wins out for me in this discussion (we can debate the quality versus quantity issue further, if warranted)

As I have stated, there was a time when I would have fought tooth and nail against reducing spring gobbler bag limits.  In my mind, times have changed.  Mind you, I don't swallow that pill easily, but I am now willing to do so based on what we are seeing happening around the country. 

If I'm spending money to travel to another state, I'd much prefer to have a chance at two birds.  Three is even better but those states are becoming fewer and fewer.  Admittedly, I've been to three bird states and only come home with one bird, but I had the opportunity if circumstances had permitted.
That's a lot to spend on travel and a hunt to stop at one bird.  I may be forced in the future to hunt more states as one bird limits will become more common I think.

   :z-winnersmiley:

Quote from: deerhunt1988 on June 10, 2022, 12:59:09 PM
Pretty crazy to me how willingly we are now days to give up our hunting opportunities. If you look at the data, I'm willing to bet an extremely small percentage of non-resident hunters actually kill multiple birds in a given state. Especially on public lands. And saving a few birds from non-residents is going to do NOTHING at the landscape level to help populations. On small, localized areas it may could help with carryover (that is if another person doesn't kill that bird). But in the big picture, nada.

What it would also cause, is a chain reaction. We are currently seeing these chain reactions in regulations play out now. Many of us on this forum predicted this exact thing would happen. As one state implements non-resident/public land restrictions or reduces the bag limit, traveling turkey hunters focus elsewhere. Bama/Ga tighten down on public lands, more hunters head to TN. TN public lands get overwhelmed, they tighten down. We will see another shift in this pressure for 2023. The same thing will happen if states start going to 1 bird NR limits. Non-rez pressure will just inundate the next closest area with a multiple bird bag limit. When in reality, they won't kill multiple. It is more of a perception issue.

Before the social media/YouTube boom, (when turkey numbers still weren't doing so well in a lot of places) you'd never see a discussion like this get so much support. Once opportunity is taken away, you will likely never get it back. Regardless of how bird populations or hunter numbers are trending.

Regs like this would also affect non-resident landowners and leaseholders. On the bright side, I guess it could potentially lower turkey lease prices (I'm all for that!) and free them up for residents.

One thing I loved so much more about turkey hunting over deer hunting, was that it as an "everyman's game". No need for expensive leases, high price tags, or complicated draw systems. My oh my how quickly those days have ended! Just glad I got to experience the bountiful opportunities before social media, YouTube, and the commercialization of turkey hunting in general, all pissed in our Cheerios. You already need access to private land to hunt the season in its entirety in multiple states now (Alabama, Georgia) due to recent changes. South Carolina as well, but its been like that for a while. And we can brace for me. Turning into a rich man's game, fellas!

We'll, it all sounds good on the outside, but when you actually dig into the meat of it, who's killing the VAST majority of gobblers?
Residents!!! Of course!
Non-residents make up the minority of hunters everywhere you go. So if you want REAL help for the turkey population, restrict everyone.
For example, I've been deer and turkey hunting SC as a non-resident for almost 15 years. The bag limit used to be 5 gobblers, which I never took, but TONS of resident hunters did every year. Then they dropped the bag limit to 3, then they not only reduced non-resident only to 2, but charged us $100 for the privilege of having our limits reduced. For SC, it was all about hogging the gobblers for the residents, while gouging non-residents for $100 each. It had absolutely NOTHING to do with helping the turkey population.
In most states, the almighty dollar comes first, so I wouldn't be looking for them to reduce license/tag fees.
Personally, I just want to see the turkey population rebound so I can enjoy hunting like in the good old days. To that means, research needs to be done, changes need to be made, predators need to be taken out and funding for habitat improvement needs to be allocated.
But I won't be holding my breath. Those are all expensive, so look for more of the cheap and ineffectual restrictions on non-residents to increase.

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Look out New Jersey, here THEY come!!

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Quote from: Cowboy on June 10, 2022, 02:28:58 PM
Look out New Jersey, here THEY come!!

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NJ is the worst it's been in the past 15 years. Harvest last year down over 18%. Results from this year not in yet, but the word is it's way down. The Northern part of the state has really been hit with a drop in Turkey numbers. They most likely will be lowering permits in certain areas or there will be a huge problem down the road....stay tuned...

The problem most have with non-residents is really a PUBLIC LAND PRESSURE problem moreso than a bag limit problem. If people have an issue with non-residents killing more than 1 bird, I imagine it is due to them (the resident) hunting the same public land. The non-resident is taking away from THEIR (the resident's) opportunity to kill the same bird. Or impacting the resident's hunt quality. Regulating non-residents on public lands is a bit different than regulating NR statewide!

I really think Mississippi went the right direction with their 2 week non-resident public land draw. You want to hunt the public lands, you have to draw. If you don't draw, you can still come hunt afterwards. If a non-resident owns or leases land in MS, they can still hunt early season on private lands if they don't draw. What they legally kill on private lands really shouldn't concern anyone other than the same ones hunting that private land.

I'm much quicker to support non-resident quotas on public land than I am statewide bag limit reductions. What I hate to see is RESIDENTS get shafted when entire WMAs go quota hunt only or enact stricter regulations when a bulk of the pressure issue is from non-residents. Case in point, TN's recent changes. More quota hunts and 1-bird the first 2 weeks for ALL hunters on some WMAs where half or more of the harvest this spring came from non-residents! TN should have taken care of its resident's first rather than restricting opportunity for all.

Florida is another prime example of the above. More quota hunts enacted by the day, with no preference to residents. I've seen some hunts where over half the tags are drawn out by NR. I really feel for south zone residents who have lost a tremendous amount of open hunting opportunity due to some of their WMAs being pimped out all over YouTube since 2018.

I'm betting KY is seriously considering a non-res reduction but their tags are pricey anyway.  Having lived there a few years I'll guarantee their residents would jump all over it.

Quote from: joey46 on June 10, 2022, 04:44:12 PM
I'm betting KY is seriously considering a non-res reduction but their tags are pricey anyway.  Having lived there a few years I'll guarantee their residents would jump all over it.

Their commission was considering non-resident restrictions last summer. No doubt it'll be brought up again! With TN moving their season back closer to the KY opener, KY may very possible see NR numbers unlike ever before during Spring 2023. All goes back to the chain reactions I mentioned in my previous post.

Simplest solution? A non-resident draw for public lands the first week of their season.

All for it.  Glad that TN and KY will now open at the same time.

Be nice if KY, TN, WV and OH all opened the same day.  Remember when OH opened on a Monday and KY opened on April 15th?  The good old days.  Really seemed to spread out the public land pressure.

Quote from: deerhunt1988 on June 10, 2022, 04:42:51 PM
The problem most have with non-residents is really a PUBLIC LAND PRESSURE problem moreso than a bag limit problem. If people have an issue with non-residents killing more than 1 bird, I imagine it is due to them (the resident) hunting the same public land. The non-resident is taking away from THEIR (the resident's) opportunity to kill the same bird. Or impacting the resident's hunt quality. Regulating non-residents on public lands is a bit different than regulating NR statewide!

I really think Mississippi went the right direction with their 2 week non-resident public land draw. You want to hunt the public lands, you have to draw. If you don't draw, you can still come hunt afterwards. If a non-resident owns or leases land in MS, they can still hunt early season on private lands if they don't draw. What they legally kill on private lands really shouldn't concern anyone other than the same ones hunting that private land.

I'm much quicker to support non-resident quotas on public land than I am statewide bag limit reductions. What I hate to see is RESIDENTS get shafted when entire WMAs go quota hunt only or enact stricter regulations when a bulk of the pressure issue is from non-residents. Case in point, TN's recent changes. More quota hunts and 1-bird the first 2 weeks for ALL hunters on some WMAs where half or more of the harvest this spring came from non-residents! TN should have taken care of its resident's first rather than restricting opportunity for all.

Florida is another prime example of the above. More quota hunts enacted by the day, with no preference to residents. I've seen some hunts where over half the tags are drawn out by NR. I really feel for south zone residents who have lost a tremendous amount of open hunting opportunity due to some of their WMAs being pimped out all over YouTube since 2018.

I agree with this.

  I agree with Tom007.  Mid New Jersey and Turkey Rich South New Jersey might have to reduce permit numbers.  North Jersey has very few Turkeys.   Still I will pay the $135.50 non Resident Hunting License Fee and 21 dollar Turkey Permit to walk the Turkey Ghost Woods. I am making someone Rich.

Quote from: joey46 on June 10, 2022, 06:34:37 PM
Be nice if KY, TN, WV and OH all opened the same day.  Remember when OH opened on a Monday and KY opened on April 15th?  The good old days.  Really seemed to spread out the public land pressure.

One of the ways we could spread the public land pressure out is to have
3 opening days across the nation. The southern tier of states would open on April 1st, the central tier would open on April 15th, and the northern tier on April 30th.

Quote from: Jimspur on June 10, 2022, 08:06:14 PM

Quote from: joey46 on June 10, 2022, 06:34:37 PM
Be nice if KY, TN, WV and OH all opened the same day.  Remember when OH opened on a Monday and KY opened on April 15th?  The good old days.  Really seemed to spread out the public land pressure.

One of the ways we could spread the public land pressure out is to have
3 opening days across the nation. The southern tier of states would open on April 1st, the central tier would open on April 15th, and the northern tier on April 30th.

That won't happen because each STATE regulates their own. Red states or blue states each with their own agenda.

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I'm all for whatever helps the turkey so if reducing to one bird for non-residents is the answer, ok, but I don't know if it's that simple. I'd be all about making it illegal to shoot jakes too, aside from youth hunters, but that's another can of worms.

IMO, when it comes to hunter harvest effecting turkey numbers, it's not the one guy that's filling his 4 tags that's the problem...It's the 1000's of extra guys filling one tag that's doing the majority of the damage. It's a very small percentage of the turkey hunting community that ever shoot a second turkey, much less a third. What we have now is a surge in new turkey hunters over the last 5-10 years, and they're all taking one or two (whether that be resident or non-resident). The states don't want to do anything to discourage hunter's from coming to their state because that's revenue for them so what you have is a conflict of interest between what's best for the bird and best for license sales is directly at odds with each other. Tennessee and Georgia paying The Hunting Public to promote their states while simultaneously watching numbers drop and preparing to take opportunity away from hunters, is a prime example.

I could hop on the soap box about this but one thing is very clear to me-  when a state gets popular on social media, number's start to drop in the years to follow.  I'm not going to name the states here but most of the states with the biggest drops in population are also the ones that were/are most popular on the facebook forums, hunting forums, and now youtube. When people start flocking to area's in mass, it takes an incredibly high level of reproduction to keep up with all of the extra guns. For a bird that already see's 70-80% nest predation, that's a tall order if you have a bad hatch due to weather or whatever else.

It won't bother those chasing 49

With the numbers down I honestly would not mind one in the Spring and one in the Fall for both residents and non residents and no more bearded hens. I know I will be the odd man out though.

With the several post recently about Turkey numbers and NR hunters and bag limits just remember you can set a self imposed 1 Turkey limit.


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Would that even be legal?  Seriously though a one bird legal limit may discourage some that would consider only one bird on a out of state trip not worth their time or expense.  Not necessarily a bad thing. :OGani:

100% good. Think it would be just as good

I'd be for the one bird non- resident I travel 2-3 states per year and that's getting to be the norm- I love to turkey hunt so I'll continue to go

Honestly if I'm traveling out of state and I was successful enough to kill one turkey I would be pumped up. Also I'd probably immediately want to try to kill another one. I'm not opposed to a lower out of state limit. I think it depends on the state.


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in most states, residents kill more birds than non-residents.  Only limiting the non-residents to one bird makes no sense to me.  If you are dropping the limit to one bird, drop the limit for all hunters.

This doesn't seem like a measure that will help turkeys much.  It might help resident hunters "feel better" because they see fewer out of state license plates in their neck of the woods.  Just my two cents.

I realize the OP is about reducing limits on non-residents, but I feel if this is all about protecting diminishing Turkey populations. I feel that everyone should be a part of the answer/solution. Bag limits should be adjusted across the board for all if the numbers dictate same since the results will affect the entire Turkey fraternity. Heading off this drop in numbers now will hopefully stabilize our resource to enjoy in years to come.

Not that I want this to happen, I definitely don't, but if the goal is to reduce the effects of turkey hunters on turkey populations, go old school and eliminate the Spring season entirely. Fall adult gobblers only. That would do it.


There are a number of less severe measures that would help. Better predator control is of course one. Eliminating decoys especially strutting jakes and gobblers would probably help. I know some pretty inexperienced guys who routinely kill gobblers using strutting decoys who are terrible callers and woodsmen. I doubt they would have much success without a decoy on an open field.

Hopefully the turkey numbers can be stabilized so that our kids, grandkids and their kids can enjoy this great sport for years to come, but it would appear the best days are probably behind us.That doesn't mean we still can't have very good days ahead. I just don't see things going back to hearing a dozen or more gobblers on the roost at times.


As the human population continues to grow and the inevitable sprawl advances here in SC, I personally now see areas paved over and developed that once held all kinds of wildlife. That will continue and in some areas it is happening at a rapid pace. Habitat loss will continue to be an issue.

Hopefully the wildlife biologists will have more of a say in hunting and fishing regulations in SC and elsewhere rather than politicians and admin types in the DNR.

I'm open to change if it is based on sound science and not on money or some state representative or senator who seemingly knows all. Our turkey laws here in the past have been based on anything but science.

The vast, vast majority on this board love this sport, love this bird and are willing to sacrifice to some degree to afford future generations a chance to enjoy what we all enjoy.

There's plenty of things that COULD be done to help but the easiest (cheapest as well) is to reduce bag limits...so that's what they'll usually go with first, for better or worse.  If that's what needs to happen then ok but it can't be the only thing that happens or it's just a bandaid, IMO. 

Obviously there's a lot more turkey hunters than there were 5-10 years ago and the traveling turkey hunting has increased in popularity also...we've all heard how good that is for the sport and it's needed etc. That might be true IF AND ONLY IF those increased numbers/additional revenue funnel back into helping wild turkey and not just in "research".  I mean use the increased numbers to improve habitat specifically for turkey, use some of it to procure more public land opportunities (possibly through Walk In Hunt areas like you see in some of the states),  actively trap predators,  burn in a way that is more beneficial to turkey (meaning 15-50 acre parcels instead of 2000+ acres at a time) etc.    I'm aware of the fact that all of the things I'm suggesting require a lot of money and manpower, both of which are limited, and you're talking about a lot of public land...So set up volunteer programs for both donations above and beyond license fees, and also actively engage the public with habitat improvement projects. I, personally would donate a couple hundred dollars a year if I knew it was going right back in to my public land for the species I hunt and If there was a specific way to volunteer to go put in work in habitat improvement (specifically for turkey) on the land I spend time on, I'd volunteer my time....Same way I would if I was on a private hunting club. I'd donate time and money to improve the areas I hunt.   The point is, I think there's a desire for people to do something but not a lot of good avenues for the guys that hunt public or even on hunting clubs in some cases but that's what it's going to take- guys getting out there and doing something about it.

Quote from: redleg06 on June 10, 2022, 10:16:56 PM
numbers drop and preparing to take opportunity away from hunters, is a prime example.

I could hop on the soap box about this but one thing is very clear to me-  when a state gets popular on social media, number's start to drop in the years to follow.  I'm not going to name the states here but most of the states with the biggest drops in population are also the ones that were/are most popular on the facebook forums, hunting forums, and now youtube. When people start flocking to area's in mass, it takes an incredibly high level of reproduction to keep up with all of the extra guns. For a bird that already see's 70-80% nest predation, that's a tall order if you have a bad hatch due to weather or whatever else.

This is a very accurate statement.

Let's just all quit turkey hunting for at least 2 years...that will help the population quickly recover. Maybe even 5 years, then we can get the original limits back and have a restart. But we need to ban all social media and the cigar smokers on youtube

Quote from: WW on June 13, 2022, 04:33:38 PM
But we need to ban the cigar smokers on youtube

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Quote from: turkeyfool on June 10, 2022, 09:30:17 AM
Would you guys be cool seeing a 1 bird limit for out of staters? I live in NJ, but have never hunted here. I do 100% of my hunting out of state and I'd be totally fine seeing this. Just keep the tag/license around $100-150 and not $250 or $300 for 1 bird.

What do you think?

Just read through the thread and this is the most interesting comment? Why do you not hunt in the state you reside in? This just strikes me as odd and I am curious to know. Sorry for being nosy

Interesting point! I moved to the Midwest for college and stayed there until 2020. Didn't know a thing about turkey hunting, but I was still-hunting with my bow along the Miss. river in December one morning and a bird hammered like 5 yards from my face. I decided at that point I would try turkey hunting and killed one with my bow (no blind) that spring. I had no idea what I was doing, but loved it. Since then, I've just been traveling, but it's really more to extend my season than anything. I try to be anywhere it's around 45 degrees at first light. Don't really have particular states in mind although I have a few I go to in late May. So I've never actually hunted in my home state

I see people on here suggesting stop hunting for at least two years, ban the "cigar smokers", etc. Sorry, but these ideas sound crazy to me. I don't know about other people, but I just enjoy being outdoors in an area that has gobbling turkeys, with just a chance to tag one. To hang it up for two years is not  an option for me. Instead of banning these guys or that, I suggest we spend our time/resources finding out why our recruitment/nesting success is down so much. Then figure out from a scientific standpoint how to improve these areas.

I have chosen a profession that requires me to be on call 24/7, to leave I have to make special arrangements for someone to cover for me. If it were not for the "cigar smokers" I'd never get to see an Osceola come wading through water in Osceola country, or dozens of other interesting locales that I know I'll never get to visit first hand.

Everyone here seems to agree that they would keep hunting out of state for the chance at a single bird. Removing multiple tags for NR would be the low hanging fruit, only saving a very small percentage of gobblers from being harvested. As for the cigar smokers.. I hold Dave to the highest regard. Sure he takes plenty of birds off the landscape, but again is that really impacting the population? He loves the bird more than he loves to kill em, and surely does his fair share to give back to the resource. There are a handful that I can think of that take advantage of the wild turkey, he is not one of em.

I believe the timing of harvest has more impact than the harvest itself. New techniques (strutter decoys) are increasing in popularity and killing birds the first week of the season that would otherwise survive past the seasons end or until their hens are all bred and nesting.

One final note.. if there's one thing the decline of the ruffed grouse in my part of PA taught me, its that animals can withstand disease/predation with the necessary habitat. Without it, they can become few and far between. Does this apply to turkey? I think so..

Honestly I really enjoy the states that allows you to shoot 5+ a year.

Quote from: makestomstremble on June 14, 2022, 02:31:53 PM
I see people on here suggesting stop hunting for at least two years, ban the "cigar smokers", etc. Sorry, but these ideas sound crazy to me. I don't know about other people, but I just enjoy being outdoors in an area that has gobbling turkeys, with just a chance to tag one. To hang it up for two years is not  an option for me. Instead of banning these guys or that, I suggest we spend our time/resources finding out why our recruitment/nesting success is down so much. Then figure out from a scientific standpoint how to improve these areas.

I have chosen a profession that requires me to be on call 24/7, to leave I have to make special arrangements for someone to cover for me. If it were not for the "cigar smokers" I'd never get to see an Osceola come wading through water in Osceola country, or dozens of other interesting locales that I know I'll never get to visit first hand.

If it weren't for the cigar smoker and other attention hounds we likely wouldn't be having this conversation at all.......

Quote from: arkrem870 on June 14, 2022, 06:28:35 PM

Quote from: makestomstremble on June 14, 2022, 02:31:53 PM
I see people on here suggesting stop hunting for at least two years, ban the "cigar smokers", etc. Sorry, but these ideas sound crazy to me. I don't know about other people, but I just enjoy being outdoors in an area that has gobbling turkeys, with just a chance to tag one. To hang it up for two years is not  an option for me. Instead of banning these guys or that, I suggest we spend our time/resources finding out why our recruitment/nesting success is down so much. Then figure out from a scientific standpoint how to improve these areas.

I have chosen a profession that requires me to be on call 24/7, to leave I have to make special arrangements for someone to cover for me. If it were not for the "cigar smokers" I'd never get to see an Osceola come wading through water in Osceola country, or dozens of other interesting locales that I know I'll never get to visit first hand.

If it weren't for the cigar smoker and other attention hounds we likely wouldn't be having this conversation at all.......

BINGO. It's amazing how some have trouble correlating the two.

I am good with it. My favorite state to hunt just allows one bird per non resident and it always been fun. Anything that will help the birds rebound I am in favor off.

I call "the cigar smoker" a friend.  I've hunted with him.  He's much better than what shows on YouTube.
Hope he considers me a friend also.   He's just a guy trying to make a living and most of us are jealous that we didn't come up with the idea and have the guts to quit their job and go turkey hunting for a living. I know that I am.  There are several out there.  I know at least 3.  He and his kind aren't the reason.  I don't blame anyone for loving the sound of a spring gobble.  And if they bring that joy to a new hunter, then all the better.   Knight and Hale,  Will Primos and others got us fired up about turkey hunting. You don't blame them.   Don't blame "the cigar smoker". 

  But how would you get all 49 States to agree to this at the same time?
    Probably  areas absolutely  Hammered  by out of Staters who live a Stones Throw from a Neighboring  State would like this new Regulation.
   South New Jersey comes to mind with half of Pennsylvania  Turkey Hunters  looking to Grab those few weekly Permits in their Lottery System. 
    In my area of New York,I see half of New Jersey's Turkey Hunters parked in New York. Meanwhile,I see very few New Yorkers hunting in New Jersey. Go Figure
 

This turkey hunting thing is a fad that won't last.  It's kind of like discussing how few turkeys there are these days on OG.  Be careful what you change because of a fad.  There's already talk around Wisconsin numbers showing that maybe turkeys are not gonna disappear from the landscape and maybe the numbers were skewed from Covid.  Just doing something won't fix a problem. Especially if there might not have been a problem to begin with.  A few good hatches and we are all singing and dancing in the streets and back to arguing about shots over 40 yards????

I hope your right. Unfortunately arkansas duck hunting underwent a similar public green timber hunting fad some years back. Resulting in non resident draws and closed /rest days on many public spots to reduce the increased pressure. Social media hunters made sleeping at the boat ramps in line a fad and now folks start lining up a full week before opening day. Turkey hunting is following the same trajectory. I've lived both extensively and am worried for the future of turkey hunting. Turkeys are precious and shouldnt be exploited on public lands for profit.

But what if you go to north or south dakota for ducks?  You won't face the same challenges.  I think the Arkansas duck hunting thing is mainly because it's Arkansas and these kids think that you have to go there and endure that misery to earn your SnapTok badge.  If you wanna turkey hunt there are great places all over this country that aren't that crowded.  I just don't see the issues that everyone is all bent over..........

Quote from: Shiloh on June 16, 2022, 12:20:44 PM
But what if you go to north or south dakota for ducks?  You won't face the same challenges.  I think the Arkansas duck hunting thing is mainly because it's Arkansas and these kids think that you have to go there and endure that misery to earn your SnapTok badge.  If you wanna turkey hunt there are great places all over this country that aren't that crowded.  I just don't see the issues that everyone is all bent over..........

I agree Shioh.  I have or had 3 primo turkey gun bring hunting spots.   One I lost due to someone buying the property.   The other two I was either the only one allowed to hunt there or was with the property owner.   Blessed to be sure.   No "YouTuber" has ever set foot on either property.   All three typically held up to five adult gobblers per year.   This year? Nada.  Not one gobbler on any property.  The areas held many jakes which gives me hope for next year and a few very old gobblers.    Guess we had a few bad hatches.  I'm not blaming "YouTubers".  I had to step up my game to harvest the bird.   Go deeper,  hunt more days,  learn new calls,   be patient.  Yes,  I'm retired and can hunt weekdays but I don't blame anyone for the lack of gobblers.

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Quote from: Shiloh on June 16, 2022, 12:20:44 PM
But what if you go to north or south dakota for ducks?  You won't face the same challenges.  I think the Arkansas duck hunting thing is mainly because it's Arkansas and these kids think that you have to go there and endure that misery to earn your SnapTok badge.  If you wanna turkey hunt there are great places all over this country that aren't that crowded.  I just don't see the issues that everyone is all bent over..........

Arkansas green timber duck hunting is a different animal than prairie ducks of the Dakota's. Hunting wise and crowd wise. Most people head to Arkansas for the experience. Whether it's good or bad is in the eye of the beholder.

I'm bent because Mississippi now has a non resident drawing to hunt public land, alabama now has a drastically late opening and lower limit on public land to curb non resident use, South Carolina has done the same, Georgia has done the same, Oklahoma has done the same, Tennessee has done the same,  etc. etc. Public land hunters are paying 1000x the amount of money these YouTubers have made in lost hunting opportunity. Sure, I can drive 12+ hours and get to other less crowded locations.....I've been extensively traveling for nearly 20 years now and know all about it. Just hate to lose all my close public land options to regulation because a few people had to have their 10 minutes and a few dollars.   

Quote from: ElkTurkMan on June 15, 2022, 08:06:18 PM
I am good with it. My favorite state to hunt just allows one bird per non resident and it always been fun. Anything that will help the birds rebound I am in favor off.

Gonna go out on a limb here and assume you are speaking of Iowa. IMO its comparing apples to oranges to compare Iowa to any other state.

Arkrem.......I completely and fully understand your gripe and this is in no way directed at you, but ALL of mississippi is glad that there is now some reprieve from the Arkansas hunters.  Of the hundreds of complaints that I have heard from public land over the last 35 years about 90% of them have been directed at Arkansas hunters.  Now I am sure the duck hunters in Arkansas could have the same complaints about MS duck hunters, but I don't plan to fight the duck battle.

That's fine.....but doesn't change what's happened around the country to public land hunters and what's yet to come. A handful of guys and cameras have turned public turkey hunting upside down. Nobody else thought to do it before because it's no efficient way to make any kind of money and frankly it's no kind of  life.  Selling merchandise is the only money in it. With rising fuel prices and higher license prices it'll be thinner margins. 

Quote from: Shiloh on June 16, 2022, 03:17:12 PM
...glad that there is now some reprieve from the Arkansas hunters.  Of the hundreds of complaints that I have heard from public land over the last 35 years about 90% of them have been directed at Arkansas hunters....

A few years back I was turkey hunting public ground in north central Kansas for several days. I got to know the local CO...he'd stop by at the end of every day and we'd chat. He said he had far more problems with Arkansas hunters than any other state.