OG shop member gallery
OldGobbler
          bullet Forum Board      bullet Pushpin Turkey Call Blog      bullet Advertising Info     

OG Gear Store

Sum Toy
Dave Smith
Wood Haven
DC Cattle Ranch






Author Topic: Midwest US turkey decline  (Read 2075 times)

Online Sir-diealot

  • 2018 SITE SUPPORTER
  • Double Beard
  • ********
  • Posts: 2513
Re: Midwest US turkey decline
« Reply #15 on: June 04, 2018, 06:37:05 PM »
The sad reality is limited tags sales means limited income for the DNR. I also agree on agricultural practices have changed. Here in Iowa, 25-30 yrs ago you could drive down the road and tell where every creek was from all the trees. Now all the trees and fence rows have been torn out and the sloughs have been tiled. Not only has it hurt the turkey population, but pheasants and other small game also. Iowa went from one of the top Pheasant hunting states in the country to nothing. It use to pretty common to get out of school and be able to shoot a Pheasant or two before season closed at 4:30. Now you can hunt most of the day and feel lucky to see a couple of birds.
Mennonites are raping the land here with the same practices and worse.
Strength does not come from winning. Your struggles develop your strengths. When you go through hardships and decide not to surrender, that is strength. Arnold Schwarzenegger

Offline wernerjd

  • Full Member
  • *
  • Posts: 50
Re: Midwest US turkey decline
« Reply #16 on: July 13, 2018, 06:46:48 PM »
You sure don't see the flocks in Nebraska that were 250+ birds like you use too. In one of there areas I hunted there use to be 3 groups that were 250+ in the winter know your lucky to 50 birds in that same area and that's just in the last 5 years. I think in some of the high flock areas it may be disease. I also believe its farming practice, habitat, trapping, urban sprawl, and most of everything that's been mentioned. 

Offline sasquatch1

  • Hero Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 322
Re: Midwest US turkey decline
« Reply #17 on: July 14, 2018, 05:13:26 AM »
People are overpopulating the world, no one ever mentions that cold hard truth. There's a REASON farm practices and lands are disappearing.

Online Sir-diealot

  • 2018 SITE SUPPORTER
  • Double Beard
  • ********
  • Posts: 2513
Re: Midwest US turkey decline
« Reply #18 on: July 14, 2018, 05:22:21 AM »
People are overpopulating the world, no one ever mentions that cold hard truth. There's a REASON farm practices and lands are disappearing.
I beg to differ, let me drop you off in the middle of Alaska or Montana and you walk home and then tell me how we are overpopulating.
Strength does not come from winning. Your struggles develop your strengths. When you go through hardships and decide not to surrender, that is strength. Arnold Schwarzenegger

Offline sasquatch1

  • Hero Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 322
Midwest US turkey decline
« Reply #19 on: July 14, 2018, 05:38:07 AM »
People are overpopulating the world, no one ever mentions that cold hard truth. There's a REASON farm practices and lands are disappearing.
I beg to differ, let me drop you off in the middle of Alaska or Montana and you walk home and then tell me how we are overpopulating.

I’ve been to most states hunting. Except alaska. Ik of the huge plains out west. A lot of which is just that. Plains!

What is most resourceful is being raped more and more. Plain and simple. We have changed the land scape and migrations ramping up farming practices and building up cities and stuff.


Why do you think farmers are eliminating hedges? More money to be made. Why is that? Supply and demand, more demand less product.




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Offline sasquatch1

  • Hero Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 322
Re: Midwest US turkey decline
« Reply #20 on: July 14, 2018, 05:38:23 AM »



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Online Sir-diealot

  • 2018 SITE SUPPORTER
  • Double Beard
  • ********
  • Posts: 2513
Re: Midwest US turkey decline
« Reply #21 on: July 14, 2018, 05:50:56 AM »
People are overpopulating the world, no one ever mentions that cold hard truth. There's a REASON farm practices and lands are disappearing.
I beg to differ, let me drop you off in the middle of Alaska or Montana and you walk home and then tell me how we are overpopulating.

I’ve been to most states hunting. Except alaska. Ik of the huge plains out west. A lot of which is just that. Plains!

What is most resourceful is being raped more and more. Plain and simple. We have changed the land scape and migrations ramping up farming practices and building up cities and stuff.


Why do you think farmers are eliminating hedges? More money to be made. Why is that? Supply and demand, more demand less product.




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Now this I agree with and is what I was talking about with the Mennonites around here raping the land. They do it everywhere they go as I understand it. The other thing is we are living much longer and that is where I see the demand coming in.
Strength does not come from winning. Your struggles develop your strengths. When you go through hardships and decide not to surrender, that is strength. Arnold Schwarzenegger

Online Sir-diealot

  • 2018 SITE SUPPORTER
  • Double Beard
  • ********
  • Posts: 2513
Re: Midwest US turkey decline
« Reply #22 on: July 14, 2018, 05:52:35 AM »



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
This graph shows what I was saying about more demand because we are living longer. I have to go take the dog for a walk on the trail before it gets to hot, you have a good day bud.
Strength does not come from winning. Your struggles develop your strengths. When you go through hardships and decide not to surrender, that is strength. Arnold Schwarzenegger

Offline FL-Boss

  • The Boss Gobbler
  • ****
  • Posts: 883
Re: Midwest US turkey decline
« Reply #23 on: July 14, 2018, 11:39:14 AM »
People are overpopulating the world, no one ever mentions that cold hard truth. There's a REASON farm practices and lands are disappearing.
I beg to differ, let me drop you off in the middle of Alaska or Montana and you walk home and then tell me how we are overpopulating.

I’ve been to most states hunting. Except alaska. Ik of the huge plains out west. A lot of which is just that. Plains!

What is most resourceful is being raped more and more. Plain and simple. We have changed the land scape and migrations ramping up farming practices and building up cities and stuff.


Why do you think farmers are eliminating hedges? More money to be made. Why is that? Supply and demand, more demand less product.




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I agree with population being an issue... it floors me people don't really talk about this as it's the root of many issues.  Knowing that... do you really think your secret public land hunting spot is going to be less crowded next year and the year after?

Also - private lease prices are going to continue to go through the roof as more land vanishes to accommodate more people, development, etc.

Just look at what has happened to Florida over the last 30 years....  I would bet a guided Osceola hunt in Florida will cost over 10K in the not so distant future. 

I see turkey hunters will a few choices in the decades to come.  1. Hunt public with countless other hunters calling every 100 yards apart. Or pay for high dollar leases, or outfitters.  Hunting will become a rich mans sport over the coming decades for those hunters that can't tolerate the rat race on public land. This is already becoming the case in Fla. 

And yes, there is still plenty of open land in Montana, Wyoming and some other western states now... but I assure you that will change to with time. You guys over 40 can remember how things "used to be"  around where you live. Just imagine the changes to come..




Offline silvestris

  • The Boss Gobbler
  • ****
  • Posts: 870
Re: Midwest US turkey decline
« Reply #24 on: July 17, 2018, 01:34:56 PM »
People are overpopulating the world, no one ever mentions that cold hard truth. There's a REASON farm practices and lands are disappearing.
I beg to differ, let me drop you off in the middle of Alaska or Montana and you walk home and then tell me how we are overpopulating.

And then you can tell us how many Wild Turkeys are in Alaska.

Online Sir-diealot

  • 2018 SITE SUPPORTER
  • Double Beard
  • ********
  • Posts: 2513
Re: Midwest US turkey decline
« Reply #25 on: July 17, 2018, 08:46:16 PM »
People are overpopulating the world, no one ever mentions that cold hard truth. There's a REASON farm practices and lands are disappearing.
I beg to differ, let me drop you off in the middle of Alaska or Montana and you walk home and then tell me how we are overpopulating.

And then you can tell us how many Wild Turkeys are in Alaska.
lol Not the point I was making, but no there are none.
Strength does not come from winning. Your struggles develop your strengths. When you go through hardships and decide not to surrender, that is strength. Arnold Schwarzenegger

Offline jims

  • Hero Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 223
Re: Midwest US turkey decline
« Reply #26 on: July 17, 2018, 10:27:09 PM »
I would totally agree that public land hunting is going to be tougher in the years to come.  The turkey population where I hunt in Nebraska has plummeted in the last 5 years.  I wouldn't say it's due to an increase in hunting pressure...it is likely due to the increase in predators plus possibly poor nesting conditions for several consecutive years in a row.  With the decrease in turkey numbers it doesn't seem like states have decreased tag numbers..especially in the winter when quite a few states offer quite a few either sex tags where hens can legally be harvested!  From what I've heard declines in turkeys is on a fairly large scale across the Midwest.

Offline GobbleNut

  • Double Beard
  • *****
  • Posts: 2739
  • Southern New Mexico
Re: Midwest US turkey decline
« Reply #27 on: July 18, 2018, 09:03:41 AM »
There are many possible factors, either singly or collectively, that are the possible culprits.  When it comes down to it, turkey population stability is a function of nesting success and poult survival.  The real question, to me, is what are wildlife management agencies doing to address the issue?  And the secondary question is what is the main organization focusing on wild turkeys, the NWTF, doing to assist in addressing the issue in both funding and expertise?

Not living in the Midwest or Southeast, and hence not being directly involved in what's going on, I am not familiar enough with the situation to know much about it.  If I lived there and was witnessing what some here are indicating is happening, I would be doing what I could as a turkey hunter and conservationist to get to the bottom of the issue. 

I can tell you this.  If the turkey population is significantly decreasing over time, the first response in terms of hunting change is to curtail the hunting of hens, assuming that hen numbers are considered to be low.  If there are plenty of hens about and population recruitment is still going downhill, then hen harvest is not the problem.  There is something going on environmentally that is the issue.

The second thing to look at related to hunting is to make sure the spring hunting season takes place after the onset of the breeding season so that the gobblers have had a chance to fertilize the hens.  In addition, overly long spring hunting seasons have the potential to disrupt nesting, as well, although that is probably not as big an issue as the first two in most places.

The natural/environmental/ecosystem factors are considerably more complex and difficult to identify.  However, the solution lies in actually getting the folks that are supposed to be addressing the problem to do so. In my opinion, the three areas to focus on (as others have stated) are agricultural practices (both farming and poultry operations), nest predation, and nest failure due to increasing spring flooding.

Finally, in terms of gobbler harvest, that is usually a non-factor.  However, it can be if conditions are such that population recruitment (successful hatches) do not occur over an extended period.  If jakes are not recruited into the population over a period of time, then each year, hunters are taking our a few more of the mature gobblers until you reach a point where there are practically none there.  It sounds to me like that is probably the situation in at least some of the described areas. 

The "ace in the hole" for us as turkey hunters is that, turkey transplants have proven to be a very successful tool in wild turkey management. The worst case scenario is that turkey populations have to be supplemented with transplants.  That is not the ideal solution, but it is always there. 


Online guesswho

  • Long Spur Gobbler
  • ******
  • Posts: 7156
  • Gobbler Goober
Re: Midwest US turkey decline
« Reply #28 on: July 18, 2018, 08:09:18 PM »
There are many possible factors, either singly or cThe "ace in the hole" for us as turkey hunters is that, turkey transplants have proven to be a very successful tool in wild turkey management. The worst case scenario is that turkey populations have to be supplemented with transplants.  That is not the ideal solution, but it is always there.
I bet the N"WTF" would even provide boxes, especially if there are any cameras present! :toothy12:
If I'm not back in five minutes, wait longer!
BodonkaDeke Prostaff
MoHo's Prostaff
Do unto others before others do unto you

Offline ccleroy

  • Longbeard
  • ****
  • Posts: 1017
    • Spring Allure Custom Calls
Re: Midwest US turkey decline
« Reply #29 on: July 19, 2018, 08:08:44 AM »
There are many possible factors, either singly or cThe "ace in the hole" for us as turkey hunters is that, turkey transplants have proven to be a very successful tool in wild turkey management. The worst case scenario is that turkey populations have to be supplemented with transplants.  That is not the ideal solution, but it is always there.
I bet the N"WTF" would even provide boxes, especially if there are any cameras present! :toothy12:

Ha!!